Rallye France Alsace 2013

[Zeropt]

so "the master" (of hirvonen and solberg) also makes mistakes when he is pushed to it. he was just too comfortable with no compettion when collecting "numbers" some years ago

Totally agree, competition is a bitch!! :D

[Mirek]

Everybody, please, if you consider some post utterly stupid don't quote it! The function of ignore list is ruined by that. Thank You

[A FONDO]

http://www.sport-team.org/site/chaine11.html

[stefanvv]

Wow, Mikkelsen got away with high speed off. Very lucky

[noel157]

Which reminds me, Paul Nagle is doing a good job for Mikkelsen, new team, new note system, 2nd event with him and difficult conditions.

[noel157]

Looks like lying water is getting worse, aquaplaning / shiny asphalt time...........

[Mirek]

Looks like lying water is getting worse, aquaplaning / shiny asphalt time...........

I was always wondering about any reason why FIA made hand cutting of tyres forbidden in 2008. Especially with the universal dry/wet pattern. It's just stupid and dangerous in my opinion.

[stefanvv]

Battle for 2nd is on

[jonkka]

I was always wondering about any reason why FIA made hand cutting of tyres forbidden in 2008. Especially with the universal dry/wet pattern. It's just stupid and dangerous in my opinion.

Teams primarily cut tyres to increase performance, safety concerns are secondary. As with control tyre, FIA probably wanted to introduce level playing field and despite control tyre scheme has been abolished, tyre cutting hasn't.

[Mirek]

Teams primarily cut tyres to increase performance, safety concerns are secondary. As with control tyre, FIA probably wanted to introduce level playing field and despite control tyre scheme has been abolished, tyre cutting hasn't.

Of course it's for performance but it's connected with safety (especially if we don't speak about the top drivers only, the rest is far majority of the entry field). Aquaplaning is very much affected by cutting of tyres so is braking on wet. In places with standing water it's big difference (same goes to slush in Monte Carlo). Everybody has full mouth of safety but this rule which is now new also for regional championships is going against safety.

Regarding leveling of performance - I has never liked that and with more tyre manufacturers allowed again it has no meaning at all.

[noel157]

Loeb's onboard didn't reveal much.

[jonkka]

Aquaplaning is very much affected by cutting of tyres so is braking on wet.

Yes, it is. But so is speed. When you cut tyres, you improve their ability to stay in contact with the road surface and when you do that, driver can go faster. By going faster, the tyre again exceeds it's water removal capability and you end up aquaplaning. Cut tyre is only safer if driver doesn't go quicker (and when have you seen that happen) or, when you encounter unexpected amount of water on otherwise drier section.
Regarding wet sections the only way to increase safety is by cancelling them. That's why that-not-named-sport-on-circuit introduces safety car when it's too wet.


Regarding leveling of performance - I has never liked that and with more tyre manufacturers allowed again it has no meaning at all.

That's a double edged sword. In one hand, leveling is against the spirit of competition. The very aim of competing is to be the best. On the other hand, if advantages are not kept reined in to a degree, we get dominating drivers, teams or tyres which deflates the interest on the sport. Either way, it's not ideal.

[rage82]

Looks like lying water is getting worse, aquaplaning / shiny asphalt time...........

I was always wondering about any reason why FIA made hand cutting of tyres forbidden in 2008. Especially with the universal dry/wet pattern. It's just stupid and dangerous in my opinion.
Guy Frequelin is commentating on Canal + and he also is criticising FIA for universal dry/wet pattern and not allowing to make proper wet tyres.

[Bartek]

Shame that Thierry had puncture yesterday, he is the only one who can fight today with Ogier. Sorry, not only today, he is our hope for a next year :)

Hirvonen almost won a stage :crazy:

[Mirek]

Yes, it is. But so is speed. When you cut tyres, you improve their ability to stay in contact with the road surface and when you do that, driver can go faster. By going faster, the tyre again exceeds it's water removal capability and you end up aquaplaning. Cut tyre is only safer if driver doesn't go quicker (and when have you seen that happen) or, when you encounter unexpected amount of water on otherwise drier section.
Regarding wet sections the only way to increase safety is by cancelling them. That's why that-not-named-sport-on-circuit introduces safety car when it's too wet.

No, it's not entirely true. A tyre with proper rain pattern or hand cut is much more predictable on wet than a tyre without proper pattern. The best drivers always find a way to cope with that but for the majority it is dangerous solution. They don't have a chance to test hundreds of kilometers in all conditions etc. Rallying is not about ten people, especially when the rule is now forced for all regional events.

Now let alone new rules and have a look how it always worked before. For example when it was just raining but not heavily the top drivers opted for cut slicks because it was fastest solution but the far majority took wet tyres because it was safe. Slicks on wet are very difficult to handle. It's not just that You drive slower and things are solved. Now there are no wet tyres at all and moreover the cutting was forbidden so not only one but two safety measures were lost.

I spoke with many drivers about that and I haven't found a single one who would support the recent rules. It's exactly opposite. Here in CZ it came so far that for the first time we are going to use national rules different from FIA only because of that. Recently Czech ASN and Škoda Motorsport agreed to try to push to change this rules again. Even for them it's completely stupid. Even in FIA many people understand that it's wrong.

[6789]

Loebs off

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MmIKLlRE ... redirect=1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MmIKLlRE7n0&feature=share&noredirect=1)

[mousti]

Neuville: https://scontent-a-cdg.xx.fbcdn.net/hph ... 2549_n.jpg (https://scontent-a-cdg.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc1/1385260_10201634811386190_1840512549_n.jpg)

[uranium]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MmIKLlRE7n0

[Mirek]

Neuville: https://scontent-a-cdg.xx.fbcdn.net/hph ... 2549_n.jpg (https://scontent-a-cdg.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc1/1385260_10201634811386190_1840512549_n.jpg)

From which stage?

[noel157]

Mistake. Can't delete posts anymore?

[jonkka]

A tyre with proper rain pattern or hand cut is much more predictable on wet than a tyre without proper pattern.

That is true and but wasn't my point. Tyre cutting was used not only in wet tarmac, but on gravel too (and to a much greater extent). I think it's better to allow a proper wet pattern tyre than to allow hand cutting. I seem to recollect that hand cutting was mainly abolished "in the interest of costs", as many things were in those days. So was control tyre and with if fewer tread patters and compounds as well.

Where you're absolutely correct is the non-works drivers, who don't have skill or experience to cope with. But then again, do they (or their team) have experience to cut tyres effectively? Also, it adds to their financial burden so I say again, it's better to have proper tyre from tyre manufacturer (same for all competitors) than to allow hand cutting.

This is even more pointed issue on regional events, as you pointed out.


Even in FIA many people understand that it's wrong.

This is not the only rule many both inside FIA as well outside it think is wrong.

[jonkka]

From which stage?

Judging from the footage from yesterday, I'd guess SS11 where he went only so innocently wide before puncturing.

[Mirek]

That is true and but wasn't my point. Tyre cutting was used not only in wet tarmac, but on gravel too (and to a much greater extent). I think it's better to allow a proper wet pattern tyre than to allow hand cutting. I seem to recollect that hand cutting was mainly abolished "in the interest of costs", as many things were in those days. So was control tyre and with if fewer tread patters and compounds as well.

Where you're absolutely correct is the non-works drivers, who don't have skill or experience to cope with. But then again, do they (or their team) have experience to cut tyres effectively? Also, it adds to their financial burden so I say again, it's better to have proper tyre from tyre manufacturer (same for all competitors) than to allow hand cutting.

I was referring to the hand cutting as an option in the situation when there is only a single pattern tyre (and I actually meant only asphalt events). I do agree that a proper rain tyre is a better solution.

[Mirek]

Judging from the footage from yesterday, I'd guess SS11 where he went only so innocently wide before puncturing.

Thanks, I though so.

[AdvEvo]

Loeb out.

When he joined this rally i really enjoined watching again and following live timing. No i can make other sunday plans.


Cya.

[Tom206wrc]

SS18 about to start ;)

[jonkka]

In reverse order?

[A FONDO]

In reverse order?
seems like that, no idea why

http://www.sport-team.org/site/chaine11.html

[EightGear]

Ostberg lost a minute, Hirvonen will pas him.

[jonkka]

They've drank too much red wine and forgot that power stage has already been run...

[Tom206wrc]

Östberg :mark:

[NxOxT]

Very anticlimatic end from every point of view...

The nightmare is over... the healing may begin... it will take some time though.

[Mirek]

JML gave up the fight or was ordered to just finish.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Sordo fighting back ! :D

[Bartek]

Sordo fighting back ! :D

Too late I think. 10 seconds - about 14km

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Yes, but in these conditions it only takes a slight mistake and Sordo to go flat out...

But I hope Ogier wins now as the new World Champion.

[T.Maanteiden kuningas]

VW near to get max points.

[Tom206wrc]

Christian Riedemann really fast on that SS18(compared to Quentin Gilbert leader WRC3) :eek:

[Mintexmemory]

The reverse order was. A piece of stage management to ensure a triumphal progress to Hageunau - unfortunately no one sent Ogier the script!

[A FONDO]

:bounce: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zt-BZk4zikY :bounce:

[dimviii]

Mads :vader:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... VCRU-ADHrc (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=KVCRU-ADHrc)

[dimviii]

http://scontent-a-ams.xx.fbcdn.net/hpho ... 2353_n.jpg (http://scontent-a-ams.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/q83/s720x720/1391686_539956129412032_289322353_n.jpg)

[dimviii]

http://scontent-b-ams.xx.fbcdn.net/hpho ... 4938_n.jpg (http://scontent-b-ams.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/q71/s720x720/1385858_10151896436098641_311344938_n.jpg)

[NxOxT]

http://scontent-a-ams.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/q83/s720x720/1391686_539956129412032_289322353_n.jpg

LOL...

[dimviii]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... whv0UsU2sc (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=3whv0UsU2sc)

[dimviii]

http://pbs.twimg.com/media/BV49KE4CAAAujKv.jpg:large

[Tom206wrc]

SS19 penultimate stage running ;)
Despite nothing to win anymore, Kubica still attacking :D

[jonkka]

http://pbs.twimg.com/media/BV49KE4CAAAujKv.jpg:large

Who are those? Police? Gendarmerie? Private security?

[NxOxT]

gendarmerie i think.

[Tom206wrc]

Neuville keeps fighting too ;)

[jonkka]

gendarmerie i think.

I see. To keep trophy hunters from tearing Loeb's car to pieces... :D

[dimviii]

gendarmerie i think.
think same too.Seems they are searching for something?

[NxOxT]

thye are just protecting the car from the pillagers... LOL...

[tommeke_B]

It's prevent people from breaking down the car. Sadly it wouldn't be the first story of people pulling mirrors, spoilers etc off crashed cars... I already heard similar stories from rallies in France.

[NxOxT]

especially the car of the best motorsport personality ever walked on the planet... they would tear that car to shreds...

[NxOxT]

Last stage started.. an era is about to end !!!!!! Brace yourselves....

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Au revoir, Monsieur Loeb ... :wave:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BV5JUcgIEAACmey.jpg:large

[Mirek]

Despite nothing to win anymore, Kubica still attacking :D

I don't think he was. There was no competition for him.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Nice to hear the right attitude from Neuville - really disappointed and determined to win and prove himself the fastest.

Great hope for next year. :spin:

[NxOxT]

9 World Championships
78 Wins
900 stage wins
116 podiums
1619 points
167 starts

SEBASTIEN LOEB THANK YOU FOR THE MEMORIES !!!

THE END.

[Francis44]

A bit sad too think Loeb just did his last rally.

It was great to see him on the stages, and I hope his heart will speak louder than words and he comes back for atleast one more rally.

[danon]

As a true Master Loeb fought to the very end to protect its Empire!

“Happens to every guy sometimes this does”
- Yoda

[dimviii]

a very big bravo to Ogier-Ingrassia for their best rally at their career.Amazing comeback after the 1st day,a comeback only very big drivers can do!
Sordo an excellent rally too,always on top without mistake at very difficult conditions.
Excellent rally for Latvala without a single mistake.
Neuville progressing rally after rally at fast forward mode.
Ostberg,Novikov,Hirvonen lemons of the rally.All of them seems that are going from bad to worse.Where has gone Novikovs speed?

About Maestro a big ''thank you'' for all these moments he gave us.A very big driver,a decent down to earth character,a record braker at everything can be measured at rallies.
Not an end he deserves inside his home rally,but that cant change his achievements.Last asphalt event (except Monte)not qualifying for Maestro was at Corse 2003 if i remember right.(jonhkka?)
Thank you again Maestro!!

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Congrats again to Ogier - it turned out a perfect way to cement to Championship :champion: ...and I bet he had a little smile for the way Loeb finished... :blackeye: ;)

Flat-out trophy goes to Neuville.. very fast and spectacular . And well done to JML for finally showing true pace on tarmac. :spin:

Amazing rally. :crazy:

[wwbroe]

Congratulations to Ogier for taking the victory and the world crown. Very nice performance again by my countryman Thierry Neuville, i am sure he is gonna take that first win pretty soon. Sad to see Seb Loeb leaving rallysport in this manner, but what memories does he leave. He will always be remembered for that an i hope his life goes the way he wants from now on. :)
Very good speed by Kubicka, alltough he was never under much pressure, but you still have to do it. Very nice rally for both Sordo and Latvalla, the first we knew allready he could do it on tarmac, for JML i was quite surprised to see his speed, didn't think he had it in him on asfalt.

[kober]

Shame that the fight for the win ended after the first stage of the day. I hoped for more. Congratulations to Ogier & Ingrassia. Au revoir to Loeb & Elena.

Btw. Have VW clinched the title yet?

[kober]

9 World Championships
78 Wins
900 stage wins
116 podiums
1619 points
168 starts
Fixed that for you.

[Barreis]

It's good for WRC that he's gone...

[Puyan]

Loebs spin
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lss7otuime8

lol what Seb said : " the car escaped me in the spin, plus i get It back on the road Iike a grandpa, so i loose ten seconds. :D

[stefanvv]

Congratulations to Ogier for the brilliant Rally and season. After the emotional setback on Friday he came back as true champion as the title itself deserves. Farewell to Loeb, the best ever, I'm also dissapointed by his end this Rally, but doesn't really matter when you have so much achieved so far.
Excellent Rally for Sordo, we know how quick he can be on asphalt, including difficult conditions like this. The real surprise cane from Latvala, who said he can't handle pressure? I think this Rally proves otherwise, moreover on his not favorite surface in extreme conditions. Big bravo to Neuville too, his first win is around the corner, and there will be many to come. Next season he will be contender for the title for sure.

[stefanvv]

Btw. Have VW clinched the title yet?
Very close, but not yet

[WUff1]

a very big bravo to Ogier-Ingrassia for their best rally at their career.Amazing comeback after the 1st day,a comeback only very big drivers can do!
Sordo an excellent rally too,always on top without mistake at very difficult conditions.
Excellent rally for Latvala without a single mistake.
Neuville progressing rally after rally at fast forward mode.
Ostberg,Novikov,Hirvonen lemons of the rally.All of them seems that are going from bad to worse.Where has gone Novikovs speed?

About Maestro a big ''thank you'' for all these moments he gave us.A very big driver,a decent down to earth character,a record braker at everything can be measured at rallies.
Not an end he deserves inside his home rally,but that cant change his achievements.Last asphalt event (except Monte)not qualifying for Maestro was at Corse 2003 if i remember right.(jonhkka?)
Thank you again Maestro!!

+1!

[stefanvv]

Sad way to win 20 beers. I told you it wasn't over Dimviii....

not 20 i own 22 beers :D
3 more for me please :D

[dimviii]

Sad way to win 20 beers. I told you it wasn't over Dimviii....

not 20 i own 22 beers :D
3 more for me please :D

i never could imagine that i will bunkrupt in a bet from Loeb :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

[dimviii]

http://pbs.twimg.com/media/BV5a9PeIUAAwiY-.jpg

http://pbs.twimg.com/media/BV5dOIdCQAAszWQ.jpg:large

[dimviii]

lol
http://pbs.twimg.com/media/BV5i-lvIIAItley.jpg:large

[Ucci]

As a loyal Loeb's fan I must give my tribute and deep respect to the new world champion. By far best driver in this season and I'm scared that we are facing a new Seb era. Honestly-at the moment no one is a serious competition for him. Just like previous nine years with the Master.
The Master-we will never forget you, but the fact, that he made a five months pause (even longer on a tarmac ) shows that he lost his sharpness, his speed, yes speed!!Remember comeback of Gronholm-disaster !. With Loeb's previous speed he would not have to deal with Neuville, Sordo, JML, Ogi; with all the respect to them. Loeb gambled a lot entering this rally. And the gamble didn't paid off, sorry....It will always be a black mark on his immaculate career. But the decision was his...and I (we) must respect this. A lot of luck in WTCC, the Master.
Sordo has met the expectations, with a bit of luck he might win in Spain. The same goes for Neuville. JML didn't make any mistake, he (and the team) should already open a bottle of champagne for this ''effort''.
Mads, Evgeny and Mikko: losers.
At the end-as already many times this season: thank god for Robert Kubica. No mistake in very heavy conditions, he is an alien for other guys in WRC2 (except Evans).
So, not my kind of a rally or better say the final result is not according to my expectations, but life is going on and I have to find a new ''hero''.
Again, goodbye Mr. Loeb.

[NxOxT]

lol
http://pbs.twimg.com/media/BV5i-lvIIAItley.jpg:large

the people around loebs wreck were more than around the champion... it a pity because Ogier is trully a step above everyone but he has the ugly role now to lead an era with just one champion...all the rest of his rivals are unproven stray dogs.

It is going to be hard for him to justify his greatness over the years...

meanwhile i just found the trophy they prepared for him during the gala in january...

http://stoppests.typepad.com/.a/6a01348 ... 970c-popup (http://stoppests.typepad.com/.a/6a013486861d6a970c0168e82f8606970c-popup)

[A FONDO]

What an experience, I still can't find words to properly describe the excitement of this rally. Great live footage, multiple drivers fighting for the victory, exchanging positions all the time without crucial tyre gambles, technical troubles or team orders and ultimately the best in the world deservedly won.


Ogier had some problems in the first day but managed to limit the damage so in the beginnings of 2nd and 3rd he got what he needed, like a real master.

Sordo did all he can and to finish first after Ogier is realistically said the best possible result. And hopefully he didn't need to slow down for "somebody else" this time, unlike some occasions in the past.

JML was unbelievable, I didn't watch Germany but this time he was like Basso or Makinen, so clean and precise. I hope he keeps this level in Spain and why not beat Sordo this time.

Thierry again very impressive, okay he pushed his luck and escaped many close moments but hopefully at the end he got away easily. His time will come that's for sure!

The Quitter did what he could but it's not the same anymore, new talented drivers and strong independent teams have arisen.

[dimviii]

some nice new photos ar Best of rally live
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bestofrallylive/

[stefanvv]

meanwhile i just found the trophy they prepared for him during the gala in january...

http://stoppests.typepad.com/.a/6a01348 ... 970c-popup (http://stoppests.typepad.com/.a/6a013486861d6a970c0168e82f8606970c-popup)
tasteless

[NxOxT]

meanwhile i just found the trophy they prepared for him during the gala in january...

http://stoppests.typepad.com/.a/6a01348 ... 970c-popup (http://stoppests.typepad.com/.a/6a013486861d6a970c0168e82f8606970c-popup)
tasteless

its not about taste it is about the truth..and it will always be.

[dimviii]

Sordo did all he can and to finish first after Ogier is realistically said the best possible result. And hopefully he didn't need to slow down for "somebody else" this time, unlike some occasions in the past.

The Quitter did what he could but it's not the same anymore, new talented drivers and strong independent teams have arisen.

3 pills 4 times a day
http://wedorecover.com/images/Painkiller-1.jpg

[tfp]

What an experience, I still can't find words to properly describe the excitement of this rally. Great live footage, multiple drivers fighting for the victory, exchanging positions all the time without crucial tyre gambles, technical troubles or team orders and ultimately the best in the world deservedly won.


Ogier had some problems in the first day but managed to limit the damage so in the beginnings of 2nd and 3rd he got what he needed, like a real master.

Sordo did all he can and to finish first after Ogier is realistically said the best possible result. And hopefully he didn't need to slow down for "somebody else" this time, unlike some occasions in the past.

JML was unbelievable, I didn't watch Germany but this time he was like Basso or Makinen, so clean and precise. I hope he keeps this level in Spain and why not beat Sordo this time.

Thierry again very impressive, okay he pushed his luck and escaped many close moments but hopefully at the end he got away easily. His time will come that's for sure!

The Quitter did what he could but it's not the same anymore, new talented drivers and strong independent teams have arisen.

Very good post, and a great rally. I can't remember the last time at any point there were four drivers chasing the lead. (Except after the opening SSS ;) )
I used to get really bored of Tarmac events very quickly, but here and Germany (and possibly Sweden) have been probably the best events of the year, IMO.

[A FONDO]

3 pills 4 times a day
http://wedorecover.com/images/Painkiller-1.jpg
you must speak less and listen to me more. yesterday evening I told you who will and who wont win the rally.

[nafpaktos]

The next years neuville will be a very fast driver in every surface,his speed will be close to ogiers and i believe that he will beat him in some rallies,espessially in tarmac events(maybe he will even lose a championship by thierry).So dont worry he will have a very capable driver to compete the next years and by that way his championsips will have great value.Seb had two years marcus for opponent(2006-2007) and all the other years miko.Ogier will have thierry(and thierry has this performance so far without big wrc experience-imagine what will happen fron next year).The conclusions are yours!!!!So dont wast your time by saying that ogiers titles will have the same value as loebs.

[stefanvv]

meanwhile i just found the trophy they prepared for him during the gala in january...

http://stoppests.typepad.com/.a/6a01348 ... 970c-popup (http://stoppests.typepad.com/.a/6a013486861d6a970c0168e82f8606970c-popup)
tasteless

its not about taste it is about the truth..and it will always be.
The truth is different for everyone, especially for dedicated Loeb fans, I can understand it, but for me Ogier last 2 days showed what is it about, period.

[dimviii]

3 pills 4 times a day
http://wedorecover.com/images/Painkiller-1.jpg
you must speak less and listen to me more. yesterday evening I told you who will and who wont win the rally.

couldn t listen you because last 78 times you was wrong. ;)

dont forget your pills.

[kober]

Not exactly on the topic of Rally France, but according to Top Gear's interview with Seb Loeb (http://sundayafternoonclub.blogs.topgear.com/2013/10/04/sebastien-loeb-i-have-no-regrets/), the Master is still able do a backflip :)

[NxOxT]

Sordo did all he can and to finish first after Ogier is realistically said the best possible result. And hopefully he didn't need to slow down for "somebody else" this time, unlike some occasions in the past.


The Quitter did what he could but it's not the same anymore, new talented drivers and strong independent teams have arisen.

when did he do that... i can only remember spain a few years back.

the quitter did just enough to keep the pain coming...but now its over... the sooner you will forget about it the better for you. He put his mark in a whole era...

he literally WAS the sport all these years and the people reactions on this rally shows that, even you spent more time addressing him than the driver you admire..

he came this year with minimal testing lost 2 won 2 and was never dominated against a younger driver with a better team with a huge budget... how many people have done that in the past ? NONE... It is ok to hate someone after he has done so much to you... all these years of wins and records and humiliations just slowly carved his name on your soul... the huge pain is over he cannot put any more hurt on you.... but sometimes now and then the nightmare will flash back...it is normal. it may actually never heal but you should not believe what they say....you are strong i believe in you.

[A FONDO]

The next years neuville will be a very fast driver in every surface,his speed will be close to ogiers and i believe that he will beat him in some rallies,espessially in tarmac events(maybe he will even lose a championship by thierry).So dont worry he will have a very capable driver to compete the next years and by that way his championsips will have great value.Seb had two years marcus for opponent(2006-2007) and all the other years miko.Ogier will have thierry(and thierry has this performance so far without big wrc experience-imagine what will happen fron next year).The conclusions are yours!!!!So dont wast your time by saying that ogiers titles will have the same value as loebs.
Ogier's today victory of the rally is more valuable than loeb's championship title from 2008, or 2009 or 2010

[tommeke_B]

It is ok to hate someone after he has done so much to you... all these years of wins and records and humiliations just slowly carved his name on your soul... the huge pain is over he cannot put any more hurt on you.... but sometimes now and then the nightmare will flash back...it is normal. it may actually never heal but you should not believe what they say....you are strong i believe in you.
"And the Pulitzer Prize for category "Forum Posting" goes to..." :D

[NxOxT]

it is the easiest thing in the world to show someone the truth...

making up lies and trying to persuade people is the hard part.

[Zeropt]

especially the car of the best motorsport personality ever walked on the planet... they would tear that car to shreds...

That`s impossible, Colin McRae died in 2007!

[NxOxT]

replace the word personality with driver then.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

meanwhile i just found the trophy they prepared for him during the gala in january...

http://stoppests.typepad.com/.a/6a01348 ... 970c-popup (http://stoppests.typepad.com/.a/6a013486861d6a970c0168e82f8606970c-popup)

As usual you spread you bile and spoil the forum for everyone - just no need for it, not funny, not clever & certainly not the truth.

The only 'garbage' is what you talk.

Pity they got rid of the block option ...

[wwbroe]

meanwhile i just found the trophy they prepared for him during the gala in january...

http://stoppests.typepad.com/.a/6a01348 ... 970c-popup (http://stoppests.typepad.com/.a/6a013486861d6a970c0168e82f8606970c-popup)

As usual you spread you bile and spoil the forum for everyone - just no need for it, not funny, not clever & certainly not the truth.

The only 'garbage' is what you talk.

Pity they got rid of the block option ...

Get over it, i believe in you, i think you can do it. :D

[Miika]

I´ve missed the bs and the lols. Not.

[A FONDO]

As usual you spread you bile and spoil the forum for everyone - just no need for it, not funny, not clever & certainly not the truth.

The only 'garbage' is what you talk.

Pity they got rid of the block option ...
ucp.php (http://www.motorsportforums.com/ucp.php) > the tab "Friends and Foes"

[NxOxT]

The next years neuville will be a very fast driver in every surface,his speed will be close to ogiers and i believe that he will beat him in some rallies,espessially in tarmac events(maybe he will even lose a championship by thierry).So dont worry he will have a very capable driver to compete the next years and by that way his championsips will have great value.Seb had two years marcus for opponent(2006-2007) and all the other years miko.Ogier will have thierry(and thierry has this performance so far without big wrc experience-imagine what will happen fron next year).The conclusions are yours!!!!So dont wast your time by saying that ogiers titles will have the same value as loebs.

the main rival for Ogier will be Latvala...

Neuville doesn't have a car to compete against Ogier... in order to be close to him he has to drive 11/10 and that is the reason he cannot handle it.

next year only 4 drivers will take part that have won events and 2 of them are Sordo and Hirvonen..so technically only Latvala can be considered a constant winner due to speed... the conclusions are yours.

Loeb was lucky and when his domimance began some old gods competed still that people looked in awe... that is why his legend grew and that is why people will have him as standard for the years to come.

Any championship is still a championship at the end of the day the numbers count.

but Ogier must try 10 times harder than Loeb did to build his name because currently he is going to win championships against nobodies...

He lost his chance to ridicule Loeb this year big time and make him look like a scared running dog despite everything was in his favour.

[Rallyper]

The only fair competition between the two Sebs would have been them both competing the whole year. Loeb choose not to do that. Now after this rally and how it ended I think Loeb would have liked to do whole season.

And it would have helped a lot of you guys competing in the topic of Seb and Seb.... ;)

[NxOxT]

The only fair competition between the two Sebs would have been them both competing the whole year. Loeb choose not to do that. Now after this rally and how it ended I think Loeb would have liked to do whole season.

And it would have helped a lot of you guys competing in the topic of Seb and Seb.... ;)

even if he did...

we are talking about a 39 year old guy vs a 30 year old guy don't forget that... NEVER in history has a 39 year old managed to drive faster and win championships consistently than drivers in their best rallying age...

You think that Loebs legendary status is only about numbers... his legend and skills go deeper than superficial numbers... the records are just the tip of the iceberg.. we are talking about a true legend here not some fast driver with some wins and championships.

Poeple talk about Makinen Sainz Mcrae Kankkunen Auriol ects but these compared to Loeb where nothing they were just normal fast drivers who completed the normal short circle of 5-6 years of any average champion in every motorsport.

[nafpaktos]

Poeple talk about Makinen Sainz Mcrae Kankkunen Auriol ects but these compared to Loeb where nothing they were just normal fast drivers who completed the normal short circle of 5-6 years of any average champion in every motorsport.

? LOVE YOU MAN!!!

[RAS007]

I think it is clear to see why Loeb retired at the end of last season. He knew that the time of easy victories, against almost no competition, was at an end.

[dimviii]

meanwhile i just found the trophy they prepared for him during the gala in january...

http://stoppests.typepad.com/.a/6a01348 ... 970c-popup (http://stoppests.typepad.com/.a/6a013486861d6a970c0168e82f8606970c-popup)

As usual you spread you bile and spoil the forum for everyone - just no need for it, not funny, not clever & certainly not the truth.

The only 'garbage' is what you talk.

Pity they got rid of the block option ...

Get over it, i believe in you, i think you can do it. :D

i am almost sure,he can do it.

[dimviii]

it is the easiest thing in the world to show someone the truth...

making up lies and trying to persuade people is the hard part.

so true!!

[stefanvv]

Poeple talk about Makinen Sainz Mcrae Kankkunen Auriol ects but these compared to Loeb where nothing they were just normal fast drivers who completed the normal short circle of 5-6 years of any average champion in every motorsport.
"normal fast drivers" - any driver achieved world championship title(s) is much more than that. Every one of them is great personality too, with its pros and cons. Of course there might be an exception out there, as any other rule. Don't forget Loeb too wanted to retire 3 years ago, which almost fits the profile you created.

[dimviii]

I think it is clear to see why Loeb retired at the end of last season. He knew that the time of easy victories, against almost no competition, was at an end.

Ogier choosed to walk away.Loeb was present.We can say that Ogier walked away as he knew that Loeb had 1 year.

[dimviii]

when did he do that... i can only remember spain a few years back.

the quitter did just enough to keep the pain coming...but now its over... the sooner you will forget about it the better for you. He put his mark in a whole era...

he literally WAS the sport all these years and the people reactions on this rally shows that, even you spent more time addressing him than the driver you admire..

he came this year with minimal testing lost 2 won 2 and was never dominated against a younger driver with a better team with a huge budget... how many people have done that in the past ? NONE... It is ok to hate someone after he has done so much to you... all these years of wins and records and humiliations just slowly carved his name on your soul... the huge pain is over he cannot put any more hurt on you.... but sometimes now and then the nightmare will flash back...it is normal. it may actually never heal but you should not believe what they say....you are strong i believe in you.

thats some facts.
Bigger budget
10 times more testing and rally kms
semiretired
2-2 rallies for both Sebs.

[dimviii]

The only fair competition between the two Sebs would have been them both competing the whole year. Loeb choose not to do that.

They compete a whole year,with Quesnel in Ogiers favour and lost fair and square.Next year walked away knowing that he compete 1 year with s2000.Loeb was present at wrc and won the championship.Period.

[stefanvv]

Just what part of "Loeb is the best ever" is not clear? :)

[stefanvv]

This was a great Rally with great live coverage. I doubt we all want to ask for more for this monumental ocasion. I wish that coverage in WRC for future, at least for some Rallies in the calendar for a start.

[NxOxT]

I think it is clear to see why Loeb retired at the end of last season. He knew that the time of easy victories, against almost no competition, was at an end.

of course it would be harder the guy is 39 years old... name someone who won a championship so easy at 38 against 25 and 30 year olds...

I think Ogier would be faster than him next year easily... you cannot beat time...

But ok i can understand your pain... its different from those Ogier fans... your pain comes from a certain driver who was hired by citroen as No1 and ended but jobless in the USA doing tricks like a monkey in stadiums..and all because of Loeb...

As i said all these years Loeb gave many people different reasons to hate him... let the pain go away... just let go...

When you try and face the truth...the truth will slap you like a 5 year old and take away your candy.

[NxOxT]

Poeple talk about Makinen Sainz Mcrae Kankkunen Auriol ects but these compared to Loeb where nothing they were just normal fast drivers who completed the normal short circle of 5-6 years of any average champion in every motorsport.
"normal fast drivers" - any driver achieved world championship title(s) is much more than that. Every one of them is great personality too, with its pros and cons. Of course there might be an exception out there, as any other rule. Don't forget Loeb too wanted to retire 3 years ago, which almost fits the profile you created.

you miss the point...

every driver in motorsport has a career for around 15 years if he is lucky but from those years he has a learning curve then if he is lucky again he has 5-6 years where he is at best and he can win championships then there is a decline... ONLY LOEB managed to hold that peak for so long... of course in the latter years it was easy due to competition but he was the main reason that the competition was not there.

Yes the drivers of the old were great, as some of todays are, they do something extrordinary that simple folk cannot even conceive but as i said the perior they were great was short as any normal champion in motorsport.

[NxOxT]

Just what part of "Loeb is the best ever" is not clear? :)

its a matter of pride for some... if you come into my house and you kick me in the face it would be hard for me to accept you as the best ever... because everytime i look myself in the mirror i would be reminded of that moment...

Also ordinary People hate prefection... they like success because they can relate... everyone has small and big successes in life. but when it comes to perfection it is hard to accept that because none is perfect and you cannot relate... so you either hate them or accept the fact that some people are just perfect in what they do.

[stefanvv]

you miss the point...

every driver in motorsport has a career for around 15 years if he is lucky but from those years he has a learning curve then if he is lucky again he has 5-6 years where he is at best and he can win championships then there is a decline... ONLY LOEB managed to hold that peak for so long... of course in the latter years it was easy due to competition but he was the main reason that the competition was not there.
I agree Loeb is extraordinary, there cannot be doubt. Began his career so late and achieved so much, you must be special. But I don't agree to underestimate other drivers who have earned their titles in different eras, under different circumstances. Yes, Loeb is the top, but every driver in his time, and this year belong to Ogier, who helped his team to develop alot last year and deserved won the title this year, only by driving, without any handicap.

[EightGear]

This was a great Rally with great live coverage. I doubt we all want to ask for more for this monumental ocasion. I wish that coverage in WRC for future, at least for some Rallies in the calendar for a start.

http://www.wrc.com/news/rallye-de-franc ... &page=9054 (http://www.wrc.com/news/rallye-de-france-live-tv-goes-global/?fid=19171&page=9054)

Sounds promising:

“The positive feedback from our TV partners and fans after the live broadcast of the Rally Finland in August and the large interest in the broadcast of the Rallye de France affirms our plan to provide regular live coverage of the WRC in the future. Plans are currently being made for the live broadcast of at least eight rallies in 2014"

[NxOxT]

i underestimate them when i compare them to Loeb not in general... as i said the driving skills of the top 5-10 rally drivers are hard to conceive.

that different era different circumnstances i do not agree with... the sport is the same, i see no reason why someone would not dominate in the 70s 80s 90s like Loeb did in the 00s

Ogier FULLY deserved the championship, it is not a matter if he deserved it or not it is a matter of how much it was worth...same as Loeb the first few championships were something amazing but the some of the latter ones arte not going to be memorable.

[A FONDO]

I think it is clear to see why Loeb retired at the end of last season. He knew that the time of easy victories, against almost no competition, was at an end.
I am glad more and more people realise this. loeb is one coward and this time he fell in his own trap. he embarassed himself in the worst possible time.

[NxOxT]

This was a great Rally with great live coverage. I doubt we all want to ask for more for this monumental ocasion. I wish that coverage in WRC for future, at least for some Rallies in the calendar for a start.

http://www.wrc.com/news/rallye-de-franc ... &page=9054 (http://www.wrc.com/news/rallye-de-france-live-tv-goes-global/?fid=19171&page=9054)

Sounds promising:

“The positive feedback from our TV partners and fans after the live broadcast of the Rally Finland in August and the large interest in the broadcast of the Rallye de France affirms our plan to provide regular live coverage of the WRC in the future. Plans are currently being made for the live broadcast of at least eight rallies in 2014"

BEST NEWS EVER...

[NxOxT]

I think it is clear to see why Loeb retired at the end of last season. He knew that the time of easy victories, against almost no competition, was at an end.
I am glad more and more people realise this. loeb is one coward and this time he fell in his own trap. he embarassed himself in the worst possible time.

overall the score this year is 2-2 with Ogier being younger, having a better car, far more testing and commitment... i cannot see why you want to diminish Ogiers title that much... i think it is still not worth much but not to the point you are going.

You do not try to release the pain from your heart... that is a bit worrying i must say.... but it is still early so there is hope... i believe you can do it... when you are in distress about Loebs numbers just look at this picture.

http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Spo ... er-008.jpg (http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Sport/Pix/pictures/2013/10/3/1380832534709/S-bastien-Ogier-008.jpg)

[stefanvv]

This was a great Rally with great live coverage. I doubt we all want to ask for more for this monumental ocasion. I wish that coverage in WRC for future, at least for some Rallies in the calendar for a start.

http://www.wrc.com/news/rallye-de-franc ... &page=9054 (http://www.wrc.com/news/rallye-de-france-live-tv-goes-global/?fid=19171&page=9054)

Sounds promising:

“The positive feedback from our TV partners and fans after the live broadcast of the Rally Finland in August and the large interest in the broadcast of the Rallye de France affirms our plan to provide regular live coverage of the WRC in the future. Plans are currently being made for the live broadcast of at least eight rallies in 2014"
Wow, that sounds really great :)

[dimviii]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... wfS_oqS90k (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=XwfS_oqS90k)

[Allyc85]

This was a great Rally with great live coverage. I doubt we all want to ask for more for this monumental ocasion. I wish that coverage in WRC for future, at least for some Rallies in the calendar for a start.

http://www.wrc.com/news/rallye-de-franc ... &page=9054 (http://www.wrc.com/news/rallye-de-france-live-tv-goes-global/?fid=19171&page=9054)

Sounds promising:

“The positive feedback from our TV partners and fans after the live broadcast of the Rally Finland in August and the large interest in the broadcast of the Rallye de France affirms our plan to provide regular live coverage of the WRC in the future. Plans are currently being made for the live broadcast of at least eight rallies in 2014"

Do like the sound of that! :bounce: :bounce:

I guess all we can do is spread the word about it and let every source that needs to know that we want it!

[stefanvv]

that different era different circumnstances i do not agree with... the sport is the same, i see no reason why someone would not dominate in the 70s 80s 90s like Loeb did in the 00s
Yes, Loeb dominated in great company in his early titles, but later the competition was rather "weak". Which of course doesn't underestimate his abilities, but was easying him. For me the real heroes in Rallying are in Group B era, with all the challenges they were facing with the machinery. Some of them payd with their lives, R.I.P. Who can forget Mikkola's Ouninpohja's record in '85, Rohrl's Monte Carlo victories with different teams, Vatanen with all his wins and fights. For me the best of Loeb this year was Monte Carlo when he "got into the game" after first stage win of Ogier and his Pike Peak race, wow, just wow.

[Integrale]

I wonder how someone can get that much pleasure out of stating the same point over and over and over again. I really do.

It actually feels like a little kid imitating you, you know, like kids do. It's funny at first. Then it gets annoying, but the little kid still finds it funny.

[NxOxT]

I wonder how someone can get that much pleasure out of stating the same point over and over and over again. I really do.

It actually feels like a little kid imitating you, you know, like kids do. It's funny at first. Then it gets annoying, but the little kid still finds it funny.

i see it more like a tuition class, when the little ignorant kids have questions the master teacher must answer them...each and every one indivudually so they feel special in their little hearts.

[dimviii]

http://www.ewrc.cz/ewrc/fotogalery.php? ... otograf=59 (http://www.ewrc.cz/ewrc/fotogalery.php?events=6541&fotograf=59)

[dimviii]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... 3bvC6qECz8 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=T3bvC6qECz8)

[stefanvv]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ZQefbgd7rs

Take a notice of Ogier, Neuville & Ostberg

[focus206]

Congratulations to Ogier for the win of this great rally and of course for his dominant championship :)
Excellent rally by Dani and a great surprise by Jari-Matti! Very good Neuville, really a shame for his error...
Novikov slightly better than the last rallies, but still... Mikko and Mads no comment.
Though I see as always people trying to minimize Mr Loeb, searching every possible excuse... the funniest and most ridicolous one "he was afraid of Ogier, he's a coward" :D why of course! After 9 championships he was so afraid to lose one that he ran away... I don't even know how you can think those things.

[Puyan]

I think it is clear to see why Loeb retired at the end of last season. He knew that the time of easy victories, against almost no competition, was at an end.

It s a bit harsh no ? :) 1m39 on ogier and 3m49 on third place at M.Carlo . Second at Sweden rally, one of his best result on this one.
55s on ogier and 2mn on third at argentina rally. That s not so bad to say the least. And i m close to beleive that without his wrong tires choice , it would have been again a not so stressful win for him on this rally.

[dimviii]

don't even know how you can think those things.

this happens only when he dont take his Loebphobia pills.Dont worry.

nice video
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x15mml ... ?start=404 (http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x15mml7_alsace-2013_auto?start=404)

[dimviii]

I think it is clear to see why Loeb retired at the end of last season. He knew that the time of easy victories, against almost no competition, was at an end.

It s a bit harsh no ? :) 1m39 on ogier and 3m49 on third place at M.Carlo . Second at Sweden rally, one of his best result on this one.
55s on ogier and 2mn on third at argentina rally. That s not so bad to say the least. And i m close to beleive that without his wrong tires choice , it would have been again a not so stressful win for him on this rally.

no Loeb was scared and go away.But he thought again and came back and won 2 out of 4 rallies with difference measured in minutes.Was so scared.... :laugh:


nice photos
http://rhphotograph.free.fr/rallye-spor ... rance.html (http://rhphotograph.free.fr/rallye-sportmeca/photos/2013/rallye/france/france.html)

[Kielder]

Some pics I took there:

http://i1231.photobucket.com/albums/ee510/OAnibal/Alsace%202013/DSC04709_zpsb2c675db.jpg (http://s1231.photobucket.com/user/OAnibal/media/Alsace%202013/DSC04709_zpsb2c675db.jpg.html)
http://i1231.photobucket.com/albums/ee510/OAnibal/DSC05133_zps91878d70.jpg (http://s1231.photobucket.com/user/OAnibal/media/DSC05133_zps91878d70.jpg.html)
http://i1231.photobucket.com/albums/ee510/OAnibal/DSC05523_zps7afa8f98.jpg (http://s1231.photobucket.com/user/OAnibal/media/DSC05523_zps7afa8f98.jpg.html)
http://i1231.photobucket.com/albums/ee510/OAnibal/DSC05454_zpse619ed1b.jpg (http://s1231.photobucket.com/user/OAnibal/media/DSC05454_zpse619ed1b.jpg.html)
http://i1231.photobucket.com/albums/ee510/OAnibal/DSC05515_zpsd8337ea8.jpg (http://s1231.photobucket.com/user/OAnibal/media/DSC05515_zpsd8337ea8.jpg.html)

I haven't now enough time to give my impressions about the event, but I can say that my biggest memory of it will be shaking the hand which shields the driver's eyes from the sun on Hill Climb :) .

[Puyan]

Ari ?

[EightGear]

I haven't now enough time to give my impressions about the event, but I can say that my biggest memory of it will be shaking the hand which shields the driver's eyes from the sun on Hill Climb :) .

Ari?

[stefanvv]

my biggest memory of it will be shaking the hand which shields the driver's eyes from the sun on Hill Climb :) .
Vatanen?

[stefanvv]

http://www.volkswagen-motorsport.com/fileadmin/user_upload/Fans_Friends/1%20WRC/Rallye/Frankreich/Berichterstattung/2013/20131006/Galerie_des_Tages/886x498px_vw-20131006-9589.jpg
http://www.volkswagen-motorsport.com/fileadmin/user_upload/Fans_Friends/1%20WRC/Rallye/Frankreich/Berichterstattung/2013/20131006/Galerie_des_Tages/886x498px_vw-20131006-9529-max-VW-WRC-2013-11-BK1-4165.jpg
http://www.volkswagen-motorsport.com/fileadmin/user_upload/Fans_Friends/1%20WRC/Rallye/Frankreich/Berichterstattung/2013/20131006/Galerie_des_Tages/886x498px_vw-20131006-9527-max-VW-WRC-2013-11-BK1-4061.jpg
http://www.volkswagen-motorsport.com/fileadmin/user_upload/Fans_Friends/1%20WRC/Rallye/Frankreich/Berichterstattung/2013/20131006/Galerie_des_Tages/886x498px_vw-20131006-9668.jpg
http://www.volkswagen-motorsport.com/fileadmin/user_upload/Fans_Friends/1%20WRC/Rallye/Frankreich/Berichterstattung/2013/20131006/Galerie_des_Tages/886x498px_vw-20131006-9662.jpg
http://www.volkswagen-motorsport.com/fileadmin/user_upload/Fans_Friends/1%20WRC/Rallye/Frankreich/Berichterstattung/2013/20131006/Galerie_des_Tages/886x498px_vw-20131006-9670.jpg
http://www.volkswagen-motorsport.com/fileadmin/user_upload/Fans_Friends/1%20WRC/Rallye/Frankreich/Berichterstattung/2013/20131006/Galerie_des_Tages/886x498px_vw-20131006-9676.jpg
http://www.volkswagen-motorsport.com/fileadmin/user_upload/Fans_Friends/1%20WRC/Rallye/Frankreich/Berichterstattung/2013/20131006/Galerie_des_Tages/886x498px_vw-20131006-9673.jpg

[dimviii]

I haven't now enough time to give my impressions about the event, but I can say that my biggest memory of it will be shaking the hand which shields the driver's eyes from the sun on Hill Climb :) .

waiting for your review mate!

[Rallyper]

that different era different circumnstances i do not agree with... the sport is the same, i see no reason why someone would not dominate in the 70s 80s 90s like Loeb did in the 00s



What you forget is the reliability of the cars today. Much more rallies back in the days depended on the technical material. If you were unlucky it was the car that broke down and made the driver not winning. With todays reliabiltiy of cars in the 80´s and 90´s there could have been certain drivers which could have dominated more.

[stefanvv]

that different era different circumnstances i do not agree with... the sport is the same, i see no reason why someone would not dominate in the 70s 80s 90s like Loeb did in the 00s



What you forget is the reliability of the cars today. Much more rallies back in the days depended on the technical material. If you were unlucky it was the car that broke down and made the driver not winning. With todays reliabiltiy of cars in the 80´s and 90´s there could have been certain drivers which could have dominated more.
That's fine, but I remember one statement of Malcolm Wilson - "Colin knew the wekanesses of the car and tried to avoid it" (or something like that).

[A FONDO]

http://www.volkswagen-motorsport.com/fileadmin/user_upload/Fans_Friends/1%20WRC/Rallye/Frankreich/Berichterstattung/2013/20131006/Galerie_des_Tages/886x498px_vw-20131006-9670.jpg
what is this, and where?

[stefanvv]

http://www.volkswagen-motorsport.com/fileadmin/user_upload/Fans_Friends/1%20WRC/Rallye/Frankreich/Berichterstattung/2013/20131006/Galerie_des_Tages/886x498px_vw-20131006-9670.jpg
what is this, and where?
Isn't it obvious?

[stefanvv]

http://www.volkswagen-motorsport.com/fileadmin/user_upload/Fans_Friends/1%20WRC/Rallye/Frankreich/Berichterstattung/2013/20131006/Galerie_des_Tages/886x498px_vw-20131006-9670.jpg
what is this, and where?
Isn't it obvious?
If you incidentally see the Bulgarian flag in the public, you must know we are big Loeb fans :D

[danon]

... loeb is one coward...

Only a wanna-be-low creature can make up such a statement.

2004... 2005... 2006... 2007... 2008... 2009... 2010... 2011... 2012...

[kober]

that different era different circumnstances i do not agree with... the sport is the same, i see no reason why someone would not dominate in the 70s 80s 90s like Loeb did in the 00s
What you forget is the reliability of the cars today. Much more rallies back in the days depended on the technical material. If you were unlucky it was the car that broke down and made the driver not winning. With todays reliabiltiy of cars in the 80´s and 90´s there could have been certain drivers which could have dominated more.
Also, the events were much more diverse - some of them were so long, that the question wasn't if, but when your car will have a technical issue. Loeb has won 46% of the rallies he contested. Drivers of yesteryear would hope to actually finish half of the rallies they started. Additionally, the drivers/teams were not obliged to start every single WRC round.
If Loeb was born twenty years later (and granted that he would made it to the WRC), he still would snatch multiple championships, but he wouldn't be able to win 78 rallies "for sure®".

[danon]

2004... 2005... 2006... 2007... 2008... 2009... 2010... 2011... 2012...
+
4-four-time Alsatian champion, once champion of the French Grand East, and fifth in the French championship as a gymnast

= Best Ever MASTER!!!

They all have 9-nine! years to reach The Master.

No more, no less!!!

[danon]

except VW - 8

[urabus-denoS2000]

I really can't believe some of the anti-Loeb comments I am reading here. What would his career have to look like in order to "mute" some people? Did he have to win 500 rallies and keep winning until he was 65? The man was simply perfect, whether you want to admit it or not. He dominated on every surface on multiple occasions. He was, is and will continue to be a great ambassador for Citroen. What arguments can these people even offer? His fear of Ogier led him into retirement? 2 wins out of 4 rallies for fun, with the other two being a 2nd and a crash while going for the victory on his last rally- I would rather say he made fun of Ogier this year, not to mention others. He always had a super jet-powered car in his career? Just look at the results of Citroen this year. If I am not mistaken, Hirvonen has said he suffers much with Loeb's absense since he doesn't work with him on set up anymore- anyone with any kind of motorsport experience will know to appreciate how much this says about Loeb. Simply compare 2012 Mikko with 2013 Mikko. As someone noted, he sent a whole generation of rally legends (who were our idols) into retirement by beating all of them and destroyed the careers of an entire following generation, leaving them to fight for 2nd. I don't think much more needs to be said about the greatest rally driver of all time. I am happy to have followed rallying in his era :)

[Mintexmemory]

The man was simply perfect, whether you want to admit it or not. He dominated on every surface on multiple occasions. He was, is and will continue to be a great ambassador for Citroen.

He's not the Messiah ... but he has been the dominant driver of this generation and sublime to watch when at the top of his game.
But not 'perfect'. While never stooping to the sort of behaviour that prevents Michael Schumacher being regarded as 'perfect', Loeb did benefit from the preferred status on occasions when team mates were quicker as Sordo was in Spain 2009. A fair fight to the finish in 2011 might have left Citroen with a WRC future right now, even if it meant that Loeb had ended with 7 or 8 titles.
I wish him every success in WTCC and count it one of the great sporting moments to have seen him on the stages in the past 6 years I've been following rallying again.
Just to clear up a point about age - if Loeb still had the desire to compete I'm sure he could. Fangio only won the first of his 5 world championships at age 40 in an era when GP was more physically demanding than modern WRC.

[stefanvv]

I would rather say he made fun of Ogier this year, not to mention others.
No, this has never been Loeb's ambition, and rather he didn't achieve such thing.

EDIT: I don't know if you noticed, but he was the first one to congratulate Ogier for the title ;)

[NxOxT]

Just to clear up a point about age - if Loeb still had the desire to compete I'm sure he could. Fangio only won the first of his 5 world championships at age 40 in an era when GP was more physically demanding than modern WRC.

LOL... Goodnight.

[gorganl2000]

great drive by Ogier this rally and congrats on his title
dani sordo drove a good rally too
JML did well to keep it together and drove well in this rally...i hope he can repeat this in the future in more rallies

Neuville, this guy has some great potential and is really coming into his own, i hope he continues to work on his driving. next year he can do great things once he stays focused

Loeb and Elena, wow what a team over the years, i'm so glad to have been able to watch them. i'm a little disappointed he rolled out in this rally, but honestly he's has done so much in his WRC career that it makes little difference, and i cant fault him for trying to win in such a close battle. i'm a long time fan and i wish him all the best in his future endeavors. i applaud Elena too, cause i know sometimes co-drivers get left out, and he was their throughout. great memories

[scn]

I have seen about 35 times some WRC rally and about 150 times some national rally. This time, in rally Alsace, is the only time I wanted to leave before it ended. The spectacle was so bad that, if Alsace was not so nice as a place, I would have cried about the money I spent. The marshals and the policemen gathered all spectators in crowded areas where you could see only boring turns of 2nd or 3rd gear. The modern WRC cars with the modern tyres turn on wet tarmac like F1, and if this continues like this I doubt that there will be spectators in the future. Spectators were less than all other WRC rallies I have been in Europe (Spain, Germany, Italy and Alsace 2011) and, most important, not even one of them seemed interested, not to mention enthused, about what he saw. Except of some 2WD cars, like Gilbert, Chardonnet, Suarez, Lemes and some young guys in Twingos, there was absolutely no spectacle worthy a penny.

[mohit]

driving styles have changed so much over the years now you don't see cars sliding or pendulums and etc.

spectators want to see car's sliding and jumping on the stages, so FIA should re-think all again now cars prepared by VW, M-SPORT, CITROEN & Hyundai (soon) they all are so so similar in characteristics so FIA should open regulations a bit more so that there is variation all around.

[urabus-denoS2000]

Just to clear up a point about age - if Loeb still had the desire to compete I'm sure he could. Fangio only won the first of his 5 world championships at age 40 in an era when GP was more physically demanding than modern WRC.

LOL... Goodnight.

Watch how you quote, I didn't say that :)

[rallyfun]

I have seen about 35 times some WRC rally and about 150 times some national rally. This time, in rally Alsace, is the only time I wanted to leave before it ended. The spectacle was so bad that, if Alsace was not so nice as a place, I would have cried about the money I spent. The marshals and the policemen gathered all spectators in crowded areas where you could see only boring turns of 2nd or 3rd gear. The modern WRC cars with the modern tyres turn on wet tarmac like F1, and if this continues like this I doubt that there will be spectators in the future. Spectators were less than all other WRC rallies I have been in Europe (Spain, Germany, Italy and Alsace 2011) and, most important, not even one of them seemed interested, not to mention enthused, about what he saw. Except of some 2WD cars, like Gilbert, Chardonnet, Suarez, Lemes and some young guys in Twingos, there was absolutely no spectacle worthy a penny.
I share you view. There are more and more restrictions for spectators justified by "safety" or other nonsens. Zones are set up for organiser convinience with no concern about spectators. Going to some rallies is purely waste of money and after 20-25 cars is nothing to watch, those guys drive like taxi drivers. Just wondering if rally is addressed to spectator anymore, potential customer of many drivers sponsor. I think is getting worse and worse, stages with only 1-2 access roads or even with no access, car parks miles away, town/castle stages, timetable doesn't allow you to see more than 2 stages a day. Not mention about spectators who want to take nice pics, loads of obstacles, tapes, poles, nets and so on.

[Bartek]

http://instagram.com/p/fI-TDWFbwt/ Woman in background is Seb wife?

[bluuford]

http://instagram.com/p/fI-TDWFbwt/ Woman in background is Seb wife?
Yes she is.

[T.Maanteiden kuningas]

Oh, come on you French! What are you doing there somewhere in Europe? Way too ultimate fast driving...

Time to drink more Kossu in the korsu, dark age continues in Soviet Finland. Again and again there comes those really fast drivers and makes Finns cry like a baby (some new girly thing?) or do more dark sad stories with national drink and axe. It's hard to be a tonttumies.

Loeb was always too fast for us and now there is that Ogier and more to come...give me back my old Sierra, oh shit that was 80´s flashback.

Lumihanki, poliisi ja viimeinen erhe...oh dear there is no even snow, f**ck!

[Mintexmemory]

Oh, come on you French! What are you doing there somewhere in Europe? Way too ultimate fast driving...

Time to drink more Kossu in the korsu, dark age continues in Soviet Finland. Again and again there comes those really fast drivers and makes Finns cry like a baby (some new girly thing?) or do more dark sad stories with national drink and axe. It´s not easy to be tonttumies.

Loeb was always too fast for us and now there is that Ogier and more to come...give me back my old Sierra, oh shit that was 80´s flashback.

Lumihanki, poliisi ja viimeinen erhe...oh dear there is no even snow, f**ck!

Now that is pure comedy gold - Thank you for the most accurate summary of Rallye France so far :)

[Mintexmemory]

Watch how you quote, I didn't say that :)

Indeed you didn't, some people are just too concerned about shooting from the hip to ensure the gun is horizontal first ;)

[dimviii]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... zcMI01YNmM (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=ZzcMI01YNmM)

[Mirek]

I share you view. There are more and more restrictions for spectators justified by "safety" or other nonsens. Zones are set up for organiser convinience with no concern about spectators. Going to some rallies is purely waste of money and after 20-25 cars is nothing to watch, those guys drive like taxi drivers. Just wondering if rally is addressed to spectator anymore, potential customer of many drivers sponsor. I think is getting worse and worse, stages with only 1-2 access roads or even with no access, car parks miles away, town/castle stages, timetable doesn't allow you to see more than 2 stages a day. Not mention about spectators who want to take nice pics, loads of obstacles, tapes, poles, nets and so on.

Around 20 people died last year alone in rallying. Large majority on asphalt. While the development of tyres and suspension which is irreversible makes them looking calmer and cleaner they actually go much faster than in the past. That plays a big role in the number of fatal accidents in recent years - cars behave and look calm and the coming crisis is very hard to estimate, for spectators it is often impossible. That's why they are moved farther from the road. I don't like that either as a spectator but You must understand that large part of spectators don't think about safety at all. Look at this year's WRC Germany. The two hit spectators fortunately survived but judging from the images there were dozens of potential grave situations on every stage. If You think that the sport can afford few dead people from time to time You are welcome to have a look on out national scene where people connected to rallying are now considered public enemies by a reasonable part of population and where some politicians took ban of rallying into their agenda.

Anyway in my opinion the cars look calm and "slow" only in really slow technical places. If You have some sense of speed You must see how crazy fast the cars are in the hi-speed sections. The difference is huge even compared to five years old cars, not speaking about older ones.

[scn]

Around 20 people died last year alone in rallying. Large majority on asphalt. While the development of tyres and suspension which is irreversible makes them looking calmer and cleaner they actually go much faster than in the past. That plays a big role in the number of fatal accidents in recent years - cars behave and look calm and the coming crisis is very hard to estimate, for spectators it is often impossible. That's why they are moved farther from the road. I don't like that either as a spectator but You must understand that large part of spectators don't think about safety at all. Look at this year's WRC Germany. The two hit spectators fortunately survived but judging from the images there were dozens of potential grave situations on every stage. If You think that the sport can afford few dead people from time to time You are welcome to have a look on out national scene where people connected to rallying are now considered public enemies by a reasonable part of population and where some politicians took ban of rallying into their agenda.

Anyway in my opinion the cars look calm and "slow" only in really slow technical places. If You have some sense of speed You must see how crazy fast the cars are in the hi-speed sections. The difference is huge even compared to five years old cars, not speaking about older ones.
I agree, that's why I consider that we urgently need a change of rules, mostly about the tyres (dimensions, tread pattern, durability etc.) and the general dimensions of WRC cars, especially the width. Cars are extremely fast, but extremely boring to watch on asphalt when it comes to 2nd or 3rd gear corners. In Germany 2012 and Corsica 2011 I managed to go to fast places, where the spectacle was exciting. But there are few such conrners, even fewer with a safe place to sit and almost none that access is allowed by the organizers. Cars must become slower and with more tolerance or even tendency for sliding and driver's error.

[Mirek]

I'm sorry but in my opinion that is impossible. You can't reverse tyre and suspension development. The world moves on and You can not start to produce 20 years old tyre compounds or dampers worse than average stock ones.

[NxOxT]

Watch how you quote, I didn't say that :)

Indeed you didn't, some people are just too concerned about shooting from the hip to ensure the gun is horizontal first ;)

No actually i hate the new quoting system... i tried to shorten it and it showed like i was quoting you.

sorry Urabus. the LOLZoRzzzzzz were for Mintex...

[makinen_fan]

Hello guys, I came back home last night from Strasbourg and still recovering a bit. Here is my summary for the event:

After asking of what to expect from the rally, I was prepared about the spectator zones and control from police/marshals. But I have to say it is more relaxed than what I am used to from Wales GB and you have far more options where to go and where to stand. Although there are crowds everywhere, at least at the places I have been, there is place for everywhere and in all stages I found a place where I liked and I was not behind many people.
This was my first all tarmac event spectating (I also did Cyprus rally 2009 but that was with gravel tyres so doesn't count) and I have to say I am far from impressed with what I watched. The show is not nice whatsoever, the cars are too perfect. Also spotting differences in driving style is far more difficult than in gravel.
My program was the following:
Arrived at Strasbourg about midday on Thursday and went for a trip in service park before going to the Power Stage. The crowds were not as big as I was expecting when I arrived (approx an hour after it started) and although I could find a first row place, I opted to stand after the finish line, where the leading driver parked his car to get a good view of the drivers and cars, since the show in that stage is nothing exciting. Got to say hi to Colin Clark and Neil Cole who were doing the interviews. The only two drivers that I didn't managed to get close look were the two Sebs as they parked far away, but managed to get decent pics as the drove away. Josh Capito was there much earlier, and from what it looked like he was planning the celebrations ahead of Ogier's championship win. Interestingly he was giving instruction to a female photographer (in a very bossy manner) where to stand expecting Ogier to arrived at the finish line. A thing that impressed me the most is that by the time Loeb left, all the crowds started disappearing, not bothering about Seb O...
On Friday I watched SS3 at the mid-point in the forest, in a non designated parking area. I was not so sure if this allowed there (as in GB it is not) and I gambled but it was OK at the end. I was a narrow road, and I watched the exit of a mid-speed right hander leading to a small straight with slight curvature. Keith Cronin span there, but managed to get going in approx 15s.
After that I drove to SS7 through some back road and parked near the start where I walked into the stage for appox 1.5-2km. The spot was in a relatively wide road, med-fast right corner to a straight and then an open uphill hairpin left. Loeb was noticeably later with the brakes in the hairpin.
On Saturday I went to SS8 at the first left hand hairpin, some 200m after the start line. It was drizzling all the time and the road was wet but no standing water. Again the only noticeable difference was with Loeb being more sideways into the hairpin (!!) than anyone else. I left early so that I have time for SS10, but the police blocked the road for 100m as it was used from the drivers to heat the tyres. Some 8-10 cars wanted to do the same and start arguing with the Gendarmerie and they finally let us go after 30min. It was marginal if I had time to reach SS10 early. Finally made it with 30s to spare and watched Thierry from a 'no go' area, which was the highlight of my event, a short straight to a tight turn left. Then gendarmerie told us to move away but still I managed to get in front of all the crowds in the spectator zone. Nothing exciting there either, so I left a bit early after the WRC2 cars passed and went to the start of SS13 and walked for 2km into the stage in the short straight after the second uphill hairpin. Again nothing too exciting in this stage, and no driver making the difference.
The way back to Strasbourg was a nightmare with a lot of traffic in the mountains and stormy weather and fog.Going into the service area, I bumped into Jari-Matti leaving the VW press area and going to the service park. I was walking with him for some 2-3 minutes and interestingly hardly anyone recognized him! (you get the idea what kind of people are watching this rally). The service area in front of VW and Citroen was PACKED, at least 7-8 rows of people in front of cars, so with nothing to see I drove to SS15 to stay for the night.
The heavy rain didn't stop for a minute and they wanted to park our cars in some corn-field (good luck with that! even with walking you bogged down) A lot of cars got stuck but luckily not me. I stood at the left turn after the bridge crossing in Steinseltz. The best viewing point of the turn were block by some stupid advertising banners... so I had to compromise my position but OK. When Sordo arrived and not Jari-Mati I was worried that he did one of his usual, I forgot to look for the start list and see that position were as per SS13 and not SS14. Everyone was very cautious but Ogier was obviously on it and the difference from the rest was so obvious, the time reflected it. When Seb L did not arrive I was very deflated and I lost interest straight away, the rest did not seem to bother too much. Also Ostberg was a bit more aggressive than in other stages.
Being afraid with my nightmare drive back to Strasbourg the night before I left for Strasbourg as my train left a bit early and did not want to miss it. I took the road section leading to Haguenau meeting the rally cars coming the other way, the streets were lined by spectators, amazing atmosphere.

All in all it was an average event from a spectator point of view, I am not sure If I want to watch another all asphalt event in the near future with these cars.

Good to see the Maestro for the last time but I was hoping for that very last fight that didn't come. Seb O is a deserving winner and champion, putting everyone to shame this year. JML was a nice surprise to be on the pace here. Mikko, Novikov and Ostberg are getting worse and worse as the year goes, in my view they do not deserve their places in the official teams. Even Prokop in some stages was driving better than them.

I have lots of pictures to process and I will post again soon, I didn't have a chance to properly look at them yet.

So now bring it on for REAL rallying in the muddy Wales in six weeks! Can't wait for it!

[Mirek]

The spectacle in modern asphalt events is all about experience. It's really much harder to find nice places but they do exist - it just requires quite a lot of effort or experience to find them. For me it's part of what I love on rallies - to find Your own brilliant spot :)

[rallyfun]

Around 20 people died last year alone in rallying. Large majority on asphalt. While the development of tyres and suspension which is irreversible makes them looking calmer and cleaner they actually go much faster than in the past. That plays a big role in the number of fatal accidents in recent years - cars behave and look calm and the coming crisis is very hard to estimate, for spectators it is often impossible. That's why they are moved farther from the road. I don't like that either as a spectator but You must understand that large part of spectators don't think about safety at all. Look at this year's WRC Germany. The two hit spectators fortunately survived but judging from the images there were dozens of potential grave situations on every stage. If You think that the sport can afford few dead people from time to time You are welcome to have a look on out national scene where people connected to rallying are now considered public enemies by a reasonable part of population and where some politicians took ban of rallying into their agenda.

Anyway in my opinion the cars look calm and "slow" only in really slow technical places. If You have some sense of speed You must see how crazy fast the cars are in the hi-speed sections. The difference is huge even compared to five years old cars, not speaking about older ones.
You don't need to lecture me about danger or stupid people on stages.I wasn't talking about safety as it is no brainer, I have that privilege I can watch rallies live and can compare different events across Europe. There is nothing more frustrating when you need to walk for miles if you don't really need to, just to find out you are catlled with others by straight stretch of the road with lots obstacles in a view. Then you realize that 100 m down the meadow there is better, safer and most of all more interesting spot with great view and no one knows why you are not allowed to go there, the answer is "because not".

[Hartusvuori]

The spectacle in modern asphalt events is all about experience. It's really much harder to find nice places but they do exist - it just requires quite a lot of effort or experience to find them. For me it's part of what I love on rallies - to find Your own brilliant spot :)

This applies to all events. If you want to ruin the event for yourself, don't do your homework. But if you want the best experience, take an extra day or two off, drive through the stages and find what you prefer. Stages bear a heritage and it's good to get to know that.

[makinen_fan]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RRpQpC2 ... ata_player (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RRpQpC2r1Xs&feature=youtube_gdata_player)

[dimviii]

http://instagram.com/p/fI-TDWFbwt/ Woman in background is Seb wife?

yep!

very emotional video,has the moment with his wife Severine.
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x15mop ... ?start=140 (http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x15mopy_loeb-sort-de-la-route-et-sordo-monte-sur-le-podium-du-rallye-de-france-citroen-wrc-2013_auto?start=140)

[NxOxT]

The greatest.

[Allyc85]

Uk TV highlights are on ITV4 tomorrow at 6pm :)

[scn]

I'm sorry but in my opinion that is impossible. You can't reverse tyre and suspension development. The world moves on and You can not start to produce 20 years old tyre compounds or dampers worse than average stock ones.
You don't have to reverse development. Just put some restriction on the tyre width, increase the percentage of grooves and force the manufacturers to use harder compounds by decreasing the number of available tyres per event. These, together with the decreasing of car width would be more than enough for increasing spectacle and decreasing speeds, now that no electronic diffs are allowed.
I can see the effect of these simple modifications in my car. When I decrease the car width just by 30 mm and put semislicks like Toyo R1R instead of my normal Dunlops CR311 or Michelins N00, the car becomes slower of course, but it is much more forgiving, with much more tendency to slide longer and easier and the spectacle is many times better. Besides, the decreasing of speeds decreases the energy of an impact.

[denkimi]

I'm sorry but in my opinion that is impossible. You can't reverse tyre and suspension development. The world moves on and You can not start to produce 20 years old tyre compounds or dampers worse than average stock ones.
You don't have to reverse development. Just put some restriction on the tyre width, increase the percentage of grooves and force the manufacturers to use harder compounds by decreasing the number of available tyres per event. These, together with the decreasing of car width would be more than enough for increasing spectacle and decreasing speeds, now that no electronic diffs are allowed.
I can see the effect of these simple modifications in my car. When I decrease the car width just by 30 mm and put semislicks like Toyo R1R instead of my normal Dunlops CR311 or Michelins N00, the car becomes slower of course, but it is much more forgiving, with much more tendency to slide longer and easier and the spectacle is many times better. Besides, the decreasing of speeds decreases the energy of an impact.
imo the problem today is that cars are way to fine-tuned, which makes them extremely efficient.

in the group B en the early group A en WRC era, manufacturers could spend their money on improving engines or suspension or other major parts, which was the easiest way to make the car faster. by doing that, they had less money and time to set the car up so it would drive easy. this made them very fast, but also very difficult to drive, which made them spectacular.

nowadays almost nothing can be changed due to homologation rules, so cars can only be made faster by fine tuning them. they can spend all their efford on finding the ideal setup. even with narrower tyres and harder compounds, they will just drive slower but just as boring, because it is the most efficient way.

perhaps we could give them much more power, but short gearboxes so they become harder to control when searching for traction in acceleration but dont reach higher top-speeds.

[RAS007]

I think it is clear to see why Loeb retired at the end of last season. He knew that the time of easy victories, against almost no competition, was at an end.

of course it would be harder the guy is 39 years old... name someone who won a championship so easy at 38 against 25 and 30 year olds...

I think Ogier would be faster than him next year easily... you cannot beat time...

But ok i can understand your pain... its different from those Ogier fans... your pain comes from a certain driver who was hired by citroen as No1 and ended but jobless in the USA doing tricks like a monkey in stadiums..and all because of Loeb...

As i said all these years Loeb gave many people different reasons to hate him... let the pain go away... just let go...

When you try and face the truth...the truth will slap you like a 5 year old and take away your candy.

The Loeb Liebe runs strong in you...I can sense it.

[AMSS]

I'm sorry but in my opinion that is impossible. You can't reverse tyre and suspension development. The world moves on and You can not start to produce 20 years old tyre compounds or dampers worse than average stock ones.
I`m with Mirek on this one, now when the engineers and drivers have found that the fastest way to go is straight lines with very little sliding they will always try to get any new car to do that regardless of rules and they will succeed.
This is just simple evolution of engineering and won`t change regardless of rules unless they find something faster

[Mirek]

You don't need to lecture me about danger or stupid people on stages.I wasn't talking about safety as it is no brainer, I have that privilege I can watch rallies live and can compare different events across Europe. There is nothing more frustrating when you need to walk for miles if you don't really need to, just to find out you are catlled with others by straight stretch of the road with lots obstacles in a view. Then you realize that 100 m down the meadow there is better, safer and most of all more interesting spot with great view and no one knows why you are not allowed to go there, the answer is "because not".


I don't know how it is in France but here such situations are usually caused by refusal of the owner of the meadow. All private property must be respected by the organizers here and if the owner says no, the place is restricted for spectators. Some organizers don't care but that later causes big damage when You ask for permission to run some stage and the argument against You is that You damage private property. I don't say it was like that with the place You refer to but from my experience it's often like that.

[makinen_fan]

Is the crew of car No 147 (Wagemans Joachim-Pattyn Diederik) ok after their crash? I have seen their car after SS13 and it looks a really bad side impact accident:
http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2840/10151255745_fc01ac79e9.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/yiannis_chris/10151255745/)
DSC_6923.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/yiannis_chris/10151255745/) by Yiannis Christodoulou (http://www.flickr.com/people/yiannis_chris/), on Flickr
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3822/10151399923_ee5f586bbf.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/yiannis_chris/10151399923/)
DSC_6925.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/yiannis_chris/10151399923/) by Yiannis Christodoulou (http://www.flickr.com/people/yiannis_chris/), on Flickr

[MK2 BDG]

Is the crew of car No 147 (Wagemans Joachim-Pattyn Diederik) ok after their crash? I have seen their car after SS13 and it looks a really bad side impact accident:


Spoke to Wagemans on Sunday,, He is ok, (in a neck brace) Co driver was in hospital at the time, with bust ribs etc

[danon]

Sebastien Loeb - The Master - Au revoir! - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pH_0CVm4W5I

[dimviii]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... Qd16CLNc30 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=oQd16CLNc30)

[kober]

Full version (78 min) of WRC TV highlights are now available on wrc.com/video/highlights/

[dimviii]

like this photo.
http://pbs.twimg.com/media/BWI2oAsIcAAYks9.jpg:large

[dimviii]

some nice photos
http://www.ewrc.cz/ewrc/fotogalery.php? ... tograf=228 (http://www.ewrc.cz/ewrc/fotogalery.php?events=6541&fotograf=228)

http://www.ewrc.cz/ewrc/fotogalery.php? ... tograf=174 (http://www.ewrc.cz/ewrc/fotogalery.php?events=6541&fotograf=174)

[Andre Oliveira]

If you go from eWRC-results.com side, you see all photos:

http://ewrc-results.com/foto.php?e=6541 ... lsace-2013 (http://ewrc-results.com/foto.php?e=6541&t=Rallye-de-France-Alsace-2013)

[jonkka]

little ignorant kids have questions the master teacher must answer them...

That being you? :eek: :laugh:

[nafpaktos]

I just read ogier's interview.He gives congratulations to his gravel crew.The gravel crew was the same with germany?i ask that because he blamed a little bit his gravel crew for his exit in germany.to my mind of course it was his mistake and not gravel crew's mistake(as i can judje from the in car).

[dimviii]

lol
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BWNxW3fIUAAcn0z.jpg:large

[NxOxT]

we need a high resolution images of the door.

[kober]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BWNxW3fIUAAcn0z.jpg:large
Did Seb get the other, left door?

[306 Cosworth]

Just like to say that while I enjoyed my trip to France to see Loeb one last time, I certainly wouldn't go again to spectate. Can't wait to go where I want and see a lot more action on Wales Rally GB.

Biggest positive about France is that it was all free!

[MK2 BDG]

Really looking forward to France this year

Keep a look out for the Dorset and Somerset Air Ambulance Fiesta R2.. any pics would be much appreciated
If anyone in service, come and say hello :)

Did anyone get any pictures ,, Only got to halfway on SS15 ;(

[HaCo]

I don't like that either as a spectator but You must understand that large part of spectators don't think about safety at all. Look at this year's WRC Germany. The two hit spectators fortunately survived but judging from the images there were dozens of potential grave situations on every stage.

Just saw that crash on Youtube, what a weird crash that was.

[dimviii]

http://scontent-b-cdg.xx.fbcdn.net/hpho ... 5465_n.jpg (http://scontent-b-cdg.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/q71/s720x720/1380162_555285337859934_511265465_n.jpg)

[nafpaktos]

Just like to say that while I enjoyed my trip to France to see Loeb one last time, I certainly wouldn't go again to spectate.

Why you wouldnt go again?because of the restrictions to viewing points?give us some details.

[306 Cosworth]

A very small number of clips from me

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nzKZNtPvHos

[dimviii]

A very small number of clips from me

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nzKZNtPvHos

nice spots! ;)

[dimviii]

nice photo
http://imageshack.us/a/img138/5617/p7fa.jpg

[makinen_fan]

I just finished sorting my photos from Alsace. Not many nice pics since most of my places were s***. Have a look:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/yiannis_ch ... 316400433/ (http://www.flickr.com/photos/yiannis_chris/sets/72157636316400433/)

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8402/10244068076_c100a68ffb.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/yiannis_chris/10244068076/)

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3695/10244159453_8179c0363e.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/yiannis_chris/10244159453/)

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5522/10243990014_877276f9c3.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/yiannis_chris/10243990014/)

http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2819/10244443793_d840073fef.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/yiannis_chris/10244443793/)

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8256/10244424286_495a0c0579.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/yiannis_chris/10244424286/)

[306 Cosworth]

Nice pics Makinen_fan :)

[dimviii]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... shvJd9T-rQ (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=wshvJd9T-rQ)

[dimviii]

outside camera from Loebs exit from road,We haven t see this one
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=627563447295835