2011 WRC Rally Mexico

[Mirek]

So it's fuel tank ventilation system: http://www.rallymexico.com/official/Document%202.8.pdf

[RallyTyger]

So it's fuel tank ventilation system: http://www.rallymexico.com/official/Document%202.8.pdf

Too bad for Nasser Al-Attiyah. The document states he bought the car in damaged condition and rebuilt it. Anybody know who he bought the car from?

[6789]

That is tough luck. The only thing that annoys me about SuperRally is that Tanak now gets a podium when he was 40 minutes off the lead, I don't think thats really fair

[RallyTyger]

That is tough luck. The only thing that annoys me about SuperRally is that Tanak now gets a podium when he was 40 minutes off the lead, I don't think thats really fair

I agree, though the main problem is that there are too few drivers in SWRC, so you'll still score points even if you're centuries behind the others

[Mirek]

Too bad for Nasser Al-Attiyah. The document states he bought the car in damaged condition and rebuilt it. Anybody know who he bought the car from?

Symtech Racing, car crashed by Kosciuszko in Jordan 2010.

But I find it hard to believe that it's accidental coincidence when something wrong with fuel cell ventilation is found in Mexico which is the most problematic event for under-pressure in fuel tank which can cause fuel to boil. Vapor than stalls fuel pump and that's the end of game. This was by the way reason for both Kruuda's retirements.

[serial jeff]

Wow this is a really bad break for Nassar. To think you've won the rally, then discover you're disqualified for a technical infringement that (as far as I know) doesn't affect performance, must be really disappointing :(

Shame he wasn't driving a Citroen factory car- then he would have gotten off with a 1 minute penalty, at the worst :rolleyes:

[Mirek]

Wow this is a really bad break for Nassar. To think you've won the rally, then discover you're disqualified for a technical infringement that (as far as I know) doesn't affect performance, must be really disappointing :(

It's not sure it was something minor because it was in Mexico. Some others retired because of fuell cell vent system. So I would be really careful in judging if it helped the performance or not. Maybe not but it's fact that in Mexico problems with in-tank pressure, which may even cause retirement, are common.

[Sulland]

So it's fuel tank ventilation system: http://www.rallymexico.com/official/Document%202.8.pdf

Strange that this was not found in the pre rally tech inspection, but after the rally. If found before this detail could have been fixed. Reminds me of the brake issue Brynildsen had in GB. Things like this must be addressed before, so you dont waste a whole rally, before you are disqualified.

Not sure how much a rally like this costs, but it is very expensive for private teams/drivers - and then it is to bad to be kicked out for something that could have been fixed !

[Mirek]

It's impossible to do complete scrutineering of every car before the event. It would take weeks to do so. Pre-event scrutineering is mainly focused into safety features.

[Francis44]

With Citroen adamant that it will give both its drivers equal chance to chase this year's title, Ogier is still optimistic that he can bounce back from this weekend's disappointment.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/89772

Interesting.

[Sulland]

It's impossible to do complete scrutineering of every car before the event. It would take weeks to do so. Pre-event scrutineering is mainly focused into safety features.

More people doing it would help, and it did not take them weeks to figure it out after the event, not in Brynildsens case either.

[Mirek]

No, it doesn't take weeks in case of ONE car (few hours for that). But to check completely hundred of cars before the event would take weeks or You need a whole army of scrutineers. Where would You get them and who would pay that? Also can You imagine how happy would the teams be if You disassemble them engines and other important parts before start?

[Bobcat]

It's not sure it was something minor because it was in Mexico. Some others retired because of fuell cell vent system. So I would be really careful in judging if it helped the performance or not. Maybe not but it's fact that in Mexico problems with in-tank pressure, which may even cause retirement, are common.
"During the rebuild, the valve on the fuel cell ventilation line was not checked.

Although this did not offer any competitive advantage, the team was excluded as the rules clearly state that technical conformity is their responsibility at all times."
http://www.maxrally.com/news/entry/al_attiyah_excluded_from_super_2000_win/

[Bobcat]

Wow this is a really bad break for Nassar. To think you've won the rally, then discover you're disqualified for a technical infringement that (as far as I know) doesn't affect performance, must be really disappointing :(

Shame he wasn't driving a Citroen factory car- then he would have gotten off with a 1 minute penalty, at the worst :rolleyes:
+1

[Mirek]

"During the rebuild, the valve on the fuel cell ventilation line was not checked.

Although this did not offer any competitive advantage, the team was excluded as the rules clearly state that technical conformity is their responsibility at all times."
http://www.maxrally.com/news/entry/al_attiyah_excluded_from_super_2000_win/

Sir, You can't use statement of one side as a proof. Neither we nor stewards can judge if it was mistake or purpose. We can only see clear facts. Ventilation system affects pressure inside the cell. That's fact - it's fundamental function of it. High altitude and high temperatures in Mexico cause problems with pressure inside cell. That's also fact. If it was just a mistake, it's sad for Nasser but in Mexico ventilation of the cell is an important issue.

[Co-driven]

I think that whether it benefits or not, if it's out of the rules then should be penalized. For sure, it is a pity that Nasser was excluded after a great rally he did, but I think that the rules are the rules.

It's just a shame that FIA won't apply the rules to the same one, as seen on Ogier's case.

[Barreis]

"During the rebuild, the valve on the fuel cell ventilation line was not checked.

Although this did not offer any competitive advantage, the team was excluded as the rules clearly state that technical conformity is their responsibility at all times."
http://www.maxrally.com/news/entry/al_attiyah_excluded_from_super_2000_win/

This maxrally is really bad site..

[Daniel]

Sir, You can't use statement of one side as a proof. Neither we nor stewards can judge if it was mistake or purpose. We can only see clear facts. Ventilation system affects pressure inside the cell. That's fact - it's fundamental function of it. High altitude and high temperatures in Mexico cause problems with pressure inside cell. That's also fact. If it was just a mistake, it's sad for Nasser but in Mexico ventilation of the cell is an important issue.

Bobcat would have no reason to try and paint M-Sport in a good light now would he? :rotflmao:

[Karukera]

Bobcat would have no reason to try and paint M-Sport in a good light now would he? :rotflmao:

Since you unfairly caught him "bobshallying", i don't think he'd dare. :s tare:

@ Barreis, i don't regard maxrally as a bad website. Being the voice of MSport, i find it to be rather neutral and informative but that's just me. :)

[Barreis]

Since you unfairly caught him "bobshallying", i don't think he'd dare. :s tare:

@ Barreis, i don't regard maxrally as a bad website. Being the voice of MSport, i find it to be rather neutral and informative but that's just me. :)

If it's yours, 'cos you've signature with C.McRae, I'll find it rather as nice developed.. :)

[tolis]

Day 3 highlights:http://www.woop.gr/article/19853/wrc-mexico-highlights-day-3-video

[Barreis]

Thanks Tolis11!

[tolis]

Thanks Tolis11!
You are welcome Barreis!!!

[jonas_mcrae]

Well, just got back from Leon and I have to say that despite the thin entry list it was a very nice rally, with good competition on day 1 and some nice surprises, specially novikovs pace on day 1 and 2 before had to retire.

I went to shakedow on thursday and at first was very dissapointed with the speed of the new WRC cars, but after a couple of passes you could see the real potential of these cars, of course in sweden grip was a little bit more tricky, but here you could see the speed these cars can handle when entering a corner, In my opinion the citroens are still faster, they have torque when leaving a corner, and can handle just a little bit more speed when going in.

The street stage on thursday evening was a very pleasant surprise, I wasnt expecting much, but where I was located (near a roundabout), the environment was great, I dont know how many people gathered near that place but it was at least 5,000 and when Ostberg rolled in with a mexican flag on the roof everyone went crazy.

Friday I got to see three stages and even though the Fords looked fast, it was evident they were struggling for grip, I was in a steep uphill section and the DS3's were coping with gravity and altitude much better than the fiestas. Back in service I heard henning complaining about the suspension and how the dampers were afecting the handling of the fiesta. Also petter looked very dissapointed.

Saturday we saw a twisty uphill section where Ogier was very spectacular, Mikko was pushing and Novikov was very quick, unfortunately on the next stage we found his car stopped just after the stage finnish, the cooling system had a big impact and Novikov seemed very angry and dissapointed. Later that day we went to the place were Kuipers rolled (a downhill tricky section) and Petter was pushing like hell, also Nasser was impressive on that section, being faster than several WRC's

Sunday we just saw the jump on the power stage, so cannot tell much on that, just that Block finished the rally with a massive jump which pleased fans a lot.

Overall I think citroens are still faster, maybe in a lesser proportion but they seem to get more torque from the new regs, cars are more spectacular and lowder, however the gap with S2000 cars has shortened a lot, still I hope rallys in lower altitude give us closer fights.

About the rally, very good organization again, security was better this year, red zones were mostly people free but were also forbidden even for photographers in some places, which was a little bit odd, FIA security delegates were very aggresive on stage one, and they even delayed it for a while, guess it was just for safety reasons. My biggest complaint will be (again) the lack of signs leading to the stages, there are some around the big roads, but once you get onto gravel there is nothing that will tell you were you need to go. Also, I didnt see anyone throwin rocks this year, which is good.

[Hartusvuori]

^ Good post. Thanks Jonas! Nice to hear you had great rally.

[jonas_mcrae]

also in the media room I heard several interesting comments from some drivers:

Ostberg: Very difficult to drive and trying to find grip, seems like he was testing several settings on the fiesta (on request from M. Wilson) after he lost time on friday to get ready for other gravel rallyes.

Henning: "Suspension is too soft and feels heavy on the back, loosing preassure on the dampers"

Elena: (to ford engineers after they said the DS3 is very small): "you have the Ipad and we have the Iphone, almost the same but smaller..."

Nasser (after someone asked him if we would see him next year with VW): "Eerrr mmhm eeh, I dont know, I cant say, maybe after portugal there's something new"

AND there was a rummor going around that VW is approaching Petter, who knows....

[tfp]

also in the media room I heard several interesting comments from some drivers:

Ostberg: Very difficult to drive and trying to find grip, seems like he was testing several settings on the fiesta (on request from M. Wilson) after he lost time on friday to get ready for other gravel rallyes.

Henning: "Suspension is too soft and feels heavy on the back, loosing preassure on the dampers"

Elena: (to ford engineers after they said the DS3 is very small): "you have the Ipad and we have the Iphone, almost the same but smaller..."

Nasser (after someone asked him if we would see him next year with VW): "Eerrr mmhm eeh, I dont know, I cant say, maybe after portugal there's something new"

AND there was a rummor going around that VW is approaching Petter, who knows....

Very sporting from Elena!
And for the Petter/VW rumours, I think he'd suit VW very well!

[bluuford]

It's not sure it was something minor because it was in Mexico. Some others retired because of fuell cell vent system. So I would be really careful in judging if it helped the performance or not. Maybe not but it's fact that in Mexico problems with in-tank pressure, which may even cause retirement, are common.

Well, one day after the rally I come to forum and I can see that Nasser is DQF again. Again means that he tends to walk on a very thin line all the time.

Couple of years ago he was DQF in Dakar, because his BMW was overheating and he decided to skip a few checkpoints.

He was initially DQF in 2009 in PWRC, in Greece but later thanks to appeal he was given the last place of the rally (I dont remember the exact reason, something with engine?).

Couple of years before that (2006?) he got something like 5 minutes of penalties in Greece again (if I am not wrong?) for not following the rally route! He went straight on the junction, decided not to reverse ( he said that he was afraid of colliding with the following car in the dust) and continued straight until he was back on the SS. By the way, he still won that rally if I am not mistaken?

And now this, some people tend to have more troubles than the others.

[charro_wrc]

hi:

This is the link to my own WRC Rally Mexico 2011 video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rf2vMsTrt9g

i hope you like it!

[6789]

hi:

This is the link to my own WRC Rally Mexico 2011 video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rf2vMsTrt9g

i hope you like it!
Was an awesome video after the welcome :)

Really looks like a great rally, have to go one day

[N.O.T]

finally someone with some material from the rally, nice work on the pictures and the video.

[jonas_mcrae]

finally someone with some material from the rally, nice work on the pictures and the video.

you can also check out the pics by my friend Fri here, http://www.rallysport.hu/images/2011/photo/wrc/02_mexico/picture_gallery.htm, there are a couple of videos as well on the homepage including one of Kuiper´s roll.

[Xsara Fan]

hi:

This is the link to my own WRC Rally Mexico 2011 video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rf2vMsTrt9g

i hope you like it!

Bad video, I don`t like it. Why? Cause you forgot about Novikov ;)

[OldF]

I watched the Mexico highlights (http://www.woop.gr/article/19651/wrc-mexico-highlights-day-1-video) from day 1 yesterday and about 11:00 Ogier and Petter is going flat out with the Citroens.


The speed was about 195 km/h and the revs about 8000 rpm. Pity they didn’t show the Fiesta at the same place so it could have been able to see if they have some different gear ratios with 6th gear (top speed).

[OldF]

Henning: "Suspension is too soft and feels heavy on the back, loosing preassure on the dampers"

That was also what Mikko told on the MTV3 web site. He said it was OK on Friday when he was the first car on the road but on Saturday it was to soft.

[dimviii]

That was also what Mikko told on the MTV3 web site. He said it was OK on Friday when he was the first car on the road but on Saturday it was to soft.

Ιfi remember correct this about the ''heavy back'' didn t complain also about focus?

[OldF]

Mikko didn’t say anything about a heavy back. I’m not sure but I think the first spare wheel is at the centre of the car and the second, if used, at the same location as in the Focus.

[charro_wrc]

hi again guys:

i come back with more pictures! this time they are action pictures from day 1

http://www.charrovision.com/wrc2011day1.php

you can see all my photo and video from 8 years of rally Mexico at:

http://www.charrovision.com/wrc.php

cu

[charro_wrc]

I'm sorry, BUT i hope you like this Novikov picture!

http://i881.photobucket.com/albums/ac18/charrovision/wrc2011day1/DSC_4605copy.jpg

[AP-Racing]

Great video, gracias

[Eugenio Perea]

also in the media room I heard several interesting comments from some drivers:.

You were there?? And you didn't say hello to me?? : )

[jonas_mcrae]

You were there?? And you didn't say hello to me?? : )

Several times I thought about looking for you, the problem was, who should I look for!!!?? we have never met in person! haha It would have been quite tricky!

[Eugenio Perea]

Demonios! You should have asked for me! I did meet your friend, the photographer, albeit under less than pleasant circumstances : ) Next time, then!

[Barreis]

Day 2 Highlights: http://www.woop.gr/article/19759/wrc-mexico-highlights-day-2-video

Only 1:04 is lenght of this video.. Tolis11, please help! :)

[tolis]

Only 1:04 is lenght of this video.. Tolis11, please help! :)
You are right Barreis... Sorry can't do anything... Here, you can find the day 2 highlights.(http://wrc.mirafiori.com/wrc_2011/). You follow the 3 steps, then you download the file and you'll be able to watch it. It's the same coverage exactly!!! Have fun mate! :)

[Barreis]

Thanks friend! :)

[N.O.T]

http://www.wrc.com/news/wilson-recalls-differing-mexico-fortunes/?fid=14318

triumph turned into disaster...right...anyone has the e-mail of wrc.com ?? i would like to ask them some things...

[pettersolberg29]

Interesting video to show Henning's valiant effort in the broken Fiesta. Also noted a lot of pacenote corrections as he was going - I know this is normal for drivers but it really brings up the question about Ilka Minor. Is she a good enough co-driver? Ever since Cato left Henning has gone downhill...

http://www.wrc.com/video/browse-all/video-mexico-2011-henning-feels-the-heat-on-ss15/?vid=2035

[tmx]

Henning results going down hill could be of other factors, I don't think one need to question Minor on her codriving ability since she codrove Stohl to several podiums. Anyway, Henning had made it clear he has no testing.

[cali]

If he is correcting the pacenotes, it is not the fault of Ilka's competence, but more to do with Hennings incompetence of making the right notes. Am I correct?

[Karukera]

You are correct, Henning tells the notes, Ilka put them down on paper.

[I am evil Homer]

Ilka's plenty good enough as her work with Stohl proved.

[pettersolberg29]

If he is correcting the pacenotes, it is not the fault of Ilka's competence, but more to do with Hennings incompetence of making the right notes. Am I correct?

I'm not blaming her for incorrect pacenotes, but it was just providing a time to ask the question about Ilka's ability. She was successful with Stohl, but Petter didn't fancy her much when auditioning for a new co-driver and I have heard grumblings from fans about her role in Henning's seemingly declining pace. I may be barking up the wrong tree but maybe Cato just suited Henning better?

[charro_wrc]

Hi again:

more pictures from day 2

http://www.charrovision.com/wrc2011day2.php

Greetings from Tequila Land

[vino_93]

I'm looking for pictures of 206's and Rally America's crews. Where can I find it ? :P

[Juha_Koo]

I'm not blaming her for incorrect pacenotes, but it was just providing a time to ask the question about Ilka's ability. She was successful with Stohl, but Petter didn't fancy her much when auditioning for a new co-driver and I have heard grumblings from fans about her role in Henning's seemingly declining pace. I may be barking up the wrong tree but maybe Cato just suited Henning better?

Ilka is for sure a Professional with a capital P. She has over 15 years of codriving experience and over 80 WRC starts. I have never heard her read a note wrong and/or late watching Stohl's and Henning's onboards. And like said, Ilka just writes what Henning says on the recce. Henning has also kept some Norwegian words in his pacenotes like "Obs" which is "caution".

I'm sure Petter wouldn't fancy majority of the codrivers. I'm in no position to criticize, but his system is way too complicated and contains terrible amount of information. Apparently it suits him though. I'd go even to the lenghts to say that Petter's pacenote system requires a native English speaker. Well, not nescessarily, because Timo Alanne is in his gravel note group, but anyway. But if one single left corner needs a myriad of information like "four left minus half long, tightens two plus tightens half long, and, opens five plus over crest, keep in" you better have your English pronunciation and diaphragm at good condition. :) Even Northern Irish Patterson sometimes feels like short on breath.

I'm very disappointed for Henning because he hasn't been able to push the WRC Fiesta to same results than S2000 Fiesta. If there is some reason to the poor results, it is the lack of testing.

[pettersolberg29]

I think you are right JK...it's just unfortunate for Ilka that Henning's decline has coincided with her arrival as they are probably unrelated. You are certainly correct r.e. Petter's pacenotes! I'd like to see a non-native British try and read those pacenotes in English - would be almost impossible. I hope Henning can get his mojo back though - he's undoubtedly fast and could challenge for wins in the right circumstances I think.

[Coach 2]

I do not agree with you J.. K. .. or PS29.
Yes you have to be very good in English to read for Petter S, but that the notes are complex can be discussed.

Notes can be created in two different ways (mainly). The main difference between these systems is how many decisions (under full speed) the driver must make on the basis of what codriver says. Petters system is to simply do what codriveren says, not consider what codriver say and then do.

Short explanation.
The purpose of such a system are numerous, but less likely that codriver deliver the notes to late, and therefore less likely to run off the road, is one. Why: it is not necessary to hear the notes long before then consider how to perform the bend, then perform it.

[tfp]

I still think its amazing that a Norwegian can understand english pacenotes so well. Mind you, Petter probably speaks better english than me anyway:-)

[tolis]

Review of Rally Mexico: http://www.woop.gr/woopgallery/20720/wrc-mexico-anaskopese-video

[tfp]

Review of Rally Mexico: http://www.woop.gr/woopgallery/20720/wrc-mexico-anaskopese-video

"We regret to inform you that this webpage is only avaliable in greece"
Haha:-)

[DIMI44]

"We regret to inform you that this webpage is only avaliable in greece"
Haha:-)

Where is the problem? Come to Greece to see it. :-)

[tfp]

Where is the problem? Come to Greece to see it. :-)

Sounds like fun, I could do with a holiday:-) When is Acropolis rally again?:-)