The 2019 Season - Your Verdict

[Zico]

I'm quoting this again, as I think you were editing it after I had quoted it, thus I missed some of the context....

I've never stated that any driver on the grid could win a WDC in the right car, I'm just of the strong opinion that as often as not (if not more) the car is at least 50-60% of the equation. We've seen multiple instances of WDC drivers that struggle in average or even above average cars. If they themselves (and not the car/driver combination) were the primary factor in WDC standings, we would have examples of WDC drivers in cars that were down in the WCC standings quite a bit. And in any case, good car or bad, the driver must beat the other drivers on his team. By the time you factor in that, mechanical problems, status within the team, team orders, etc..... well there are quite a few times the best driver on a given day might not win the race.

As far as luck... IMHO luck is luck. Despite all the hard work that gives the upper tier drivers more options, they can make a decision that leaves them in a car that isn't going to take anyone to a WDC. Who beat who is a circular debate, as every WDC beat everyone else that year. So regardless of the driver, you still have to take their whole career into the picture to have a better gauge of where they stand among the best. Would Jenson be considered one of the GOATs if the Brawn dominance continued? By some maybe, but not by me. He beat Seb, Fernando, Lewis, Nico, and Kimi. That year, in a superior car. This doesn't mean that I don't consider him a very good or even great driver, or ridicule his title. It simply means that I view his entire career in context, just as I do with others. He even beat Lewis in the same car, but only one out of three times.

So overall, I still view the car as a big part of a drivers record. And though I openly agree that drivers must propel themselves to the upper levels, at some point luck is still just luck and not made IMHO.


The worst drivers that make it to the grid have more road racing skill than most of us will ever hope to have. Which are the very best is highly subjective, even when we realize they are all better than most of the world. But they are still humans, and in this case humans highly assisted by the hardware they are in. I'll remember the years that any driver dominated another team mate, or drove well beyond what the car seemed capable of, just as much as I'll remember the years that a team and driver walked away with titles. Alonso in that pig of a Ferrari he walked into on his return comes to mind.

At last... someone unbiased, able to apply logic and who really understands the status quo in F1. Thank you for restoring my faith in this forum!
I wholeheartedly agree with 99% of everything you have written, our views are so similar its unreal.

The only tiny thing that I might disagree on is your statement on the car being 50-60% of the equation. I'm of the opinion that it is not a fixed percentage and actually a variable percentage and more in line with just how much better the dominant car is as well as simply being quicker than your team mate.


Could all of the drivers on the grid win the WDC in a hugely dominant car? Of course not... simple maths, of any 2 drivers in a team, someone has to finish 2nd which automatically rules out half the grid.

Open ended question... Is luck just luck? I think in most cases it is... Although I guess if you are super well connected with a finger on the pulse and able to have half an insight on which team is likely to dominate, one might reasonably argue that to be a skill... It is clearly not a driver skill though, if anyone really wants to argue otherwise please do go for it... I've got some popcorn in the cupboard.

What does this 'GOAT' word I keep reading on here actually mean? Greatest what of all time?

Lets face it, until F1 is a one make series with far more equality between machinery, this constant crowing from the one winning drivers fanboy fanbase is quite frankly an embarrassment to true F1 fans... normal people who just love great wheel to wheel racing regardless of who it is.