Is Redbull the architect of its engine problems?

[Mia 01]

Now they can get a Ferrari Engine for next year, a detuned one that is.

[Nitrodaze]

Good work in finding two pictures where you can't actually see the engine cover. Good work in also proving yourself wrong.
Truly this is a case of the salmon that jumps on the hook for you. A fish gets caught when it opens its big mouth and into your big mouth we could fly a plane.

If you'd been honest, you'd have shown a picture of the side of the car:


Oh dear. I must be illiterate. That engine cover reads "Ren an Stimpy" doesn't it? What a dog and cat show!





Both of these pictures are of the RB10 which raced in 2014.
RB10 was always stated as Red Bull-Renault, with the engine as "Renault Energy F1-2014 1.6 L". Never has the engine itself has ever been branded Infiniti.

Steady buddy, Renault = Infiniti

If you had clicked on the image you would have seen a larger version of the image in a popup. I shall take it that you were having a bad day when you wrote your reply as this is not your normal behaviour.

They have both brands on the Redbull for exposure. I made quite an innocuous observation that Redbull may brand the engine either Renault or Infiniti if they choose. I can't see the basis for name calling in this statement.

[Rollo]

Steady buddy, Renault = Infiniti

Renault ≠ Infiniti

Renault does not equal Infiniti. Renault has never equaled Infiniti.

If you had clicked on the image you would have seen a larger version of the image in a popup.

They have both brands on the Redbull for exposure. I made quite an innocuous observation that Redbull may brand the engine either Renault or Infiniti if they choose. I can't see the basis for name calling in this statement.

Actually, that's not what you said at all. In post #51 you wrote:

Renault engines has alway been branded infiniti, Redbull shall also be branding the engine infiniti l think.

You said "Renault engines has alway (sic) been branded infiniti"; then you posted links to two photographs where the engine covers couldn't be seen. The truth is that Renault engines have never been branded Infiniti. Infiniti has appeared on the cars but never in the capacity of the engine supplier.

Infiniti is the title partner of the team and not the engines:

http://cms.infiniti-redbullracing.co...25-11-2012.pdf
The increased agreement will see Infiniti become title partner from 2013, meaning Red Bull Racing’s team name will become Infiniti Red Bull Racing from the start of next season.
- RedBull info statement, 25 Nov 2012

Infiniti is a division part of the Nissan Motor Company which whilst is owned partly by Renault (and own part of Renault), the two are not synonymous.

this is not your normal behaviour.

I live in a terrace house on Pedant Corner, overlooking Persnickety Lane; where the Shriners and the lepers play their ukuleles all day long And anyone on the street will gladly shave your back for a nickel. Wacka wacka doodoo yeah!

[inimitablestoo]

By mathematical definition, I don't think anything can equal Infiniti, merely tend towards it

I think I'm right in saying nobody's actually rebadged an engine since Sauber had the Petronas deal? Seemed to be a big thing around the turn of the millennium (Prost-Acer, Minardi-Fondmetal/European, Benetton-Playlife) but soon died out.

[AndyL]

It certainly says "Renault" on the cam covers.
http://en.espn.co.uk/f1/motorsport/story/186981.html

[Rollo]

By mathematical definition, I don't think anything can equal Infiniti, merely tend towards it

I think I'm right in saying nobody's actually rebadged an engine since Sauber had the Petronas deal? Seemed to be a big thing around the turn of the millennium (Prost-Acer, Minardi-Fondmetal/European, Benetton-Playlife) but soon died out.

This is where I don't know enough about the Williams FW28 or FW32.
On neither occasion did the cars actually display that they were running Cosworth engines; I suspect that had to to with Williams paying for them though. Cosworth wasn't really a sponsor.

[truefan72]

well
I think its just about done:
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/121722

Back with renault and they will be paying more for them and lose part of the the renault and total sponsorship money in 2016 and all from 2017.
Plus a likely rebranding of the engine (probably to infiniti) although i think it only helps renault to have an additional team with its name on the cars
Contracts have been exchanged and the decision now rests with mattershitz...who would be wise it eat some humble pie and accept it

[Nitrodaze]

Renault ≠ Infiniti

Renault does not equal Infiniti. Renault has never equaled Infiniti.




Actually, that's not what you said at all. In post #51 you wrote:



You said "Renault engines has alway (sic) been branded infiniti"; then you posted links to two photographs where the engine covers couldn't be seen. The truth is that Renault engines have never been branded Infiniti. Infiniti has appeared on the cars but never in the capacity of the engine supplier.

Infiniti is the title partner of the team and not the engines:

http://cms.infiniti-redbullracing.co...25-11-2012.pdf
The increased agreement will see Infiniti become title partner from 2013, meaning Red Bull Racing’s team name will become Infiniti Red Bull Racing from the start of next season.
- RedBull info statement, 25 Nov 2012

Infiniti is a division part of the Nissan Motor Company which whilst is owned partly by Renault (and own part of Renault), the two are not synonymous.



I live in a terrace house on Pedant Corner, overlooking Persnickety Lane; where the Shriners and the lepers play their ukuleles all day long And anyone on the street will gladly shave your back for a nickel. Wacka wacka doodoo yeah!

Point taken, Wicki wacka doodaa

[Rollo]

Back with renault and they will be paying more for them and lose part of the the renault and total sponsorship money in 2016 and all from 2017.
Plus a likely rebranding of the engine (probably to infiniti) although i think it only helps renault to have an additional team with its name on the cars.

Aw nuts.

I was hoping for this:
http://www.foxsports.com.au/motor-sp...-1227603123090
“The possibility of co-operating with Red Bull remains an option but not in the context of them having an engine equivalent to what is used by Ferrari,” Ferrari president Sergio Marchionne was quoted by Italian media as saying.
“So there is a willingness to provide services as a side project, but it cannot be the engine that Ferrari uses in the race.”

- Fox Sports (AU), 10th Nov 2015

The way they were talking about this on the BBC World Service was that Ferrari may have even been willing to supply current spec short engines to Red Bull, and that Red Bull would undertake their own engineering.

Actually, if Red Bull were to buy out something like General Motors Holden for $1 when Detroit pulls the plug on Australian manufacturing operations on 1st Jul 2017, they could buy a fully working set of plant, equipment and staff and actually undertake their own engineering and be a fully fledged car company to boot.

[Nitrodaze]

well
I think its just about done:
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/121722

Back with renault and they will be paying more for them and lose part of the the renault and total sponsorship money in 2016 and all from 2017.
Plus a likely rebranding of the engine (probably to infiniti) although i think it only helps renault to have an additional team with its name on the cars
Contracts have been exchanged and the decision now rests with mattershitz...who would be wise it eat some humble pie and accept it

Redbull suddenly finds themselves with loads of possibilities. Ferrari already has a relationship with Toro Ross, hence l can see a renewal of this relationship in 2016. I wonder if the B spec Ferrari engine would be more competitive than the illien developed Renault engine. Technically, the unbranded Redbull engine is a new entrant to F1 and would benefit from the new supplier entry rules, l am guessing. This would suggest that Redbull has more flexibility and possibility of making bigger competitive strides than using the B spec Ferrari engine. It would thus seem like a no brainer that Redbull may not consider Ferrari's offer as an option for 2016.

Besides, this seems like first steps towards becoming a works team. I have to say that l applaud them for such a courageous move.