WRC Wales Rally GB

[dimviii]

trying to replace gear box in 30 minutes
https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/408966_4551718876817_1091460332_n.jpg

[dimviii]

Loebs front left tyre
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/A21Ae3iCYAAgyAc.jpg

[Mirek]

trying to replace gear box in 30 minutes

Remember when some years a go a friend from JM Racing told me it is much more difficult to change gearbox in Fiesta than in Fabia. I think they did it normally with Fabia around 15 minutes , similar time with Punto.

[GigiGalliNo1]

I say if A.A was in the Mini he would be 7th or 8th. :)

[dimviii]

Remember when some years a go a friend from JM Racing told me it is much more difficult to change gearbox in Fiesta than in Fabia. I think they did it normally with Fabia around 15 minutes , similar time with Punto.

they said that at fiesta they need 25 minutes.

http://www.wrc.com/news/breen-confident-of-car-fix/?fid=17461

[Viking]

"Mads Ostberg is just 12.2s behind Loeb, and along with fellow M-Sport drivers Ott Tanak and Evgeny Novikov made history in Crychan as they combined to win every sector split of the stage - the first time this has been done by privateer drivers. Ostberg won the stage overall."

This stat from autosport. Any stat experts know if this is right? Would have guessed Petter won all the splits in at least one stage while he was in his private team.

That is a lot of data, but I am sure Petter did it. He won 90..somthing stages in 09-10-11 and the shorter stages only have one or two splits.

[stefanvv]

Remember when some years a go a friend from JM Racing told me it is much more difficult to change gearbox in Fiesta than in Fabia. I think they did it normally with Fabia around 15 minutes , similar time with Punto.

Things are getting complicated. Decades ago Ford Motorsport did that for 7 minutes in the Sierra!

[dimviii]

Things are getting complicated. Decades ago Ford Motorsport did that for 7 minutes in the Sierra!

sierra gearbox is not tranverse.

[Viking]

they said that at fiesta they need 25 minutes.

World Rally Championship - News - Breen confident of car fix (http://www.wrc.com/news/breen-confident-of-car-fix/?fid=17461)

Different car, perfect cicumstanses 5.48min! Oh I miss the blue cars (maybe not the S12b...) :)



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QLLvB_RHqfg

[stefanvv]

sierra gearbox is not tranverse.

True :)

[dimviii]

Different car, perfect cicumstanses 5.48min! Oh I miss the blue cars (maybe not the S12b...) :)



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QLLvB_RHqfg

subaru has the same configuration like Sierra,thats why you can change gearbox fast.

[Sulland]

Why does Ford almost always go in the wrong direction when they do set-up changes, spare or no spare in the car?
Strange!

[skarderud]

Nice one Petter! And a important one, and for one times sake, loeb afraid of the worn out on his tyres. Seems like Petter has found his setup again.

[stefanvv]

Why does Ford almost always go in the wrong direction when they do set-up changes, spare or no spare in the car?
Strange!

Ostberg said yesterday his car is not balanced that well for two spares, I don't know the exact reason for this though...

[dimviii]

Why does Ford almost always go in the wrong direction when they do set-up changes, spare or no spare in the car?
Strange!

at this rally they have performed excellent at all levels till now.Tanak impressive time with 2 spares

[RAS007]

Well, this all makes a fine change now, doesn't it?

[stefanvv]

Well, this all makes a fine change now, doesn't it?

Yes for sure. Both Ford teams are doing really good so far...

[RAS007]

at this rally they have performed excellent at all levels till now.Tanak impressive time with 2 spares

Any reason for the sudden avatar change? ;)

[Sulland]

So throw the 2nd spare out of the car Mads !! ;-))

[stefanvv]

Any reason for the sudden avatar change? ;)

Who is that? :D
Isn't little yearly to sprinkle the champagne? :D

[rjbetty]

My Thoughts:
1.Any sport in which someone like Petter Solberg hasn't been able to win for 7 years has something very wrong with it. I do think he has long since lost his edge, apart from 2010. This just seems very wrong.
2.Whatever happened to Gigi Galli?!!
3.Matty ain't doing that badly considering he's been gone so long, given people had him being around 12th-15th before the start.

[stefanvv]

SS11: ØSTBERG M. / ANDERSSON J. (st. č. 10) "Just struggling so much with two spares. Car feel strange, I'm not able to drive it."
0.6 secs adrift from the winner Latvalla and 3rd time.

What it would be if he is able to drive it :D

[darkstar]

östberg and tänak start to impress me :)

[stefanvv]

östberg and tänak start to impress me :)

Hirvonen might loose 5th. O-mai, O-mai :o hplease: I might overestimated him in pickems :eek:

[T.Maanteiden kuningas]

Latvala was in second split +3.2 behind Petter and in finish just +0.4 He is pushing still quite hard. GOOD.

[stefanvv]

Latvala was in second split +3.2 behind Petter and in finish just +0.4 He is pushing still quite hard. GOOD.

Said he lost time in muddy section... I guess that is in the start of the stage...

[andyone]

Well, this all makes a fine change now, doesn't it?

Yap once in a while citroen being pushed. Well done to ford

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

[andyone]

Tannak eating up mikkos time stage after stage

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

[Miika]

Come on Ott, you can do it.

[janvanvurpa]

Things are getting complicated. Decades ago Ford Motorsport did that for 7 minutes in the Sierra!


I can assure you that is a little exagerated.....I know some older English and spent time at Boreham..and I've asked the guys who had to do it.
A good clean swap in a Group4 Escort maybe 11 minutes if every thing worked well.

Mike Little Motorsport way up in Yorkshire had the contract from Ford to develop Group N parts and techniques and I was buying some Sierra parts from him when he was closing the business. He said thet did 1 gearbox change at the big motor show in Birmingham under the lights and if front of cameras etc and they had modded a fair amount of things to make it quicker--like slotting some places bolts went thru holes--he said "not quite legal--- and it took them 14 or 17m....this was the 4x4 box---like I have in my rally car...17m would be real good. :s mash:

[Rallyper]

Loebs front left tyre
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/A21Ae3iCYAAgyAc.jpg

Too low tyre pressure....

[T.Maanteiden kuningas]

Huge attack by JML!! Great time at SS13

[stefanvv]

Forza Jariiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!

Indeed he goes :D The difference between him and Loeb passed 30 secs, I know victory for Loeb is not crucial here, but wow.

[tolis]

http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/396452_423862984337803_1798157912_n.jpg

[andyone]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tZ2NDGzk5S4&feature=em-uploademail

[Jafry]

http://www.rally-mania.cz/fotogalerie/2012/1079/1079_wales_rally_gb_2012_58b728b46c.jpg

http://www.rally-mania.cz/fotogalerie/2012/1079/1079_wales_rally_gb_2012_69b337785e.jpg

http://www.rally-mania.cz/fotogalerie/2012/1079/1079_wales_rally_gb_2012_a61bcc941f.jpg

http://www.rally-mania.cz/fotogalerie/2012/1079/1079_wales_rally_gb_2012_0278e17786.jpg

http://www.rally-mania.cz/fotogalerie/2012/1079/1079_wales_rally_gb_2012_c442062a43.jpg

More photos from day 2 HERE (http://www.rally-mania.cz/photogallery.php?id=1079)

[MJW]

What have citroen done to Mikko's car? turning it down or something? Honestly Mikko is driving fantasticly well, with good braking points, turn in, not sideways, on driving his times do not reflect this. Something strange. Cynically I am thinking Citroen want to clinch championships at the next round, so on a round that Mikko could win his car seems to be a bit like Petter's DS3, do they not want him to win so they make sure of this?

[dimviii]

lol
they had turned it down in Ford too?

[rallye-vid]

Tomorrow we will see a lot of hot battles ;)

Al Rahji vs. Breen
Hirvonen vs. Tänak
Solberg vs. Loeb
Tänak vs. Novikov

Latvala vs. himself

[stefanvv]

Tomorrow we will see a lot of hot battles ;)

Al Rahji vs. Breen
Hirvonen vs. Tänak
Solberg vs. Loeb
Tänak vs. Novikov

Latvala vs. himself

:laugh: Tough day for Tanak & Latvalla is going to be...

[dimviii]

lol
they had turned it down in Ford too?

that was an answer to a post that dissapeared.


from Citroen racing twitter
Interesting to notice that the @WalesRallyGB (http://twitter.com/WalesRallyGB) top 13 didn't change since SS5!!!

[tolis]

that was an answer to a post that dissapeared.


from Citroen racing twitter
Interesting to notice that the @WalesRallyGB (http://twitter.com/WalesRallyGB) top 13 didn't change since SS5!!!

00.00 vale ET1 dim!

[stefanvv]

that was an answer to a post that dissapeared.


from Citroen racing twitter
Interesting to notice that the @WalesRallyGB (http://twitter.com/WalesRallyGB) top 13 didn't change since SS5!!!

That's amazing - no one has crashed out/malfunctioned.

[Rallyper]

Where is N.O.T. someone!!?? We need your comments right now!

[stefanvv]

Where is N.O.T. someone!!?? We need your comments right now!

He had predicted well what is going to happen and gone preliminary...

[Ultima]

Can u get into a forest stage without a ticket? I done it a few times in the past, is it only stages like Walters Arena that are more stringent with the security?

Also, is Andy Burton competing this year with his Peugeot Cosworth?

Thanks

[satnav]

Can u get into a forest stage without a ticket? I done it a few times in the past, is it only stages like Walters Arena that are more stringent with the security?

Also, is Andy Burton competing this year with his Peugeot Cosworth?

Thanks

Yes for your first question
And No to your second

[Ultima]

So is it a waste of time trying to get into Walters Arena without a ticket?

[driveace]

No I am sure Andy Burton is not competing ,as I dont think there is a class for his unorthodox car in this event .You can get into any forest stage to spectate providing you avoid the official designated entry point ,I would have thought

[Ultima]

No I am sure Andy Burton is not competing ,as I dont think there is a class for his unorthodox car in this event .You can get into any forest stage to spectate providing you avoid the official designated entry point ,I would have thought

The problem is where to park as there's plenty of law enforcement around stopping people parking on grass verges etc.

[Ultima]

Anyone know any good parking places for the Rheola or Walters Arena stages?

[AndyRAC]

Anyone know any good parking places for the Rheola or Walters Arena stages?

Yes, the official car parks. Will cost you £25 for entry..... There is nowhere else to park, unless you don't mind your car being towed away. This probably explains the low spectator numbers.....

[byrnec39]

Tomorrow we will see a lot of hot battles ;)

Al Rahji vs. Breen
Hirvonen vs. Tänak
Solberg vs. Loeb
Tänak vs. Novikov

Latvala vs. himself

Winners (my prediction)
Breen
Tänak
Solberg
Tänak
Latvala ;)

[tfp]

Can u get into a forest stage without a ticket? I done it a few times in the past, is it only stages like Walters Arena that are more stringent with the security?

Also, is Andy Burton competing this year with his Peugeot Cosworth?

Thanks

I thought Burton was forced to retire the car because the MSA banned it?

Andy Burton Haye Park 2011 - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PAvdeWzhY80&feature=related)

Such a shame, unfortunately I am too young to have witnessed the group B era, but I can almost imagine this Q plate 306 to be something like the monsterous cars of the 80's.

[dimviii]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BUoGDHxaWGo&feature=player_embedded

[rallye-vid]

Solberg f** up his setup again? :dozey:

Al Rahji out of the battle for SWRC win after a 5min penalty

[dimviii]

Tanak +31 Novikov +52 wtf?

[dimviii]

Loeb 1,4 from Petter.

[rallye-vid]

:eek:


07:48 Ostberg on the pace despite misfire

Mads Ostberg's sick-sounding Adapta Ford reaches the finish having lost only 4s to Mikko Hirvonen."I don't have the slightest idea. Something with the engine. It's not running as it's supposed to do. We are pushing hard anyway," says Ostberg.

07:44 Tanak also in trouble

Yet more early-morning drama as Ott Tanak spins his M-Sport Ford as well."I just touched the bank and spun. It was a very narrow place so it took a really long time to get it straight again," says the Estonian.

07:43 Minor drama for Novikov

Evgeny Novikov loses around half a minute when he slides off the road near the end of the stage."The end of the stage was a bit slippery. Just before the last corner I missed the braking and I stalled. It's fine, no problems," he says.

07:38 Wilson hits problems too

Ostberg isn't the only Ford privateer having a tough start - Matthew Wilson comes through with a misfire."I don't know how we managed to do that time because the misfire is just incredible. It's really not a smooth acceleration, it's just juddering all the time," he says.

[Bl187 TME]

Citroen seems to be running on the right setup this morning. It was very strange to see Loeb giving up the last 2 days.

[dimviii]

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/557209_10151036843095754_321879636_n.jpg

[EightGear]

Nice one for Abbring finally. :)

[dimviii]

end ss14
https://twitpic.com/show/large/av4tzx

[dimviii]

Loeb passed Petter

[T.Maanteiden kuningas]

Latvala is controlling the rally. This is too good to be real! Pessimisti ei pety.

[Bl187 TME]

Let's see Peters reaction. Does he have the strengths to stay on the road and win the 2nd place. It's really a big chalenge for him.

[andyone]

Latvala is controlling the rally. This is too good to be real! Pessimisti ei pety.
Tell me about it.. if jari was on peters position he would have put up an awesome fight.. the only person who can shake things to Loeb if he don't have the bad luck.

[dimviii]

Let's see Peters reaction. Does he have the strengths to stay on the road and win the 2nd place. It's really a big chalenge for him.
i dont think that he will react.

[andyone]

i dont think that he will react.
looks like he is trying

[rallye-vid]

Not anymore..

Let's hope there are no stones on the road

[dimviii]

looks like he is trying

not clever

[dimviii]

not clever
[SS16] Petter Solberg (Ford) 8:53.2 - Finishes with damage to the front left rim - "I was over jump when I landed, I heard it happen. We lost a little bit and got a little bit back at the end :vader:

[bluuford]

not clever

Novikov got 250 EUR fine for speeding:
http://www.walesrallygb.com/documents/C_o_C_Decision_No._5.pdf

Yazeed got 135 EUR fine for first speeding
http://www.walesrallygb.com/C_of_C_Decision_No._2_%28Signed%29.pdf

and

Yazeed got five minutes penalty for second speeding:
http://www.walesrallygb.com/documents/C_of_C_Decision_No._4_%28signed%29.pdf

Bertelli got 140 EUR fine for first speeding

Busy day for local police

[rallye-vid]

Too bad for Yazeed.. He is driving well this time and the penalty costs him the SWRC win

[Sulland]

Too often the 'rental' Fords start to play games to the renters. Too bad, since rents for the WRCars are high, and they deserve better !!

[pucky54]

Too bad for Yazeed.. He is driving well this time and the penalty costs him the SWRC win

Own mistake if you ask me if you're driving too fast on public roads!!!

[mstfozkan]

is there any broadcast for power stage ?

[Ultima]

is there any broadcast for power stage ?

All I can find are highlights programs on S4C and MotorsTV. U would have thought the BBC would have had some live coverage, I suppose all the money was spent on the Olympics.

£25 for entry to a stage is ridiculous!

[noel157]

Too bad for Yazeed.. He is driving well this time and the penalty costs him the SWRC win

I doubt he would've been able to hold back Breen once he got his new gearbox.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

All I can find are highlights programs on S4C and MotorsTV. U would have thought the BBC would have had some live coverage, I suppose all the money was spent on the Olympics.

£25 for entry to a stage is ridiculous!

Wales TV channel S4C really should be showing the Power Stage live...

Rally GB is the biggest international sports event in Wales and they should be making the most of it.

I cant find coverage anywhere online either. :(

[noel157]

Wales TV channel S4C really should be showing the Power Stage live...

Rally GB is the biggest international sports event in Wales and they should be making the most of it.

I cant find coverage anywhere online either. :(

Yep, nothing on anywhere that I can find. Just highlights as you mentioned.

[rallye-vid]

The final loop is running :vader:

[dimviii]

yes is running :vader:

[rallye-vid]

Nobre decided to stay in the woods?

[dimviii]

Prokop at ss stop
https://twitpic.com/show/large/av7s84

[AndyRAC]

Wales TV channel S4C really should be showing the Power Stage live...

Rally GB is the biggest international sports event in Wales and they should be making the most of it.

I cant find coverage anywhere online either. :(

It could be argued that the sport gets the coverage it deserves. This isn't the Lombard RAC Rally, it's a minor sporting event in the British calendar.

[dimviii]

Tanak stopped in stage

[dimviii]

Tanak stopped in stage

broken wheel from vysledky.cz

[wwbroe]

broken wheel from vysledky.cz

Too bad for Ott, with only two more stages to go, he was doing a fine rally untill now. :(

[dimviii]

Latvala not splits at all

[rallye-vid]

Latvalas splits?

[Viking]

Good one from Petter. Game on!

[dimviii]

Petter 0,3 in front of Seb.
carnage treiler must be ready to collect :vader:

[wwbroe]

Petter takes back his second place from Seb, great driving.

[6789]

I have fath that Solberg can bring it home. If not he'll rip a wheel off big time lol

[pino]

Go Petter !!! :D

[rallye-vid]

Wilson performs a voodoo to all stones on the stages now to disappear from Petters driving line :vader:

[René]

Personal message:

Please Malcom don't take the champagne bottle in your hand before the final line crossed by your 2 cars !

[René]

Thinking about Rajd Polski 2009... :D

yes :)

And at same time I was sad for him, with this unbelievable scenario

[rallye-vid]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ubFjib2FoA

[Viking]

Unforgetable pictures...

[Ultima]

It could be argued that the sport gets the coverage it deserves. This isn't the Lombard RAC Rally, it's a minor sporting event in the British calendar.

But it is the Welsh/British round of the World Rally Championship.

[rallye-vid]

WRC is nothing worth these days .. Sad but true

[rallye-vid]

Loeb vs. Solberg 0.1s before the last stage... HOT

[dimviii]

Latvala again without splits

[andyone]

i think Jarri it pushing too much.. he should take it easy.. he is still doing some fast times and he doesn't need to.

[Rallyper]

A stump of tree on the road in front of PG: s car destroyed his power steering on PT2... Pity.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

But it is the Welsh/British round of the World Rally Championship.

Yes and we're not saying it should be live on the BBC - S4C is the Welsh TV channel and the Welsh do love their rallying so they should at least be catering for their own viewing public.

S4C could even have streamed the PS on their 'Ralio' website ...

[dimviii]

Chris Atkinson (Mini) 10:27.9 - Damage to the rear left wheel, wheel at 45 degree angle "I thought we had a puncture, I have no idea…" - could be a snapped wishbone

[Ultima]

WRC is nothing worth these days .. Sad but true

Do u mean compared to F1 or other rally championships?

[dimviii]

http://a.yfrog.com/img875/2868/81krj.jpg

[GigiGalliNo1]

Come on PETTER!!! :D

[T.Maanteiden kuningas]

Split 2 Petter 0,2 faster than Loeb....

[GigiGalliNo1]

Close!!!

[darkstar]

solberg messed it up...

[T.Maanteiden kuningas]

Split 3 Petter is loosing, now 1,3s behind Loeb

[rallye-vid]

Now slower than Loeb

[darkstar]

0.8 seconds...pitty for solberg.

[Zeropt]

Fu... :mad:

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Disappointing for Petter, he should have got 2nd in this rally after the Citroen times on day 1 & 2.

[T.Maanteiden kuningas]

HYVÄ SUOMI FINLAND PERKELE!!!!! LATVALA WINSSSSS!!

Just awesome great VICTORY!! LATVALA "king of WALES" YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Latvala wins - brilliant drive ! :)

[BDunnell]

But it is the Welsh/British round of the World Rally Championship.

A championship, in my opinion, sadly not worthy of mainstream coverage. What is there of interest to cover?

[andyone]

AND HE WINS RALLY GB.. THANK YOU LATVALA FOR THE WIN.. YIPIEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!! :eek:

[T.Maanteiden kuningas]

And Mikko fastest on PowerStage.....GREAT!!!

[Rallyper]

These are the fights we want to see always!!!! Next year one more team in the fights...

[dimviii]

HYVÄ SUOMI FINLAND PERKELE!!!!! LATVALA WINSSSSS!!

Just awesome great VICTORY!! LATVALA "king of WALES" YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!
http://rallyphoto.automoto365.com/pictures/big/single/latvala_finlande12_8.jpg

[René]

Congrats to Jari Matti he really deserve that one ! ;)

[Hartusvuori]

Thank you Latvala! I can breath again :)

It's funny how when Latvala wins, it's basically after a dominating performance. This weekend there has not been second guessing who's been the fastest out there.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

A championship, in my opinion, sadly not worthy of mainstream coverage. What is there of interest to cover?

Only asking for WRGB to be live on Wales S4C, a minority Welsh language channel... hardly mainstream !

[rallye-vid]

Well done Jari-Matti .. Plz more next time ;)

[GigiGalliNo1]

Sad hearing WRCLive radio now...

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Great win for Breen also... that's for Jaffa (Gareth Roberts RIP) !

SS19 - Craig Breen wins S2000 - a hugely emotional win; "I'm so glad I've done it - I know he was there with me this afternoon..."

[RAS007]

Well done to JM, really good win. Pity for Petter though.

[dimviii]

Congrats to Latvala and M-sport for an excellent rally from 1st stage to last.
As we saw there is no rocket science suspensions,not cars specially made for Loeb etc.
Just to setup properly and stay inside the road while being fast.
Was a rally with proper preperation from Ford,and bad preparation for Citroen.
Hope the win will boost Latvalas confidence, we need it for the last rounds.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

JML at the finish: Jari-Matti WINS Wales Rally GB - YouTube
http://d3j5vwomefv46c.cloudfront.net/photos/large/657150416.jpg?key=640480&Expires=1347802112&Key-Pair-Id=APKAIYVGSUJFNRFZBBTA&Signature=zU5jYVog~8pCLRntMkMyptw9l3KvSad-PME3Ji7MP1FqyWNODQS8waE3m22MiJUke7u9XuKNtLvl3PugdU jox0nqzeB3evMZl2Q27QC~RdrUqVzokC0TjIhUMk4ryubx7cg4 wMZrtvZnxyfLpwiVGg9MXjJGMDUafJdlhhFoq~4_ (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fkdo7ipJNEs)

[tolis]

http://sphotos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/76218_343337242425318_1002415989_n.jpg

[mstfozkan]

congrats to jml and petter...

[Ultima]

Next round is asphalt, Loeb to rule again!

[tolis]

Next round is asphalt, Loeb to rule again!
Let us enjoy Jari's win now!!!!!!!!

[Viking]

Happy for Ford and JM also Petter has a wery good rally neck'n neck to Loeb all weekend.

And one more, Østberg :up: Fast and concistent, beating Mikko fair and square as an privater. I really did not think he had it in him.

[GigiGalliNo1]

Next round is asphalt, Loeb to rule again!

Ford will win ;)

[tolis]

SWRC standings after GB, with 2 tamac (France, Spain) rounds to go:

Andersson 76
Breen 68
Paddon 68
Oleksowicz 65
Al Rajhi 55

[Karukera]

Refreshing in every way, big congrats to Latvala.

Setup, tires, titles manoeuvers or not, he was out of reach there :up: .

Hyvä JML ! :beer:

[Sulland]

Congratulations to all involved in the top fight.
lets do it like this in the next rally as well, untune the citroens for the first 2/3 of the rally, so we can hold the exitement to the end !! :D

[rjbetty]

Random Short Interlude: (An idea nicked from Antony Warmbold) :)

1.Really sad for Petter who definitely is not at his best. I think it's the fact he now hasn't won a rally for 7 years - a statistic that almost beggars belief, and for me shows that there is something very wrong with this sport. This must be affecting him very much, as would be that Malcolm isn't very fond on him (he is in the same situation as Mark Webber at Red Bull kinda). This rally could be a defining moment in his career as he came only 3rd in a straight fight. In his prime he could probably have won this. I remember how he finished Tommi Makinen's career and his "warp 10" speed on Rally GB in the past, as Autosport's David Evans put it.

2.Throughout his entire time in the WRC, Matty Wilson has received massive amounts of hate which has been spewed at him. I always felt it was OTT (and I don't mean Tanak). I admit I did get a little stewed a couple of years ago and attacked him once or twice when it looked to me he was getting SLOWER and didn't appear bothered about it. But this was all out of frustration and a big desire to see him do well, not anything negative.

Anyway, I thought he wasn't too bad this weekend. I think this has been the quickest he's ever been on this rally compared to the leaders. He himself said he has monitored his splits and they have been faster. He was 3.3% off the pace rather than 3.7%, which I think was his previous best here. Considering he's been out the whole year, I'm reasonably satisfied.

3.Disappointed with Paddon's car failure. I want him to win WRC and don't want him being let down by his car.

4.Where is Alister Mcrae? Was it only one or two rallies he was doing in the Proton? :(

5.I wish the Resolven stage would make a return. I grew up on the other side of the mountain in the village of Glyncorrwg, and it was amazing to hear the sound of the cars reverberating through the village as they came down the mountainside, with helicopters also around the place!

[noel157]

Random Short Interlude: (An idea nicked from Antony Warmbold) :)

1.Really sad for Petter who definitely is not at his best. I think it's the fact he now hasn't won a rally for 7 years - a statistic that almost beggars belief, and for me shows that there is something very wrong with this sport. This must be affecting him very much, as would be that Malcolm isn't very fond on him (he is in the same situation as Mark Webber at Red Bull kinda). This rally could be a defining moment in his career as he came only 3rd in a straight fight. In his prime he could probably have won this. I remember how he finished Tommi Makinen's career and his "warp 10" speed on Rally GB in the past, as Autosport's David Evans put it.

2.Throughout his entire time in the WRC, Matty Wilson has received massive amounts of hate which has been spewed at him. I always felt it was OTT (and I don't mean Tanak). I admit I did get a little stewed a couple of years ago and attacked him once or twice when it looked to me he was getting SLOWER and didn't appear bothered about it. But this was all out of frustration and a big desire to see him do well, not anything negative.

Anyway, I thought he wasn't too bad this weekend. I think this has been the quickest he's ever been on this rally compared to the leaders. He himself said he has monitored his splits and they have been faster. He was 3.3% off the pace rather than 3.7%, which I think was his previous best here. Considering he's been out the whole year, I'm reasonably satisfied.

3.Disappointed with Paddon's car failure. I want him to win WRC and don't want him being let down by his car.

4.Where is Alister Mcrae? Was it only one or two rallies he was doing in the Proton? :(

5.I wish the Resolven stage would make a return. I grew up on the other side of the mountain in the village of Glyncorrwg, and it was amazing to hear the sound of the cars reverberating through the village as they came down the mountainside, with helicopters also around the place!

Excellent, young Wilson's multi year plan has generated 0.4% improvement. Well worth all those millions then....#Not.

As somebody said somewhere else:

"Is is easier to see the breasts of the future queen than find footage of Wales Rally GB. Something's gone badly wrong."

Well done to Latvala, good win. Congratulations to Loeb, another WRC championship.
And also to Craig Breen and Paul Nagle. Perhaps a little fortunate regarding the attrition rate but a win is a win and in Gareth Roberts' home country.

[driveace]

You cannot knock Petter,he has had a terrible time these last few years,when he had run his own team.To come back with Ford at 37 ? Years old and be on the pace,well !He is on a place where Mikko never was ,and unless Ford are to spend horrendous amounts of money to coax Loeb,he is the best driver for the job I admire his results,and he ain't far of ,and better to finish 3rd than to throw it off trying to keep Loeb behind!

[Viking]

Random Short Interlude: (An idea nicked from Antony Warmbold) :)

1.Really sad for Petter who definitely is not at his best. I think it's the fact he now hasn't won a rally for 7 years - a statistic that almost beggars belief, and for me shows that there is something very wrong with this sport. This must be affecting him very much, as would be that Malcolm isn't very fond on him (he is in the same situation as Mark Webber at Red Bull kinda). This rally could be a defining moment in his career as he came only 3rd in a straight fight. In his prime he could probably have won this. I remember how he finished Tommi Makinen's career and his "warp 10" speed on Rally GB in the past, as Autosport's David Evans put it.

2.Throughout his entire time in the WRC, Matty Wilson has received massive amounts of hate which has been spewed at him. I always felt it was OTT (and I don't mean Tanak). I admit I did get a little stewed a couple of years ago and attacked him once or twice when it looked to me he was getting SLOWER and didn't appear bothered about it. But this was all out of frustration and a big desire to see him do well, not anything negative.

Anyway, I thought he wasn't too bad this weekend. I think this has been the quickest he's ever been on this rally compared to the leaders. He himself said he has monitored his splits and they have been faster. He was 3.3% off the pace rather than 3.7%, which I think was his previous best here. Considering he's been out the whole year, I'm reasonably satisfied.

3.Disappointed with Paddon's car failure. I want him to win WRC and don't want him being let down by his car.

4.Where is Alister Mcrae? Was it only one or two rallies he was doing in the Proton? :(

5.I wish the Resolven stage would make a return. I grew up on the other side of the mountain in the village of Glyncorrwg, and it was amazing to hear the sound of the cars reverberating through the village as they came down the mountainside, with helicopters also around the place!

Seeing your post and signature.....


Are you Matthew Wilson in disguise??

;)

[stefanvv]

Congratulations to Latvala for the win, very good one and long missing this year. Also for Solberg's 3rd place. Ford did excellent rally first 2/3 of it. I don't know what happened today, it was not their day obviously, but most of the job was done anyway.

Probably Solberg could keep that second place, but he made 2 small mistakes in his setup yesterday and today. Looks like he is not so sure what setups will work best for his Fiesta. I know he has small amount of hours with it on tarmac, but on gravel there are plenty of them. Anyway it is not bad result at all to fight with the master till the end...

[dimviii]

https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/381141_470814162952977_1714700734_n.jpg

[rallye-vid]

I got some tears myself now ...

[noel157]

I got some tears myself now ...

Me too.

[noel157]

We argue and worry about television coverage. We discuss who is good and who is bad, who should be driving better, who should be driving harder but that picture of Craig Breen puts everything into prospective. Rallying isn't that important.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Craig Breen with Gareth Roberts' family on the Wales Rally GB (https://twitter.com/WalesRallyGB) finish ramp in Cardiff Bay. Nice touch.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/A27DYZKCcAAxi8n.jpg

[rallyfiend]

You sir, win the Forum.

[rallyfiend]

We argue and worry about television coverage. We discuss who is good and who is bad, who should be driving better, who should be driving harder but that picture of Craig Breen puts everything into prospective. Rallying isn't that important.

You sir, win The Forum.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Classic rally cars at the ceremonial start in LLandudno... fantastic :)

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/A2rsHiJCQAEnUgi.jpg:large

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/A2rsgHpCYAMiOXs.jpg:large

[stefanvv]

Classic rally cars at the ceremonial start in LLandudno... fantastic :)

That white-yellow kind-of are always sticking into my monitor :D

[stefanvv]

Craig Breen with Gareth Roberts' family on the Wales Rally GB (https://twitter.com/WalesRallyGB) finish ramp in Cardiff Bay. Nice touch.

Emotional and important moment! R.I.P.

[Ucci]

Ford will win ;)


In R2 class, maybe....

[andyone]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zMLxAF21h-g

[dimviii]

and another emotional photo....
https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/184075_10151074692212775_1436940657_n.jpg

[dimviii]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Red98v1_0mk

[306 Cosworth]

Here's my highlights video from a mega 3 days watching the worlds best!


http://youtu.be/Kt5gVo74dEM?hd=1

My highlight drivers were Yazeed Al-Rahji and Mads Ostberg, both very impressive.

[dimviii]

Here's my highlights video from a mega 3 days watching the worlds best!


http://youtu.be/Kt5gVo74dEM?hd=1

My highlight drivers were Yazeed Al-Rahji and Mads Ostberg, both very impressive.

very well choosen spots!!At 3,15(Novikov) dont you have any other passes from same spot except Loeb?

[dimviii]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DKEjxiHubA&feature=player_embedded

[306 Cosworth]

very well choosen spots!!At 3,15(Novikov) dont you have any other passes from same spot except Loeb?

Yes I have all the WRC from that spot, but Novikov was the best around that spot, and I didn't include too many clips from there because of the kids with their phones getting in the way on the apex of the corner.

[tolis]

http://sphotos-g.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/550433_4558205398976_1817136688_n.jpg

[306 Cosworth]

A bizarre sight for some of us in the Hafren stage on Friday.


http://youtu.be/yrNzPInDja0

[dimviii]

Tanak at least at this point didn t touched something


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xdz-k7Ele58&feature=player_embedded

[bluuford]

http://sphotos-g.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/550433_4558205398976_1817136688_n.jpg
Bad luck this time:
Ott says:
“There was a long straight through the forest and one of the marshals had told us that one of the cars in front had pulled some rocks onto the stage. They had managed to clear most of them, but there was one left and I didn’t see it as it was behind a crest. We hit it and it went under the car and broke the suspension.

“For sure before that the event had been going really well. OK the first day was quite difficult making the change from Tarmac to gravel without a test. But yesterday was pretty good and we were setting some good times and keeping in touch with the guys in front.”

[darkstar]

poor tänak, i think its normal that in the first season you have big problems to adapt to a wrc from a s2000 car. and in general he has not got a lot of experience and he also has no testing. shurely he also has not a top spec car like latvala and solberg. tänak is quite young, wilson sets him under pressure, what does he imagine? i hope tänak will have the chance to do at least another season on top level.

[stefanvv]

poor tänak, i think its normal that in the first season you have big problems to adapt to a wrc from a s2000 car. and in general he has not got a lot of experience and he also has no testing. shurely he also has not a top spec car like latvala and solberg. tänak is quite young, wilson sets him under pressure, what does he imagine? i hope tänak will have the chance to do at least another season on top level.

Fears that will loose Latvalla and probably will promote him with factory seat :confused:

EDIT: Probably is not secret that Wilson likes him and thinks he is one of the future champions. I don't know how lack of tests fits in all that though...

[Fly_Half]

5.I wish the Resolven stage would make a return. I grew up on the other side of the mountain in the village of Glyncorrwg, and it was amazing to hear the sound of the cars reverberating through the village as they came down the mountainside, with helicopters also around the place!

No rallying in the Resolfen/Rhondda complex for the foreseeable future, as a huge windfarm is being constructed up there over the next 3-4 years. My home stage :(

[bassist]

We argue and worry about television coverage. We discuss who is good and who is bad, who should be driving better, who should be driving harder but that picture of Craig Breen puts everything into prospective. Rallying isn't that important.

Sums it all up for me! Well said that man!

[tfp]

Well done Jari Matti!! A nice and refreshing change to the WRC results! Fantastic result, this one victory will mean more to JML than 10 rally wins by Loeb.
And well done to Petter aswel, he may be past his best, but this weekend proves he has about 95% of what he used to have! A 9 time world champion barely scraped a couple of tenths to be in front of him at the end, well....That just proves his worth and proves that he still belongs in the seat of Fords factory team. I hope we get to see him still in the sport next season and many more to come! That win has got to come soon....

[tfp]

Has anyone else noticed JML is much more reliable at the second half of the season? Spends most of the time in a ditch at the first half of the season, and most of his time at the podium or on top in the second half?

[stefanvv]

Has anyone else noticed JML is much more reliable at the second half of the season? Spends most of the time in a ditch at the first half of the season, and most of his time at the podium or on top in the second half?

Sure. I think he is more calmed now as he is not trying to be at front of Loeb at all cost all the time. If he can keep that attitude for the future, there is nothing but titles are expecting him, 'cause for sure he has the speed :up:

[janvanvurpa]

Well done Jari Matti!! A nice and refreshing change to the WRC results! Fantastic result, this one victory will mean more to JML than 10 rally wins by Loeb.
And well done to Petter aswel, he may be past his best, but this weekend proves he has about 99.997% of what he used to have! A 9 time world champion barely scraped a couple of tenths to be in front of him at the end, well....That just proves his worth and proves that he still belongs in the seat of Fords factory team. I hope we get to see him still in the sport next season and many more to come! That win has got to come soon....


Fixed that for you.

[kirungi okwogera]

A nice clean rally from almost everyone! Hardly any mistakes and restarts etc. Latvala shows he can contend - I hope he can continue to, because it's been a few years now waiting for his speed to start to combine with consistency. The "make a fast driver consistent" saying needs to come true for him now.

Petter, well, I wanted him to take 2nd from Loeb - well, to be honest I want him to win one more rally, just one, any rally, so he can retire a happy man! But Loeb is who he is.

For SWRC for sure it's poetic for Breen to win here, but I really think Paddon probably would have had it in the bag without another random mechanical fault on the first day. Without mechanicals Breen would be fighting Al Rajhi for the podium no doubt, but Paddon won 9 stages out of the 14 he ran when his car wasn't broken... All the same, Breen shows a brave recovery.

Congratulations to Yazeed for a performance (minus speeding tickets) that shows he can run. First time I've noticed good speed from him this season. Both he and Paddon approached Ogier's "factory Skoda" times. Paddon actually took Ogier for a second on SS15 and five on SS14. It's a pity his new team just basically lost him two gravel rallies when he's quickest on that surface. He was freakishly error-free for basically his whole PWRC career.

Now the SWRC points standings are really stacked up! 5 guys within 20 points or so! Dramatic finale for sure, hope it'll make up for the inexorable Citroën/Loeb win in WRC. Not that they don't deserve it, but the human mind craves drama and conflict!

And some of these SWRC guys are drivers I'd definitely like to see given a go in WRC cars in the future! Breen, Al Rajhi, Paddon...

And let the Mini/Atkinson/Araujo guys continue to speculate on the 01B conspiracy...

[Munkvy]

Its a sad testament to the WRC that once again the SWRC has a better title race than the WRC itself...

[spiderem]

What happened to Mikko this week end? it is a bit worrying his lack of pace, and the fact that he kind resigned himself to fight and get more speed after only few stages...
And the setup of the DS3 shouldn't be an excuse as he managed to get the power stage...
Come on Mikko, show us some crazyness a bit, and prove that you deserve to be a flying finn.

[rjbetty]

Seeing your post and signature.....


Are you Matthew Wilson in disguise??

;)

Yes it's me. I came 8th on Wales Rally GB yesterday. What did you lot do? *BLOWS MASSIVE RASPBERRY*

And yes I HAVE improved quite a bit thank you very much. I was 6 minutes off the pace - but you gotta admit that's miles better than being 18 minutes off in Monte Carlo. Did you see how I totally whooped Atko in the Mini, haha!

Any chance of you lot cloobing together and sending oos a few quid for another rally? Dad says he managed to raise some cash by selling Henning off. :p My dad's also a (dodgy) second hand car dealer in Ford Fiesta WRCs. He can save soom more cash by fitting even more soobstandard parts to their cars - notice how Prokop's gears were a bit off yesterday.

Maybe Mentos will give me soom cash if I ploog their sweets for them. Why not? They're sponsoring a boonch of obscure Ukrainians and an Argentinian coomback guy already (took him long enoof to finally win a round).

To make my point about Petter again: To oonderstand how long it's been since he woon a rally, my five year plan hadn't begoon yet!

And yeah my ankle's better, thanks for asking. :p

(oh dear I might get in so much trouble by impersonating someone... And I really have got to stop taking the mick out of accents other than my own. :p )

[Plan9]

So Armindo was right about his car all along, Atko could do not better with it. I'll bet Meeke in the Bentley was more interesting to watch. On SWRC; it will be interesting to see if PG can hold his nerve and not overdrive the Proton out of contention on the tarmac (a surface he is quite strong on).

[Rallyper]

What happened to Mikko this week end? it is a bit worrying his lack of pace, and the fact that he kind resigned himself to fight and get more speed after only few stages...
And the setup of the DS3 shouldn't be an excuse as he managed to get the power stage...
Come on Mikko, show us some crazyness a bit, and prove that you deserve to be a flying finn.

I think Mikko was under some sort of teamorders before the start of the Rally GB, just to secure as many point as possible. But that teamorder made him loose too many seconds to his combattants whom were much faster than Citroen maybe expected...?

[Jafry]

http://www.rally-mania.cz/fotogalerie/2012/1079/1079_wales_rally_gb_2012_744af5a8b1.jpg

http://www.rally-mania.cz/fotogalerie/2012/1079/1079_wales_rally_gb_2012_769cfa9585.jpg

http://www.rally-mania.cz/fotogalerie/2012/1079/1079_wales_rally_gb_2012_c8df53ea45.jpg

http://www.rally-mania.cz/fotogalerie/2012/1079/1079_wales_rally_gb_2012_4a9b5beb4d.jpg

http://www.rally-mania.cz/fotogalerie/2012/1079/1079_wales_rally_gb_2012_2dcf6bf203.jpg

More photos from last day HERE (http://www.rally-mania.cz/photogallery.php?id=1079)

[JAM]

So Armindo was right about his car all along, Atko could do not better with it. I'll bet Meeke in the Bentley was more interesting to watch.

That's what i said a lot of times, but some developed minds of this forum tought that i was saying only because of being portuguese.. now the evidences show that i was right. That car is crap and that team is crap too.

Now let's see when Bruno di Pianto says to Atkinson to reveal that is ill and need to be replaced by another driver.

[JAM]

What happened to Mikko this week end? it is a bit worrying his lack of pace, and the fact that he kind resigned himself to fight and get more speed after only few stages...
And the setup of the DS3 shouldn't be an excuse as he managed to get the power stage...
Come on Mikko, show us some crazyness a bit, and prove that you deserve to be a flying finn.

IMO nothing special happened to Mikko. The problem was the Fiestas, that were really fast on this rally.

Mikko is able to challenge Loeb only when the Fords are far behind, but only because Loeb is slower by option. When the frenchman needs to attack (like here in Wales), Mikko simply desapears in the mirrors.

That is the biggest evidence that some fights between Loeb and Mikko were a Hollywood move.

[kirungi okwogera]

IMO nothing special happened to Mikko. The problem was the Fiestas, that were really fast on this rally.

Mikko is able to challenge Loeb only when the Fords are far behind, but only because Loeb is slower. When the frenchman needs to attack (like here in Wales), Mikko simply desapears in the mirrors.

That is the biggest evidence that some fights between Loeb and Mikko were a Hollywood move.

Hold on here, Mikko Hirvonen has won 14 rallies, all of which were during Loeb's reign, including two years where he came very close indeed to winning the championship. That doesn't add up with your assessment. No doubt Hirvonen was not on pace in this rally, but you can't say that he is never able to compete with Loeb. Just this weekend.

I seriously doubt Citroën has conspired to make "Hollywood moves" and make it look like they're fighting out front in other rallies. For one thing, there's nothing in it for them to stop Hirvonen taking a win or two at this point, Loeb is so far ahead, and their Manufacturers' is just as secure. They might as well let the drivers do what they do. Plus how do you explain Ogier's five wins to Loeb's five wins last year? Was that a phony competition too?

[uranium]

Holywar started ;)

[Francis44]

I think Citroen will be pretty balsy if they make Hirvonnen their title contender next year. I know Mikko has been very close two times to win the championship but not because of his speed. Im not sure how his consistency will help him next year specially if Loeb leaves, no need for others to go ultra mad because Loeb is in no more. No Loeb = Less mistakes by others.

[JAM]

No doubt Hirvonen was not on pace in this rally, but you can't say that he is never able to compete with Loeb. Just this weekend.


Are you saying that Hirvonen is as good and fast as Loeb?

I'm saying that he is slower than Loeb.

By the way, tell me the rally that Hirvonen challenged Loeb with the Fords between them. In Mexico that oportunity was gone by Latvala at the beggining. In Argentina Ford were gone at SS4, and Mini was very behind. In Greece Ford were challenging Loeb and Loeb needs to atack, and Hirvonen had no speed. In NZ was a good oportunity to prove Mikko's speed... but Ford gone out again on the 1st leg. Hirvonen is able to be fast in Sweden and Finland, there i believe he could challenge any driver.

[bluuford]

Hold on here, Mikko Hirvonen has won 14 rallies, all of which were during Loeb's reign, including two years where he came very close indeed to winning the championship. That doesn't add up with your assessment. No doubt Hirvonen was not on pace in this rally, but you can't say that he is never able to compete with Loeb. Just this weekend.

-1 one rally. Loeb was at home, sleeping, eating and watching TV when Mikko won in Australia in 2006

[kirungi okwogera]

Who would you make your title contender if you were Citroën? Or any manufacturer?

You have 4 guys who have won all the rallies in the past five seasons (and Østberg because of DSQ) 2008-2012. Loeb leaves, so you have Latvala, Hirvonen and Ogier to choose from.

And you think it's some big gamble that they might use Hirvonen?? Knowing that Ogier is with another team and Latvala will likely stay with Ford or go to VW? Who would you use?

Take Loeb away from the standings of any of those past five seasons 2008-2012 and tell me the name of the guy who'd have won the most rallies - i.e. the guy with most runner up positions. You think he's not a safe bet? Who is?

And tell me of any time, in the history of motorsport or any sport ever, when somebody dominates winning for many years and then leaves and everybody relaxes and takes it easy and slow (and stops crashing/knocking wheels off) as soon as he is retired? You can't be serious.

I just spent the time doing this so here you go, I've done the work for you. Guys who would have won rallies if Loeb didn't exist:

2008-2012:
hirvonen 28 rallies
latvala 11 rallies
sordo 10 rallies
ogier 7 rallies
solberg 5 rallies
atkinson 2 rallies


2012
sordo 1
latvala 3
hirvonen 6


2011
ogier 5
hirvonen 6
latvala 2


2010
hirvonen 1
solberg 4
latvala 3
sordo 3
ogier 2


2009
hirvonen 8
sordo 3
latvala 1


2008
hirvonen 7
sordo 3
latvala 2
atkinson 2
solberg 1

(Yes I'm bored with time to kill.)

edit: good point bluuford.

second edit: JAM - have you only been following WRC since January or something? Of course he is slower than Loeb, everybody is slower than Loeb! That doesn't make "everybody" not worth hiring when Loeb retires. Hirvonen is the closest statistically as you can see above.

[stefanvv]

I don't know how good that statistics is as there aren't the number of Rallies each one participated. Ogier for instance has much less than Hirvonen.

[kirungi okwogera]

Yeah, of course, it's not perfect - I would put Ogier and Hirvonen on similar ground, with Ogier having the edge due to his success last year.

Ogier also has never come second to Loeb, he's always either beat Loeb or come below second - so his number 7 there is actually how many rallies he's really won.

But there's no question that for drivers who are "able to compete" with Loeb, Hirvonen is in the top two with Ogier, and Latvala maybe below them. It's an interesting set of numbers anyway.

[JAM]

second edit: JAM - have you only been following WRC since January or something? Of course he is slower than Loeb, everybody is slower than Loeb! That doesn't make "everybody" not worth hiring when Loeb retires. Hirvonen is the closest statistically as you can see above.

My point is that Hirvonen is slower than Loeb, and except Sweden and Finland, all the fights with Loeb where hollywood show from Citroen. Hirvonen has value, but not to have fights with the Loeb with the same car.

But IMO Ogier is faster and better than Hirvonen

[uranium]

Ogier had a chance. But he wasted it. He is not team player. And he will not have soon the chance, because WV will not be competitive next year.
Mikko definitely will have his chance next year.

[kirungi okwogera]

I agree Ogier is probably faster in most places - I am not sure better overall because of consistency. I hope to see a good battle between them to settle it in the future though!

I can promise you that Hirvonen is fast enough to have "fights" with Loeb that aren't faked by team orders. Come on, that's the maddest conspiracy theory yet, you think a team that has won everything for years and years would care about entertainment value so much that they'd risk secure wins to pretend to have fights? This is Citroën, the "nine championships with one man, we don't care if it's boring" team. Also the team that let Ogier run wild last year and win five times. Not like Hirvonen won most of these battles, and none this year, but he's been up there with Loeb many times and beaten Loeb more than any other man still driving (Gronholm has more).

[kirungi okwogera]

Ogier had a chance. But he wasted it. He is not team player. And he will not have soon the chance, because WV will not be competitive next year.
Mikko definitely will have his chance next year.

This is a good point - we'll see how far VW can take it before Monte-Carlo, but they have at least 1 year less development than the others. And the fact that Ogier NEVER came second to Loeb as a support driver in Citroën does say something about his abilities to drive for a team. If he'd stayed in Citroën this year he'd be a shoe-in in a DS3 as soon as Loeb retired. Now he has a new car and who knows.

[JAM]

Come on, that's the maddest conspiracy theory yet, you think a team that has won everything for years and years would care about entertainment value so much that they'd risk secure wins to pretend to have fights?

Yes, i think. And they don't need to take risks. They give the order: "look at the splits, mantain fight and no risks taken!"

That's why they never had that fight when Ford were near or in the middle. Get it?

[andyone]

Ogier had a chance. But he wasted it. He is not team player. And he will not have soon the chance, because WV will not be competitive next year.
Mikko definitely will have his chance next year.

U cant compare mikko to ogier. I dont see any driver who gave loeb pressure than ogier. He was very good. Mikko cant do a thing to ogier. Dint under estimate yhe VW.. they are Germans

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

[uranium]

I didn't compare them. Just analysed their chances and behaviour. Nothing personal.
You must be not just fast, but wise too. Sometimes you should better play chess in this life :)

[stefandavisBRC]

Successful debut for Rally Team GB Scott Larder on Wales Rally GB


http://www.rallyteamgb.com/ScottLarder.jpg


This weekend saw the welcoming of the world’s best rally drivers to the Welsh countryside as they fought it out for the British round of the World Rally Championship, WRC Wales Rally GB. There was also a new face to rallying in the supporting National Rally with the debut of Rally Team GB’s 3rd Driver Facebook competition winner, Scott Larder, a 26 year old factory worker from Cwmbran, taking the wheel of the Production World Rally Driver Louise Cook’s Fiesta ST.


A massive 6,000 fans entered the competition with a simple page ‘like’ of the rallyteamgb Facebook page and a quick email to confirm entry. The Facebook fans were then given the opportunity to earn their way into the finals with multiple tasks with a view to win a free rally license and a free drive on Wales Rally GB National Rally.


“We simply want to see more people coming into the sport and want to help as many as we can to find their way. The sport is difficult and entry to the sport is not easy and quite hidden when you are on the outside looking in. The competition was more about that, but we wanted to get people thinking about being out in the sport themselves, of course there would only be one drive at the end and Scott Larder was lucky enough to be chosen” said British Rally Driver Stefan Davis.


For Scott Larder it was a true baptism of fire. The stages of Wales Rally GB are renowned as some of the toughest in the world and with Scott only sitting in a rally car for the first time just 2 weeks before, to pass his rally license test, it was an immense task to try and get through such a massive event.


Scott, despite his inexperience, did incredibly well, finishing all three days of the rally and in the end finishing in 32nd place from the 45 starters.


The 3 days in the challenging Welsh forests were far from easy. The learning curve was near vertical for Scott. Learning how to rally and getting the Ford Fiesta ST across the 9 stages of gravel, mud and slick rock was far from a normal day for the South Wales Factory Worker.
Scott was taking it all in being on the right side of caution to get familiar with the Rally Team GB car, the racing lines, the braking points, throttle control and steering, as well as the alien driving conditions and terrain.


“Making my debut on Wales Rally GB is stuff of dreams, it really is. I was keen to try and get things right for my first outing. I wanted to get the most experience I could from the event and that meant seeing every corner and condition I could.” Said Scott


“I was so nervous when I pulled up to that start line of Stage 1, Dyfnant, I still could not believe that it was happening. If someone had said to me last year when I was out spectating ‘Scott that will be you next year’, I would have not thought it was even possible, but the Rally Team GB Facebook competition made it happen” said Scott.


“It was so difficult, not just the driving, but listening to this new language of pace notes describing the road and then taking in all the coaching that Stefan was giving me, it was CRAZY!” said Larder.
Day two saw Scott starting to feel more at home in the car and becoming more comfortable with the concept of someone describing the road ahead through an intercom.


“The second day was better, another 3 stages complete, but every stage was totally different from the other. I felt a little calmer, though the stages were more cut up, rutted and bumpy in places. It was a lot dryer than the first day and each stage had a mixture of rock, fine gravel and tarmac which was very difficult to adapt to, but I was really happy to get to the end.” Said Scott.
The last day of Wales Rally GB was further south in the damper forest of the valleys. Some rain overnight meant the forest had become very slick.


“I had a fair idea that it would be hard work to keep the car from sliding too much through the forest. The stages were more like mud tracks with less gravel base, so I had to fight with the car a bit to keep it on line. I suffered a puncture when I ran slightly wide on a hairpin in the Port Talbot stage. I went off line which made it really difficult to brake in time and I just panicked and hit a large rock with the front near-side tyre. It was a shame because it cost us about 7 minutes and a few places in the rally.” Said Scott.


“I think the puncture reminded Scott that it was not going to be simple to finish a rally like Wales Rally GB. After the puncture, he started to tidy the car up a bit more and focussed on getting to the finish of his first ever rally” said Stefan.


“My only goal on the rally was to finish the event but when you’re in the car there is so much going on it is easy to forget that. There were a few times during the weekend where my brain was totally fried. When I crossed the finish line of the final stage Walters Arena, I can’t tell you how amazing that felt. I was so happy, I had a lump in my throat and couldn’t speak! I was totally thrilled!” said Scott.


“The whole weekend was just so surreal I can’t thank everyone enough for the support that they have given me. I saw people jumping for joy in the corner of my eye and a lot of British and Welsh flags flying which made me feel good to know they were behind me.“ Said Scott.


“Rally Team GB are amazing people and they are doing amazing things for the sport. I would like to thank them for what they have done for me with getting me started and the knowledge that has been given to me. Stefan was so patient with me – he is a legend! I’m really happy with what I have achieved over the weekend and I know it’s not easy.” Said Scott.


“It was the most amazing experience and one I will never forget especially making my debut on an event this big. I was thrown in at the deep end and I think I proved I can keep it together, just and keep it on the road. I really want to make something of myself as a competitor in this fantastic sport and I have to concentrate on making my own career now for next season. I will be working non-stop to trying to find some support and sponsorship to help me start a real rally career so I can put everything I have learned into practice.” Said Scott.


rallyteamgb.com (http://www.rallyteamgb.com)
Rally Team GB - Fawkham, United Kingdom - Équipe sportive professionnelle | Facebook (http://www.facebook.com/rallyteamgb)
Scott Larder Rallying | Facebook (http://www.facebook.com/scottlarderrallying)

[dimviii]

very nice as always

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hjScLXMYM4Q&feature=player_embedded

[GigiGalliNo1]

I've spoken to one of the MINI mechanics... Atkos MINI is an early 01A WRC, so it was down on power from the latest spec machine Sordo drives.

So they seem to have built a few 01A's in generations with upgrades... So the MINI Sordo drove last is given to another driver who's renting it and Sordo gets a newly developed one!

[EightGear]

Maybe he will get a 01B again in France? He had one in Germany didn't he?

[Mirek]

When privateers like Snijers or Pech can have 01B why not an official team? Something is wrong there...

[dimviii]

lol
http://pbs.twimg.com/media/A27jFKLCMAA3-za.jpg:large

[dimviii]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9JJWZoSaVO8&feature=youtube_gdata_player

[dimviii]

http://pbs.twimg.com/media/A2_WuJ5CIAA7jcv.jpg:large

[dimviii]

When privateers like Snijers or Pech can have 01B why not an official team? Something is wrong there...

Mirek maybe prodrive dont want to sell to MI,because of the well known reasons?...

[Mirek]

Maybe. Pech said that during Barum he used dampers which Prodrive doesn't sell, only rents.

[prisciou]

When privateers like Snijers or Pech can have 01B why not an official team? Something is wrong there...

Atkinson will recover the 01B (old "4 WRC" Sordo) from germany to Rallye de France and will have a new 01B car to Rally Italia Sardegna (currently under construction).
This is to avoid changing the specification of the car (spec asphalt -> gravel -> asphalt -> gravel ...)
Surely the old "4 WRC" will be used in Spain.

Source for Italia (https://twitter.com/motorsportita/status/247664073972527104)

[makinen_fan]

Atkinson will recover the 01B (old "4 WRC" Sordo) from germany to Rallye de France and will have a new 01B car to Rally Italia Sardegna (currently under construction).
This is to avoid changing the specification of the car (spec asphalt -> gravel -> asphalt -> gravel ...)
Surely the old "4 WRC" will be used in Spain.

Source for Italia (https://twitter.com/motorsportita/status/247664073972527104)

I saw that bodyshell arriving on an MI truck in MI service area on Saturday night and I was a bit surprised what was it for and why they brought an extra shell with them to the rally. It makes sense to drive it there directly from Prodrive maybe and then built it up for France???

[dimviii]

lol
http://pbs.twimg.com/media/A27jFKLCMAA3-za.jpg:large

https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/548483_485209651503651_120078364_n.jpg

[denkimi]

Ogier had a chance. But he wasted it. He is not team player. And he will not have soon the chance, because WV will not be competitive next year.
Mikko definitely will have his chance next year.
i never understood these statements.

this is what we know for sure:
-ogier was as fast or perhaps even faster than loeb.
-he wanted a equal chance, which he was granted by quesnel.
-loeb went to citroen and overturned quesnel, so he could get an absolute number 1 status.

and then you think it is ogier who's not a team-player? its loeb who has never allowed his teammates to have an equal chance.

[janvanvurpa]

i never understood these statements.

this is what we know for sure:
-ogier was as fast or perhaps even faster than loeb.
-he wanted a equal chance, which he was granted by quesnel.
-loeb went to citroen and overturned quesnel, so he could get an absolute number 1 status.

and then you think it is ogier who's not a team-player? its loeb who has never allowed his teammates to have an equal chance.


You could re-phrase things and then think aboutit
Loeb has won XX WRC titles for Citroen and his paid and acknowledged as their boy.
Ogier comes along later and is hired---and entering into the exisiting team, IF he was a professional he knows and accepts the team structure.
He drives hard and tries to prove he is "equal", but disturbs the team structure.
He is reminded of the order in the team..
he pouts and whines and goes away rather than obey his employers who were paying him XXXXXXXX euros..

He is not a team player.


That's an alternate view and seems as legitimate as anything..
So what? What's the point?

[dupanton]

i never understood these statements.

this is what we know for sure:
-ogier was as fast or perhaps even faster than loeb.
-he wanted a equal chance, which he was granted by quesnel.
-loeb went to citroen and overturned quesnel, so he could get an absolute number 1 status.

and then you think it is ogier who's not a team-player? its loeb who has never allowed his teammates to have an equal chance.

Citroën gave Ogier a great chance to get experience in the WRC. It understand Citroën that they don't want to take the risk to let Ogier fight with Loeb. Loeb needed the points and Ogier the experience. If he would have been smart, he should have been patient (although it isn't fun to be 2nd driver). When Loeb retires (soon!), we could be the absolute nr1 driver for Citroën/Peugeot for the next 10 years and get just as much titles :)

[MartijnS]

My photos are online now!

http://www.rallymedia.nl/images/2012/walesrally/Habig%202.jpg

http://www.rallymedia.nl/images/2012/walesrally/Loeb%205.jpg

http://www.rallymedia.nl/images/2012/walesrally/Novikov%203.jpg

http://www.rallymedia.nl/images/2012/walesrally/Wilson%204.jpg

http://www.rallymedia.nl/images/2012/walesrally/Prokop%205.jpg

More at our Facebook page (http://facebook.com/rallymedia) or our website (http://www.rallymedia.nl/images/2012/walesrally/walesrally.html) !

[denkimi]

You could re-phrase things and then think aboutit
Loeb has won XX WRC titles for Citroen and his paid and acknowledged as their boy.
Ogier comes along later and is hired---and entering into the exisiting team, IF he was a professional he knows and accepts the team structure.
He drives hard and tries to prove he is "equal", but disturbs the team structure.
He is reminded of the order in the team..
he pouts and whines and goes away rather than obey his employers who were paying him XXXXXXXX euros..

He is not a team player.


That's an alternate view and seems as legitimate as anything..
So what? What's the point?
only was ogier trained and hired by citroen to become the succesor of loeb. he was promissed equality, and not servanthood.


it is exactly this mentality that has killed the wrc. it just sad to see how many people find it correct that promissing drivers have to give up their hopes and dreams just for the greater glory of loeb.
that's why we don't have personalities anymore in the wrc.

[dupanton]

only was ogier trained and hired by citroen to become the succesor of loeb. he was promissed equality, and not servanthood.



And how can you know what Citroën promissed him :)

[tfp]

i never understood these statements.

this is what we know for sure:
-ogier was as fast or perhaps even faster than loeb.
-he wanted a equal chance, which he was granted by quesnel.
-loeb went to citroen and overturned quesnel, so he could get an absolute number 1 status.

and then you think it is ogier who's not a team-player? its loeb who has never allowed his teammates to have an equal chance.

This was never proven, to us anyway as the general public, because I presume none of us have ever seen the actual contract. However, it is very logical, and makes perfect sense, Loeb wanted to get rid of the driver that threatened him the most. Loebs consistency won him the title last year, not his speed. He wants it as easy as possible, thats why he wanted rid of Ogier. And (hides under a table) thats why he wanted Mikko as his team mate....


only was ogier trained and hired by citroen to become the succesor of loeb. he was promissed equality, and not servanthood.


it is exactly this mentality that has killed the wrc. it just sad to see how many people find it correct that promissing drivers have to give up their hopes and dreams just for the greater glory of loeb.
that's why we don't have personalities anymore in the wrc.

The WRC gods have got to shine their light on somebody, its just its been shining in the same place too long. And they forgot about JML at the beginning of the year ;)

[tfp]

And how can you know what Citroën promissed him :)

Quesnel made it very public that he had been gifted once with Loeb, then a second time with Ogier. He said that there would be no number one in the team, and that he will let their drivers fight. Only until it became clear that one of the drivers was out of the title race completely (like Ford last year, when JML diddnt score enough points in the earlier rounds, and he had to play second fiddle to Mikko in the later rallys) that one of the drivers should support the other. This kind of went balls up for Loeb in Germany last year!

[JAM]

Mirek maybe prodrive dont want to sell to MI,because of the well known reasons?...

And also MI don't want to pay the price.

Litle by litle people understand why Armindo was not only slow, but very slow on that team :rolleyes:

[Plan9]

Yes the 01A is already far behind the main field (that is an amzing fact in itself, its only 1 year old). I can't see MI continuing as the manufacturer entry for Mini beyond this year. It will make a nice customer operation though.

[Antony Warmbold]

Quesnel made it very public that he had been gifted once with Loeb, then a second time with Ogier. He said that there would be no number one in the team, and that he will let their drivers fight. Only until it became clear that one of the drivers was out of the title race completely (like Ford last year, when JML diddnt score enough points in the earlier rounds, and he had to play second fiddle to Mikko in the later rallys) that one of the drivers should support the other. This kind of went balls up for Loeb in Germany last year!

Not sure that's right because Quesnel gave orders as early as Mexico for Loeb no to push Ogier on Sunday. Loeb told Ogier on sunday morning before the stage start that he would not follow the orders. Ogier went off trying to beat Loeb, and Loeb won. Loeb then spoke out for the first time about the conflict, and was clearly entering into a conflict with Quesnel.
The whole year was very well documented in the french motorsport press, who was circling around like vultures. The first signs of conflict between Quesnel / Loeb / Ogier started in Mexico.

This was the standing at the end of day 2, on the SECOND rally of the season:



World Rally Championship - Results - Rally Guanajuato Mexico (http://www.wrc.com/results/2011/rally-guanajuato-mexico/stage-times/?category=wrc&stageno=19)
http://www.wrc.com/results/2011/rally-guanajuato-mexico/stage-times/?category=wrc&stageno=19
http://www.wrc.com/results/2011/rally-guanajuato-mexico/stage-times/?category=wrc&stageno=19



It was reported in the press that Quesnel had signed Ogier with an equal number one status. when he told Loeb to take it easy because we want a 1-2 and Hirvonen is 1.5min behind, Loeb could not take it.

It seems to me like poor team management.

My opinion: never hire 2 French drivers, in a french team, with the french press in the middle. VERY BAD idea and explosive combination.

[uranium]

That's why Quesnel and Ogier lost their positions in the Team :)

[janvanvurpa]

only was ogier trained and hired by citroen to become the succesor of loeb. he was promissed equality, and not servanthood.


it is exactly this mentality that has killed the wrc. it just sad to see how many people find it correct that promissing drivers have to give up their hopes and dreams just for the greater glory of loeb.
that's why we don't have personalities anymore in the wrc.

Do you work for wages or a salary? Are you telling your bosses how to run their business?
We all give up some of our hopes and dreams when we agree to accept wages/salary, sometimes for a while, sometimes for longer.

Drivers getting paid millions is not what has killed the WRC, Trying to make it into a made for TV melodrama has, HUGE money made by peripheral parasites like media moguls has.
This is just a spoiled boy not yet ready throwing a public tantrum and not getting away with it.

It is a different world when MFG team pays you money..

[Antony Warmbold]

That's why Quesnel and Ogier lost their positions in the Team :)

Yes, I think so too.

The following is a recap from french press and personal sources as I recall it:

Around the time when Loeb was looking to leave Citroën and was getting offers from VW, Sainz was putting pessure on Loeb to come to VW. However, Loeb is very good buddy with Frequelin, who still keeps an eye on things from a distance. It was Frequelin who alerted the Citroën big boss that there was some serious offers on the table from VW. The big boss then dealt with Loeb, over Quesnel's head. Loeb's new contract was signed with Citroën directly, not Citroën Racing!!! When Ogier heard he had lost his equal n°1 status he got annoyed. The rest we know...

My personal opinion is that Loeb played all this to his favor, knowingly. He went to speak to VW, interested, but was hoping in secret that something big would happen at Citroën to make him stay. I can imagine he was reluctant to go to VW because you are never sure if a car will win or when it will win. I think he did not want Ogier to beat him with the Citroën, while he's developing around in the Polo. I know from personal experience with him between stages that he gets really upset when he loses.

It worked.

Big salary, lifelong ambassador for the brand, Ogier out, Quesnel out, Hirvonen in.

[MJW]

Yes, I think so too.

The following is a recap from french press and personal sources as I recall it:

Around the time when Loeb was looking to leave Citroën and was getting offers from VW, Sainz was putting pessure on Loeb to come to VW. However, Loeb is very good buddy with Frequelin, who still keeps an eye on things from a distance. It was Frequelin who alerted the Citroën big boss that there was some serious offers on the table from VW. The big boss then dealt with Loeb, over Quesnel's head. Loeb's new contract was signed with Citroën directly, not Citroën Racing!!! When Ogier heard he had lost his equal n°1 status he got annoyed. The rest we know...

My personal opinion is that Loeb played all this to his favor, knowingly. He went to speak to VW, interested, but was hoping in secret that something big would happen at Citroën to make him stay. I can imagine he was reluctant to go to VW because you are never sure if a car will win or when it will win. I think he did not want Ogier to beat him with the Citroën, while he's developing around in the Polo. I know from personal experience with him between stages that he gets really upset when he loses.

It worked.

Big salary, lifelong ambassador for the brand, Ogier out, Quesnel out, Hirvonen in.
Very good comment and also how I heared things were, plus the VW meetings for Loeb started after the saturday night situation in Acropolis,(when Ogier played tactics and Quensel didnt share splits with Loeb) up to then VW had been talking to two drivers, but after a possibility for Loeb to sign with them, these two were left in the cold.

[dupanton]

Quesnel made it very public that he had been gifted once with Loeb, then a second time with Ogier. He said that there would be no number one in the team, and that he will let their drivers fight. Only until it became clear that one of the drivers was out of the title race completely (like Ford last year, when JML diddnt score enough points in the earlier rounds, and he had to play second fiddle to Mikko in the later rallys) that one of the drivers should support the other. This kind of went balls up for Loeb in Germany last year!

As said above, Quesnel didn't do what Citroën wanted... Maybe Quesnel said they were equal, but it's not sure that was what stood in his contract ;)
Anyway, Citroën-Ogier is over, let's hope VW will be competitive and Neuville gets a spot in the Citroën works team :)

[MJW]

As said above, Quesnel didn't do what Citroën wanted... Maybe Quesnel said they were equal, but it's not sure that was what stood in his contract ;)
Anyway, Citroën-Ogier is over, let's hope VW will be competitive and Neuville gets a spot in the Citroën works team :) If Loeb satys and Neuville becomes a threat he too (or his car) will be dealt with.

[Mirek]

That would be a very similar situation. First Ogier and Quesnel and now Neuville and Matton. But I think that Thierry won't be so ambitious so quickly. He has time. Loeb will retire anyway and Thierry still needs some more experience.

[JAM]

That would be a very similar situation. First Ogier and Quesnel and now Neuville and Matton. But I think that Thierry won't be so ambitious so quickly. He has time. Loeb will retire anyway and Thierry still needs some more experience.

That's not an excuse. Ogier also had time, but Ogier proved to be fast very quickly, and Neuville is not so quickly to prove that.

Ogier made a thing that IMO is very important: He didn't want to be the best after Loeb, he tried to be the best challenging Loeb.

[Mirek]

I don't speak about any excuses. Ogier did what he was allowed by his agreement with Quesnel. Later the new contract between Loeb and Citroën broke the conditions of Ogiers contract so he left to be No.1 in VW. For me it is quite simple.

[noel157]

I don't speak about any excuses. Ogier did what he was allowed by his agreement with Quesnel. Later the new contract between Loeb and Citroën broke the conditions of Ogiers contract so he left to be No.1 in VW. For me it is quite simple.

That's exactly what happened. Quesnel double crossed Ogier. Ogier said FU and went.

[Karukera]

One important thing that played a large part, from a manufacturer perspective not the rally fans, is Ogier's poor ability to communicate, or to shut the f* up when he needs to.

So there are also serious theories coming in saying he broke that part of his contract and was dropped with no compensation in favor of a more polished but quick and reliable Hirvonen.

[AndyRAC]

Ogier was Quesnel's boy, Loeb was Frequelin's......

Frequelin still has a major influence with the Citroen board - voila! Ogier went to VW, and Quesnel has left PSA and gone to Oak Racing....

[dimviii]

Not sure that's right because Quesnel gave orders as early as Mexico for Loeb no to push Ogier on Sunday. Loeb told Ogier on sunday morning before the stage start that he would not follow the orders. Ogier went off trying to beat Loeb, and Loeb won. Loeb then spoke out for the first time about the conflict, and was clearly entering into a conflict with Quesnel.
The whole year was very well documented in the french motorsport press, who was circling around like vultures. The first signs of conflict between Quesnel / Loeb / Ogier started in Mexico.

This was the standing at the end of day 2, on the SECOND rally of the season:



World Rally Championship - Results - Rally Guanajuato Mexico (http://www.wrc.com/results/2011/rally-guanajuato-mexico/stage-times/?category=wrc&stageno=19)
http://www.wrc.com/results/2011/rally-guanajuato-mexico/stage-times/?category=wrc&stageno=19
http://www.wrc.com/results/2011/rally-guanajuato-mexico/stage-times/?category=wrc&stageno=19


It was reported in the press that Quesnel had signed Ogier with an equal number one status. when he told Loeb to take it easy because we want a 1-2 and Hirvonen is 1.5min behind, Loeb could not take it.

It seems to me like poor team management.

My opinion: never hire 2 French drivers, in a french team, with the french press in the middle. VERY BAD idea and explosive combination.





























So Quesnels decision was right or NOT?
If you was at Loebs position what would you do?
Also if you was at Ogiers position what would you do?

[stefanvv]

So Quesnels decision was right or NOT?
If you was at Loebs position what would you do?
Also if you was at Ogiers position what would you do?

All good questions :D . From the Citroen point of view following the chain of command, obviously Quesnels wasn't right. All of us who watch the events think otherwise though.
As for the drivers, I don't think any of them feels sorry for their actions back then, so they must be right for themselves. I personally don't mind Ogier to be N1 VW driver, in fact it'll be quite interesting.

[Antony Warmbold]

I don't speak about any excuses. Ogier did what he was allowed by his agreement with Quesnel. Later the new contract between Loeb and Citroën broke the conditions of Ogiers contract so he left to be No.1 in VW. For me it is quite simple.

Exactly my thoughts.

Quesnel also had to deal with the "Loeb retirement" issue. It seems to me Loeb has a habit to wait very long before re-committing, every time his contract runs out, talking about Le Mans...F1....his own team....

At the time Citroën Racing really had to find a future n°1 driver to replace Loeb, in case Loeb suddenly says bye-bye...then what? Citroën Racing detected Ogier and decided to spend a hell of a lot of money on him to give a top car in top conditions. With a lot of talent and top of the line material he got fast....almost too quickly.

It's quite ironic really if you think about how much money Citroën Racing pissed away on Ogier only so the guy could take all his knowledge and experience to VW !!!

[Antony Warmbold]

So Quesnels decision was right or NOT?
If you was at Loebs position what would you do?
Also if you was at Ogiers position what would you do?

My personal take on this?

1. After Ogier's amazing drives in the Junior team, Quesnel should have known there was way too much risk to have Ogier and Loeb as joint n°1's... and I don't believe the "I had to give him the n°1 status or he would have gone to Ford...bs" that we heard at the time because M-Sport didn't even know if they'd still be there with Ford so giving a new driver a contract is the last thing you can do in this case...and I cannot even imagine that Citroën would be so crazy to give Ogier some drives in the junior team without some kind of guarantee that he stays with them if he's good.

2. As the boss, I would have a sit down with Loeb and tell him that he : either gives a definite timetable of when he wants to stop; or accept that I bring a young and fast driver who will push and therefore stay motivated while waiting to take Loeb's place when he eventually decides to quit.

3. I would never have hired a 2nd French driver....the Panizzi/Delecour/Peugeot fiasco is still fresh in my mind. The fact that both drivers and co-drivers were speaking in their corners, in french to the french press and even the local village press is the worst in terms or "rumor control". Something like this with 2 Finns would have been highly unlikely given the Finn's different mentality...with 2 latins it's very dangerous!

4. Hold the n°2 driver firmly by his balls right from the very beginning, because let's face it, there are so few paid seats he'd better be happy to be there with a guaranteed future...that's it, bloody hell.

5. Don't give team orders on the second event of the year... But tell them their asses are grass if they crash fighting each other with a 1-2 lead of 1,5min over Hirvonen... In a case like that, a top factory driver should be intelligent enough to know when it's time to back down or he doesn't deserve the seat.

---------

In Loeb's position I would not have followed Quesnel's order unless there was some clear rules applying to both drivers established before Monte Carlo regarding who leads at the end of day 2.

In Ogier's position I would have gone for the win if my contract allowed me to.


cheers ! :p

[denkimi]

Do you work for wages or a salary? Are you telling your bosses how to run their business?
We all give up some of our hopes and dreams when we agree to accept wages/salary, sometimes for a while, sometimes for longer.

but we all have contracts. if my boss suddenly desides i have to work 20 hours a week more without any compensation, i am not going to agree to that. if i'm hired as a mechanic, i'm not going to clean the toilets all day.

secondly, if i'm better at my work than my boss, i'll start my own business.




Drivers getting paid millions is not what has killed the WRC, Trying to make it into a made for TV melodrama has, HUGE money made by peripheral parasites like media moguls has.
This is just a spoiled boy not yet ready throwing a public tantrum and not getting away with it.

It is a different world when MFG team pays you money..
it's not about the money, it's about the lack of personality's. if you kick everyone out who has an own opinion and his own goals, you end up with a bunch of pussy's and an extremely boring championship.

[dimviii]

In Loeb's position I would not have followed Quesnel's order unless there was some clear rules applying to both drivers established before Monte Carlo regarding who leads at the end of day 2.



cheers ! :p

I don t think that there is even a 1% posibilities that a 7 time world champion will sign his 9th continuesly contract without refering who is nr1....

Thanks for reply Antony.

[dimviii]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N7_med_gops&feature=player_embedded

[Allyc85]

My pics from Halfway are up, Walters Arena will be tomorrow.

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8440/8000265569_7e2ae552a4_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/allyc85/8000265569/)
Nasser Al-Attiyah Halfway1 Rally GB 2012 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/allyc85/8000265569/) by Allyc85 (http://www.flickr.com/people/allyc85/), on Flickr

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8303/8000288919_9c54040e8a_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/allyc85/8000288919/)
Mads Ostberg Halfway 1 Rally GB 2012 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/allyc85/8000288919/) by Allyc85 (http://www.flickr.com/people/allyc85/), on Flickr

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8039/8000415444_b1a00315a2_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/allyc85/8000415444/)
Sebastien Loeb Halfway 2 Rally GB 2012 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/allyc85/8000415444/) by Allyc85 (http://www.flickr.com/people/allyc85/), on Flickr

Wales Rally GB 2012 - a set on Flickr (http://www.flickr.com/photos/allyc85/sets/72157631567596755/)

[rjbetty]

No rallying in the Resolfen/Rhondda complex for the foreseeable future, as a huge windfarm is being constructed up there over the next 3-4 years. My home stage :(

Oh so they are going ahead with that windfarm...? :( I moved out of the area a while ago (in fact Petter was still winning and Loeb only had one title, so it has been a while now) Hey it's your home stage too? I wasn't in Resolven, I was on the other side if the mountain just South where the cars come down a long stretch with the village down on the right, then back up heading East towards Rhondda. That stage was obviously my favourite :D and it was the longest - about 33km I think.

Btw I have to confess despite being a pretty die-hard fan, I NEVER took the short walk to go and watch the rally despite it being literally on my doorstep (when other fans come from all over). I only watched it once from the upstairs window in 2003...

[Allyc85]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FNoeHl56p_s