Rally2 (ex-R5) News

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Originally Posted by Mirek

There is a big difference between RGT and R5. RGT are near stock cars while R5 are purpose built machines. They need to use quite a lot of production parts but that doesn't make them less tricky. The rules of R5 are really challenging and don't allow cheap success. You can see how many difficulties big and rich factory teams have with them. In some way the R5 development is more difficult than S2000. RGT is entirely different story.

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You're missing the point! After FIA opening homologation to private tuners the interest over GT class increase hugely, and that could also be the case with R5 (nowadays limited to 3/4 manus) and even on the other R categories (there are little more than 20 models homologated, all classes combined).

Rally fans needs diversity of models on stages and drivers could be able to choose their cars from different tuners, instead of having to pay a fortune to the established ones that profit from FIA strict homologation methods.

In Gr.N/A days there was an enormous variety of models homologated from almost every make and a huge number of capable private tuners, that could provide competitive cars at a fraction of the cost of a works car.

With the exception of WRC cars, the pinnacle category of the sport, R classes homologation process shouldn't be so oriented to manufacturers, and FIA could easily replicate the overture to private tuners like in R-GT.

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Originally Posted by Rally Power

You're missing the point! After FIA opening homologation to private tuners the interest over GT class increase hugely, and that could also be the case with R5 (nowadays limited to 3/4 manus) and even on the other R categories (there are little more than 20 models homologated, all classes combined).

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I wouldn't say there is some special interest in RGT category. We can count the cars which run some international event on fingers of one hand. That's hardly a success after two years with new rules. Besides that I stand my point. To build an RGT car is very very easy compared to building an R5 car and there is no real benchmark in the class for You to destroy all Your hopes after first stage You run. Let's be real. We have seen a lot of much better funded projects in the S2000 category which failed. Nobody was buying MG, Corsa, Proton or Polo despite them being cheaper than the opponents and even the fact that they weren't that bad (Polo and Proton were quite competitive at some point). Moreover... In 2012 You could buy once totally competitive Punto S2000 for 70 thousand Euros. There was 70 Puntos built. Do You see them running on stages?

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Originally Posted by Rally Power

Rally fans needs diversity of models on stages and drivers could be able to choose their cars from different tuners, instead of having to pay a fortune to the established ones that profit from FIA strict homologation methods.

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Again same point. Building R5 cars is not tuning. It's a development of the entire car from scratch. It costs millions of Euros if You want to sell it to someone. Nobody will do that just for fun. We can keep dreaming that if we change the rules the world will be suddenly flooded with new cars but it won't. It would make sense for smaller classes such as R1, R2 because there would be a lot of teams capable of making them good. R5 is a manufacturer playground. When was the last time a completely privately developed car was competitive against factory cars? I don't know myself but I guess it must be half a century a go.

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Originally Posted by Rally Power

In Gr.N/A days there was an enormous variety of models homologated from almost every make and a huge number of capable private tuners, that could provide competitive cars at a fraction of the cost of a works car.

With the exception of WRC cars, the pinnacle category of the sport, R classes homologation process shouldn't be so oriented to manufacturers, and FIA could easily replicate the overture to private tuners like in R-GT.

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Three points. First point is that around 1990 there was multiply more independent car manufacturers in the world than now. The globalization made them join into huge groups which are driven both by strict internal policies and effectiveness. For them there's no point to have two or three brands of the same group involved in the same thing.

Second thing is that You put an example which contradicts You own previous statements. There was same homologation system valid in 1990 as it is now. All those cars were homologated by the manufacturer and the tuners were only tuning them. They didn't develop them from scratch for the homologation.

Third point is that it was simply different times. Road going rally cars were popular stuff produced by many manufacturers and it was relatively easy to tune them into something useful. Making a road going Delta Integrale Evo into a rally car was sure easier than to buy a Fiesta and change totally everything except the bodyshell to make it the R5. I know I repeat myself frequently but those days are over. Let's get used to it. The car development took different way and it will not come back in a foreseeable future.

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Originally Posted by Mirek

I know I repeat myself frequently but those days are over. Let's get used to it. The car development took different way and it will not come back in a foreseeable future.

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Why couldn´t things change for the better? ie. going back to roots.

Because it's utopia.

I like rally very much but i can t buy an r5 car and i certainly can t pay the running costs on such cars. So i have a gr a BMW M3. I like also rwd cars and BMW. This is my only choice if i want a FIA homologated car from BMW.

Rally needs to be more open and let you drive cars you like. If i could rally an newer BMW i would maybe choose that. But my only choice is gr a!

Maybe going back to roots it's not utopia, just good sense instigated by the course of circumstances…

Obviously all homologation are, as always were, proposed by the manufacturer and works tuners will always get advantage over the private ones, but after the introduction of R categories homologations are so strict that the use of works tuners components become virtually mandatory.

That's ok for the WRC class, because makes are directly involved in the major expression of the sport, but it makes no sense that drivers and teams competing with lower categories cars in regional and national championships should be forced to follow this official supplier policy.

This is a way to restrain the sport, as become clear in the R-GT issue. Just hope FIA officials understand that there's a need to use the R-GT example and allow private tuners homologations on other R categories, to bring diversity and larger accessibility to the sport.

SKODA Motorsport has 2 entries in WRC2
http://www.fia.com/news/2015-fia-wrc...-registrations

new DS3 R5 for FriulMotor

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Originally Posted by Mirek

Video of Kopecký's R5 test at the opposite end of the stage: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kGzP4MuyT5s

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Breen with Skoda uniform at r5 tests?

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Originally Posted by dimviii

Breen with Skoda uniform at r5 tests?

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Where?