Is it time to promote diesel engines in F1?

[Lennat]

Don't get me wrong, i do believe that we have to do something to save this planet, no doubt.

But to me it doesn't have that much to do with F1 really, it's still a racing series more than anything else. And the sound of a high revving petrol engine is a big part of what makes F1 what it is, to me anyway.

[Valve Bounce]

I have always wondered why diesel engines are banned in F1.

[Rollo]

Diesel engines are not banned.

http://argent.fia.com/web/fia-public.ns ... 2-2008.pdf

Article 5 of the regulations defines the engines as being:
4 stroke, less than 2400cc, max 19000rpm, as 90° V8s (with the cross section as circular), no supercharging and two inlet and two outlet valves.

Article 19 of the regulations defines the composition of the fuels used.

As no point does it mention how the air-fuel mixture inside the combustion chamber is to be ignited. If you could develop an engine using the Diesel cycle as opposed to the Otto cycle within the regulations, then you'd be perfectly fine.

The question would be whether that would provide any benefit though.

[Valve Bounce]

That link doesn't work
Sorry!! it does

I think section 19 knocks diesel on its head.

[Lennat]

Le Mans rules favour diesel powered engines atm. I don't think the diesels will perform that well on a level playing field. If the FIA do allow diesels in F1, I doubt there will be any constructors rushing to run diesel engines just yet. Technology hasn't developed far enough yet for diesel powered F1 cars to be an option yet. At least, not without rules that favour them.

Exactly, with similar specs except of the type of fuel, I can't imagine a diesel being even close in power.

It is fairly common in a road car to get a hundred hp per litre with a N/A engine, while a diesel usually won't get that much even while turbo charched, for example the Audi R8 TDI supercar gives 83 hp per litre from its turbo diesel.

Of course you have to consider the torque and stuff as well, and it's hard to say how much power a N/A 2,4 diesel could put out, but i doubt it would get the 750 or there about of a modern F1 engine. So yes, in my opinion diesels would need preferable treatment to be competive.

[Rollo]

98RON petrol contains 39.5MJ/L whereas diesel fuel contains 38.6MJ/L. Theoretically if you could use a Diesel cycle to extract more energy out of the same fuel as a regular Otto cycle then it would make sense.

Since the Diesel cycle uses compression ignition as opposed to spark ignition in an Otto cycle engine, and the real differences are the pressures required inside the engine, I don't think it would that much of a leap to attempt it. Isn't that what you pay engineers to test for you, to push the barriers?

Certainly stopping less in a GP might be worth the effort.

[Valve Bounce]

98RON petrol contains 39.5MJ/L whereas diesel fuel contains 38.6MJ/L. Theoretically if you could use a Diesel cycle to extract more energy out of the same fuel as a regular Otto cycle then it would make sense.

Since the Diesel cycle uses compression ignition as opposed to spark ignition in an Otto cycle engine, and the real differences are the pressures required inside the engine, I don't think it would that much of a leap to attempt it. Isn't that what you pay engineers to test for you, to push the barriers?

Certainly stopping less in a GP might be worth the effort.

There's a helluva lot of difference between diesel and petrol. You can ignite petrol just by igniting the fumes, whereas if you poured diesel on some firewood, you still have to use a newspaper lighter or similar to get it alight.

[Rollo]

There's a helluva lot of difference between diesel and petrol. You can ignite petrol just by igniting the fumes, whereas if you poured diesel on some firewood, you still have to use a newspaper lighter or similar to get it alight.

So?
Article 19 already defines what sort of through is going the engine. In theory, a Diesel cycle engine could have practically anything running through it from vegetable oil to nitro-methanol.

By "diesel" are you referring to the Distillate used in diesel engines or the actual Diesel Cycle engine itself?

[Valve Bounce]

So?
Article 19 already defines what sort of through is going the engine. In theory, a Diesel cycle engine could have practically anything running through it from vegetable oil to nitro-methanol.

By "diesel" are you referring to the Distillate used in diesel engines or the actual Diesel Cycle engine itself?

The fuel. I am not aware that you can put petrol in a diesel engine. However, if you think you can, ............???????????????

[Roamy]

At present, diesel engines are outlawed in F1; don't understand why. But with the growing popularity of HDi diesel engines and their fuel economy characteristics, should HDi diesel engines be permitted in F1?

Your thoughts please.

No Way F1 should move to hydrogen