Top Drivers from 2000 Onwards

**steveaki13** · 1st March 2013, 23:44

I think that Massa did better than Montoya against Raikkonen. Look at 2008 Felipe was fantastic and all but won that title, although I think Kimi wasn't up to his 2005 level which for me was his best season.

Having said that Montoya had the might of Ferrari to fight against in 2002-2003.

Tough call.

**Garry Walker** · 2nd March 2013, 11:54

Originally Posted by D-Type

Come off it!

7 grand prix wins
1 Indianapolis win
1 CART Champoinship

You can't dismiss him out of hand

I didn't, he was a good driver. Simply, against Kimi he was beaten very clearly and rarely matched him. Nor did he ever really dominate Ralf like his plethora of fanboys would like to believe.

Originally Posted by wedge

Massa beat Kimi so by that logic...

Did he? I would say overall, Kimi was the better driver, but he lacked ability in one thing that is very important in Ferrari - politics, which hurt him greatly.

**wedge** · 6th March 2013, 21:25

Originally Posted by Garry Walker

Did he? I would say overall, Kimi was the better driver, but he lacked ability in one thing that is very important in Ferrari - politics, which hurt him greatly.

Yes you dummy!

In all seriousness it comes down to opinion.

I remember there was a time you thought Kimi was rhe most over rated driver pre-2008.

Kimi was fed up with Ron The Don but still manage to maximise the car in '06 - races in particular.

JPM was a wasted talent who had issues and believed too much in the hype but similar to Kimi and Massa: excelled in the right car/right circumstances.

**Rollo** · 7th March 2013, 01:37

Originally Posted by wedge

Kimi was fed up with Ron The Don but still manage to maximise the car in '06 - races in particular.

JPM was a wasted talent who had issues and believed too much in the hype but similar to Kimi and Massa: excelled in the right car/right circumstances.

If you do a direct comparison of Kimi and JPM (ignoring Kimi's 2007 WDC which instantly makes him better than JPM), Kimi has had two 2nds and two 3rds in F1. JPM has had two 3rds in F1 and a best result of 8th in NASCAR.

Kimi didn't make my list, so there's still no way JPM would.

**wedge** · 7th March 2013, 15:27

Originally Posted by Rollo

If you do a direct comparison of Kimi and JPM (ignoring Kimi's 2007 WDC which instantly makes him better than JPM), Kimi has had two 2nds and two 3rds in F1. JPM has had two 3rds in F1 and a best result of 8th in NASCAR.

Kimi didn't make my list, so there's still no way JPM would.

Fair enough.

Statistics have their place but it's not the be all and end all. For instance in 2003 Williams drivers were taking points off each other because Ralf Schumacher was a much stronger team mate to JPM than DC to Kimi.

**Alfa Fan** · 7th March 2013, 16:00

That no-one has mentioned Tom Kristensen 3 pages into this thread just illustrates how silly it is.

**Rollo** · 7th March 2013, 22:43

Originally Posted by Alfa Fan

That no-one has mentioned Tom Kristensen 3 pages into this thread just illustrates how silly it is.

Is the 24 Hours of Le Mans by itself worth a championship though? 7 of them are included from 2000 onwards but as far as I'm aware, he's only one one championship in that period, the 2001 ALMS.