Osama Bin Laden Is Dead

[Daniel]

So how was the monster created?

For either of us to claim to know would be hilariously stupid.

[Bob Riebe]

With respect, I don't think we know that for sure. It's like discounting the domino theory in South East Asia purely because Vietnam fell but Communism didn't go through Malaysia and into Indonesia. We have to accept that things happened the way they are and saying that they should have been done otherwise is just a guess.

To a degree I agree with you-- but one must remember the stalling of a Communist agendas was greatly influenced by the China-Russia conflict in 1969; the North Vietnamese-China conflict in 1979; and the North Vietnamese invasion of Cambodia which lasted till 1989.
It is not that Communism was not a threat, but that rather than work together, they attacked each other.

Whereas to the the Soviets credit, the reason they went into Afghanistan was similar to Bush's they went in to prevent actions on their border that Carter allowed in Iran.
Some of their tactics while there were foolish and self-defeating.

[Eki]

According to the Jihad ideals it is okay to kill others if it is for the God; especially for the spreading of the Muslim faith (not all Muslims agree with the ideas of a Jihad)."

According to Bush, it was OK to kill others if it was for "freedom"; especially for the spreading of "democracy" (not all believers in democracy agree with that stance).

[BDunnell]

To a degree I agree with you-- but one must remember the stalling of a Communist agendas was greatly influenced by the China-Russia conflict in 1969; the North Vietnamese-China conflict in 1979; and the North Vietnamese invasion of Cambodia which lasted till 1989.
It is not that Communism was not a threat, but that rather than work together, they attacked each other.

Whereas to the the Soviets credit, the reason they went into Afghanistan was similar to Bush's they went in to prevent actions on their border that Carter allowed in Iran.
Some of their tactics while there were foolish and self-defeating.

And the lack of discipline prevalent within their armed forces did not help. This was not something that suddenly reared its head once the USSR ceased to exist and the successor states became strapped for cash — it was there all along. Personally, I feel that many continue to this day to concentrate on the numerical might of the Soviet bloc's military capability without considering what you might call the human factor.

[Eki]

This has what to do with the thread topic?

I thought attacking posters was against forum rules.

Nah. If it was, Garry Walker and anthonyvop wouldn't be doing it, and you wouldn't call me a Troll Boy.

[Daniel]

To a degree I agree with you-- but one must remember the stalling of a Communist agendas was greatly influenced by the China-Russia conflict in 1969; the North Vietnamese-China conflict in 1979; and the North Vietnamese invasion of Cambodia which lasted till 1989.
It is not that Communism was not a threat, but that rather than work together, they attacked each other.

Whereas to the the Soviets credit, the reason they went into Afghanistan was similar to Bush's they went in to prevent actions on their border that Carter allowed in Iran.
Some of their tactics while there were foolish and self-defeating.

I certainly don't think that what you're saying is impossible, but it's like cooking an egg and then saying that it would definitely have become a chicken

[janvanvurpa]

With all due respect I don't feel that tony needs to prove any of these claims to you

I do not respect murderers, criminals and terrorists, He cliamed he "served" my country and accused my of "not serving".
I say he should prove he served the interests of the country, and wasn't another terrorist like his freind he bragged about.

Clearly---logically if one person attempts to rest their abililty to tell others off is based on some alleged service, that claim should be backed up.

And US interests were not served in killing and wounding thousands of Panamanians in a terror action to nab yet another American 'favorite son" who supposedly had gone bad. (like the Shah, Sadaam Hussein, the Mujahadeen etc etc.)
If you're not familiar with the US undeclared short war on Panama to grab one man which he claims he "was there", maybe look at this:
http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/ar...omichitman.pdf

David Harris, a contributing editor at the New York Times Mag-azine and the author of many
books, has an interesting observation. In his 2001 book Shooting the Moon, he states:
Of all the thousands of rulers, potentates, strongmen, juntas, and warlords the Americans have
dealt with in all corners of the world, General Manuel Antonio Noriega is the only one the
Americans came after like this. Just once in its 225 years of formal national existence has the
United States ever invaded another country and carried its ruler back to the United States to
face trial and im-prisonment for violations of American law committed on that rulers own native
foreign turf.8
Following the bombardment, the United States suddenly found itself in a delicate situation. For a
while, it seemed as though the whole thing would backfire. The Bush administration might have
quashed the wimp rumors, but now it faced the problem of legiti-macy, of appearing to be a bully
caught in an act of terrorism. It was disclosed that the U.S. Army had prohibited the press, the
Red Cross, and other outside observers from entering the heavily bombed areas for three days,
while soldiers incinerated and buried the casualties. The press asked questions about how much
evidence of criminal and other inappropriate behavior was destroyed, and about how many died
because they were denied timely medical attention, but such questions were never answered.
We shall never know many of the facts about the invasion, nor shall we know the true extent of
the massacre. Defense Secretary Richard Cheney claimed a death toll between five hundred
and six hundred, but independent human rights groups estimated it at three thousand to five
thousand, with another twenty-five thousand left homeless.9 Noriega was arrested, flown to
Miami, and sentenced to forty years' imprisonment; at that time, he was the only person in the
United States officially classified as a prisoner of war.10
The world was outraged by this breach of international law and by the needless destruction of a
defenseless people at the hands of the most powerful military force on the planet, but few in the
United
The United States Invades Panama

If he took part in that, he's a terrorist and did not serve The United States or its Constitution.

[anthonyvop]

Here you go ant:

http://www.britannica.com/bps/additi...r-on-Terrorism

The declaration of war on terrorism was directly aimed at Muslims.

Thank you for proving my point....Nowhere did President Bush order the killing of Muslims just for being Muslims.

[anthonyvop]

If he took part in that, he's a terrorist and did not serve The United States or its Constitution.

You are a vile, loathsome, spoiled, creature who spews hatred under the allusion that you are morally superior. What they say about you is more than true and it is no surprise your life and career has turned out the way it has.

One day our paths will cross and I will give the courtesy and allow you to apologize.

[janvanvurpa]

You are a vile, loathsome, spoiled, creature who spews hatred under the allusion that you are morally superior. What they say about you is more than true and it is no surprise your life and career has turned out the way it has.

One day our paths will cross and I will give the courtesy and allow you to apologize.

Don't dodge things by calling me vile and loathsome, you don't see me claiming I "served my country" by invading and indiscriminately murdering women and children by the hundreds. You claimed you "were there".

My career? You know nothing of "my career". Besides, obvious dodge is obvious, where is the proof you're even American, and that you ever were in the service of my country.?
And why should I apologize when you have insulted me and soiled my Country"s reputation by your claimed terrorist acts?

Even if you apologized to the people of Panama for invading their country just for a cheap ass salary you got---if you ever did---and apologized to the families of those killed and wounded and whose homes were destroyed because you were "just following orders", why should I apologize to you? Because I've shown what you claim you did to be a terrorist action, and illegal under American law?

Ha!