[WRC] News & Rumours 2019

[AnttiL]

It's different from country to country...

In Belgium we had WRC cars allowed 10 years ago. We had 2 people fighting for the win. Normally you could predict the complete top 5 correctly just because of the huge difference between the cars. Now without WRC cars destroying the competition, we have an average of 15 R5 cars in all BRC events, with more than 5 drivers capable of winning. All thanks to the more "reasonable" price of R5, and more equal competition. And of course thanks to having a good promotor. Most (if not all) top drivers in Belgium are driving only with sponsorship money, without own budget (or very little own budget). Right now most organizers have doubled the spectator figures compared to 10 years ago.

About the value of winning a local or national event, it's as big as the competition is. In Rallye de Wallonie few weeks ago, the difference between first and second was only 3 seconds. Last year in 5 of the 9 BRC events, the difference between first and second was less than 10s at the end of the rally. Closest win was Haspengouw with a 1,2s difference between Princen and Verschueren. With such competition, people are getting more excited and start following the sport more closely. Winning as only WRC car with 5 minutes advantage will be soon forgotten indeed... ;)

For me it's a no-brainer, I prefer to see the WRC cars only in WRC.

You are implying that if there's a WRC car infront of the R5 cars, there won't be a competitive R5 field or no one will follow that? It's like (well a lot more than) WRC2 in WRC, people still follow that. And you also imply that people will remember details of the local rallies such as the margin or the car that the winner drove, but that people would not remember who was the fastest R5 in a tight battle behind the winning WRC?

Maybe I'm just spoiled in Finland where we have four separate championships for different classes of cars with usually intense battles in all of them and no one really cares about the rally overall results.

[AnttiL]

Allowing current WRC cars in national series is like allowing F1’s in F3 local championships; it simply doesn’t make sense.

So, allowing R2 cars in a local championship where the main class is R5 doesn't make sense either?

[tommeke_B]

You are implying that if there's a WRC car infront of the R5 cars, there won't be a competitive R5 field or no one will follow that? It's like (well a lot more than) WRC2 in WRC, people still follow that. And you also imply that people will remember details of the local rallies such as the margin or the car that the winner drove, but that people would not remember who was the fastest R5 in a tight battle behind the winning WRC?


Yes I do. The overall winner gets the headlines, having a few WRC cars means (far) less return on investment from sponsoring an R5 car.

But as I said, it's different from country to country. In Belgium the "rally culture" is completely different than in Finland. ;)

[Tarmop]

Real fans follow their local events anyway, somehow...shallow fans don`t care about the results either, most of the time not even the driver....just the event, atmosphere etc. WRC atracts the crowds, some of whom may become real fans. In each case, where there`s people, there is publicity and where there is publicity, there is money and money buys cars, tyres, closes-repairs roads, boosts local shopkeepers, accomodation etcetc... But what goes for the headlines...it`s the 21st century, era of snowflakes, bloggers, social media and everything else "influencing"...and cheap. How many care about the companies logo on a car...in the event or in the "headlines".

[AndyRAC]

We do need the event to get more National press coverage etc however so feel a move will be a good thing its just needs a big headline sponsor as too many salaries in the promotion/organisational team to pay otherwise.

Agree. It's dwindled over the last 15+ years, for all sorts of reasons; one is that's no longer a 'National' event. The longer it's stayed in Wales, it's become a 'regional/ Welsh' event.
And, also, during this time, the pull and exposure has gone, meaning no other regions/ authorities have thrown their hat in the ring to host it. So it's suited IMS to keep going to the Welsh for funding.

In an ideal world, there would be a big money sponsor, and the event could rotate, for example every 3-5 years in a different region.
Let's be honest, the event is starting to get a bit stale with the same stages more or less, year after year.

[Rally Power]

So, allowing R2 cars in a local championship where the main class is R5 doesn't make sense either?

That’s a silly question. The point here is to establish a viable top national category and support it as the main national class. That’s what has been done with R5 cars and thanks to it most European national series have now balanced and competitive top fields. It’s not hard to understand that balance will be at risk with the introduction of hugely expensive WRC cars.

[Mirek]

You are implying that if there's a WRC car infront of the R5 cars, there won't be a competitive R5 field or no one will follow that? It's like (well a lot more than) WRC2 in WRC, people still follow that. And you also imply that people will remember details of the local rallies such as the margin or the car that the winner drove, but that people would not remember who was the fastest R5 in a tight battle behind the winning WRC?

Maybe I'm just spoiled in Finland where we have four separate championships for different classes of cars with usually intense battles in all of them and no one really cares about the rally overall results.

This is pure Finnish specific. In nearly all other countries and championships it's not like that and the overall standings is what matters the most.

Also Your example with WRC2 is wrong (or it actually proves that Tommeke was right). The number of people following WRC2 is way lower than of those following overall standings (hell, even common media don't bother with WRC2 - even in Czech Republic where one would expect them to write something about Škoda or Kopecký's successes You usually get an information that Ogier won and Kopecký was 15th without bothering with any further details).

[Tarmop]

In other topic, R4 was the saviour of top lvl national classes...
The answer is that no, there are too many championships still with 2-5 R5s per event...and others have no chanche against them. Is it unfair? Well, in a way... some local 4wd nationals have died because of R5, many are fading away, with spectators...only to be occasionally boosted by big names and/or WRC cars, also among the drivers btw.
In the end, they are still the nationals, competitions, where people with possibilities like to go to and relax from their daily responsibilites...and start again fresh at work, on Mondays.


Belgium should not be considered as an example (now), because i believe that they drive without taking part in the points scoring.

[Mirek]

In other topic, R4 was the saviour of top lvl national classes...
The answer is that no, there are too many championships still with 2-5 R5s per event...and others have no chanche against them. Is it unfair? Well, in a way...but in the end, they are the nationals, competitions, where people with possibilities like to go to and relax from their daily responsibilites...and start again fresh at work, on Mondays.

R5 class objectively has been a huge success in Europe. No top class ever before was so successful and compared to the previous attempts it managed to break through even overseas (for example in South America). You must really try to find European championships with 2 R5 cars on the start and those are from traditionally weak rally countries. Everywhere else the level of the championship grew a lot with the R5 cars.

The point is - R5 absolutely works in national championships and there is no need to fix what is not broken especially to fix it with experiments of questionable outcome.

[Tarmop]

It`s not fixing, it`s just to give people opportunities to enjoy themselves accordingly to their life. They are not competing in the same class...there`s probably only one or two around...

[AnttiL]

That’s a silly question. The point here is to establish a viable top national category and support it as the main national class. That’s what has been done with R5 cars and thanks to it most European national series have now balanced and competitive top fields. It’s not hard to understand that balance will be at risk with the introduction of hugely expensive WRC cars.

Well you were the one to bring up the F1/F3 comparison. Rallying has always had different classes of cars within the same overall competition, circuit racing more rarely so.

I repeat myself: I don't mean WRC cars should be allowed to score points. They would work merely as an attraction for spectators. In most cases the absence of the WRC car wouldn't mean the same driver would do the event in an R5 car.




Also Your example with WRC2 is wrong (or it actually proves that Tommeke was right). The number of people following WRC2 is way lower than of those following overall standings (hell, even common media don't bother with WRC2 - even in Czech Republic where one would expect them to write something about Škoda or Kopecký's successes You usually get an information that Ogier won and Kopecký was 15th without bothering with any further details).

Well of course WRC2 is not as interesting as main WRC, it can't be compared to a national event with a guest WRC driver ahead of the actually competing R5's.

[AnttiL]

Belgium should not be considered as an example (now), because i believe that they drive without taking part in the points scoring.

No, the Ypres example is different because they have a parallel event for WRC cars. In other countries WRC cars are in the same overall standings but not eligible for points.

[mknight]

, there are too many championships still with 2-5 R5s per event...and others have no chanche against them. Is it unfair? Well, in a way... some local 4wd nationals have died because of R5, many are fading away, with spectators...only to be occasionally boosted by big names and/or WRC cars, also among the drivers btw.


So you are saying that 2-5 R5s kill local championships.
Then let's introduce 1-2 WRCs into the same championship, that will help!

Or similarly introduce 2-3 WRCs into championships that currently have 10-15 R5s om each rally. That will have exactly same effect that you just described.

As Mirek says R5 is clearly the most sucesfull class there has been in very long time. Don't change something that is not broken. Especially with something that has been tried before and didn't work (WRCs in 2005-2010, before getting banned almost everywhere).

[AnttiL]

let's introduce 1-2 WRCs into the same championship, that will help!

Or similarly introduce 2-3 WRCs into championships that currently have 10-15 R5s om each rally.

No one is suggesting this. We're talking about one-off guest drives with no points eligibility. But again I'm just repeating myself, like talking to a wall.

[mknight]

You are talking about zero eligibility, others aren't.

Zero eligibility is ok with regards to how the national championship is affected.
But still there is the issue with factory teams using their main drivers on multiple rallies to avoid testing restrictions. Hyundai now has 4 rallies planned.

[Tarmop]

So you are saying that 2-5 R5s kill local championships.
Then let's introduce 1-2 WRCs into the same championship, that will help!

Or similarly introduce 2-3 WRCs into championships that currently have 10-15 R5s om each rally. That will have exactly same effect that you just described.

As Mirek says R5 is clearly the most sucesfull class there has been in very long time. Don't change something that is not broken. Especially with something that has been tried before and didn't work (WRCs in 2005-2010, before getting banned almost everywhere).

In terms of spectators, and event sponsorship, yes. AND i am talking about non-scoring WRCs from the beginning in post nr. 1971, with the only exception that not only in the hands of WRC teams and drivers, but also privateers. Though that is also correct, that "village" events are "village" events and there is never equality in rallying or sports in general (Dr. Schmidt is a perfect example at the moment, sports in general).

[Allez Andruet]

But still there is the issue with factory teams using their main drivers on multiple rallies to avoid testing restrictions. Hyundai now has 4 rallies planned.
Thank god they have. What I find astonishing, is that now that we finally have the brutally beautiful WRC machinery that the sport craved for years (better second coming of Group B than anyone had ever hoped for), someone still thinks it would be better to keep those cars in the garage rather than let them terrorize the special stages for the pleasure of rally fans. I just don't get the logic.

[er88]

I worry for the future of the GB rally if this proposal is to go ahead. As has already been said the event has received a lot of money from the Welsh authorities as they have seen this as a flagship event to bring in tourist spend. Northern Ireland maybe a go-er as I know Bobby Willis was looking as getting the COI back in the ERC and that is basically a NI based rally. Elsewhere I'm not so sure. There was plenty of money around in Yorkshire a few years back and a ERC counter based in the county was on the blocks but fell through ironically the same promoter was involved in that deal! The money then went cycling's way and we had Le Grand Depart and now the Tour De Yorkshire however the local tourism body is in a state of flux as its Chief Exec had to leave recently under a cloud. Also there are very few of the traditional forests that the old RAC Rally used to use left for access as there is far more recreational use now and there are only a couple of allocations each year. Maybe a tie-up with the North East to use Keilder etc may work? Scotland had a bit of a failed attempt back in the IRC days but that event only got a few entries so not so sure the appetite for another try will be there.

We do need the event to get more National press coverage etc however so feel a move will be a good thing its just needs a big headline sponsor as too many salaries in the promotion/organisational team to pay otherwise.

The original plan of IMS was for Scotland (with the perthshire/trossachs stages) to take over from Wales in 2015, which was struggling badly at the time Scotland got the initial IRC contract.

But IMS fucked that event so badly despite the quality stages, by not getting the British rally championship on board or even the Scottish rally championship. So the event lacked entries basically every year and couldn't gain the momentum it deserved. It was fucked before it even began.

Wales also took on a new lease of life with the move to the north of the country and has grown a lot again with the new cars being introduced, and an exciting new championship. But I still feel Rally GB needs a new lease of life.

However without major sponsors it's simply not feasible. Visit Scotland put a lot of money into the IRC rally but it still wasn't enough without another major sponsor and more interest. If there is potential for something to happen in NI or Scotland it would be nice if IMS didn't tie events arms behind their back from the get go, unless they want more failure. I already fear for Wales this year with the service park being moved from Deeside which has easy access from huge population centres like Liverpool, Manchester etc. Instead it'll be crammed into a small seaside town on the north east tip of Wales. Smells of potential chaos but I hope I'm wrong.

I think Rally GB does need a change up and re located but I don't trust IMS to manage it properly at all - even if they did get a major sponsor on board. Once the event falls off the WRC calendar it won't come back for a long, long time - despite any promises or PR bullshit the organisers come out with. It's so important it remains for the rallying scene in the UK.

[the sniper]

I worry for the future of the GB rally if this proposal is to go ahead. As has already been said the event has received a lot of money from the Welsh authorities as they have seen this as a flagship event to bring in tourist spend. Northern Ireland maybe a go-er as I know Bobby Willis was looking as getting the COI back in the ERC and that is basically a NI based rally. Elsewhere I'm not so sure. There was plenty of money around in Yorkshire a few years back and a ERC counter based in the county was on the blocks but fell through ironically the same promoter was involved in that deal! The money then went cycling's way and we had Le Grand Depart and now the Tour De Yorkshire however the local tourism body is in a state of flux as its Chief Exec had to leave recently under a cloud. Also there are very few of the traditional forests that the old RAC Rally used to use left for access as there is far more recreational use now and there are only a couple of allocations each year. Maybe a tie-up with the North East to use Keilder etc may work? Scotland had a bit of a failed attempt back in the IRC days but that event only got a few entries so not so sure the appetite for another try will be there.

I'm curious to see if the MN version of this story adds a bit more meat to the bones, as I'm not sure what Oliver Ciesla actually wants in reality. He says "There's a huge fan base and lots of tradition. But we are running this event, not in the heart of the country where the fans are." Where does he consider the heart of the country, where the fans are...? If we're talking about Britain, I'd say you are in the heartland of rallying in this country, and arguably is as close to "where the fans are" as you can reasonably get with a proper forest rally. The north/mid Wales location is probably the best compromise for being central within the UK, allowing fans to travel from across the UK & Ireland. Once you move the rally to Scotland or Northern England (presumably the intent would be for a Newcastle/Gateshead HQ), you're really moving the rally away from "where the fans are", or at least away from where the bulk of the UK population are.

Then you have the move to Northern Ireland, which will serve the island of Ireland brilliantly I'm sure, but won't really serve the British fan base at all beyond those of us hardcore fans who will make the trip over. But then any rally in Europe serves us to a similar extent. That article seems to give the impression that it'd still be 'Rally GB' in Northern Ireland rather than the Circuit of Ireland? That'd be a very poor decision, but I can imagine Motorsport UK wanting to keep their hand in the event. For a start, maybe some abroad aren't familiar with this, but Northern Ireland isn't actually a part of Great Britain, but is part of the UK. I would personally prefer for the rally there to be a CoI rather than a completely out of character 'Rally GB'.

Personally I like the concept of one year in Wales, one year in Scotland, one year in Newcastle (for Kielder/Yorkshire), then a year off for CoI, before three more years of rotating Rally GB. Obviously as has been said though the funding model is the issue. The article quotes Iain Campbell as saying MSUK have been working with the "Welsh Assembly, the WRC Promoter and the devolved governments of Northern Ireland and Scotland" which makes sense. Rally of Scotland received £250,000 in 2011 from the Scottish Government (plus £50k from Stirling and Kinross Councils) and the CoI received "significant funding" from 2014 to 2016 from the NI Government, so the precedent is there, and with a WRC round being a much better sell, I can imagine them being able to provide more money for a bigger WRC event. Funding a Newcastle/Kielder/Yorkshire combined event would seem more complicated, as nobodies interests are fully served that well. As you say I could see Yorkshire being up for it, going it alone, as they seemingly were before, but there can only be a maximum of 100km of forest road available now, even less of a WRC worthy standard. So realistically I think we'll only see Wales, NI and Scotland rotating.

All that aside, while I don't like to see the UK treated as a special case in general (Brexit...), I think the potential popularity of Rally GB is still intrinsically linked to a return to an RAC style rally. I can't see anything other than that truly reigniting an interest amongst the general public/sponsors. To me it'd make sense for the FIA/WRC Promoter to allow Rally Monte Carlo, the Safari and Rally GB (start, middle-ish and end of calendar) a bit of leeway to be something different from the standard 350km cloverleaf model. If you look at some of the long road sections being permitted to get to and from SSS on some WRC rounds in recent years, I don't think the likes of Deeside/Chester to Grisedale or Carlisle to Hamsterley to Cropton (without return or repeat trips) compare too badly...


However without major sponsors it's simply not feasible. Visit Scotland put a lot of money into the IRC rally but it still wasn't enough without another major sponsor and more interest. If there is potential for something to happen in NI or Scotland it would be nice if IMS didn't tie events arms behind their back from the get go, unless they want more failure. I already fear for Wales this year with the service park being moved from Deeside which has easy access from huge population centres like Liverpool, Manchester etc. Instead it'll be crammed into a small seaside town on the north east tip of Wales. Smells of potential chaos but I hope I'm wrong.

Entirely agree. Personally I can see this being the first year that I don't go to the service park...


I think Rally GB does need a change up and re located but I don't trust IMS to manage it properly at all - even if they did get a major sponsor on board. Once the event falls off the WRC calendar it won't come back for a long, long time - despite any promises or PR bullshit the organisers come out with. It's so important it remains for the rallying scene in the UK.

That must be the fear, a risk which I think can be seen across various elements of British rallying. Once it stops, the impetus to keep the show on the road may be lost. Ten years ago I think you could argue that Rally GB only kept going because the MSA at least didn't think they could get away with letting it die...

[Rally Power]

Thank god they have. What I find astonishing, is that now that we finally have the brutally beautiful WRC machinery that the sport craved for years (better second coming of Group B than anyone had ever hoped for), someone still thinks it would be better to keep those cars in the garage rather than let them terrorize the special stages for the pleasure of rally fans. I just don't get the logic.

The logic is quite simple: despite being brutally beautiful machines, current WRC cars are too expensive for national rally use and for that reason they can’t provide a large and competitive national top rally field, like most rally fans want and R5 cars are providing. In that sense crews using R5's must be protected (not only in terms of championship points but also on their rally overall win chances) and occasional WRC entries should only be allowed in demo mode.

[Allez Andruet]

The logic is quite simple: despite being brutally beautiful machines, current WRC cars are too expensive for national rally use and for that reason they can’t provide a large and competitive national top rally field, like most rally fans want and R5 cars are providing. In that sense crews using R5's must be protected (not only in terms of championship points but also on their rally overall win chances) and occasional WRC entries should only be allowed in demo mode.

But in that case we should ban the R5s immediately and focus only on some R1 or R2 machinery - IF the widest and most competitive (I guess that means number of entrants) field of cars is set as a priority.

But ok, maybe we have to agree to disagree here ;)

[AnttiL]

https://www.rallit.fi/kaksi-mm-rallia-liipaisimella-kalenteriluonnos-menossa-wrc-komissiolle/

The WRC Calendar draft for 2020 leaves out Corsica and Germany to make room for Kenya and Japan. Also mentioned is the possible swap of Australia for New Zealand.

[er88]

It really annoys me Sardinia stays over Germany or even Corsica (and I've said in the past Corisca should go because France technically have two events with Monte). However to only have Japan as a true tarmac event next year is an absolute disgrace for the championship (unless GB moves to the tarmac of Northern Ireland AND Spain gets back to being full tarmac).

I really do like what Cielsa is trying to do in making this a proper world championship. I like the Mexico/Argentina/Chile long events, the return to Japan will be great and they've brought back the Safari (and aren't going to make it a pathetic 300km event either which is a relief), but where's the tarmac....

[AnttiL]

Safari (and aren't going to make it a pathetic 300km event either which is a relief)

I believe it when I see it. Unless the maximum length is increased again for next year...

The 500 km thing was mentioned by a "source close to the event" who might remember wrong or not know the latest regulations...

[Katvala]

I believe it when I see it. Unless the maximum length is increased again for next year...

The 500 km thing was mentioned by a "source close to the event" who might remember wrong or not know the latest regulations...I believe it was Mouton who said that

Sent from my F8331 using Tapatalk

[AnttiL]

I believe it was Mouton who said that

Sent from my F8331 using Tapatalk

https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/142847/safari-rally-told-to-toughen-up-route-for-return


A source close to the event said: "She [Mouton] said her desire and that of the world is to see the Safari Rally as a true test of man and machine.

"Although a WRC Safari will be shortened to around 500 kilometres (310 miles) spread over three days, it must remain hard work for the current crop of sprinters who are so evenly matched that in some events they are separated by milliseconds.

Doesn't actually seem a quote at all, just a misplaced quote character.

EDIT: I sent the author (David Evans) a question about this and he replied that in his understanding Safari are trying to get a waiver to run a longer itinerary.

[racerx1979]

I believe it when I see it. Unless the maximum length is increased again for next year...

The 500 km thing was mentioned by a "source close to the event" who might remember wrong or not know the latest regulations...

Kenya will not be a 500km rally. I can tell you first hand. Was born in Kenya and have indirect ties to the organizers of the rally. They don't have enough private land for 500km. Public land is too dangerous and risky. It's basically farm land and fire roads... Mostly smooth roads even better than Turkey. I met two of the main organizers at Rally Turkey last year. They we're very vocal about how rough the Turkish roads were since they drove through many stages with FIA.. A vid of what stages would look like. https://youtu.be/mWLZhNgHVmA

[AnttiL]

It's basically farm land and fire roads... Mostly smooth roads even better than Turkey.

A vid of what stages would look like. https://youtu.be/mWLZhNgHVmA

I know, I wrote about it already last year https://itgetsfasternow.com/2018/06/23/the-return-of-the-safari/

[denkimi]

Kenya will not be a 500km rally. I can tell you first hand. Was born in Kenya and have indirect ties to the organizers of the rally. They don't have enough private land for 500km. Public land is too dangerous and risky. It's basically farm land and fire roads... Mostly smooth roads even better than Turkey. I met two of the main organizers at Rally Turkey last year. They we're very vocal about how rough the Turkish roads were since they drove through many stages with FIA.. A vid of what stages would look like. https://youtu.be/mWLZhNgHVmA
Where are the corners?
They will need longer gears if they are going to drive 400 out of 400km straight and flatout against the limiter.

[jbmarcus21]

today M-Sport testing in France on tarmac new Ford Fiesta R5 with Valtteri Bottas ► http://bit.ly/2M422kb

[Rally Power]

But ok, maybe we have to agree to disagree here ;)

Amen to that ;)


However to only have Japan as a true tarmac event next year is an absolute disgrace for the championship (unless GB moves to the tarmac of Northern Ireland AND Spain gets back to being full tarmac).

I believe Catalunya organizers already admitted that 2019 would be their last mix rally.

[EstWRC]

i wont miss Corsica (alhtough this year it awesome and step into the right direction with the new stages) but i will definitely miss Germany, sad to hear its out, ive always liked this event with its unique stages in vineyard and military area, good challenge for drivers IMO. Especially if it rains.

with that being said, im also sure that now Rally Spain will be full tarmac rally from 2020, but IMO it isnt enough. Like er88 says, its an absolute disgrace for the championship. Only 2 pure tarmac rallies ?

And together with Monte kinda 3, but we know Monte is in its own category.

If New Zealand makes it then i would be a lot happier.

[mknight]

Where are the corners?
They will need longer gears if they are going to drive 400 out of 400km straight and flatout against the limiter.

Yeah that vid as well as the one AnttiL has on his site are just terrible, sure scenery and setting is interesting but the 2 shown stages are horrible.

[the sniper]

A little bit more info about the Rally GB situation in this BBC article. If it goes to Northern Ireland in 2020, it'd be back in Wales in 2021, according to Motorsport UK chief executive Hugh Chambers. No mention of Scotland or elsewhere.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-48292439

[AnttiL]

Yeah that vid as well as the one AnttiL has on his site are just terrible, sure scenery and setting is interesting but the 2 shown stages are horrible.

Yes. In a way those roads work when the idea is to drive 1000 km in one day - you need to keep up the speed on the smooth sections and know when to slow down for the bad places not to break the car. But it doesn't work for a rally where you fight for tenths of seconds. The average speeds on the national private R5's has been as high as 120 km/h - the WRC's could probably go up to 140 km/h. Let's see if they start putting chicanes on those stages...

[Allez Andruet]

Let's see if they start putting chicanes on those stages...
It's about time for mr. Rilli to check whether his export licence is still valid...

On a more serious note, in some twisted way I almost like the idea of 500kms of these roads that don't seemingly make any sense to be used in WRC rally. In a way that would make the championship's return to Africa even more unique, i.e. to make the rally differ as much as possible from other events. Maybe we'll end up having the most boring rally ever, but I'm willing to give it a shot.

[AnttiL]

With the drivers attacking the stages at full, the rally could be decided on a puncture roulette.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

A little bit more info about the Rally GB situation in this BBC article. If it goes to Northern Ireland in 2020, it'd be back in Wales in 2021, according to Motorsport UK chief executive Hugh Chambers. No mention of Scotland or elsewhere.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-48292439

I just did a search on the two main UK sports sites, BBC Sport & Sky Sports, and there isnt one single mention of rallying (WRC or national).

This shows how invisible the sport is here and so how unlikely it is for anywhere other than NI is to take on Rally GB.

[rallyfiend]

I just did a search on the two main UK sports sites, BBC Sport & Sky Sports, and there isnt one single mention of rallying (WRC or national).

This shows how invisible the sport is here and so how unlikely it is for anywhere other than NI is to take on Rally GB.

Do you think you're the only one with internet, and no one has the ability to check your bullshit?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/motorsport/48248493

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Do you think you're the only one with internet, and no one has the ability to check your bullshit?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/motorsport/48248493

One small page, well done on finding that ! Probably from the N.Ireland Section seeing as they only mention Meeke, and not fellow Brit Elfyn Evans...

I just looked at the main page https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/motorsport where there is nothing about WRC.

Anything on the Sky Sports site - probably the most popular sports news site in the UK, especially with younger people ?

[racerx1979]

https://www.kahawatungu.com/2019/05/18/safari-rally-closer-world-rally-championship/

[denkimi]

Yes. In a way those roads work when the idea is to drive 1000 km in one day - you need to keep up the speed on the smooth sections and know when to slow down for the bad places not to break the car. But it doesn't work for a rally where you fight for tenths of seconds. The average speeds on the national private R5's has been as high as 120 km/h - the WRC's could probably go up to 140 km/h. Let's see if they start putting chicanes on those stages...
If they use longer gears i suspect we could see even much higher average speeds than that.


It's about time for mr. Rilli to check whether his export licence is still valid...

On a more serious note, in some twisted way I almost like the idea of 500kms of these roads that don't seemingly make any sense to be used in WRC rally. In a way that would make the championship's return to Africa even more unique, i.e. to make the rally differ as much as possible from other events. Maybe we'll end up having the most boring rally ever, but I'm willing to give it a shot.
Those roads would only make sense in something like dakar, where there is no reconnaissance en navigations plays a big part. Just because it would be unique doesn't mean its usefull.

[the sniper]

I wouldn't say this for any other 'new' rally really, but given how relatively unique the Safari will be if it does indeed return for 2020, would there not be a reasonably substantial benefit to any of the WRC guys in taking part in the 2019 candidate event? Even if it were only in an R5?

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Does a return to Africa have to be a 'Safari-style' event anyway ?

Rally Chile was new but its roads and itinerary were comparable with many current events. Chile is even a location for the modern Dakar but no-one said its WRC event should use such areas...

[tommeke_B]

Chile is even a location for the modern Dakar but no-one said its WRC event should use such areas...

Was a location for Dakar last time in 2015. And the closest point they got to the current rally location is roughly 1300kms... So what's the point of what you are saying?

[Hartusvuori]

Jari Huttunen will do two Finnish Championship events in an i20 Coupe WRC. The organizers of Pohjanmaa-ralli, held in mid June, confirmed the team is coming. The first start will be this weekend in Riihimäki-ralli.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Was a location for Dakar last time in 2015. And the closest point they got to the current rally location is roughly 1300kms... So what's the point of what you are saying?

Exactly that - WRC Chile wasnt using any of it's previous Dakar route, type of 'roads' or big distances.

So why does a WRC rally in Kenya have to be like the old Safari ie. extra long and tough ?

A 'normal' gravel rally held there would still be good as it would put WRC back on that continent.

[jbmarcus21]

Today M-Sport continues the test with new Ford Fiesta R5 and Eric Camilli
Here the video ► https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qjzt-rgDFY0&t=6s

[AnttiL]

Exactly that - WRC Chile wasnt using any of it's previous Dakar route, type of 'roads' or big distances.

So why does a WRC rally in Kenya have to be like the old Safari ie. extra long and tough ?

A 'normal' gravel rally held there would still be good as it would put WRC back on that continent.

Chile has a long tradition of normal rallying on the roads we saw a week ago. Why should they have suddenly used a Dakar element? Kenya has similarly arranged rallies on the roads similar to the candidate event for years.

Besides, I don’t think Kenya has much road types to choose from.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

WALES RALLY GB:
Just revealed - the route for @WalesRallyGB 2019 (3-6 October). More information here https://t.co/Gzogf7R9yW

and here: https://www.walesrallygb.com/innovations-power-wales-rally-gb-to-new-heights/

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Chile has a long tradition of normal rallying on the roads we saw a week ago. Why should they have suddenly used a Dakar element? Kenya has similarly arranged rallies on the roads similar to the candidate event for years.

Besides, I don’t think Kenya has much road types to choose from.

I didnt say Chile should change and use Dakar elements, exactly the opposite. I used that as an example of why a Kenya WRC event doesnt need to be like the old Safari...

[doubled1978]

Honestly, without seeing the timings of the stages it looks like a sensible route...makes sense to go back to Brenig on the final day because there is way more parking than Gwydir and Elsi.
Good that there will be a night stage on Friday again.
Bit nostalgic going back to Oulton Park, last time I remember going there was for the rally was 1987. Should be better than TIR Prince tho...

[Allez Andruet]

1769
1770

Could it be...

Tuominen's tweet is about him being "cleared for atleast one more international motorsport competition".

[AnttiL]

I didnt say Chile should change and use Dakar elements, exactly the opposite. I used that as an example of why a Kenya WRC event doesnt need to be like the old Safari...

Still has no logic to it. Safari was once a part of WRC, Chile Dakar roads were not (not sure of Codasur in early 80’s).

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Still has no logic to it. Safari was once a part of WRC, Chile Dakar roads were not (not sure of Codasur in early 80’s).

I give up, some people will argue with Our Lord.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Honestly, without seeing the timings of the stages it looks like a sensible route...makes sense to go back to Brenig on the final day because there is way more parking than Gwydir and Elsi.
Good that there will be a night stage on Friday again.
Bit nostalgic going back to Oulton Park, last time I remember going there was for the rally was 1987. Should be better than TIR Prince tho...

I was last at Oulton Park for the RAC Rally in 1993 to see McRae & Burns.

If I remember right it was torrential rain there in 1992 and a nightmare to get out of the circuit when the stage finished.

It was quite a decent for a spectator stage and far better than the usual 'street-stages'.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Rally GB itinerary: https://d2cx26qpfwuhvu.cloudfront.net/wrgb/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/22092301/2019-Wales-Rally-GB-Route-1.2.pdf

[AnttiL]

It was quite a decent for a spectator stage and far better than the usual 'street-stages'.

True. The RAC ”Mickey mouse” stages seem pretty neat when compared to today’s super specials. But who knows, they could still ”spice” Oulton up with donuts and jump ramps...

[doubled1978]

I was last at Oulton Park for the RAC Rally in 1993 to see McRae & Burns.

If I remember right it was torrential rain there in 1992 and a nightmare to get out of the circuit when the stage finished.

It was quite a decent for a spectator stage and far better than the usual 'street-stages'.

I recall ‘92 being properly wet....I think we went to Weston Park & Clumber Park on day 1 if I remember right.

[mknight]

1769
1770

Could it be...

Tuominen's tweet is about him being "cleared for atleast one more international motorsport competition".

Since he wasn't nominated last year it would also fall under the additional testing days rule:



66.4.4 For Manufacturers, 7 additional test days may be allocated to each team in addition to Art. 66.4.2.
These additional days will only be applicable to guest drivers who have not been nominated to score points
up to the requested testing date in the Manufacturers Championship in the previous or current year.


I don't think Toyota lacks testing days though.

They talk about 4th car. The only really good reason for me would be testing for Turkey (where they struggled last year) during an actual rally.

[dimviii]

Peugeot Sport
‏Verified account @peugeotsport


BREAKING NEWS // François Wales has been named as Director of #PeugeotSport, succeeding Bruno Famin who having led Peugeot Sport crews to victories at the 24 Hours at Le Mans, Pikes Peak & Dakar. He rejoins the @fia as Director of Operations for Sports. Massive thanks, Bruno!

https://twitter.com/peugeotsport/status/1131185167333318656

[Allez Andruet]

Anyway I don't believe it will happen, unless Toyota bosses pressure Tommi. Tommi himself doesn't seem to be keen on dropping drivers mid-season, and don't see the point of 4th car (Hyundai learned that in Portugal last year).

It would most certainly be a 4th car. Tommi sure ain't dropping anyone he's picked himself.

[mknight]

It would most certainly be a 4th car. Tommi sure ain't dropping anyone he's picked himself.

I edited the post after I read the tweet comments.

4th car with the purpose for testing for Turkey makes most sense.

[AndyRAC]

True. The RAC ”Mickey mouse” stages seem pretty neat when compared to today’s super specials. But who knows, they could still ”spice” Oulton up with donuts and jump ramps...

Don't give them ideas......

[jiipee64]

Juho will drive Yaris in Sardinia.

[Allez Andruet]

https://twitter.com/TGR_WRC/status/1131424759177203713

There we go. Hänninen/Tuominen in a Yaris WRC entered by Tommi Mäkinen Racing.

[er88]

That's great news!!!

Took him half a year to get upto speed in 2017, hopefully he can be on the pace in Sardinia but I don't have big expectations. One of my favourite drivers, shame he never realised his full potential in the WRC.

[EstWRC]

great and interesting news, especially the part "to stay race-sharp"

[rp]

great and interesting news, especially the part "to stay race-sharp"

Full season for Hänninen in 2020 as a 3rd car...

[racerx1979]

That's great news!!!

Took him half a year to get upto speed in 2017, hopefully he can be on the pace in Sardinia but I don't have big expectations. One of my favourite drivers, shame he never realised his full potential in the WRC.

Juho really started to get his groove by the second half of the season. TGR says he's possibly the best test driver they've had so it says a lot about his style. I think of him as the Finnish Meeke. He just needs to work things out.. the speed and talent is there. Happy to see him back. I heard about him driving earlier this year ...

[AnttiL]

great and interesting news, especially the part "to stay race-sharp"

I still think it’s mostly for testing purposes. And to recheck his pace level

[er88]

If he does well in Sardinia would Finland be a possibility? If he's only in for one event I don't get why they'd do Sardinia over his home event.

This could also be Makinen perhaps hedging his bets and maybe thinking about getting Juho upto speed for a full campaign in 2020 - taking over from Jari? If Latvala's performances/luck don't improve, Juho might even be needed to help out in the second half of this season.

[denkimi]

So toyota already understands a 4th car might help tanak get the title. Now lets wait untill hyundai realises the same thing and also starts using 4 cars.

[AnttiL]

https://www.rallit.fi/tommi-makinen-selvittaa-mista-juho-hannisen-wrc-paluussa-on-kyse/

In here Mäkinen says it’s just for testing. But yeah, it’s also Mäkinen saying.

[mknight]

That's great news!!!
Took him half a year to get upto speed in 2017, hopefully he can be on the pace in Sardinia but I don't have big expectations. One of my favourite drivers, shame he never realised his full potential in the WRC.

I don't think he will aim to "get up to speed", if he retires there wont be much testing done.

But if it's normal Sardinia with heavy cleaning he could be top 5 ish after Friday since he starts last.

EDIT: Toyota doesn't need any more testing in Finland with the "unlimited" testing they have there atm.

[mknight]

So toyota already understands a 4th car might help tanak get the title. Now lets wait untill hyundai realises the same thing and also starts using 4 cars.
They did that exactly a year ago in Portugal... and showed how problematic it was.
The two nominated drivers dropped (Paddon crashed out, Mikkelsen got first powersteering and after engine issue), and Sordo who wasn't nominated didn't bring any points.

That said, in heavy cleaning rallies it might sometimes help for driver points but imo it's better to use the money on other things... unless you can combine it with testing... bringing us back to Toyota.

[Googol]

They did that exactly a year ago in Portugal... and showed how problematic it was.
The two nominated drivers dropped (Paddon crashed out, Mikkelsen got first powersteering and after engine issue), and Sordo who wasn't nominated didn't bring any points.

What was the problematic part?

[mknight]

What was the problematic part?

Even though he finished 4th, running the 4th car gave them 0 manu points and 0 driver points taken off their rivals. So high? cost with no benefit at all.

[dimviii]

Even though he finished 4th, running the 4th car gave them 0 manu points and 0 driver points taken off their rivals. So high? cost with no benefit at all.

and because that happened once,it will be such for ever?

[Googol]

Even though he finished 4th, running the 4th car gave them 0 manu points and 0 driver points taken off their rivals. So high? cost with no benefit at all.

And the problem? I'm pretty sure they knrw that he won't score team points when they put him in the start list.

[mknight]

and because that happened once,it will be such for ever?

Obviously not, but the risk is there and it's not small, rather the opposite.

Typically you don't have freely available 4th driver that both knows the car and can be relied to take points off the top3. (Haninen can't reliable take points off them, neither could Sordo last year). If a driver is so fast that he can you'd want to nominate him for manu points... but then what's the point of the 4th not-nominated driver again?

The cost-benefit calculation doesn't look nice. This is why Nandan didn't do that in 2017 (his own words) even though he was talking about considering it. His reasoning was that if the 4th driver could at least "block" manu points of other drivers (i.e if he finished 6th the manu nominated driver behind him would get manu points for 7th) then it might have been interesting, but with rules as they are it wasn't worth it.

[AnttiL]

Hyundai used four cars in Portugal 2018 in order to give equal amount of rallies for Sordo and Paddon. Choosing the non-nominated driver was a gamble which they ”lost”. But the result could have been the same with just no Sordo finishing at all on a three-car lineup.

[dimviii]

Obviously not, but the risk is there and it's not small, rather the opposite.
.

so you think that starting with 4 drivers at more rallies will be a disadvantage for Hyundai.
and all this,because once they tried they failed.

[Crazy J]

great and interesting news, especially the part "to stay race-sharp"

It is nice for Hanninen to get this guest star opportunity to yet extend his rally career. It is a shame though that after all those promising title years with Skoda, the WRC career was just getting nowhere. I hope Lappi haven't got the same disease.

[COD]

Hänninen case makes sense, testing the car in real conditions and when he does a rally, he is better tester as well as he has up to date experience.

[Simmi]

If they end up running Katsuta as a fourth car too at points is there some merit to expanding and bringing through new crew members etc? Can test more than just the car in a rally situation.

[Tarmop]

They don`t need to expand...

[racerx1979]

If they end up running Katsuta as a fourth car too at points is there some merit to expanding and bringing through new crew members etc? Can test more than just the car in a rally situation.

Well rumor has it Katsuta needs a lot of time and work (not really a rumor if you ask me) before he is granted a full drive. Kalle will be driving a full season in a Toyota before Katsuta...

At least that's what the TGR team is reporting to the high-ups and who can disagree. Katsuta would be finishing nowhere near the current top 10 and would end up costing a lot of money.

[Japé]

It would be easier to compare Katsuta's performance against other R5 drivers if he would be driving e.g. new Polo or Fabia instead of old Fiesta.

[racerx1979]

It would be easier to compare Katsuta's performance against other R5 drivers if he would be driving e.g. new Polo or Fabia instead of old Fiesta.

Of course, but he has tested the Yaris...

[mknight]

so you think that starting with 4 drivers at more rallies will be a disadvantage for Hyundai.
and all this,because once they tried they failed.

There is always the option that you actually start to read what I write, but it looks it might be too hard. Somehow it always feels like you read 1/4 of the post, turn off your brain and hit reply... let's try one last time:

Running 4th car with current rules just to take driver points off the top 3 is expensive and with high-risk of failure.
Both based on the one time Hyundai did it but also by analysing the normal results. Just yesterday I did a full analysis of how many points other drivers (Loeb, Sordo, Mikkelsen, Meeke, Latvala, Lappi, Suninen) took off the top 3 so far in the season (in Hyundai thread) . The average was about 0.7 points per rally. Sordo has 2 points/rally but that's only from 3 starts so it's quite uncertain. Note that 3 of the 7 drivers took zero points off the top 3 over 16 combined starts). So in the extreme you risk that in 16 rallies your 4th driver doesn't help in any way.

Even in the average case using all that money to take 1 point per rally doesn't seem to be good use of money. If It was Hyundai could have been doing that since end of 2017 and Toyota during whole 2018. Similar situation at Citroen where they decided not to run 3rd car this year.
All of them think that using the money for car development is a better idea.

Now Toyota is trying to somehow combine both. We won’t ever really know how sucessfull the development part was. Overall it might be a good idea for a few rallies during the year but likely not for the majority of the season.

[dimviii]

There is always the option that you actually start to read what I write, but it looks it might be too hard. Somehow it always feels like you read 1/4 of the post, turn off your brain and hit reply... let's try one last time:


man what happens with you?
you said that running 4 cars has more possibilities to dont collect points,basing your opinion at when they tried once.
Actually you said that more possibilities are to DONT collect points.
Thats is plain stupid,to express it as politely as i can

Obviously not, but the risk is there and it's not small, rather the opposite.

About the cost factor,Hyundai wants a championship,and that they will try at all costs.
Hyundai doesnt target to fix the cheaper points per euro this year.Specially after so many years without something to achieve.
So its better YOU to read again what you write,before posting,not me.

[EstWRC]

it sounds so weird to me that one forum member is so worried about the costs that the teams are running.

Like it would come out of his pocket.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Good podcast interview with Julian Porter - season so far, news and rumours.

Absolute Rally: https://www.podbean.com/media/player/gergy-b22b88-pb?vjs=1

[Allez Andruet]

it sounds so weird to me that one forum member is so worried about the costs that the teams are running.

Yep, this amazing post-2016 era of WRC will more or less come to an end as such in few years with all the hybrid and electric stuff that's already around the corner (and I'm not against it). The more the teams spend during this time, the more cars we'll see on special stages and the more fun we'll have following it. Hard to see any cons on that.

[Googol]

If you call high costs a problem, then I guess running 4th car is problematic. I just fail to see how this problem was demonstrated by Sordo finishing 4th. Especially I don't see, how Paddon and Mikkelsen's issues are related to this high cost problem.

[Rally Power]

Peugeot Sport
‏Verified account @peugeotsport


BREAKING NEWS // François Wales has been named as Director of #PeugeotSport, succeeding Bruno Famin who having led Peugeot Sport crews to victories at the 24 Hours at Le Mans, Pikes Peak & Dakar. He rejoins the @fia as Director of Operations for Sports. Massive thanks, Bruno!
https://twitter.com/peugeotsport/status/1131185167333318656

Apparently, the new guy is responsible for PSA EV’s sport projects; hope this change won’t mean Peugeot will enter Extreme E, the new motorsport farce from Formula E promoters.

[deephouse]

Apparently, the new guy is responsible for PSA EV’s sport projects; hope this change won’t mean Peugeot will enter Extreme E, the new motorsport farce from Formula E promoters.

Really not the thing for WRC thread. They are not here for many years now. And PSA with Citroen doesn't count. They are separate team and if they are not interested in rallying on a high level I think that this info is not important for anybody.

[Rally Power]

Really not the thing for WRC thread. They are not here for many years now. And PSA with Citroen doesn't count. They are separate team and if they are not interested in rallying on a high level I think that this info is not important for anybody.

Somehow everyting in motorsport is related. When manus decide to put money in a new series they just move it from the existing ones. This EE project looks to be a joke, with no capacity to affect off road and rally series in the future, but with FE marketing gang behind it it’s hard to tell.

[itix]

I read recently that Germany and Corsica are hanging by on their finger tips as a result of Japan and Kenya knocking on the door. While I semi understand Corsica with the three people spectating the stages and the logistics (even though it is one of my personal favorites), why Germany?
Why boot out the best tarmac event in the calendar with loads of fans, excellent atmosphere and crowd control? We have too many copy paste gravel events, why boot out Germany? From what I have understood, Japan is intended to be a tarmac event, correct?

Boot out Australia. It is retarded, boring and nobody likes it. It is hopeless logistically and like 50 percent of the 10 people annually spectating are always drunken morons that have passed out in on the actual stage road. Why is it even on the calendar?

[Davidbrice]

«» .
: https://lcokbhlw.bestseller-super.ru

[steve.mandzij]

I read recently that Germany and Corsica are hanging by on their finger tips as a result of Japan and Kenya knocking on the door. While I semi understand Corsica with the three people spectating the stages and the logistics (even though it is one of my personal favorites), why Germany?
Why boot out the best tarmac event in the calendar with loads of fans, excellent atmosphere and crowd control? We have too many copy paste gravel events, why boot out Germany? From what I have understood, Japan is intended to be a tarmac event, correct?

Boot out Australia. It is retarded, boring and nobody likes it. It is hopeless logistically and like 50 percent of the 10 people annually spectating are always drunken morons that have passed out in on the actual stage road. Why is it even on the calendar?Australia is supposed to be replaced by NZ in the same plans, if I'm not mistaken. I think it's only a one off, though.

[Davidbrice]

«» .
: https://lcokbhlw.bestseller-super.ru

[deephouse]

Money talks.

[Davidbrice]

«» .
: https://lcokbhlw.bestseller-super.ru

[rallyfiend]

«» .
: https://lcokbhlw.bestseller-super.ru

Australian's buy 1.2 million new cars a year. It's one of the top per capita new car sales markets in the entire world (after the US).
Top brands:
- Toyota
- Mazda
- Hyundai
- Mitsubishi
- Ford

NZ's buy 160,000 new cars.

I can see why Australia is a favoured place to go...

[EstWRC]

but there are only 10 people on the stages and the stages and service park are middle of nowhere

thats what the teams are complaining about Rally Australia, its just not only about car sales.

[rallyfiend]

but there are only 10 people on the stages and the stages and service park are middle of nowhere

thats what the teams are complaining about Rally Australia, its just not only about car sales.

How many more would you expect in NZ?

It may have nice roads, but it's not known for its huge spectator numbers either.....

I was there in 2012 (I'm from the UK, so not trying to push a pro-Aus theme here) and it was not exactly over-run with spectators, and the service park in Auckland was a disaster.

We need to be careful to not attached some sort of 'golden glow' to something that was not really that good....

[Eli]

So it wouldn't be wrong to assume next year's calendar will be something like: MC, Sweden, Mexico, Argentina, Chile, Portugal, Sardegna, Kenya, Finland, Turkey, NZ, Japan, Spain & Ireland(?)

If they say they don't want the island rallies and they boot out Corsica, by that logic, Sardegna should be out no? Why can't they leave Germany in the calendar? It's location is ideal to attract people from more than just Germany, they have very nice stages, Japan will be a Tarmac event anyhow, why not keep it & have more Tarmac events??

[Tarmop]

Well, if i remember correctly, someone behind his kitchen table just claimed, after visiting Otago rally, that it was packed with spectators.

[AnttiL]

So it wouldn't be wrong to assume next year's calendar will be something like: MC, Sweden, Mexico, Argentina, Chile, Portugal, Sardegna, Kenya, Finland, Turkey, NZ, Japan, Spain & Ireland(?)

Not Ireland. Northern Ireland maybe, but it’s still unclear, as is NZ. Otherwise well assumed.


If they say they don't want the island rallies and they boot out Corsica, by that logic, Sardegna should be out no? Why can't they leave Germany in the calendar? It's location is ideal to attract people from more than just Germany, they have very nice stages, Japan will be a Tarmac event anyhow, why not keep it & have more Tarmac events??


NI would be a tarmac rally, that must be a motivation to move it from Wales. But that is an island rally in any case!

[Eli]

Not Ireland. Northern Ireland maybe, but it’s still unclear, as is NZ. Otherwise well assumed.




NI would be a tarmac rally, that must be a motivation to move it from Wales. But that is an island rally in any case!

My bad, but even with NI as a tarmac rally, wouldn't it be nice to see more Tarmac events?

[rallyfiend]

Well, if i remember correctly, someone behind his kitchen table just claimed, after visiting Otago rally, that it was packed with spectators.

Well, he was being paid to attend there and create good PR, so he's not going to bash it....

[EstWRC]

How many more would you expect in NZ?

It may have nice roads, but it's not known for its huge spectator numbers either.....

it all depends if Paddon participates or not, im sure if he does then there would be a lot of people. im just assuming, i cant be 100% sure.

but at the moment it isnt hard to get more people on the stages than at Australia. For me that rally has stagnated.

Would be great to at least give a chance to NZ and to see what happens.

[AnttiL]

https://www.rallit.fi/toyotan-wrc-tiimin-paatos-tuli-yllatyksena-suomalaiskuskille-mietin-etta-mika-juttu-tama-on/

Hänninen says Sardegna is most likely his last WRC event and the purpose is testing

[AnttiL]

My bad, but even with NI as a tarmac rally, wouldn't it be nice to see more Tarmac events?

Catalynua could also become an all-tarmac rally according to rumors. That would make it Japan, Spain, Monte and maybe NI.

[Eli]

Catalynua could also become an all-tarmac rally according to rumors. That would make it Japan, Spain, Monte and maybe NI.

Will be an interesting year then, we'll see how it rolls out.

[Allez Andruet]

https://www.rallit.fi/toyotan-wrc-tiimin-paatos-tuli-yllatyksena-suomalaiskuskille-mietin-etta-mika-juttu-tama-on/

Hänninen says Sardegna is most likely his last WRC event and the purpose is testing

Or maybe it's the last one before the next one? That would fit well into this Tommi-esque communication strategy.

[EstWRC]

Good podcast interview with Julian Porter - season so far, news and rumours.

Absolute Rally: https://www.podbean.com/media/player/gergy-b22b88-pb?vjs=1

thanks for the link.

very interesting to hear Porters insights. Especially about the Toyota rim problems, Kruuda was saying the same after Corsica as Porter here.

and the fact that Mikkelsen now has rally-to-rally contract. I didnt know that.

Nobody hasnt mentioned it here ?

[racerx1979]

thanks for the link.

very interesting to hear Porters insights. Especially about the Toyota rim problems, Kruuda was saying the same after Corsica as Porter here.

and the fact that Mikkelsen now has rally-to-rally contract. I didnt know that.

Nobody hasnt mentioned it here ?

Apparently they renegotiated to a specific term at the beginning of 2019. Not sure of the exact terms, but Hyundai has given Andreas plenty of chances. Loebs Chile results did not help. They're now short of drivers for Finland and we all know Andreas performs poorly in Finland...he said it himself during Chile. So now they're desperate and have Huttunen testing as he might be their only hope for Finland. What to do with Andreas moving forward? Loeb won't do the full season... Bring Paddon back or try to get Ostberg or Breen??

[mknight]

It is entirely funny how Citroen was criticized for dropping Meeke for one rally after 4 crashes in 3 rallies in 2017.... afterwards they didn't drop him even when two next rallies were both disaster (no speed In Finland and crash on first SS in Germany.
They kept him in the car and he won the 3rd rally.

Now when Hyundai drops Mikkelsen
one rally after finishing 2nd "he has had enough chances". What was it he did again? Oh he finished 7th scoring more points that both Toyota drivers, the horror.

The only logical explanation is that Loeb's performance there is the main reason and they definitely wanted him to drive. When deciding whom to drop they picked Mikkelsen. So 1. Want Loeb =>2.Drop one of the others => 3. Mikkelsen. Not the complely other way around as some people here suggest.

The underlying reason might be that Hyundai expects good improvement from the changes they have planned after Sardinia (that will benefit anyone who drives the car) and tries to squeeze out as much points as possible with "worse" car they have now.

[Tarmop]

Well, he had a great going in 2016, with several wins, in 2017, before his "one-event drop", Meeke had a win+ a DNF from 1. place because of a broken engine at that time. Plus he wasn`t his teammates shadow. And he had less outings in the C3, like all the guys at that time (with their new generations) but like always, you tend to forget, that Mikkelsen has had 22 starts in the i20 by now...Meeke got 18 in the C3, being the best driver with it, before being benched.

[Davidbrice]

«» .
: https://lcokbhlw.bestseller-super.ru

[Zeakiwi2]

it all depends if Paddon participates or not, im sure if he does then there would be a lot of people. im just assuming, i cant be 100% sure.

but at the moment it isnt hard to get more people on the stages than at Australia. For me that rally has stagnated.

Would be great to at least give a chance to NZ and to see what happens.

With the 'events and promotions' section Ateed part of the Auckland Council involved with the wrc bid. Many nz rally fans would probably prefer ateed were not involved and preferred Ateed kept with what they are best at , the lantern festival , the santa parade and fashion week. etc. Doesn't help that the transport section of the council are doing their best to try and get people out of their cars and use public transport. Certainly NZ could be contenders for a round of the world Bus racing championship.
https://www.driven.co.nz/news/motorsport/world-rally-championship-could-return-to-nz-as-soon-as-next-year/


I would prefer to to see a 'Historic World Cup' Rally Championship(sort of like the old jetsprint World Championship) where one event decides the title but the event moves around 6 or so countries. NZ, Germany etc

https://silverfernrally.co.nz/ (2020)

[Davidbrice]

«» .
: https://lcokbhlw.bestseller-super.ru

[Allez Andruet]

F*** off David!

[wrc2017]

It is entirely funny how Citroen was criticized for dropping Meeke for one rally after 4 crashes in 3 rallies in 2017.... afterwards they didn't drop him even when two next rallies were both disaster (no speed In Finland and crash on first SS in Germany.
They kept him in the car and he won the 3rd rally.

Now when Hyundai drops Mikkelsen
one rally after finishing 2nd "he has had enough chances". What was it he did again? Oh he finished 7th scoring more points that both Toyota drivers, the horror.

The only logical explanation is that Loeb's performance there is the main reason and they definitely wanted him to drive. When deciding whom to drop they picked Mikkelsen. So 1. Want Loeb =>2.Drop one of the others => 3. Mikkelsen. Not the complely other way around as some people here suggest.

The underlying reason might be that Hyundai expects good improvement from the changes they have planned after Sardinia (that will benefit anyone who drives the car) and tries to squeeze out as much points as possible with "worse" car they have now.
Meeke was leading rallys, beating his team mate, and trying to do something..Mikkelsen pace on occasions is pathetic with no answer.

Anyways.. we will not see him next year so you can stop your yapping about Mikkelsen soon.

[Maui J.]

Doesn't help that the transport section of the council are doing their best to try and get people out of their cars and use public transport. Certainly NZ could be contenders for a round of the world Bus racing championship.

I think you'll find most cities around the world promote public transport. Obviously you must enjoy spending time sitting in peak hour traffic.

Case in point. 2004 Rally NZ, the first two stages were the Manukau Super Specials on Thursday night. The rally cars had to make their way to south Auckland through peak hour traffic. This crawl basically killed the rally for the Mitsubishi WRC04s of Gilles Panizzi & Kristian Sohlberg. They arrived with dead batteries and their rally was basically over before it had started.

More people on buses, trains, bikes and ferries is a no-brainer.

[EstWRC]

Rally Trivia 3️⃣4️⃣4️⃣
Current #WRC drivers points after 6 rounds
Ogier + Tanak + Neuville = 344
or
Meeke + Evans + Loeb + Mikkelsen + Lappi + Latvala + Suninen + Sordo + Guerra + Greensmith + Bulacia + Tidemand + Bonato + Ostberg + Rovanpera = 344
#FightingForTopStep


https://twitter.com/kiwiwrcfan/status/1132955260115283969?s=21

[Eli]

Rally Trivia 3️⃣4️⃣4️⃣
Current #WRC drivers points after 6 rounds
Ogier + Tanak + Neuville = 344
or
Meeke + Evans + Loeb + Mikkelsen + Lappi + Latvala + Suninen + Sordo + Guerra + Greensmith + Bulacia + Tidemand + Bonato + Ostberg + Rovanpera = 344
#FightingForTopStep


https://twitter.com/kiwiwrcfan/status/1132955260115283969?s=21

For a second there I read, #FightingForTopSeb

[mknight]

So I saw there was a Loeb interview:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cj-jezSrIRM

... sadly it follows the WRC-journalism standard, no new info and no interesting questions asked.

The only really good part is him basically saying how he liked fighting with Ogier.... he doesn't seem to care that Tanak was on a different level, as long as he fights with Ogier he is excited.


Anyway I get they don't ask nasty questions after people have bad rally, but now when Loeb got a good one why can't they ask some question that people actually wonder about?

Examples:
- Do you want to do more rallies this year following Chile? (I know he answered this elsewhere but it's something everyone wants to know)
- If not, how do you feel about driving in Portugal instead of one of Germany/Spain? if you could pick, which rallies would you prefer?
- How do you like the car on tarmac? In Corsica you had 2 offs in one rally which has basically never happened before, what do you think was the main reason?

[er88]

Anyway I get they don't ask nasty questions after people have bad rally, but now when Loeb got a good one why can't they ask some question that people actually wonder about?

Examples:
- Do you want to do more rallies this year following Chile? (I know he answered this elsewhere but it's something everyone wants to know)


In the very same interview he answered about doing more rallies this year, the full interview was in the preview show.

I mentioned it in my post in the Hyundai thread. He says he doesn't want to, if he was going to do 10 or so events he'd just have done a full season instead. So says it makes no sense, but acknowledged Mr Adamo will want to speak to him.

All in all, a 1 day test on gravel 1 and half month ago and it's clear to see why he struggled on Friday morning and shakedown. Yet despite that he beat Mikkelsen by 4 minutes and there were no mistakes by Andreas...

As for Germany, imo I don't think he has any ambition or motive to go back there. He could easily have done it with Citroen but turned it down and was adamant he didn't want to. He seems to enjoy an extended summer holiday thesedays and who can deny the GOAT that.

[tommeke_B]

Pretty sure Loeb is going to drive in Germany. He's even doing a French tarmac round with the car... ;)

[doubled1978]

I’m sure Adamo will want him to do both Germany and Spain if he can convince him to up his event count.

[mknight]

On wrc.com there is a poll where people vote who wins Portugal.
Standings at 600 votes were:
Tänak 39%
Meeke 18%
Neuville 15%
Loeb 9%
Ogier 7%
Evans 6%

[Allez Andruet]

Fast forward some six months and we'll be reading a story about how the strategy Latvala chose at the start of the season was wrong and how he has to do something else for the remaining rallies.

Ok, so I was a bit too optimistic with that prediction in January. It took four months and eight days this season.

https://www.rallit.fi/jari-matti-latvala-kertaa-vaikeita-aikojaan-motivaatio-laskee-kun-mestaruus-on-mennyt/

[racerx1979]

Rumor has it the high-ups at TGR are a bit frustrated with JML's behavior and mental coaching issues... expect to see a calm JML this weekend. I also think this rumor on top of Juho Hanninen doing Sardegnia is not a good sign

[steve.mandzij]

Rumor has it the high-ups at TGR are a bit frustrated with JML's behavior and mental coaching issues... expect to see a calm JML this weekend. I also think this rumor on top of Juho Hanninen doing Sardegnia is not a good signEven the faithful Japanese?

[mknight]

When the most experienced WRC driver in probably the fastest WRC car atm that won the last rally of 2018 has 5th place as his best in 6 rallies and out of these only had real pace on one rally it's hardly a surprise.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Julian Porter on a recent podcast said all of the teams have spoken to Elfyn Evans and he is quite admired. He could well be sought after in 2020 as a solid no.2 driver by the factory teams.

[mknight]

Yes I heard that, based on his 2019 so far it's looking good. But remember that at end of last year most people doubted he will even get a drive for 2019 as his only good rally last year was Spain.

[steve.mandzij]

Julian Porter on a recent podcast said all of the teams have spoken to Elfyn Evans and he is quite admired. He could well be sought after in 2020 as a solid no.2 driver by the factory teams.British journos have an extraordinary hard-on for Elfyn though.

[mknight]

British journos have an extraordinary hard-on for Elfyn though.

Any british drivers...
At end of 2017 C. Clark said that Evans will fight for title in 2018 no matter what car he drives...
Meeke is own category completely, as documentwd by the ammount of exposure he gets relative to other drivers. After Mexico Clark declared how he has now matured and can deliver 4th places on every rally while charging for wins in between. (results after that are 9-4-10).

Somehow Breen seemed to get significantly less focus that both these... must be cause he is Irish.

Anyway in that interview with Porter it basically started with the hosts criticizing Evans season so far (which is unwarranted imo) and Porter correcting them.

[Katvala]

Where are these podcasts?

Sent from my F8331 using Tapatalk

[AnttiL]

Where are these podcasts?

Sent from my F8331 using Tapatalk

Absolute Rally. A nice weekly roundup of rallying, sometimes a bit Brit-heavily though

https://totalrallystudio.podbean.com

[spiderem]

After 7 rallies (mid season), the 3 contenders are separated by only 10 points :)

The lowest gap so far between the 3 was after Corsica (5 points) and the biggest after Argentina (28 points). The remainder of the season will surely be epic! Let's hope tactics will not shadow the sporting results.

[dimviii]

Belgakinen
‏ @belgakinen


Renault Sport has been testing a new Clio rallycar in the south of France lately, most likely a new R2. No pictures or videos as of yet.

[dimviii]

EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW WITH KRIS MEEKE ‘’FINE MARGINS, THAT’S THE SPORT WE LIVE IN’’

http://www.kdmhire.com/news/article/46

[mknight]

EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW WITH KRIS MEEKE ‘’FINE MARGINS, THAT’S THE SPORT WE LIVE IN’’

http://www.kdmhire.com/news/article/46
The article starts with "Meeke has shown impressive level of consistency over the weekend..."

[EstWRC]

found interesting statistics from estonian forum

with half the season gone, this is how much the team leaders have contributed to manufacturer points and how much others

Hyundai - 202
Neuville - 113 - 55,9% of points

Toyota - 182
Ott - 116 - 63,7% of points

Citroen - 158
Ogier - 120 - 75,9% of points

M-Sport - 122
Evans - 62 - 50,8% of points


we must remember that Hyundai and Toyota are with 3 cars and M-sport and Citroen with 2 cars.

but oh man, Ogier carries the Citroen on his shoulders.

[Allez Andruet]

It's his sponsor's publication, not really something that can be described as an article.

[Norm75]

The article starts with "Meeke has shown impressive level of consistency over the weekend..."
No it doesn't. There is a paragraph in front of the sentence you have misquoted.

[mknight]

How thick are you both?

Don't you see the irony of the exact quote? It's on the same level of that quote of "speed was good but corner too tight". You were supposed to laugh......

--------
Technicals for thickheads:
-How you call a written piece on the internet is for anyone to pick, it's not signed off as press release hence I choose to call it an article.
-"The piece" has 12 paragraphs, 507 words, 2nd paragraph (39th word from start) start with exactly this quote.. that's a "start" for me, but yes you could call it "beginning of the article" instead.

[Allez Andruet]

How thick are you both?
I might have some work to do with my weight, but let's leave it at that.

[Norm75]

Intelligent enough to read what it says, and then not to misquote it on the internet, dipshit.

[Norm75]

How thick are you both?

.
And I can't speak for Allez, but my misses is more than happy with my girth, thank you very much :)

[wrc2017]

Any british drivers...
At end of 2017 C. Clark said that Evans will fight for title in 2018 no matter what car he drives...
Meeke is own category completely, as documentwd by the ammount of exposure he gets relative to other drivers. After Mexico Clark declared how he has now matured and can deliver 4th places on every rally while charging for wins in between. (results after that are 9-4-10).

Somehow Breen seemed to get significantly less focus that both these... must be cause he is Irish.

Anyway in that interview with Porter it basically started with the hosts criticizing Evans season so far (which is unwarranted imo) and Porter correcting them.

Your a complete cock. You twist the facts are very opperunity to suit your argument. Meeke was leading Argentina, leads Mexico, won 3 power stages , 2 secs off the lead in Portugal...after being fired later year.. and.missing 9 rallys. You cant go for wins without risking something. He admits this year is not about the championship... and the only stage Meeke hasnt completed this year.. was.Portugal Power stage.

BtW..Ogier/Citroen combo are now 4th fastest combination in the championship, behind Tanak, Meeke and Neuville. When it all clicks for Meeke youll be eating your works.. and making more excuses for your bum chum Mikkelsen.

[AnttiL]

https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/143875/fia-sets-out-goals-for-wrc-hybrid-switch

Matton says costs should not rise for the hybrid technology to be taken into use in 2022. Also under consideration is a trophy series for the current WRC cars, but they don't want to repeat the WRC Trophy mistake from 2017.

[er88]

Would be nice if the current cars could be kept in 'proper' use but I'm not sure how?

Manufacturers won't really use them to groom youngsters and bridge the gap between r5 > new hybrid generation car, as the cost to run them will be too high on top of the manufacturers main 2/3 car team. Privateers can't run them without a boat load of cash, and even if they do, drivers like Ostberg have found it's difficult to manage/maintain/prepare/setup them.

Then the cars in proper gentleman drivers hands aren't a great spectacle - besides the noise. I'd rather watch R5s driven at a decent pace by even just good local drivers, than the current WRC machines in the hands of the Sheikh or Serderitis (no disrespect to the guys as they've been really great for rallying in other ways - like sponsorship/financial help for drivers and teams ).

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Correct. Sadly there is no real future for the current WRC cars once the hybrid cars come in.

The cost of buying and running them is high and there wont be any national championships that will still allow them anyway.

They'll probably join the Group B classics and be seen just driving demos.

[Tarmop]

They are already allowed in several national championships, why would they ban them then, after their active-period? :rolleyes:

[Mirek]

They are already allowed in several national championships, why would they ban them then, after their active-period? :rolleyes:

Can You tell me in which national championship the current WRC cars are eligible to score points?

[Tarmop]

Why points, just participate...because its a beast of a car to drive if one can.
But to answer your question, in Estonia and Latvia definitely, can`t find about Norway atm, though Ostberg in 2018 should offer an answer somewhere.

[SubaruNorway]

Why points, just participate...because its a beast of a car to drive if one can.
But to answer your question, in Estonia and Latvia definitely, can`t find about Norway atm, though Ostberg in 2018 should offer an answer somewhere.

No points for any WRC here, Østberg said he spent his whole vacation trying to be allowed to drive Rally Hedemarken in 2017.
We have class 13 where you can drive up to old Gr.A and N4 out of homologation for points.

[Mirek]

Why points, just participate...because its a beast of a car to drive if one can.


They are already allowed in several national championships, why would they ban them then, after their active-period? :rolleyes:

Because being allowed in the championship = being eligible for points. I'm sorry but being allowed to drive for fun is something very different.


But to answer your question, in Estonia and Latvia definitely, can`t find about Norway atm, though Ostberg in 2018 should offer an answer somewhere.

Well, that is 2 states of 50 which is very tiny number (I am quite certain that no country of the mainland Europe allows them and that the Islands are no exception, I don't know about Nordic countries though).

[Tarmop]

Mainland allows also, You probably have read about Katsuta and Huttunen practising in Findland...without points definitely... not anything is about winning...especially some "village" championship, with driver levels from "worse than a granny, but lots of money" to a pro with nothing else to do in daily life. I bet there are many rich people who think the same...some maybe even want one to sit in the garage...
Also a good donor for RX probably, has also national championships.

[Mirek]

Well, not anything is about winning...especially some "village" championship, with driver levels from "worse than a granny, but lots of money" to a pro with nothing else to do in daily life.

I would prefer to stick with technically more precise terms because being alowed in the championship means that you are part of it. If you don't take points you are not part of the championship even if you drive on the same stages in the same time.

Like it or not that is a huge difference especially in regards to the future of these cars. It's much more realistic to expect them to end in private collections than on stages fighting for national championships.

[Tarmop]

We`ll see.

[Brynmor Pierce]

You could in theory use one in UK national championship https://www.btrdarally.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/2019-BTRDA-Rally-Series-English-RC-Reg_v2.pdf

[Steve Boyd]

You could in theory use one in UK national championship https://www.btrdarally.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/2019-BTRDA-Rally-Series-English-RC-Reg_v2.pdf
Careful - that isn't the UK National Championship. It's a club championship of the British Trials and Rally Drivers Association Ltd. The UK National Champiionship is Brittish Rally Championship which doesn't permit WRC cars, current or obsolete.

[Brynmor Pierce]

Careful - that isn't the UK National Championship. It's a club championship of the British Trials and Rally Drivers Association Ltd. The UK National Champiionship is Brittish Rally Championship which doesn't permit WRC cars, current or obsolete.

Tomato / tomato but that’s pulling at semantics now, you and I both know the level of competition that exists in Btrda, the Brc is no more national by virtue of having to be registered competitors ( just like btrda).

My point is that in the UK you could use a new WRC car on a championship that covers the country.

[Googol]

Will the hybrid rules make the cars even faster, or could the current cars beat them?

[Portimao]

Will the hybrid rules make the cars even faster, or could the current cars beat them?

Hybrids might generate additional power, so maybe drivers could use it sort of like DRS in F1?

[Tauri_J]

How in the hell does DRS give more power?

[Norm75]

How in the hell does DRS give more power?

Think he meant like the KERS system, where it gives an additional boost of power at the press of a button. That would then give drivers a strategy as where would be best to deploy it, like uphill sections.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Even if the WRCars are allowed in places, who is going to be able to afford to buy and run them (especially the parts, like aero) ?

Most people running WRC"s privately now are old Subarus and Focus's.

[AnttiL]

One solution would be to run the current WRC cars with a restrictor to ensure they won't be faster than the hybrid cars.

[Tarmop]

Even if the WRCars are allowed in places, who is going to be able to afford to buy and run them (especially the parts, like aero) ?

Most people running WRC"s privately now are old Subarus and Focus's.

Quite many, probably. You have to remember, that nationals are nationals (= no longhauls, 1/3 or more shorter events with less maintenance, maybe, most probably smoother roads, due to the fact that there aren`t 10+ WRCs with top druvers tearing them, own crew etc). There is that money issue, yes, but if there is a market, the prices will come own a bit, repairs can be made (like today privateers do)...or run them in RX and replicate the aero.

[TypeR]

on rally Sweden I heard something, that hybrid systems could/will be used on liaisons..

[AnttiL]

on rally Sweden I heard something, that hybrid systems could/will be used on liaisons..

Most likely nothing has been decided yet, but ideas are being thrown.

[Portimao]

Think he meant like the KERS system, where it gives an additional boost of power at the press of a button. That would then give drivers a strategy as where would be best to deploy it, like uphill sections.


Yeah, that's exactly what I meant

[Mirek]

on rally Sweden I heard something, that hybrid systems could/will be used on liaisons..


Most likely nothing has been decided yet, but ideas are being thrown.

If the system is about to be used only on the liaisons it will be nothing but a useless ballast on the stage. I seriously doubt such idea could ever pass through.

[NickRally]

https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/143897/loeb-to-contest-two-national-rallies-in-hyundai-wrc

Loeb to contest two national rallies in Hyundai i20 World Rally Car

Nine-time World Rally champion Sebastien Loeb will contest a pair of upcoming national rallies in a Hyundai i20 Coupe WRC, starting with next week's Rallye Vosges French Rally Championship round.

[Rallyper]

https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/143897/loeb-to-contest-two-national-rallies-in-hyundai-wrc

Loeb to contest two national rallies in Hyundai i20 World Rally Car

Nine-time World Rally champion Sebastien Loeb will contest a pair of upcoming national rallies in a Hyundai i20 Coupe WRC, starting with next week's Rallye Vosges French Rally Championship round.

Tarmac rallies?

[AnttiL]

Tarmac rallies?

Yes. Remember that this is old news, these entries were already announced some weeks ago.

[mknight]

Yes it's quite old news.
It's perfectly logical that they use Loeb for that, since it's on tarmac that the car lacks the most. (Finland is just one rally)

They did quite a lot of testing before Corsica and while Neuville and Sordo were prbly a bit faster than before, it was still on the level of 4-5th place on pure speed. Loeb was terrible (relative to his tarmac skills) and a few levels slower than the year before in C3.

But as far as I can see there won't be anyone to compare against at these two rallies so hard to say what they get from it. Maybe just "free" testing kms without direct time comparison. Though you don't need to look on times to see the typical massive understeer.

[Tarmop]

Yesterday-today some Spanish portals have started writing about Alonso-Yaris WRC-RACC. Not your usual reliable sources and wouldn`t expect them to be true, but like he said, stays in the TGR family, but not in the WEC team.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Quite many, probably. You have to remember, that nationals are nationals (= no longhauls, 1/3 or more shorter events with less maintenance, maybe, most probably smoother roads, due to the fact that there aren`t 10+ WRCs with top druvers tearing them, own crew etc). There is that money issue, yes, but if there is a market, the prices will come own a bit, repairs can be made (like today privateers do)...or run them in RX and replicate the aero.

So why are those running WRC's (in the UK at least) not running the 2016 cars ? Because even they are too expensive.

[Tarmop]

Well, if you put it that way, then I can ask you why does mr. Gross drive a private 17WRC in Estonian/Latvian nationals? There have been private outings of M-Sport cars elsewhere also, though they have been rentals from M-Sport/JanPro. All those 50 (+-1-2) Fiesta RS WRCs are also privateer cars now (+some DS3-s, I20-s, something else you said shouldn`t be happening ("all drive old Subbies and Focus`", that was, what you said I believe?)
Rally is expensive, no doubt about that, but wait a bit, let the cars themselves be cheaper (for sure, at the moment, being THE car, it is more pricey to buy-run).

[tommeke_B]

How are the cars themselves going to be cheaper? To buy, of course, but to maintain? If that car is new, or 10 years old, you need to rebuild or replace expensive parts every xxx kms. And as long as you're going to M-Sport or Prodrive, for revision and parts, it's going to stay extremely expensive. At least that's the experience from some people who have owned previous generation WRC cars a couple of years ago. ;) There's a reason all those old WRC cars, S2000 cars and S1600 cars have disappeared so fast, they're still expensive to maintain, and for the same (or little more) running cost you can have a quicker modern car.

And a person like Gross isn't the norm... How many people like him do you have in Europe?

[Tarmop]

Quite many probably. List of last weeks WRC (pre-17) starters is also quite good indication. Some of whom have severla cars. Yes, you can say that old WRCs, S2000s, even R5s are fading away, because for the same money a faster/all in all a more better car is available, but...im pretty sure that today is the time, where (fully) internal combustion rallycars aren`t going to get faster. An a use for them can be found amongst privateers, be it stagerallying, RX, hillclimbing or whatever.

[doubled1978]

https://www.thebestf1.es/fernando-alonso-disputar-rally-de-catalunya-2019-toyota-yaris-wrc/

I have no clue about the credibility of either this website or story, but if it were true could be cool to see...

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Gross is the exception and a pretty sad case , buying a 2017-spec WRC to beat the others in R5's.

Renting a WRC for a WRC event is ok but how many have done that ? One or two.

And we were talking about the future when WRC is hybrid, so no more 2017 cars will be allowed in those events. And ditto WRX.

[Tarmop]

And those shoppingmalls full of German flagships with soccermoms...super-/hypercars touring around Monaco. All pointless and unnecessary, but... just pure jelousy i believe. :D

[Mirek]

Quite many probably. List of last weeks WRC (pre-17) starters is also quite good indication. Some of whom have severla cars. Yes, you can say that old WRCs, S2000s, even R5s are fading away, because for the same money a faster/all in all a more better car is available, but...im pretty sure that today is the time, where (fully) internal combustion rallycars aren`t going to get faster. An a use for them can be found amongst privateers, be it stagerallying, RX, hillclimbing or whatever.

You are completely delusional.

[Googol]

Hybrids might generate additional power, so maybe drivers could use it sort of like DRS in F1?

Of course they can be faster. But is there any sense to make the by far fastest ever cars even faster?

But restricting the current cars and thinking someone would bother using them would be even more ridiculous than the Trophy was.

[dimviii]

The upcoming FIA World Council on Friday, June 14th, should unveil the future of the WRC and the possibility of hybrid technology landing on world championship rally cars.

FIA Director of Rallies Yves Matton confirmed that several manufacturers are interested in this project for the future generation of WRCs scheduled for 2022.

"The project will be submitted to the WRC commission and then presented to the World Council. The goal is for next generation WRCs to be hybrid. This concerns the brands present, but also others ... They are at least five, "said Yves Matton in AUTOhebdo.

The former director of Citroën Racing also spoke of other perspectives on the future of the world rally.

"The current regulation of the R5 has made its success ... However, we can not say that more or less long term, it will not be done also in R5 ...", added

https://www.autohebdo.fr/wrc/actualites/matton-au-moins-5-marques-interessees-par-l-hybride-203579.html

[Rally Power]

(...)
"The project will be submitted to the WRC commission and then presented to the World Council. The goal is for next generation WRCs to be hybrid. This concerns the brands present, but also others ... They are at least five, "said Yves Matton in AUTOhebdo.

https://www.autohebdo.fr/wrc/actualites/matton-au-moins-5-marques-interessees-par-l-hybride-203579.html

VW?

[deephouse]

Citroen don't have money to build another car. Except if Ogier will leave the team.

[Rally Power]

Citroen don't have money to build another car. Except if Ogier will leave the team.

Citroen doesn’t depend on Ogier to build a new car; they depend on PSA board will to continue in the WRC and so far the signals are positive. Besides, Matton already said that the new cars will use a mild hybrid system, in association to existing WRC tech, to avoid expensive developments. The FIA knows that's the only way to keep current manus and get new ones into the series.

[er88]

Citroen want Hybrid technology. However if Ogier leaves and they can't attract a top championship challenging driver (or one with huge potential to be), I reckon they'll pull the plug. Lappi was meant to be that but he's started poorly and who knows if he'll turn it around. If he can get into position to lead the team when Ogier goes that'll be great.

The only way I don't see Ogier leaving is if he wins the next two titles and wants to go for 9/10 world titles. He's certainly capable but has been hinting about retirement for years now, despite having plenty of years left in the tank

[mknight]

Exactly, If Citroen board decides after looking at news rules to continue in WRC, it doesn't matter what Ogier costs.

After all that's one of the biggest takeaways from the C3 fiasco start.... to win you need top driver lineup not just lot of money on car development. Looking at the lineup they started 2017 with in hindsight it's almost ridiculously bad. (Lefevbre who? - I am sure you also remember how he did in results).

(Off course the other takeaway is that you need to listen to drivers during development, but that also means you need multiple drivers with experience which goes back to previous point. What kind of experienced advice could they get from Lefevbre/ Breen who just did first 2-3 rallies in DS3 WRC)

Anyway right now I see much bigger chance of Citroen staying than Skoda or VW joining when hybrids are introduced. VW/Skoda leadership seem to aim at going from petrol/diesel directly to electric almost completely skipping hybrid. (unlike Toyota who does the opposite).

[AnttiL]

In one of the latest rallies press conferences a question came from the floor about hybrids and Ogier just said "I'll be retired when those cars come around".

[er88]

Yep he did. In normal circumstances I think he'll go but there's maybe a few things that could change his mind between then and now. You're a long time retired, and just look how even Loeb can't get enough of this sport.

Ogier could definitely challenge for titles into his 40s if he had the appetite for it.

[racerx1979]

Yep he did. In normal circumstances I think he'll go but there's maybe a few things that could change his mind between then and now. You're a long time retired, and just look how even Loeb can't get enough of this sport.

Ogier could definitely challenge for titles into his 40s if he had the appetite for it.

Lets hope he comes back for a full season when he is in his 40's since he's not too happy when drivers come for a partial season...lol

[WRC1]

Yep he did. In normal circumstances I think he'll go but there's maybe a few things that could change his mind between then and now. You're a long time retired, and just look how even Loeb can't get enough of this sport.

Ogier could definitely challenge for titles into his 40s if he had the appetite for it.

...and if Volkswagen calls him ;) he will for sure not say NO

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Mitsubishi would be my guess for a new Manufacturer.

But I worry about Ford who are in financial trouble and M-Sport being unable to produce a hybrid on their own.

[doubled1978]

Mitsubishi would be my guess for a new Manufacturer.

But I worry about Ford who are in financial trouble and M-Sport being unable to produce a hybrid on their own.

Hopefully they won’t need to do it alone. It depends if the FIA allow they hybrid element to be open, or if they stipulate a spec system. I would think it would be better to initially at least have a spec system to keep the costs sensible...and Toyota would probably have a head start on all the others with their huge experience in hybrid from WEC.
I suppose it depends on how much the manufacturers want to ‘develop’ the technology, or if they are happy to ‘advertise’ the technology.

[Rally Power]

Citroen want Hybrid technology. However if Ogier leaves and they can't attract a top championship challenging driver (or one with huge potential to be), I reckon they'll pull the plug. Lappi was meant to be that but he's started poorly and who knows if he'll turn it around. If he can get into position to lead the team when Ogier goes that'll be great.
(...)

You can be right but we’ve to stay positive and believe the top 3 will grow to a top 4 or 5 even if Ogier leaves. Hopefully Lappi, Suninen or even a younger driver will be on Tanak and Neuville level in 2 years time. Fingers crossed.

[dimviii]

rip..

http://www.rallynoticias.com/Noticias/ABM/IMAGES/FOTOS/new_big_15297.jpg


Jean Pierre Champeau died .. one of the discoverers of Loeb ..

It is not a known name for fans of this part of the world, but has made one of the historical chapters of the Gallic rally with its sporting activity and especially with the support of multiple champion Sebastien Loeb.

Champeau was an active participant in the French rally that also projected the presence of son Mark, unfortunately died during the awards of the Mont Blanc Rally of 99.

Two years later his contribution was fundamental for the start of the professional career of Sebastien Loeb, in need of financial support to drive a Saxo Kit Car with which he won the Gallic Championship and began his historic promotion to the Junior World Championship.

http://www.rallynoticias.com/nivel2.php?lang=es&id_noticia=15297

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Loeb was unhappy with Portugal team order:

"To be honest, I do not like doing these things. I think there are ways to avoid it or at least make it less obvious. I also did not like having found myself mixed with the pilots who fight for the championship when I do not play anything on a personal level. I did not come here for this. Therefore, I can understand that these things bother Seb (Ogier) or others, " admitted Loeb in AUTO hebdo.

http://motorboxradio.com.ar/2019/06/09/loeb-la-fia-debe-hacer-cambios-para-evitar-las-controversias-en-el-rally/

[mknight]

I found the second part very puzling
That's exactly what he did last year in Spain! "Interferred" with championship..almost cost Ogier the title. Now he suddenly starts feeling bad about it?

Anyway there are now multiple signs that it is not very likely we will see Loeb on more rounds than the 6 he was originally signed for:
- This article where he complains about tactics etc.
- Adamo (desperately?) apologizing (new autosport article)
- Loebs pace in Portugal and comments trough the weekend. (he says he used same diff as Neuville which he didn't test before rally, anyway he came there on a high being finally able to fight in the top in Chile... and wasn't able to fight)
- tarmac pace with the car

Maybe if the tarmac pace/experience changes after the two coming local rallies there is some hope.

Which does open a gap at Hyundai in GB and possibly AUS and TUR. I would say it's now or never for Paddon. Breen would be my second candidate.

[dimviii]

I found the second part very puzling
That's exactly what he did last year in Spain! "Interferred" with championship..almost cost Ogier the title. Now he suddenly starts feeling bad about it?
.
not puzzling at all
his problem was that his rally had been ruined from the mechanical problem,and he hadnt got the spirit to fight for something.
if he was at fight,he wouldnt had a problem to cut points from other competitors/manufacturers
Thats why they paid him.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

I'm sure he thinks 'interfering' is fine if it's to improve your own chances. But when its just to hinder an opponent of a team-mate, no.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Today’s @MNmotorsport front page has a story about Citroën unhappiness with rival manufacturer teams testing WRC cars on European national rallies.

https://t.co/RJDkRUoOBK
https://t.co/pOON0chSoh

[KKS]

oh those French. Do same and not whine!

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Anyone read the story ?

https://i.imgur.com/bzrYaDd.jpg

Citroen entered Lappi in Estonia so ...

[Tarmop]

A national championship event or a national championship+WRC promo event with all the teams present is a bit different in comparison.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/144043/citroen-rivals-entering-national-rallies-not-fair

[EstWRC]

https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/144043/citroen-rivals-entering-national-rallies-not-fair

Asked if he could see Budar's perspective, Hyundai director Andrea Adamo told Autosport: "It's not that I understand or don't understand. I don't care.

LOL.


i dont get their whining either, they can do the same.

[racerx1979]

Probably coming from Ogier

[cali]

Asked if he could see Budar's perspective, Hyundai director Andrea Adamo told Autosport: "It's not that I understand or don't understand. I don't care.

LOL.


i dont get their whining either, they can do the same.We need more guys like Adamo :D even if things start to get boring his comments usually light up the whole scene again :D :D

[Katvala]

I'm just glad I'm not the one doing the interviews with him lol.

Sent from my F8331 using Tapatalk

[racerx1979]

We need more guys like Adamo :D even if things start to get boring his comments usually light up the whole scene again :D :D

The guy is a true to the heart Italian... Mobster mentality! I love it.

[Ucci]

https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/144043/citroen-rivals-entering-national-rallies-not-fair
I totally agree with Adamo and Lindstrom.

[Rallyper]

However, being a rallyfan since the 60´s for sure there has been dirty tricks.

But - today we find it done openly and more aggresive than I ever seen before. And that development is not good. Also ruins the spirit of sportmanship I always thought rallying was.
Remember like father like sons, meaning cheating and dodging might become even more aggresive on National basis, affecting the group of amateur drivers still wanting to follow the rules...

I don´t know. Maybe a bit naive.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Adamo:
"For sure, he has seen something, let me use the word 'aggressive', in terms of approach from Hyundai.
"We did it twice and this would make him nervous.
"We did not do this to make him nervous, we did this to help Thierry against the other."

https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/144051/adamo-happy-to-talk-to-ogier-about-tactics-tension

No comment on the story he asked Sordo to stop in the stage...

[Fast Eddie WRC]

However, being a rallyfan since the 60´s for sure there has been dirty tricks.

But - today we find it done openly and more aggresive than I ever seen before. And that development is not good. Also ruins the spirit of sportmanship I always thought rallying was.
Remember like father like sons, meaning cheating and dodging might become even more aggresive on National basis, affecting the group of amateur drivers still wanting to follow the rules...

I don´t know. Maybe a bit naive.

I agree. When Adamo is appointed to win the Manu's for Hyundai and says things like, "I'll do whatever it takes", then it's no wonder others are worried about what they might do next.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

i dont get their whining either, they can do the same.

That's not the point. It's about the number of test days.

[AL14]

My opinion is that this situation is just sad.

Where are the rally spirit and principles?
They're not in alleged leaks about a team principal making one of his guy deliberately stop in the stage to put more sand on a rival, they're not in drivers denouncing such things if they are not 100% true.
They're not in a team principal whining about another team making some rally outside the WRC.

Rallyper is right. It might be naive but these kind of controversies, even if are always been there, are not what I learnt rally was about. If they have to argue about rules all the time, putting more effort on trying to exploit them or whine about opponents rather then work on cars, driving techniques, challenges, mechanics, sweating on the last tenth of a second possibile then they can all fuck off.

Sorry for the language but that's what I genuinely think about this.

[stefanvv]

However, being a rallyfan since the 60´s for sure there has been dirty tricks.

But - today we find it done openly and more aggresive than I ever seen before. And that development is not good. Also ruins the spirit of sportmanship I always thought rallying was.
Remember like father like sons, meaning cheating and dodging might become even more aggresive on National basis, affecting the group of amateur drivers still wanting to follow the rules...

I don´t know. Maybe a bit naive.

You're not alone. Such things also lower the value of the rallies they enter, in terms of the "real competition".

[deephouse]

Why they complain. They barely have any tests, only two cars on the field. It's their fault, not the other teams. Man that Ogier can't stop. How long when he will be against his pal Tanak...

[dimviii]

1086/5000
"I have no comment about these accusations," said Andrea Adamo at the microphone of Olivier Gaspard, RTBF's special envoy to Sardinia, "We have never been told to do anything. something against other crews, I think he attacked me, Andrea Adamo, as the Hyundai team leader, but I do not think he has anything against me personally, because I do not I've never done anything, honestly, I have nothing to blame myself, I forget all that, I understand when the drivers are really energized after a rally, and I'm not the guy who will react to that, I understand these reactions, I saw Mr. Budar (the boss of the Citroën team, Ed) at a dinner after, and we spoke as we always speak. We are not here to deteriorate the atmosphere Everybody needs it to be good, that's not how I work, but it's clear that everything we can do to win by following the rules We will do it, everyone is here to win, not to be nice and spend their evenings together. "

https://www.rtbf.be/sport/moteurs/rallye/wrc/detail_adamo-on-n-a-jamais-dit-a-quelqu-un-de-faire-quoi-que-ce-soit-contre-un-autre-equipage?id=10244815

[dimviii]

3814/5000
"What is happening is not fair," Budar said in Autosport. "This is a way to circumvent the rule of the number of trial days established by the FIA. We have asked the Federation to consider every national rally in which a manufacturer competes with a P1 pilot as 'proof'. If you employ a young talent in development or a 'gentleman driver', then it is different. But as long as they use P1 pilots, we're sure they'll be testing something. "

"I understand that it is good to have World Rally Cars in the national championships and that this helps to promote the rally in those countries, so that the media and the fans see the cars. But these manufacturers' appearances should be with other pilots, so that other competitors have the opportunity to drive these World Rally Car. That is our only request. For now, we do not plan to participate in national rallies, "said Budar.

The statements of the director of Citroen Racing come to account for two key factors. The first one has to do with the regulations established by the FIA ​​for the WRC in 2019. In order to reduce costs, the Federation had reduced the limit of days of previous tests for teams from 55 to 42 days.

However, the second key factor is that Hyundai and Toyota have used their bulky budget to compete with their World Rally Car events in Finland, France and Belgium, where the latest generation WRC are allowed to compete. To cite only some cases: Toyota has played the Itaralli and Riihimaki Ralli of Finland with Takamoto Katsuta, while Hyundai did the same in this last Nordic test along with Jari Huttunen, who will also play the Pohjanmaa Ralli this weekend with the i20 WRC

Apart from this, Hyundai has more scheduled appearances with Sebastien Loeb, who will take an i20 WRC to the Rallye Vosges in France, also this weekend. Then, during the next month of July, the Alsatian will play the Rally of Alba, in Italy, again with his World Rally Car. In turn, Thierry Neuville will be present in the Ypres Rally of Belgium with another i20 WRC in July.

Based on these incursions and the criticisms of Budar, Hyundai Motorsport director Andrea Adamo said: "It's not that I understand or do not understand his position. I just do not care. There are rules and I am using them. I think Pierre (Budar) is a good guy who does his job well. But he has to understand that there are certain rules and there are things that are allowed ».

"I can see that he is doing his job very well despite the conditions his team has. But he simply may not have the budget that others have, "added Adamo. "I simply come here to do the best I can according to the rules and the possibilities I have. I can not complain about something that can be done ».

In tune with Adamo, Toyota sporting director Kaj Lindstrom said that increasing the number of test days could be a good response to this situation. "What do we do if one of our cars leaves a stage and rejoins the next day through Rally 2? Are we also going to tell that as if it were a day of testing?", The Finn joked. "For me, rehearsals are not the same as a rally. With Katsuta we have only worked on his learning stage ".

"It's natural that this kind of thing starts to happen when the trial days are reduced. If doing a national rally means a problem for others, then let's increase the number of test days again. But what happens if there is a rally that we must do for promotional reasons? Are we also going to use a test day for a promotional rally? If it's a rally, then it's not a test! "Lindstrom concluded.
http://motorboxradio.com.ar/2019/06/13/budar-los-demas-equipos-esquivan-el-limite-en-los-dias-de-test/

[Rally Power]

My opinion is that this situation is just sad.

Where are the rally spirit and principles?
They're not in alleged leaks about a team principal making one of his guy deliberately stop in the stage to put more sand on a rival, they're not in drivers denouncing such things if they are not 100% true.
They're not in a team principal whining about another team making some rally outside the WRC.
(...)

In fairness, Budar complaint and Ogier claim shouldn’t be judged the same way. Budar has a point about national events being a way to bent testing limitations, which are there to help restraining manus budget escalation. Ogier has no point on making public accusations based on private infos, which no one can confirm and make little sense.

[AL14]

In fairness, Budar complaint and Ogier claim shouldn’t be judged the same way. Budar has a point about national events being a way to bent testing limitations, which are there to help restraining manus budget escalation. Ogier has no point on making public accusations based on private infos, which no one can confirm and make little sense.

I understand that but what I mainly wanted to say is that they should challenge the championship more in the stages and less in the microphones.

[Eli]

Didn't they say there is a World Motor Sport Council today that they'll be discussing the future of this sport (Hybrid's from 2022 or what not & next year's calendar)?

[Eli]

https://www.rallye-magazin.de/wrc/artikel/rallye-schweden-bekommt-neuen-dreijahresvertrag-41056/

Sweden is in the WRC calendar for the next 3 years as today they signed a new 3 year contract with the promoter.

[Andre Oliveira]

FIA WMSC decisions

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D9CkefgWkAEPI24?format=jpg&name=large

[RS]

Slowly losing their relationship to road cars altogether. Don’t like that :(

[the sniper]

Sad to see a move away from production bodyshells... I wonder who pushed for that. Here's hoping we don't get any odd looking 'scaled' cars like the Mustang in Australian Supercars! Standard tire for WRC2 seems like poor idea, could discourage entrants. Standardisation of Hybrid systems is the sensible solution.

[EstWRC]

meh

[erikli2]

Sounds like a good compromise to me. There´s no option than to go hybrid if we want more than 1-2 manufacturers in the championship in the years to come. Not sure about the bodyshell part though.

[doubled1978]

The standard hybrid part is sensible, so it doesn’t immediately turn into an arms race.
The scaled bodyshells bit could be odd, but it depends on each case. I agree the Mustang in Supercars looks weird.

[SubaruNorway]

Does scaled body shells mean that you could take an STI and just make the whole car smaller...?

[doubled1978]

Does scaled body shells mean that you could take an STI and just make the whole car smaller...?

Essentially yes....
The upside to it is that if manufacturers want to promote a model globally that doesn’t fit the regs size wise, they can scale the shell to make it happen. I suppose an example would be Mercedes deciding that after the budget cap in F1, they want to spend a bit of the excess budget rallying, they can use the A45 and make it fit.

[Eli]

https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/144104/hybrid-wrc-cars-for-2022-announced?fbclid=IwAR2doCC-JPtv9AbqKozWZzBiX9kZOGjy3-onM1Yc8sYmORReo4b0zeWMEYg

The FIA has confirmed the introduction of a new generation of hybrid powered cars for the 2022 World Rally Championship.

In a raft of decisions coming from World Motor Sport Council meeting in Paris on Friday, the governing body has also raised the potential for the reintroduction of C segment World Rally cars, as well as a return to a control tyre for a three-year period from 2021 onwards.

The next homologation cycle for the WRC will include common electric motors and batteries for the first three seasons.

But the FIA has now introduced the potential for a second level of hybridisation to be introduced from 2025, which would allow for harvested energy to be used in competition and allow greater technical freedom for competing manufacturers.

The level of technological change - and the amount the teams will be permitted to do themselves - after the first three years will depend on the success of the first period of the hybrid rules.

An FIA statement explained that: "The cars will feature a supplementary hybrid system, to be comprised of common components and software for the first three years, with the potential for more technical freedom in 2025.

"The aim is to enable the cars to run on pure electric power in cities and provide an electric power boost on special stages."

On the subject of the size and shape of the new cars, the FIA statement read: "Manufacturers will be allowed to use a production bodyshell or a prototype tubular structure to current WRC size guidelines, while the FIA is set to define carry-over elements from production vehicles for key visual elements.

"There will also be an option for 'scaling' of the body within prescribed limits, to allow larger cars to comply with dimension targets."
The main field of the WRC will return to a control tyre formula for the first time since 2010, covering the 2021-2024 seasons.

Pirelli was the last single tyre supplier in the series - running from 2008-2010 - but since the start of '11, Michelin has won every round of the world championship except for DMACK's '17 Rally GB success with Elfyn Evans.

The FIA statement explained the move was "to reduce costs by preventing an escalation in tyre development". In other news announced by the WMSC, M-Sport will offer two WRC outings in a Ford Fiesta WRC in a new Junior WRC initiative sanctioned by the FIA.

The current Junior WRC structure will continue for the next two years, with the winner getting a Ford Fiesta R5 plus support package.

In addition, if that driver then wins the following year's WRC2 title, M-Sport will field a Fiesta WRC for them on two world championship rounds.

"To support this programme, M-Sport, in conjunction with Pirelli, has developed a national 'feeder' programme across Finland, the United Kingdom, Estonia and Italy that will allow them to step up into the world stage the following season," the FIA statement explained.

In regards to the 2020 WRC calendar, the schedule has been spiked and will be the subject of an electronic vote before the end of June.

The FIA statement read: "Approval of the 2020 FIA World Rally Championship calendar was deferred to the end of June 2019.

In the intervening period it will consider the potential rotation of competitions."

The FIA also confirmed a long-term extension to the current agreement with WRC Promoter.

[Rally Power]

Sad to see a move away from production bodyshells... I wonder who pushed for that. Here's hoping we don't get any odd looking 'scaled' cars like the Mustang in Australian Supercars!

Really sad to imagine this could be the first step for having silhouette WRC cars, based on control chassis…
The possible return of events rotation is also a big surprise. As expected, common hybrid system seems to be a smart move.

[steve.mandzij]

Technically the cars are bound to be really quite interesting with the regs. I am a little skeptical about the prototype shells (particularly with the whole scaling thing, which I find ridiculous), but if the teams are allowed to make bonkers looking cars I'm all for it. Group B had homologation specials but cars like the S4, the 037 and the S1 E2 were crazy looking despite not being nearly at all stock or road relevant. And with the current state of road relevance we've got right now (which is to say, at least aesthetically, not much, and even less in some cases than others) I don't really pity the further loss of it.

Sure enough, maybe I'd like a return to Group A or early WRC levels of similarity, but if the WRC is going to evolve it's cars from what they are now it's a nearer step for them to move towards silhouettes rather than return to the basics (that might sound a little confusing: if road relevance were expressed as a line, and the current WRCs a point on that line, the point would be closer to the silhouette side than the early WRC side, I believe).

[Mirek]

Slowly losing their relationship to road cars altogether. Don’t like that :(

The ongoing trends in the automotive world go directly against usability of said cars in competition and as such it makes sense to ease the rules to allow the teams to build a rally car no matter what they produce in stock. In the current world it makes sense and I am not against it. I would be against twenty years a go but not in 2019.