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  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nitrodaze View Post
    I suspect they may not ban it for this season as they were forewarned about it. But they were quick to update the regulation for next season to specifically ban it in 2021. There are multiple benefits from this Toe adjusting technology as we would find as the season progresses. It is definitely an edge over the competition.

    Agreed...


    IF... it does offer as big an advantage as they think and Merc run up a huge lead in the first 4-5 months, if its going to take 5-6 months for the others to have it on their cars.. I see a real possibility that the others just write this season off completely and concentrate on putting all their resources and development into the 2021 reg cars instead of attempting to chase Merc down in the latter half of the season with no guarantees of success. For this reason 2020 could be Mercs most dominant season and the dullest one ever.

    Heres hoping its not really a huge advantage... or the others have an unseen but equal development to ensure that wont happen.
    The emergence of the new 'Rainmaster' - Mad Max at Interlagos 2016!

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zico View Post
    Agreed...


    IF... it does offer as big an advantage as they think and Merc run up a huge lead in the first 4-5 months, if its going to take 5-6 months for the others to have it on their cars.. I see a real possibility that the others just write this season off completely and concentrate on putting all their resources and development into the 2021 reg cars instead of attempting to chase Merc down in the latter half of the season with no guarantees of success. For this reason 2020 could be Mercs most dominant season and the dullest one ever.

    Heres hoping its not really a huge advantage... or the others have an unseen but equal development to ensure that wont happen.
    Possibly. But you assume that the DAS provides a significant advantage to put Mercedes far ahead. I think the competition may not need the DAS to catch up to and give Mercedes a good fight for the championship. The DAS is a good winter testing sensation but not necesarily a silver bullet. We don't know yet what advantages it gives. We also don't know yet if it is actually an edge. We also don't know how good the cars of the opposition actually are.

    I think it is going to be a hard fought season. As all that is needed to make the season interesting, is for one or both of the main competition to be close enough to be a real bother for Mercedes. They don't necessarily need to be faster. They just need to harass Mercedes enough to rattle their cage. Especially if both Redbull and Ferrari can simultaneously do so.

    It should not be an easy run to the finish line for Mercedes. Even Mercedes do not want that. They at least want to experience a good fight for the title.
    Last edited by Nitrodaze; 23rd February 2020 at 11:29.
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  3. Likes: Zico (22nd February 2020)
  4. #13
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    That Mercedes looks unbelievable. The main benefit to DAS is tire wear. I suspect itís mainly for race mode. DAS isnít a game changer but Mercedesís appear to have found 3 seconds over the winter. Thatís incredible. They switched focus to 2020 in July last year. Watching the onboard of Bottas fastest lap and how easyit looked. That car can do a 1.13 in Barcelona with the gloves off. I donít think Ferrari or RBR can match that.

    Mercedes will switch focus to 2021 early if they dominate this year. The speed the are carrying through the corners and the balance looks perfect, no under steering, the car just goes where they want.

    Canít wait for Melbourne but it seems ominous so far.

  5. Likes: Zico (23rd February 2020)
  6. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Black Knight View Post
    That Mercedes looks unbelievable. The main benefit to DAS is tire wear. I suspect it’s mainly for race mode. DAS isn’t a game changer but Mercedes’s appear to have found 3 seconds over the winter. That’s incredible. They switched focus to 2020 in July last year. Watching the onboard of Bottas fastest lap and how easyit looked. That car can do a 1.13 in Barcelona with the gloves off. I don’t think Ferrari or RBR can match that.

    Mercedes will switch focus to 2021 early if they dominate this year. The speed the are carrying through the corners and the balance looks perfect, no under steering, the car just goes where they want.

    Can’t wait for Melbourne but it seems ominous so far.
    We said that for Ferrari last year, look how that turned out. This is testing info which may not be indicative of the true state of affairs. Melborne is a different situation. But you are right, if Mercedes turns out to reflect their testing relative performance in inseason racing, they would coast to their seventh constructors title with ease. Hence, would be able to afford to release resources to start the work on the 2021 car earlier than their competition.

    In which case the drivers title fight would essentially be between Hamilton and Bottas. But truly hope that it not so easy and straightforward.
    Last edited by Nitrodaze; 23rd February 2020 at 11:40.
    Better a witty fool than a foolish wit.
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  7. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nitrodaze View Post
    We said that for Ferrari last year, look how that turned out. This is testing info which may not be indicative of the true state of affairs. Melborne is a different situation. But you are right, if Mercedes turns out to reflect their testing relative performance in inseason racing, they would coast to their seventh constructors title with ease. Hence, would be able to afford to release resources to start the work on the 2021 car earlier than their competition.

    In which case the drivers title fight would essentially be between Hamilton and Bottas. But truly hope that it not so easy and straightforward.
    At this point all we really know for sure is that the time Bottas set is about a half second quicker than times set last year. And that lap is short of the track record. Essentially, they are still not showing true pace, either short term or race pace. We know the cars have developed enough that all of them should be faster than their times of last year, barring any bad miscalculations. And last year the final fastest times between Seb and Lewis were almost identical, yet we all know that Merc had a much better car once we moved on to the races.

    Did Merc simply advance more between testing and racing last year, or was it just good sandbagging? The problem is, we just don't know.



    I do think Ferrari are on the back foot this year by all indications. I don't think they could fake their concern so well and be sandbagging on the issue. I'm also fairly confident that RB have not even attempted to uncork the RB16 and show any real indication of short term/qually pace. They have been quietly doing a lot of long run race pace testing, putting in almost as many laps as Merc, but staying out of the light as well. But their runs on the harder tires and obvious higher fuel loads have been very solid, and I doubt that takes place without improvements on the lighter loads and stickier tires.

    The midfield appears to have been tightened up even more, though it might seem that Racing Point have made the biggest improvements. But once again, we can't be sure that they just haven't uncorked their full power modes and made more attempts at quickest pace earlier than the other teams. But indications are that RP, Mclaren, and Renault might all be fighting for a #4 spot, or possibly even higher if one of the big 3 falter too much as the season goes on.

    But I could well be wrong as well. Until they start unleashing the cars in low fuel qually trims, we won't know for sure who is just sandbagging better than the others, and who is already showing their hand. We will find out for sure soon enough.




    As for all the talk about DAS, after reading exhaustive arguments on both sides it's still up in the air as for legality IMO. Depending on which part of which reg you read, and more importantly how you interpret it, it could go either way. I tend to think it won't be allowed after protest, mostly due to the fact that when used it becomes a moving aerodynamic device. Changing toe on the straights greatly influences the wash over the car, but is not in the interest of steering the car, since history shows they have steered the car just fine without toe adjustments.

    A brilliant move on the part of Mercedes to use the system, as I suspect they already have easily adequate parts available to disable it if in fact it is banned. They have essentially rolled the dice in hopes it can be used. Though simple enough to make by all accounts, the other teams would need major repackaging changes to implement it most likely, and Merc just smiles and watches. I would suspect the actual benefit of using it would be more to control tire temps as the primary argument, but in reality the actual use seems to favor aero improvements. Tire scrub would change some, but the benefit there in speed would not be great mostly due to camber angles and footprint of the tires on a straight. The aero wash changes would likely be of more real world use IMO. Though top speeds might not change much, fuel use and engine modes could be used at lower settings, which would be a large advantage in long term race pace.


    However, the grey area which they have exploited is in fact a very deep grey. I personally thought the banning of the Renault mass damper on the grounds of moving aerodynamic device was insane. After all, they added overall stability to the car and essentially kept the aero devices from moving as much, yet it got banned. Then on the flip side we have had POU suspension which is intended to make the car squat more when cornering, improving aerodynamic impact especially in the front. The FIA set limits on that system, yet it is still allowed. So we have a governing body that leaves a lot of grey area in regs, and as well in enforcement of the regs.

    As it stands now I'm thinking 51/49 that DAS won't be raced for more than the season opener. Maybe even 50.001 vs 49.999. But usually the FIA tend to take the grey and make their decision as 99/1 either against or in favor.





    But regardless of DAS, Merc looks very strong, as do RB in my opinion. I wouldn't be surprised to see easily a second to possibly even two seconds come off of final testing times once the gloves are off and the cars are released in anger. Though I suspect that Ferrari won't do much but pick up scraps in the early season, I hope the combination of Ferrari and RB can at least harass the Merc enough to make the WDC a fight. I'd hate to see Lewis coast to his next WDC, as so far they have IMO been harder earned than those of the record he is trying to match.

  8. Likes: Zico (23rd February 2020)

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