2021 - Race 21 Saudi Arabia

[Nitrodaze]

Yes, well thats an argument worth its own debate..I thought you were talking solely about today. They have been doing it for a while now so in the interest of continuity, they have to keep doing it.

I suppose negotiating punishment with the offender is now a norm too.

[denkimi]

The problem was the stewards did not inform Mercedes until the crash had occurred. Hamilton was not expecting Verstappen to suddenly slow down with him already in his slipstream

That is what mercedes claimed, but they showed the message to verstappen to slow down on tv half a lap before. So it's not the stewards or redbull, it was mercedes who didn't tell hamilton.

If Hamilton hasn't had the message, than i can't blame him for it. That would make it a race incident. But mercedes must have known about it, so that makes it their fault.

But weird to give verstappen a penalty when he tried to do what was asked from him.

[Nitrodaze]

That is what mercedes claimed, but they showed the message to verstappen to slow down on tv half a lap before. So it's not the stewards or redbull, it was mercedes who didn't tell hamilton.

If Hamilton hasn't had the message, than i can't blame him for it. That would make it a race incident. But mercedes must have known about it, so that makes it their fault.

But weird to give verstappen a penalty when he tried to do what was asked from him.

You have a point. It would become clear soon. It would be unfair to punish Verstappen if that is the case.

[Whyzars]

I suppose negotiating punishment with the offender is now a norm too.

If both teams agree on outcome I don't have a problem with it.

Having said that, I don't think this is over...

[Tazio]

Masi is a joke. Max break tested for sure. This thing is a joke


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That has to be the silliest f1 race I've ever seen. I think Masi's head expolded!

[denkimi]

You have a point. It would become clear soon. It would be unfair to punish Verstappen if that is the case.

If Hamilton really hasn't received the message on time nobody should be penalised.

And ifind it hard to believe he would crash into the back on purpose, so it looks very much like mercedes was just too slow.

[Nitrodaze]

I just heard Hamilton did not get the message that Verstappen was going to give the place back until after they had collided. I would think Mercedes probably got the message late too.

[Nitrodaze]

If Hamilton really hasn't received the message on time nobody should be penalised.

And ifind it hard to believe he would crash into the back on purpose, so it looks very much like mercedes was just too slow.

He probably was penalized because he could have pulled to one side rather than slow on the racing line.

[Zico]

I suppose negotiating punishment with the offender is now a norm too.

In a red flag situation well yes, I guess it is and so they have to do the same if it happens again.

As I said.. Its really not so different from during a normal race. The team have the option to give the place back if told to by the Stewards... and if they choose not to they get a 5 sec penalty.
In this case the race was stopped so there really has to be a negotiation. If they didn't give him it, Max would be disadvantaged compared to anyone else it has happened to in a normal race with no red flag. Its a pretty clear and sensible thing to do.. and with continuity IMO.

[Nitrodaze]

If both teams agree on outcome I don't have a problem with it.

Having said that, I don't think this is over...

I agree with that too. But unfortunately, that was not what happened. Masi negotiated with Redbull and told Mercedes how it was going to be based on the agreement with Redbull. It was not a three-way discussion with all parties saying how they felt about it.