New R4 Car - Think Tank

[Mirek]

I understand but is the Maxi rally the formula for replacing N4 if the price is close to R5? I don't think so (unless of course the cars are a lot cheaper than what we talk about).

[dimviii]

if the n5 cant much the r5,and they drive them just for fun,why to dont drive n4 with 1/4 of their purchase cost,and the rest money to compete for 3-4 years?
I dont think that n5 as they are now they have feature at Europe.
Another point is which would be the price of this car as 2nd hand.Maybe an r5 is not so expensive..

[OldF]

Pros and cons with different solutions. What I would like is to have the possibility to build a car locally which has an international homologation with the price and running cost of a N4 car.

With lower price than R5 cars the performance should also be lower but there can always be two different championship for R5 and N4 level cars.

I once posted an example of a season (2007) cost in FCR and here it’s again. If you compare the total season cost to the difference of the price of cars (if it’s 50 000 €) it’s less than for one season. Note that rallies in FRC are not long and most of them are only during one day.

Rallying costs:
Entry fees 3200 € (á 400 €. 1 two day rally, 6 one day rally)
Accommodations 2340 € (á 90 € * 26)
Travelling 560 € (á 80 € * 7)
Food (á 120 € * 7)
Racing fuel / litre 6,20 € * 1000 l = 6200 €
Diesel (for transporting of the car etc.) á 100 € * 7 = 700 €
Tyres, winter 345 € * 30 = 10350 €
Tyres, summer 245 € * 30 = 7350 €
Insurance 2500 € * 7 = 17500 €
Accessories, spare parts etc. 2500 €
Total = 51540 € (64,7 %)

Testing costs:
Racing fuel 6,20 € * 400 = 2480 €
Tyres 1500 € (Usually with used tyres)
Set up work, lunch, payment for test road, permission fee etc.
Total = 7480 € (9,4 %)

General expenses:
Traffic + transporting insurance 750 €
Tools and small accessories 2500 €
Clothes 500 €
Ads + marketing materials 1500 €
Total = 6750 € (8,5 %)

Maintenance costs:
Rally-specific costs 350 € * 7 = 2450 € (wear parts, cost doesn’t include own work)
Seasonal maintenance 1: 3500 € (Maintenance of transmission, dampers and turbo. Cost doesn’t include own work)
Seasonal maintenance 2: 6500 € (Maintenance of engine, transmission, dampers and turbo. Cost doesn’t include own work)
Repair of equipments etc. 1500 € (Cost doesn’t include own work)
Total = 13950 € (17,5 %)

Total season costs = 79720 €

[Rally Power]

The price difference is probably over 50.000€. Taking the 175k mid value estimation for a MR puts their price at 160.000€ (very similar to brand new top spec N4), and enlarges the difference to 70.000€. 50 is really worst case scenario.

As Sulland said, these rules shoud be articulated between countries. I believe that as more european ASN's follows the spanish example, FIA will be obligue to allow N5/MR in Europe and unify their rules.

[Sulland]

Lets see on N5 prices, speed and durability in Spain for a year and see if this is the way forward for the new N4 (5)!

[br21]

First lets see if anyone here have exact prices of MR cars and parts? It's really interesting...
And I'm 100% sure FIA will never accept MR/N5 cars only because there will be a lot of them in local championships...:-(

[vino_93]

Autohebdo talked a few years ago than FIA was looking forward MR cars. But since, nothing has been done ...

About MR, I'm wondering how much these cars cost.
Because, if you look at other South American countries, you can see these cars aren't popular at all there.
- Paraguay : one MR, but most of the top crews are using R5 / S2000 / N4
- Bolivia : no MR. The rich guys have protos from Poland, and I think some N5 from Vidal (VW).
- Brasil : 2 MR. One running only in Argentina, and another slow. Their XRC project is still running, but only 3 or 4 exists.
- Uruguay : N4 only, no MR
- Chile : is looking to FIA categories only, with manufacturer support in R3. I think R5 will appear soon ... 2017 ?
- Peru : no MR neither, only N4.

[Sulland]

First lets see if anyone here have exact prices of MR cars and parts? It's really interesting...
And I'm 100% sure FIA will never accept MR/N5 cars only because there will be a lot of them in local championships...:-(

So let them stay as national classes! If they can work as a affordable recruiting class into the international arena, they will be perfect!

[Zeakiwi]

AP 4 Mazda shakedown so not at comptetion pace. Mazda turbo engine with sadev sequential transmission (heavy duty rallycross transverse model) and good brakes.
https://www.facebook.com/Holder-Brot...8636160829964/

[Co-driven]

Autohebdo talked a few years ago than FIA was looking forward MR cars. But since, nothing has been done ...

About MR, I'm wondering how much these cars cost.
Because, if you look at other South American countries, you can see these cars aren't popular at all there.
- Paraguay : one MR, but most of the top crews are using R5 / S2000 / N4
- Bolivia : no MR. The rich guys have protos from Poland, and I think some N5 from Vidal (VW).
- Brasil : 2 MR. One running only in Argentina, and another slow. Their XRC project is still running, but only 3 or 4 exists.
- Uruguay : N4 only, no MR
- Chile : is looking to FIA categories only, with manufacturer support in R3. I think R5 will appear soon ... 2017 ?
- Peru : no MR neither, only N4.

As I said earlier, Paraguay is a bit of a particular case because they can import without paying a lot of taxes and there is a lot of money invested in rallying over there.I don't know about specific regulations in Uruguay and don't know if MR are allowed there. Besides, they have some laws regarding importation of cars that allow them to bring in a car for a couple of years and after that they either pay all the taxes or send them back. So they usually run the car for two years and after that send it back out of the country.
In Peru I think they don't have a lot of problems importing cars, I think there is a lack of money to bring R5 or MR cars.
Chile follows FIA rules, but there was a rumor that MR would be running there soon.
Brasil has the problem of taxes and also lack of money for rallying.