Rally Discussion and Bar Talk Thread

[WRCStan]

In between the lines you can read that they give f*** all about the cars being hybrids, they just want them to be cheaper.

Yet still 'green', before anybody yells the obvious. That needs to be rethought.

Found a link for this: https://www.autosport.pt/ralis/wrc/c...-a-stellantis/

[mknight]

I'd read it differently.

He also complaints that even though the cars are hybrid there is basically no way to tell most of the time (specially not on stages).The way the rules were set up the hybrid part is really only visible in service park.

I remember how excited we were before the first race how we will see the boost and see different strategies on applying it and driving styles etc.

Then we got this automatic blinking stuff from the telemetry that gets boring after 2 mins and whos effect you can't follow.

[Steve Boyd]

Strategies appear to form based on Saturday placings more than anything.

It's useless trying to have a strategy for anything other than Saturday points under the current system.

You can ask a team #2 or #3 to drop back & let the team #1 lead on Saturday night for individual championship placings and that will work if the gaps are right. Toyota could have done that in Poland if Evans had been 2nd with a manageable gap to 3rd on Saturday.

Sunday only has 4 stages (usually) and the last one is the power stage with additional points. How do you apply a Sunday strategy? You can ask a driver to throw away his power stage points to let a team leader win Leg3 but when is there ever a workable gap to the next car on Sunday times after only 3 stages before the power stage?

Overall positions at the end of a rally are irrelevant for WRC points so there's no point in applying team orders for any crew to finish 1st at the end of the event.

[doubled1978]

I'd read it differently.

He also complaints that even though the cars are hybrid there is basically no way to tell most of the time (specially not on stages).The way the rules were set up the hybrid part is really only visible in service park.

I remember how excited we were before the first race how we will see the boost and see different strategies on applying it and driving styles etc.

Then we got this automatic blinking stuff from the telemetry that gets boring after 2 mins and whos effect you can't follow.

The Hybrid WRC cars are completely pointless, honestly they could do away with the whole hybrid system, put a sticker on the car that says hybrid, and nobody outside the service park would ever know it wasn’t.
The Sesks car showed that the hybrid doesn’t add anything to the show, and even with less overall power and the same weight, it was competitive.
The pointlessness of Hybrid has just been highlighted by BMW. I’m lucky enough to have an M5 Competition, and the dealer just contacted me about the new M5 model which is a hybrid, it has approx. 100bhp more than mine, but is 570kg heavier, and slower!!!!
That isn’t an answer to a question anyone is asking except bureaucrats…hopefully someone sees sense on this net zero madness soon.

[240RS]

It's useless trying to have a strategy for anything other than Saturday points under the current system.

Overall positions at the end of a rally are irrelevant for WRC points so there's no point in applying team orders for any crew to finish 1st at the end of the event.

I probably failed in communicating my thoughts clearly and exhaustively in the initial post.

By now, I would have imagined one or two drivers would have adopted a measured strategy on Friday/Saturday, preserving softs, for example, then going on a full Sunday attack! Targeting, for instance, 10-12 pts on Saturday before going for a full complement on Sunday.

Or a driver with a road disadvantage on the first proper day settling for a limited risk Friday, hoping to pick places from those retiring or dropping down the order through problems, with an eye on a big Saturday push when a better road position allows.

Obviously this may go against their natural instincts, but with the current points system not favouring outright winners it may be only a matter of time before we see someone in the title hunt without a single win.

[Eli]

The Hybrid WRC cars are completely pointless, honestly they could do away with the whole hybrid system, put a sticker on the car that says hybrid, and nobody outside the service park would ever know it wasn’t.
The Sesks car showed that the hybrid doesn’t add anything to the show, and even with less overall power and the same weight, it was competitive.
The pointlessness of Hybrid has just been highlighted by BMW. I’m lucky enough to have an M5 Competition, and the dealer just contacted me about the new M5 model which is a hybrid, it has approx. 100bhp more than mine, but is 570kg heavier, and slower!!!!
That isn’t an answer to a question anyone is asking except bureaucrats…hopefully someone sees sense on this net zero madness soon.

First of all, you’re veryyy lucky for having an M5 Competition, you definitely dodged a bullet without having a plug-in hybrid system in your M5; Second, at least for the time being, the M2,M3,M4 & M8 are still pure ICE. Third, you would think that with all the hype of the WRC going (Plug-In) hybrid we would get more information, but I guess like everything else in the WRC it’s top secret and no can no anything about it.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

For those that dont follow World RX news, this year they are having both ICE and EV cars competing against each other. It's called the Battle of Technologies and they are supposed to be 'equalised'.

But in the first tests the ICE cars are 1-2, but only the WDC Kristofferson has a decent lead (0.4s).

The EV cars have more power but more weight and the ICE are lighter & have better braking.

Should be an interesting battle.

[becher]

I probably failed in communicating my thoughts clearly and exhaustively in the initial post.

By now, I would have imagined one or two drivers would have adopted a measured strategy on Friday/Saturday, preserving softs, for example, then going on a full Sunday attack! Targeting, for instance, 10-12 pts on Saturday before going for a full complement on Sunday.

Or a driver with a road disadvantage on the first proper day settling for a limited risk Friday, hoping to pick places from those retiring or dropping down the order through problems, with an eye on a big Saturday push when a better road position allows.

Obviously this may go against their natural instincts, but with the current points system not favouring outright winners it may be only a matter of time before we see someone in the title hunt without a single win.

The problem with this is that the Saturday points are tied to the Sunday points, so as a result the Sunday is your banker and Friday/Saturday is your risk day, unless you have issues on Friday/Saturday.

[saco0o]

stellantis is my new favorite car brand after reading that interview haha. he is 100% spot on on everything (at least I agreed with all he said). we need brands like that in WRC right now.
and jeezz I hate hybrids. Indycars are starting to use them next race. heavy parts that adds some HP 'just to equal the power' to the car without all that weight.
they have 27 entries right now, this number will only decline, just like with BTCC, going from +30 to 24 this season. "Ahh not hybrids fault, its the economy!" yes, because hybrids are more expensive! durr haha anyway

[Franky]

But why should the hybrid system be the parallel hybrid and not the series hybrid system, basically a BEV with ICE as generator?

From a personal preference would like screaming engines over everything silent as nothing attracts attention more than noise. From one offs both Burton's 306 Cosworth and the NZ 207 Formula Renault come to mind. And of course the S1600/2000 sounded great but I am aware it wasn't exactly cheap.