Horner whines to the FIA

[CNR]

another beat up by motorsport.com
http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/ma...-in-australia/
Manor "had no intention of racing" in Australia
The team failed to run all weekend, although the FIA deemed it had done all in its hands to do so and decided no penalty was needed.
http://www.racer.com/f1/item/114393-...penalise-manor
"Under article 13.2 of F1's sporting regulations, when teams enter the championship they must show that they plan to "participate in every event with the number of cars and drivers entered."

Following written evidence submitted to the stewards, as well as discussions with senior team members, the FIA eventually decided that there had been no breach of the rules.

A statement issued by the stewards said that because Manor had attended the event, brought equipment and staff with it and got its cars ready and through scrutineering, it had done all that it could. Furthermore, the team was able to demonstrate that even if it had broken F1's curfew regulations it would still not have had enough time to sort out the software problems.
Under article 13.2 of F1's sporting regulations, when teams enter the championship they must show that they plan to "participate in every event with the number of cars and drivers entered."

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"

[journeyman racer]

Horner whining when his team needs to stand up and be defiant in the face of adversity?

Pathetic clubbie racer. Pathetic leadership. Pathetic glory hunting, attention seeking fool.

[jens]

I am not sure, what everyone's problem is with Horner. He is a politician. Which means he "fights" for his team regardless of where his team sits in the pecking order. It is the task of him as a team principal.

If his team dominates, he tries to protect the advantage. If his team is behind, he tries to find ways to eradicate the handicap. Using politicking for it is just one part of the job. Every team principal does it behind the scenes, even if we do not hear much about it.

Those, who need to act, are Bernie and FIA, who are 'above' the politicking of teams, and make decisions. Teams are there to present their views, and what would be the best (for themselves). Then the governing body needs to make a summary of all this and proceed.

[jens]

Horner whining when his team needs to stand up and be defiant in the face of adversity?

Pathetic clubbie racer. Pathetic leadership. Pathetic glory hunting, attention seeking fool.

Horner can be many things, but pathetic leader he is not. 4 WDCs and WCCs. He is up there with the very successful team principals in the sport's history!

[Firstgear]

I'm sure the FIA would like a close competition just as much as the teams, but Horner needs to follow protocol.

He can't just jump up and down and demand that Mercedes be slowed down. He needs to send out his spies to find something (anything) on the Mercedes that looks to be questionable. Then he goes to the FIA and asks for clarification on that component, or how that component is tested (flexiwings anyone?). After that, the FIA can step in to declare the component illegal (for future races) or beef up the testing procedure.

FIA would be happy to rule against the Merc's to help competition, but rewriting their rulebook without being asked for clarification would be admitting that the rules are poorly written without anyone even having to question them.

I'm sure all the teams have brilliant engineers. and engineers are good with logic and finding solutions, but not always quite so brilliant with creativity and thinking outside of the box. Mercedes must be doing something creative or outside the box (like McL knee-blocking hole in the cockpit) that is within the 'grey area' of the regulations to be this far ahead of all the other teams. It's up to the other teams to discover it, then the FIA will clarify/amend the rules to ban it.

[jens]

What do you take off the car to slow it down that isn't also on every other car?

Well, the same was questioned about Red Bull. Many things were banned, but in the end they still prevailed, because the car package was simply above others, and they only had temporary setbacks due to bans.

I don't know about details, but Mercedes has better inherent quality as well. Talking about specifics - wasn't there talk about split turbo last year? FRIC-suspension? As for the effect of ban, even if others get "hurt" by the ban as well, the best team gets hurt the most, because their system is most advanced/developed/refined. Usually that's what differentiates teams - not what someone has on the car or not, but the most advanced development of a "thing", which is aimed to get banned.

I personally don't know, where the solution lies. Because it is obvious Mercedes can grasp these hybrid engines better than anyone. Give new rules, V4 hybrid or V8 hybrid, they will still most likely prevail. Competitors need to hire Merc' staff, and upgrade their inherent quality to compete. But that's not easy to do and would take many years to accomplish. Red Bull's aerodynamics advantage seems to be evaporating only now, after many-many seasons!

[truefan72]

the easiest solution is to undo the engine freeze. With only 4 suppliers, let them worry about the cost of developing the engines.
the other thing is to allow more testing and development.
Increase the engine allotment to 8 vs. 4
and finally. change the payment scale from these secretive ridiculous agreements to an equitable profit sharing system. This will allow the smaller teams to not struggle and constantly worry about financials.
I would cap the teams at 13. Then each will participate in the revenue sharing system. Winners will still get a bonus and extra money, but this will ensure that the smaller teams won't ever struggle again. and in a few years would catch up to the bigger teams. The sport will be stable, the field will be stable, Everyone wins.

[Doc Austin]

Very valid points, Truefan.

Cutting the costs would help a lot too. The current formula is ridiculous and it's just an example of what happens when you try to appease the do-gooders instead of racing with your hair on fire and dragging your balls behind you.

Just give them big ass wings and tires and motors. Get rid of all the complicated stuff, including the semi automatic slushboxes. Make them shift the damm things. That used to be a skill.

I don't think even one of us cares about the green thing when it applies to racing. Let Formula E and WEC have that nitche. Formula One cars should be the baddest thing on the planet. They should go like hell and raise hell while they are doing it. Quiet, fuel efficient cars are killing this sport. The whole point is to be wasteful and scare the schitt out of ourselves and anyone else who gets close enough. People who don't want to risk it can either grow a pair or go home.

[jens]

I don't think even one of us cares about the green thing when it applies to racing. Let Formula E and WEC have that nitche. Formula One cars should be the baddest thing on the planet. They should go like hell and raise hell while they are doing it. Quiet, fuel efficient cars are killing this sport. The whole point is to be wasteful and scare the schitt out of ourselves and anyone else who gets close enough. People who don't want to risk it can either grow a pair or go home.

Industry disagrees with you. Motor industry doesn't want to waste money on developing something, which doesn't have future. And green has future!

[Firstgear]

the easiest solution is to undo the engine freeze. With only 4 suppliers, let them worry about the cost of developing the engines.
the other thing is to allow more testing and development.
Increase the engine allotment to 8 vs. 4
and finally. change the payment scale from these secretive ridiculous agreements to an equitable profit sharing system. This will allow the smaller teams to not struggle and constantly worry about financials.
I would cap the teams at 13. Then each will participate in the revenue sharing system. Winners will still get a bonus and extra money, but this will ensure that the smaller teams won't ever struggle again. and in a few years would catch up to the bigger teams. The sport will be stable, the field will be stable, Everyone wins.

I agree with what you're saying truefan, especially that you mention both the testing and pay scale. These two must go hand in hand. If all you do is allow testing, this only benefits the bigger teams and puts a larger gap between them and the have-nots, as the smaller teams won't be able to take advantage of it for financial reasons. Once you flatten the pay scale somewhat, the smaller teams become stable and competitive as long as they are competent. As you say, over time the sport becomes stable and everybody wins.

I think there is an added bonus beyond that. Right now, teams are winning championships with brute force ($$), not necessarily with efficiency (spending less, but wisely). Once you adjust the pay scale it will remove the advantage of brute force spending somewhat. This in turn, takes away the incentive for manufacturers to stay in F1 (why stick around if you can't buy a championship). In time these teams will leave and be replaced with smaller independent teams - and here comes the bonus. The smaller independent teams are much more likely to allow character and personality back into the sport. I've always been a fan of the drivers that actually engage, not just carry the corporate image, so this would be what I'd be hoping for.