Rally2 (ex-R5) News

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Originally Posted by mknight

The supplementary regulations on Sportity don't have annexes (which include itinerary).

However, the itinerary that is on Sportity has the early check in allowed. It is listed as comming from 20.10.

What specific procedures are needed for that one to be valid I have no idea, but if anything it is an organizer mess.

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For sure it is organizer mess. Appendix 1 is available on "another" official noticeboard, which was working before sportity was started and was used as platform for entry list - https://www.dmsb-sport.de/25_Interna...er_Aushang.php

Procedures to be valid are very clear - any change in supplementary regulations or itinerary must be made by bulletin.

And in addition, in rules there is point 44.2.11 - Provided that it has been stated in the Supplementary Regulations of the rally or is indicated in a later bulletin, the organisers may authorise crews to check in before time without incurring any penalty.

For sure this was not stated in supplementary regulations or any bulletin for TC 10B...

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Originally Posted by mknight

Where does it say that lateness is the same as "as earliness" in the regulations? Only mention is that being early does not reduce the lateness. (i.e. being early in one tc doesn't mean you can exceed lateness on next).

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Yes, you are correct. Not excluded/retired, but he should receive huge penalty.

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Originally Posted by PLuto

For sure it is organizer mess. Appendix 1 is available on "another" official noticeboard, which was working before sportity was started and was used as platform for entry list - https://www.dmsb-sport.de/25_Interna...er_Aushang.php

Procedures to be valid are very clear - any change in supplementary regulations or itinerary must be made by bulletin.

And in addition, in rules there is point 44.2.11 - Provided that it has been stated in the Supplementary Regulations of the rally or is indicated in a later bulletin, the organisers may authorise crews to check in before time without incurring any penalty.

For sure this was not stated in supplementary regulations or any bulletin for TC 10B...

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This "old" itinerary has even the TCS named differently.
TC10B is Service out, while in the Annex 1 on Sportity it is Service in.

Since the one on Sportity is marked as Annex 1 it is seemingly part of Sporting Regulations and has newer date.

I don't have any idea when the Sporting Regulations are supposed to be valid and how are they distributed besides Sportity. But using the newest Annex 1 there is no breach of rules.

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Originally Posted by mknight

This "old" itinerary has even the TCS named differently.
TC10B is Service out, while in the Annex 1 on Sportity it is Service in.

Since the one on Sportity is marked as Annex 1 it is seemingly part of Sporting Regulations and has newer date.

I don't have any idea when the Sporting Regulations are supposed to be valid and how are they distributed besides Sportity. But using the newest Annex 1 there is no breach of rules.

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You are wrong, it is breach of rules. Any change to regulations (including appendixes) must be made by bulletin. Publication as "other documents" on sportity one day before the start is not valid, sorry.

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Originally Posted by PLuto

But there is black shadow on this win. Mikkelsen should be excluded for early arrival to TC 10B. And 200 euro cash penalty for not following the roadbook (missed refuel zone and tyre marking zone) is also a joke...

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Is that a co-drivers mistake or done on purpose? I mean can crew gain some "advantage" by doing so or its simply a inattention?

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Originally Posted by PLuto

You are wrong, it is breach of rules. Any change to regulations (including appendixes) must be made by bulletin. Publication as "other documents" on sportity one day before the start is not valid, sorry.

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The intenary supplied as Appendix to the supplementary regulations was followed by the crew.

Whether they published the intenary in "correct" way is an organizer problem. I don't know if they did or not and doesn't look like you do either. The whole situation looks like you just looked at the supplementary regulations published by wrong website that wasn't updated and created a drama for no reason. (Especially the part where you start claiming they should be excluded).

Advantage gained by the crew by going early into service after the rally is finished is exactly 0.

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Originally Posted by Lead

Is that a co-drivers mistake or done on purpose? I mean can crew gain some "advantage" by doing so or its simply a inattention?

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Going into service after rally is finished early gives no advantage.
(theoretically you could gain an advantage if say your alternator doesn't work and you are running low on battery, but then you would stop the car in the meantime anyway)

But as written in the post before they just followed latest published Itenary, so there was no mistake or intent by the crew.

Missing the refuel and tire marking in the morning was a mistake. By missing the tire marking you could theoretically get away with using more tires than allowed, but doesn't look like tire wear was a problem in this rally. Also dunno if there were any limits on number of tires at all and whether they went back to mark the tires. I agree that 200 euro is a bit ridiculous penalty though. I remember a few times in WRC people would get 10s-ish penalties for similar stuff.

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Originally Posted by mknight

The intenary supplied as Appendix to the supplementary regulations was followed by the crew.

Whether they published the intenary in "correct" way is an organizer problem. I don't know if they did or not and doesn't look like you do either. The whole situation looks like you just looked at the supplementary regulations published by wrong website that wasn't updated and created a drama for no reason. (Especially the part where you start claiming they should be excluded).

Advantage gained by the crew by going early into service after the rally is finished is exactly 0.

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There is no sense to continue in discussion with you...

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Originally Posted by Lead

Is that a co-drivers mistake or done on purpose? I mean can crew gain some "advantage" by doing so or its simply a inattention?

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For sure it is mistake of the crew.

The derfinitive schedule is the one shown on the time card - not the roadbook or any other published schedule. We do not have that to look at. As Pluto says above, it can only be changed by an official bulletin. It sounds like the organisers of the event need some training in the regulations!