Driver ratings

[Rollo]

I'm American so obviously I've had more chance to see drivers who were more "rounded" in their experience. My list of the best drivers would include Gurney, Andretti and Foyt because of their showings in F1, Indy cars, sports cars and stock cars. Clark belongs in this group too as he was very impressive in the couple stock car rides he had as well as at Indy.

Graham Hill is the only driver to have won the Triple Crown (under either definition). He won Le Mans in 1972, the Indy 500 in 1966 and two F1 world championships.

Jim Clark has a BTCC Championship to his name in 1966, two world championships and the 1965 Indy 500.

Jacky Ickx has six Le Mans victories to his name, the 1983 Paris-Dakar, 1977 Bathurst 1000, 1966 Spa 24 Hours, 1979 Can-Am Championship and his 8 GP victories are nothing to be sneezed at (he came close to a championship though).

[Mintexmemory]

...Back to my perennial theme. The guy who can be quick in anything he is given. The only F1 driver to actually win a major rally (forget Moss and his gentleman drives to a good dinner in the Sunbeams). In the space of 3 months at the start of 68 he won the Monte, Daytona 24 hrs and took 4th in the Spanish GP driving the dog that was the Cooper-BRM. He also went on that year to win his class in the British Saloon Car Championship in a 911.
His exploits in owning the Targa Florio are also the stuff of legend.
The fact that he never got a decent run at F1 after 68 is immaterial given he was one of the few guys (Rodriguez, Redman, Attwood) who could really drive a 917. I give you Vic Elford.

[Starter]

I agree on Hill, though I would rate Clark a little higher. I'd completely forgotten Elford as I didn't have an opportunity to see him.

[Mintexmemory]

Elford of course also drove CanAm in the 2J

[D-Type]

Whilst I agree that Vic Elford is often overlooked, I think it is a little uncharitable to dismiss Moss's three Alpine Rally penalty-free runs out of hand.

If you look at the results of the 1964 Safari you'll see that Ford Cortina GTs took the team prize finishing 1st, 3rd and 10th. The 10th place car was driven by Vic Elford and Lionel Baillon. The reason they were so far behind their team mates is interesting. About 30 miles from the finish a half shaft broke. The service car didn't have a spare and there were no Cortina driving spectators to donate one. Towing a car was prohibited by the regulations. So they wired a tyre to the front of the service car as a fender and pushed the stricken Cortina to the finish at full speed. At controls they 'juddered' the car away then carried on with the pushing once it was clear of the control.. There was a right royal fuss with protests flying but the organisers had to concede that it was within the rules.

[Mintexmemory]

Whilst I agree that Vic Elford is often overlooked, I think it is a little uncharitable to dismiss Moss's three Alpine Rally penalty-free runs out of hand.

Maybe so, but it really wasn't rallying as we have known it since the mid-60s. In fact Moss's Mille Miglia win is closer to modern tarmac rallies - could be argued that it''s the first ever use of pace notes.

[ZINOUCHA]

I think it is good to talk about one category at once, in this case F1, but you can also discuss another category on its own. Comparing different disciplines (which are like completely different sports with different performances, just look at ex-F1 drivers in DTM) is impossible. Like it is already hard enough to rate different eras of F1.

I do think driver can be rated only within the system in which they performed, i.e the series (F1) and the era. What unites Fangio and Schumacher is that they were considered as benchmark drivers for a while in their own era. Question what Fangio could have done in 00s or Schumacher in 50s is a bit academic audacity temp mail origin.

Obviously for all F1 fans it is a fascinating matter to rate drivers. But there is no science to properly separate man and machine plus take into account all other variables, so ratings and their accuracy are largely based on experience and gut feeling. You won't get an absolute truth, but you aim to get as close to 'genuine reflective performance' of drivers as you can.