Rally Discussion and Bar Talk Thread

[AnttiL]

Part three

https://twitter.com/AnttiL_WRC/statu...37150471737344

21 Richard Burns
22 Timo Salonen
23 Kalle Rovanperä
24 Dani Sordo
25 Sandro Munari
26 Elfyn Evans
27 Kenneth Eriksson
28 François Delecour
29 Markko Märtin
30 Andreas Mikkelsen

Part four

https://twitter.com/AnttiL_WRC/statu...18344555536384

11 Walter Röhrl
12 Hannu Mikkola
13 Jari-Matti Latvala
14 Petter Solberg
15 Ott Tänak
16 Mikko Hirvonen
17 Thierry Neuville
18 Björn Waldegård
19 Stig Blomqvist
20 Ari Vatanen

[focus206]

Part four

https://twitter.com/AnttiL_WRC/statu...18344555536384

11 Walter Röhrl
12 Hannu Mikkola
13 Jari-Matti Latvala
14 Petter Solberg
15 Ott Tänak
16 Mikko Hirvonen
17 Thierry Neuville
18 Björn Waldegård
19 Stig Blomqvist
20 Ari Vatanen

I never realized Latvala won more WRC events than Hirvonen (or Solberg), and yet he's never been a serious contender for the title...

[TypeR]

I never realized Latvala won more WRC events than Hirvonen (or Solberg), and yet he's never been a serious contender for the title...

but he is ,,better,, than many world champions

[AnttiL]

but he is ,,better,, than many world champions

I think you are missing the point of this listing. I'm giving points for certain achievements like win is 100 points and champion title 1000 points. Thus, winning 10 rallies is equal to a world title. Some drivers have more wins, some more podiums, some more stage wins, some more finishes etc. Lack in one area can be compensated with success in another. It is very interesting to see the result unfold. Otherwise we could just use the ewrc-results world title list and settle for that.

And in case you're just angry because JML is above Tänak, fear not, Tänak would climb ahead already by winning Monte. In any case he will most likely climb soon to #11 ahead of Mikkola and Röhrl as well, maybe even to top ten.

[EstWRC]

I understand your system but For my taste, I would put all the world championships winning drivers as first 19 and then after them the guys who haven’t won a championship.

For me it’s weird to see Latvala ahead of Kalle, Ott, Solberg, Vatanen, Blomqvist

[seb_sh]

I understand your system but For my taste, I would put all the world championships winning drivers as first 19 and then after them the guys who haven’t won a championship.

For me it’s weird to see Latvala ahead of Kalle, Ott, Solberg, Vatanen, Blomqvist

Latvala is maybe a bit of a special case because had a career so long his points maybe are a bit inflated. Still, remember he was the youngest winner at his time and for a while he was quite fast. In the end it's a data driven thing, that's the limit of the system.

It also doesn't take into account "potential". For example we all imagine Kalle will go on to win many rallies and titles but imagine if Kalle never wins a rally again and Evans and Tanak dominate him for the next 5 years, he starts to crash etc do you still think he is so good as you do now?

Kudos to Antti for putting in the work.

[EstWRC]

Latvala is maybe a bit of a special case because had a career so long his points maybe are a bit inflated. Still, remember he was the youngest winner at his time and for a while he was quite fast. In the end it's a data driven thing, that's the limit of the system.

It also doesn't take into account "potential". For example we all imagine Kalle will go on to win many rallies and titles but imagine if Kalle never wins a rally again and Evans and Tanak dominate him for the next 5 years, he starts to crash etc do you still think he is so good as you do now?

Kudos to Antti for putting in the work.

To each their own

IMO it’s more difficult to win a championship than to win a rally.

If Kalle wouldn’t win a single rally or championship again (which will never happen) then I would still rate him higher than Latvala.

[AnttiL]

IMO it’s more difficult to win a championship than to win a rally.

10 rallies, not just one. And usually winning a title also involves winning some rallies...

If Kalle wouldn’t win a single rally or championship again (which will never happen) then I would still rate him higher than Latvala.

This is the same as with Henri Toivonen who had a relatively short career. People say he would have been a champion, but it's just would. Same with Kalle, people say he will be a 9 time world champion if he just continues as long, but if he quits earlier, it's a big would. The stats don't understand this word

[AnttiL]

I understand your system but For my taste, I would put all the world championships winning drivers as first 19 and then after them the guys who haven’t won a championship.

For me it’s weird to see Latvala ahead of Kalle, Ott, Solberg, Vatanen, Blomqvist

Thanks for using "for my taste" and "for me". Everyone can make their own lists, but this one is mine

[cali]

Good list, maybe not fully for "my" taste but it's much better and adequate than the Dirtfish one.

And also there's some metrics in it while maybe you (or we) can develop the logic behind it overall very good job!

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