Was Lewis passing Heikki legal?

[cos]

The sporting regulation in question states "Team orders which interfere with a race result are prohibited", which is, let's face it, vague as anything. Lewis was much faster than anyone else on track at that time and he was clearly going to get by Heikki within a couple of laps anyway. Did McLaren suggest to Heikki that it would be a good idea to makeit somewhat easier for Hamilton to pass? Most likely. Did it affect the race result? I highly doubt it.

[Rollo]

39.1 Team orders which interfere with a race result are prohibited.

Since Lewis won the race and Hekki finished in fifth after not really improving his position after this, one wonders if this constitutes "interference" of the race result.

Even if your opinion was to throw Lewis to the dogs over this one, it's Hekki who submitted his position, and actually proving "interference" per se would be incredibly difficult.

[Tomi]

The sporting regulation in question states "Team orders which interfere with a race result are prohibited", which is, let's face it, vague as anything. Lewis was much faster than anyone else on track at that time and he was clearly going to get by Heikki within a couple of laps anyway. Did McLaren suggest to Heikki that it would be a good idea to makeit somewhat easier for Hamilton to pass? Most likely. Did it affect the race result? I highly doubt it.

This nobody cant say for sure, what ever could have happened, to pass someone is always a risk, but i think its good that Heikki let him pass until he has the name under the new contract, if you start to give positions just like that you end up like Barricello.

[schmenke]

The "No team orders" rule was introduced to avoid bringing the sport into disrepute. I feel it has somewhat backfired

[Hawkmoon]

Well this thread was inevitable...

Yes it was, and with good reason.

How much crap did Ferrari get for using perfectly legal team orders in the early part of this century? The amount of rubbish thrown about on this forum alone was staggering. McLaren use a now illegal team order and nothing. Why is that?

I thought McLaren only used yeam orders when one driver was mathematically out of contention? Unless my maths are screwy Kovalainen is still in contention is he not? So McLaren can break their own golden rule and it's OK because McLaren are a "true" racing team unlike Ferrari who only care about winning to the detriment of the sport.

For the record, I have absolutely no problem with McLaren using team orders. It's what's going to win them the WDC. Ferrari, assuming they get the car quick enough again, will be splitting points between two drivers. McLaren won't.

My problem is with the media and the fans on the forum who were so virulent in their condemnation of Ferrari being so quiet when McLaren do the same thing. If team orders are so bad then it doesn't matter what colour the cars are, does it?

[AJP]

Yes it was, and with good reason.

How much crap did Ferrari get for using perfectly legal team orders in the early part of this century? The amount of rubbish thrown about on this forum alone was staggering. McLaren use a now illegal team order and nothing. Why is that?

I thought McLaren only used yeam orders when one driver was mathematically out of contention? Unless my maths are screwy Kovalainen is still in contention is he not? So McLaren can break their own golden rule and it's OK because McLaren are a "true" racing team unlike Ferrari who only care about winning to the detriment of the sport.

For the record, I have absolutely no problem with McLaren using team orders. It's what's going to win them the WDC. Ferrari, assuming they get the car quick enough again, will be splitting points between two drivers. McLaren won't.

My problem is with the media and the fans on the forum who were so virulent in their condemnation of Ferrari being so quiet when McLaren do the same thing. If team orders are so bad then it doesn't matter what colour the cars are, does it?

I'm not being quite...BUT, Kova's was not in contention for a race win at all. Ferrari this year may well have shot themselves in the foot by having two drivers competing for the world title. Something they did not have in the Schumi era. In saying this, there is still along way to go in this championship and we could well see Massa and Raikonen fighting right down to the last race to win the title. For me, I like Ferrari even more this season as they seem to be, along with BMW, the teams with two drivers that are challenging hard for the championship. Thats better for the sport in my opinion.

[pits4me]

Comparing this to the Ferrari incident is absolutely ridiculous. That call on Ruben's had more to do with padding ShuMi's run at the WDC than the constructors points.

Lewis was fortunate it was Hiekki and not a team mate like 'unibrow' whom seldom acts in the best interest of the team or stablemates who may be clearly faster.

[Rollo]

McLaren use a now illegal team order and nothing. Why is that?

Is it actually illegal? Can you actually prove that the results of the race were "interfered" with?

Would it have been impossible for Lewis to pass Hekki anyway considering that he then went on the pass both Massa and Piquet? What of the possibility that Heikki was told that Lewis was coming through and moved over anyway? Are we even actually sure that the "team order" exists? Was Heikki deliberately told to move over?

Even if McLaren did order Hekki to move out of the way, to prove such an allegation would require a scrutineering of the radio transmissions, which I'm pretty sure at this moment in time is not happening.

At one stage Lewis was in the lead; 24 seconds ahead of his nearest rival. It just might be possible that he was the best out there on the day... but to admit that... surely not!

[Valve Bounce]

Had Kovi followed Lewis after the move and been able to overtake both Massa and Junior, then I would join the legion of forumers in condemning Ron Dennis's actions. However, Kovi had reached the limit of his pace and the only achievement he could have made was to hinder Lewis's chances to win the race.

McLaren made a gamble when they did not refuel Lewis during the SC period. They had fuel for several more laps, meaning that Lewis's final stint on soft tyres would have been a short one, enabling him to be quicker. This worked and McLaren won the race.

Kovi's contribution to the results was a fourth, and whether he was given any team orders or not, he would have ended up coming fourth anyway. The only one who could have suffered was Lewis had he been forced to follow Kovi for several laps trying to pass him as he would have buggered his tyres through graining.

So there you have it.

[mstillhere]

I love to see the McLAren fans swinging and flip flopping one way and the other too as long as it is convenient for you. All your moralistic and ethical threads about how important it is for a driver to pass his own team mate out of pure sportmanship and fairness went strait into the garbage can. I have no idea how you can actually sit down at your computer and seroiusly write your hypocritical comments TOTALLY forgetting that just a couple of years ago you were just stating the opposite. I am frankly appaled. I have shown my ability, in one of my most recent threads - Ferrrai's stupidity- to call things for what they are. If Ferrrari does something stupid, I have no problem in critizing it. It they cheated I am the first denouncing my team and their wrong doing. Here, except for a couple of guys, I see a fanatical defence of the silver (only recently) bullets about their stealing, their bending of the rules (including Heikki and his refueling issue). Is it so hard for you guys TO HAVE A A STANDARD AND STICK TO IT? As far as your crediblity goes, you really loosing lots of it.
PS Here you find what RD said about it. It's just incredible the nerve he has. http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headline...21102741.shtml