Everything is unnecessary danger, however there are degrees.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jasper
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Everything is unnecessary danger, however there are degrees.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jasper
yes, but its a choice, Hilkensteins are not.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jasper
Nah just reduce grip and make the cars LOOK fast instead of "on rails REALLY fast".Quote:
Originally Posted by Rallyper
Of course they are. Don't hit them, if you don't like them.Quote:
Originally Posted by N.O.T
For N.O.T.
https://youtu.be/Njpe4y16Z3o
http://i.imgur.com/ZGMEwFr.gifQuote:
Originally Posted by EightGear
More BHP are as much unnecessary and it is a choice as wellQuote:
Originally Posted by N.O.T
If there is a motorsport hell in afterlife you just got a lifetime pass.... kid.Quote:
Originally Posted by AL14
Going to bed is an unnecessary danger, a very large portion of the worlds population die in a bed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jasper
How difficult is it to reach the non spectator areas of panzerplatte, forest harping etc. Also talking about safety where the hell did they get the marshalls this year. Every YouTube video has them standing in escape roads and outside of fast corners. Where can I get one of them car proof yellow jackets
it does not matter where they have the cars, if the escape roads are going to be used they are going to use move them since they are close by.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nelly
You too you're lacking logic here.Quote:
Originally Posted by N.O.T
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/2016...078620057e.jpgQuote:
Originally Posted by AL14
You're correct.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mk2 RS2000
I didn't remember anyone asking guardrails in the Welsh forests achter Parks tragic crash. The risk is everywhere.
The drivers know the risks... the hinkelsteins are not a secret or hidden... so the drivers must simply drive accordingly.
This is what makes WRC rallying what it is... a variety of tests and risks to be calculated.
If everywhere was made super-safe the drivers wouldnt want to drive and we wouldnt want to watch.
No risk, no reward.
N.O.T is right here in the sense that, because hinkelsteins are man-made objects, they become an easy target for what the FIA/WRC Promoter may see as a "quick win" when it comes to safety.
I'm not in favour of removing them or the Panzerplatte stages at all - it's just not that difficult to see how people's minds work in the year 2016. Better to be actively seen as doing something (*hey look over here we are fixing this problem*) while as everyone has mentioned, the 2017 cars are getting a whole lot quicker.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Simmi
Go and wash your mouth out with soap!!
Oh dear God.
That's the best PR stunt they could come up with?
From the start in this thread we (me) questioned the increased speed. And also earlier the way tarmac rallies have developed. Hinkelsteins are not safe as well, but in Lefebvre case they probably saved him from even worse outcome.
My worry is when the monster cars also called a new GrB era will cause the disaster we not want.
Solution is changes in grip an maybe also speed oc in combination with maybe cheaper and less technical cars (i.e. why not R5 in WRC?)
Stunt ? What's wrong with the ERC drivers sending their best wishes to two of there former colleagues ?Quote:
Originally Posted by rallyfiend
I dont see the increase in speed making much difference... if a current WRC car went into spectators it would already cause carnage. At 150kph or 200kph its still a disaster.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rallyper
150 or 200kph makes BIG difference on impact, regardning driver and codriver. Make your physics.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fast Eddie WRC
When you mention 'new Group B' and a 'disaster we dont want' I assumed you meant a crash involving spectators...Quote:
Originally Posted by Rallyper
The new cars will be massively safer than the original Group B cars which were deathtraps.
Let's not exaggerate. The new WRC cars are not going to be new gr.B.
Exactly.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirek
And a big company like VW for example wouldn't want to be associated with such a thing..
Probably Rallyper meant in terms of lot of power. We should know what Group B means in terms of specification.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirek
Times changed. That days when gr.B cars had 450 Hp, the common cars used to have 60-80 Hp. Today everybody can buy a car with hundreds of Hp for relatively small money (at least used ones) and nobody is going to be astonished by 400 Hp figure anymore. It was something completely crazy in 1985.
It wasnt the big power that was dangerous even then, it was the lightweight construction and placement of the fuel tank etc.
And the lack of all crowd control in many countries.
Yes, You are right. What I meant was that the main feature of the Gr.B was that it was something unbeliavably mad and crazy. You can't achieve such wow factor today.
It's not about the numbers, they aren't something special. But the jump from current power can be a factor in getting used to.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirek
Is 20% more power so radical change? I don't think so. The cars will be faster mainly in cornering speed thanks to the active center diffs and the aero package but not that much on straights (where some of the power will be spent on the extended aerodynamic drag).
I don't think it is either, but some drivers can find it difficult to adjust. Just an assumption.
Anyway dangerous crashes can happen with any rally car, no matter ho many hp it has. It is about the safety measures regulations are taken, not the speed/hp.
20% as a number is not that radical, but if you take into account that the cars are already very very fast 20% increase is a HUGE number.
For me the more the better, there is no such thing as too much power in motorsports.
I believe the last 2.0T WRC cars had around 370-380 Hp and 800-900 Nm and nobody seemed to think it was too much when there was 300 Hp written everywhere...
WRC Germany 2016 Shakedown and Day 1 action:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NwDlQdOpiJs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MiL5ty0zoyo
Never expected but i follow N.O.T. here.Quote:
Originally Posted by N.O.T
The solution i think is to use car-tires (or something like that) around the Hilkensteins on places were it could be really dangerous like the (fast) place of the crash of Lefebvre. So in this corner you only put them on/at the last four or five ones. You can't make rally a safe heaven but you have to look what it's possible to make it safe were it can, unnatural roadchicanes is also a possibility.
maybe we should organize events on a dragster straight with 2k with plenty of barriers... this should be safe enough...
its not about safety its about unnecessary danger, for example lets say you have a lake on the outside of a corner, that would be fine for rallying since its an acceptable anger, but if that lake was the home of piranhas then that would be an unnecessary danger. Remove the piranhas and keep the lake.Quote:
Originally Posted by marcosg
First year you remove the fish, the second year the lake, the third year every solid item close to the road, fourth year you are driving in a parking lot.Quote:
Originally Posted by N.O.T