DNQ'ers

[DazzlaF1]

I meant Qualifying, not pre-qualifying

[D-Type]

What point are you trying to make? Surely "Did not pre-qualify" is a subset of "Did not qualify" which in turn is a subset of "Did not start"

[Mark]

Indeed, if you strip it back and take away that there is a session called "Qualifying", or is it still called "Qualifying Practice"? And look at the word itself, in that a driver did not qualify for the race as they weren't fast enough. It matters not if this was in the session which just happens to bear a similar name.

[Don Capps]

Indeed, if you strip it back and take away that there is a session called "Qualifying", or is it still called "Qualifying Practice"? And look at the word itself, in that a driver did not qualify for the race as they weren't fast enough. It matters not if this was in the session which just happens to bear a similar name.

A short history lesson, most of which I am sure is general knowledge....

Once upon a time, particularly in Europe, a "practice" session prior to an event was exactly that, an opportunity for drivers to literally practice their skills and find find a quick way around the course. Any lap times that were recorded were for information only. Starting positions were decided by the drawing of ballots or some other means determined by the organizing club to set the grid. However, beginning during the Thirties, the American system of using lap times set during practice sessions began to be used to set the starting grids. There were practice session during which lap times were not used to set the grid, "free" practice, and the other practice sessions during which lap times were recorded to set the starting grid. In some cases, such as when the number of starting positions was restricted and the entries exceeeded the number allowed to start, not only were the practice sessions used to set where someone was placed on the grid, but whether or not they earned a place on the grid, the obvious example being the AC de Monaco's restricting the number of grid positions to a number that was usually far exceeded by the entries competing for a place on the grid. In other cases, drivers were obliged to complete a certain number of laps during the practice sessions in order to earn a place on the startiing regardless of lap times set, the German club being the primary one for this requirement -- hence the odd grid for the 1958 GP von Deutschland for instance.

During the Seventies, the already existing trend towards "qualifying" rather than "practice" sessions crystalized as the Formula 1 Constructors Association began to become more and more involved in the promotion of events in the Championnat du Monde des Conducteurs as well as stipulations that the F1CA (renamed FOCA) demanded from the clubs for the privilege of hosting an event with its entrants. This led to varius spats and handbags at dawn such as Spain 1970 and Monaco 1972 and so on.

When the Championnat du Monde des Conducteurs was terminated at the end of the 1980 season, the FIA and its FISA henchmen negotiated a deal with the FOCA the resulted in the Concorde Agreement by which an organizing club got a package deal, which also included a set number of starters as well as a set number of those who would compete for those grid positions if the entries exceeded the number of starters; which, of course, meant that if the number of entries exceeded the number allowed to compete for the positions on the grid that prior to the actual qualifying sessions that the number had to be reduced, leading, of course, to the concept best known as "pre-quailfying." In reality, "pre-qualifying" was simply a subset of "qualifying," although such a notion did not seem to resonate with the motoring press and the others.

Of course, given the entire idea of "qualifying" is an American idea, the blame for all this landed, of course, on the necks of the Americans. This means that I will spare you the rest of the well-known trials and tribulations of the Formula 1 deities screwing up something as simple as qualifying for the starting grid.

[D-Type]

Interesting. So the Americans introduced qualifying for grid places before Monaco 1933

But Indianapolis was a world unto itself with practice, qualifying, "Carburettor Day", rookie tests, "Bump Day"etc taking up the whole of May and which day you qualified also came into it. How did that work? Was it a 107% type rule on each day, within 5mph of the fastest man, a certain number from each day, or what?

[Don Capps]

Interesting. So the Americans introduced qualifying for grid places before Monaco 1933

But Indianapolis was a world unto itself with practice, qualifying, "Carburettor Day", rookie tests, "Bump Day"etc taking up the whole of May and which day you qualified also came into it. How did that work? Was it a 107% type rule on each day, within 5mph of the fastest man, a certain number from each day, or what?

The Americans introduced the whole business of using times set during qualifying sessions literally decades prior to the Europeans slowly and reluctantly adopting the technique. Ditto with massed starts for races, which was already a long-established practice in the United States -- with road races being the last to use that format, largely in deference to their European brethren.

The legendary "Month of May" did not make its appearance until 1952. While teams and drivers prior to that would use the track, it was not quite the same orchestrated effort that went into effect that year. Most of the rest of what you describe are the recent additions. The "rookie" test was simply something that already existed within the AAA Contest Rules, new drivers having to pass a track test under the supervision of designated experienced drivers before being allowed to compete. The IMS simply jazzed it up a tad.

In the beginning, the starter of an event would set a minimum lap time or speed that had to be met before a driver could participate in an event, something that was very much a factor for oval tracks, and even more so when the planked board tracks were introduced.

There is (much) more, of course, but this is the basic information regarding this topic.