[WRC] Vodafone Rally de Portugal 2021

[flykas]

Damn, unfortunate for Ott. Most likely clipped something. Ogier waited it out and got a present. Also interesting that Katsuta is few secs away from podium.

[denkimi]

And that's how ogier becomes champion. His rivals are stupid enough to push when they don't need to and crash out, and ogier just cruises to the end.

[Ucci]

good old TÄnak luck,

Ogier will be champ this year, no doubt

As a Ogier's fan I'm happy, but still wait with such predictions....season is still long. Anything can happen.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Any facts to confirm what caused the damage to Tanak's car ?

[rp]

As a Ogier's fan I'm happy, but still wait with such predictions....season is still long. Anything can happen.

Ogier is not 7x WRC Champion by coincidence. He knows how to get to the finish. It´s just so frustrating that his rivals are always so stupid that they let him take the titles...

[Ucci]

His rivals are stupid enough to push when they don't need to and crash out, and ogier just cruises to the end.
I said already 1.000x times in the past- in rally you have sometimes to "back up", it is not whole time 100% push and attack.

[mknight]

I said already 1.000x times in the past- in rally you have sometimes to "back up", it is not whole time 100% push and attack.

Meeke and Duval disagree with you.

[EstWRC]

As a Ogier's fan I'm happy, but still wait with such predictions....season is still long. Anything can happen.


well yeah, i was just so emotional at that point and it just bursted out. sorry about that

but i agree, still 8 rallies to go and anything can happen.

[mknight]

They just said Sordo has broken starter and can't turn off the engine.

[EstWRC]

Any facts to confirm what caused the damage to Tanak's car ?

not yet, waiting for it also


1. Sébastien Ogier FRA 76 Toyota
2. Elfyn Evans GBR 76 Toyota
3. Thierry Neuville BEL 53 Hyundai
4. Ott Tänak EST 40 Hyundai
5. Kalle Rovanperä FIN 39 Toyota

[skarderud]

Exactly what I was thinking, Adamo's gonna have a hard think about his 3rd driver for next year.Solberg in WRC half season next year, split 3 driver with....? Sordo, breen, loubet, Veiby?



Sent fra min SM-G950F via Tapatalk

[EstWRC]

i think i found when the suspension broke

rewatched the live, and at 17.15 (Tänaks stage time) theres like a compression on the straight and you can see it lifts the rear of the car, and already in the next corner Tänak says: "F**k" in estonian

[mknight]

Suninens Fiesta looks set up for Safari on this stage and the Polo for tarmac :)

[Päss1928]

And that's how ogier becomes champion. His rivals are stupid enough to push when they don't need to and crash out, and ogier just cruises to the end.

Fully agree. Seems to be better at writing pacenotes too.

[TypeR]

i think i found when the suspension broke

rewatched the live, and at 17.15 (Tänaks stage time) theres like a compression on the straight and you can see it lifts the rear of the car, and already in the next corner Tänak says: "F**k" in estonian

good find! and 20-30s later smoke is coming from right rear

[mknight]

good find! and 20-30s later smoke is coming from right rear

I watched and while there is no doubt he has an issue when he gets to the tarmac the car seems strangely sideways even before 1715.

[Eli]

Solberg in WRC half season next year, split 3 driver with....? Sordo, Breen, Loubet, Veiby?



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Obviously Adamo will want just one (third) driver (ideally anyhow) but obviously I have no clue, I'm just saying, it's a tough position to be in for Adamo.

[mknight]

Obviously Adamo will want just one (third) driver (ideally anyhow) but obviously I have no clue, I'm just saying, it's a tough position to be in for Adamo.

Why would he "obviously" want just one when he won his both manu titles due to driver rotation?

[Eli]

Why would he "obviously" want just one when he won his both manu titles due to driver rotation?

Well that's what he said or what dirtfish reported if I recall correctly before the rally, something like, just because it worked in 2019 won't mean it work in 2022.

[EstWRC]

I watched and while there is no doubt he has an issue when he gets to the tarmac the car seems strangely sideways even before 1715.

i just watched again and didnt see anything strange before that...Evans was also very sideways before that same place but the compression didnt lift his car so much as Tänaks

E: same story with Sordo, the car doesnt move basically at all on the same place.

[Päss1928]

i just watched again and didnt see anything strange before that...Evans was also very sideways before that same place but the compression didnt lift his car so much as Tänaks

E: same story with Sordo, the car doesnt move basically at all on the same place.

Can't see the onboards myself atm, but from what you say it could have been caused by running his car lower than others again? I recall the same thing being the cause for several of his DNF's with Toyota.

[TypeR]

Can't see the onboards myself atm, but from what you say it could have been caused by running his car lower that others again? I recall the same thing being the cause for several of his DNF's with Toyota.

they can be seen from the SS13 live..

If he had finished the stage and only got penalty for the last one, he would have been 9th overall and 1min10 to 7th Lappi..

[EstWRC]

Can't see the onboards myself atm, but from what you say it could have been caused by running his car lower that others again? I recall the same thing being the cause for several of his DNF's with Toyota.

Maybe. It’s a fast place and it’s only for a second or less so hard to judge.


Have to wait for his own comments. Maybe I’m totally wrong but the fact that he curses already in the next corner makes me believe it was the moment

[mknight]

Hyundai have to enter one of Neuville/Tanak to get manu points tomorrow. But they can even drive in road mode and just get to finish and get 6 or 8 points.

[tommeke_B]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HXHEaiczMlc&ab_channel=AP90Video

Watching this video, I think it'd be cool to have a proper mixed rally again, with both tarmac and gravel in the same loop.

[AnttiL]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HXHEaiczMlc&ab_channel=AP90Video

Watching this video, I think it'd be cool to have a proper mixed rally again, with both tarmac and gravel in the same loop.

Not sure what you mean. Mixed surface rallies were banned from WRC from 1997 to 2009 and before that servicing was more free, so you rarely had to drive on tarmac with gravel tyres. And even in those days, Sanremo and Catalunya had distinct tarmac and gravel loops. Actually even Portugal had distinct tarmac loops, but sometimes just had some tarmac stages or sections within the "gravel loops".

However, there is something cool about driving on tarmac with gravel setup/tyres. Amarante and Terra Alta are great stages, and there are many historical examples as well (Chiusdino, Meteora)

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Adamo:
“Tomorrow, Sordo will win the rally. More of this s*** there cannot be. This car is the f****** fastest here and the fastest car has to win.”

https://dirtfish.com/rally/wrc/adamo-orders-sordo-to-win-rally-portugal/

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E2BMaxEXoAwj7Nf?format=jpg&name=small

[dimviii]

Adamo:
“Tomorrow, Sordo will win the rally. More of this s*** there cannot be. This car is the f****** fastest here and the fastest car has to win.”

https://dirtfish.com/rally/wrc/adamo-orders-sordo-to-win-rally-portugal/



Εvans was faster from Sordo at all today stages,bar the last one.

[dimviii]

what is this?

Karlip Automobile
@Karlip1
·
2h
This is from Amarante first pass. Not cool, guys. Not cool.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E2A_mrYWEAAPH9k?format=jpg&name=medium

[denkimi]

Εvans was faster from Sordo at all today stages,bar the last one.
Pretty much till tanak screwed up.

I'm not sure sordo can go much faster, but he can try.

[dimviii]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E1_0b8PXMAMHY57?format=jpg&name=large

[EstWRC]

From the vid I see it more as a technical failure than Tänak screwing it up

[dimviii]

From the vid I see it more as a technical failure than Tänak screwing it up

do we have Hyundais statement?

[TypeR]

Tänak's onboard is up from SS14. Stayed surprisingly calm..
They suspected punctured tyre and loose swingbar, but kept going..

Tänak to team before they stopped: ,,aah just on the straight I don't know, something came loose on the rear and now.. it's a bit undriveable!''

a bit indeed :D

[tommeke_B]

Not sure what you mean. Mixed surface rallies were banned from WRC from 1997 to 2009 and before that servicing was more free, so you rarely had to drive on tarmac with gravel tyres. And even in those days, Sanremo and Catalunya had distinct tarmac and gravel loops. Actually even Portugal had distinct tarmac loops, but sometimes just had some tarmac stages or sections within the "gravel loops".

However, there is something cool about driving on tarmac with gravel setup/tyres. Amarante and Terra Alta are great stages, and there are many historical examples as well (Chiusdino, Meteora)

I mean like Cyprus had in WRC and IRC.

[EstWRC]

Tänak's onboard is up from SS14. Stayed surprisingly calm..
They suspected punctured tyre and loose swingbar, but kept going..

Tänak to team before they stopped: ,,aah just on the straight I don't know, something came loose on the rear and now.. it's a bit undriveable!''

a bit indeed :D

yeah, just watched it too...it was the same place on the straight i talked about yesterday...really unfortunate, Ott is quite surprised and confused...asking couple of times "what was this now?"

[TypeR]

Tänak's onboard is up from SS14. Stayed surprisingly calm..
They suspected punctured tyre and loose swingbar, but kept going..

Tänak to team before they stopped: ,,aah just on the straight I don't know, something came loose on the rear and now.. it's a bit undriveable!''

a bit indeed :D


e: morning service park
Porter: ,,Was it a driver clipping something or an actual failure?
Tänak: ,,It's up to you to discover that..''
Porter: ,,We can't quite work out.. soo?
Tänak: ,,There was no clipping let's say..'' (with a cheeky smile)

so.. seems like not his fault, except no stopping before or goint till the end of the stage..

no words needed
https://i.postimg.cc/YC1224hL/hyudnaia.jpg

[mknight]

Could be that some rock/stone in line damaged things beforehand. But surely doesn't have to be Tanaks fault.

I also recall FX interview I heard last week "rally drivers never hit anything" ( after Latvala came to stage end with 3 wheels).

[mknight]

Looks like Neuville does really drive in road mode as I predicted yesterday.

[EstWRC]

Tänak has changed to open helmet

[Essaj]

Tänak has changed to open helmet

Power stage spec :D

[EstWRC]

lol open helmet to save weight (200 gr lighter) and also no spare tyre

All in for power stage

[TypeR]

seems that Katsuta had a call not to fight with Ogier..

[meh]

There is some hope for stagewin for Fourmaux

[meh]

Tänak with 4 tires again. All-in for powerstage.

[meh]

What, Evans 7.5 sec up with 1st split? The statement.

[TypeR]

Byeeee, Evans full attack! 7.5s ahead

[EstWRC]

you can see he is giving everything, all over the place and a lot of work with steering


E: it got so boring now, its just a full cruise fest from everyone till PS,

[meh]

Basically there is nothing to decide anymore, just waiting for power-stage.

[EstWRC]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E2DYnwZXEAc5_1E?format=jpg&name=small

[meh]

Gryazin time puts Evans "domination" in context - seems that Evans was only WRC driver who actually pushed.

[Ucci]

Sordo not following Adamo's instructions (to overtake Evans). Loosing to much on the first sunday's stage....

[Sulland]

Sunday has become a save ryres for powerstage day.
To bad really, take away good fights tha could have been.

5 points is way too muvh for a PS win in 3 classes. That means almost everyone on the list will try to keep staus quo on the rally, to fight for "easy" PS poimts.

Something needs to be done about this!

[jonkka]

Something needs to be done about this!

Your suggestion would be?

[cali]

Your suggestion would be?Fresh tyres for PS, top 3 earns points, lose PS altogether, give points not in PS but Sunday's best 3 earns bonus points. There's a lot ways to make it interesting as you see.

Sent from my GM1913 using Tapatalk

[EstWRC]

fresh tyres for PS is a idea that i totally support.

Tänak doesnt want to save tyres too much? Faster than Kalle

[meh]

Without PowerStage it could be even worse. Nothing to do, if 3 of 6 top drivers are out of fights.

[meh]

For example - today there is excitement, can any M-Sport driver get stage-win as others are not pushing at all :)

[Francis44]

Sunday has become a save ryres for powerstage day.
To bad really, take away good fights tha could have been.

5 points is way too muvh for a PS win in 3 classes. That means almost everyone on the list will try to keep staus quo on the rally, to fight for "easy" PS poimts.

Something needs to be done about this!

Agree fully.

I still dont understand why we need these 3 day rallys aswell.

[cali]

Without PowerStage it could be even worse. Nothing to do, if 3 of 6 top drivers are out of fights.Sunday top 3 earns bonus?

Sent from my GM1913 using Tapatalk

[meh]

Sunday top 3 earns bonus?

Sent from my GM1913 using Tapatalk

or extra point for every stage win

[Sulland]

Fresh tyres for PS,
top 3 earns points, better
lose PS altogether, even better
give points not in PS but Sunday's best 3 earns bonus point Good proposal! Will make whole sunday count!
There's a lot ways to make it interesting as you see. Yes, but as it is currently it makes a mockery of the whole sport imo,

Sent from my GM1913 using Tapatalk

In addition i would look into killing off Superrally. If You for some reason are out, you are out of the rally.

[cali]

In addition i would look into killing off Superrally. If You for some reason are out, you are out of the rally.Agreed, atm this cruising until PS is painful to watch.

As for Superrally I'm yet undecided. But it certainly has it's pro's.

Sent from my GM1913 using Tapatalk

[EstWRC]

In addition i would look into killing off Superrally. If You for some reason are out, you are out of the rally.

so youre complaining its boring and you want to make it even more boring with less drivers on sunday?


it is what it is this time....just a month ago we had epic sunday at croatia, short memories

[meh]

In addition i would look into killing off Superrally. If You for some reason are out, you are out of the rally.

I agree from sport perspective, but there is clear downside - then it's probably nursing car from start to finish, especially on rallies like Tukrey and Portugal. I think it's decreasing "pushing" a lot.

More on that - imagine you are fan of someone, travel to another side of the world and your hero get mechanical failure on Friday.

This sport is selling "screen time" or from car perspective "time on wheels". I think it could decrease interest from sponsors perspective as well.

Currently super-rally is actually solving a problem. You can think about removing it when you have 5+ manu teams.

[cali]

or extra point for every stage winIf we go a little bit further with our ideas I think FIA soon has some good proposals at their hands ;)

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[mknight]

Yeah Sulland wtf. "Sunday is boring so lets removed PS and remove superrally".

The only idea that has any merit around here is freshe tires. But you seem to forget that the restarting guys like Tanak will start the PS first which is usually a big disadvantage on gravel. So better tires are the only advantage they get to ca compensate.


This is actually the first rally in a long while where there is little to fight for on Sunday. The standard the last few years has actually been that there is a lot of drama. So stop proposing insane changes to something that is working.

[meh]

One more random idea - if we need to create "rally in rally" like PowerStage or "best 3 on Sunday", then maybe (at least on rough and car demanding) rallies are too long with current amount of competitive cars available.

Clearly it's not predictable, if we could have constant fight like we had in Croatia, we could not even have this conversation here.

[KKS]

Neuville starts at 08:33 instead of 08:38 as 1st car at itinerary . Somehow tactics? Or simple co-driver error..

[meh]

Neuville starts at 08:33 instead of 08:38 as 1st car at itinerary . Somehow tactics? Or simple co-driver error..

In general feels quite dangerous if you have rally car with full speed on stage 5min earlier than anyone expects.

[meh]

Seems that Neuville did quite a push on Fafe 1 - first on the road and stage win.

[dimviii]

close call for young French
https://twitter.com/GiecoNoe/status/1396374371413921792

[rallyfiend]

Neuville starts at 08:33 instead of 08:38 as 1st car at itinerary . Somehow tactics? Or simple co-driver error..

This for sure is a significant safety error from the organiser. I'm surprised the timing system would allow this to happen.

Definitely not an error of the competitor.

[denkimi]

Fresh tyres for PS would be a sensible thing. Put a remote tyre changing zone just before PS, perhaps even combine it with regroup.

Or they could give points for every stage win on sunday. 5 stages, 5 points to gain.

[Päss1928]

Fresh tyres for PS would be a sensible thing. Put a remote tyre changing zone just before PS, perhaps even combine it with regroup.



What would the fresh tires for PS change though? It would still not give the super-rally guys any more motivation to push - why take more risk if you have nothing to gain. Just cruise through to be able to start the PS. Points for every stage win, or points for fastest of the day has more merit imo. Want to see action on every stage then give them something to fight for on every stage.

[Rallyper]

This for sure is a significant safety error from the organiser. I'm surprised the timing system would allow this to happen.

Definitely not an error of the competitor.

I have old (?) itinerary saying 8:30 for Fafe1... Maybe they used that one?

[mknight]

As mentioned how would fresh tires for PS change much today?

Neuville and Tanak would not drive in road mode, but surely they wouldn't push much either. Ogier or any of the other guys wouldn't push more either

The only big difference would be that Tanak/Neuville wouldn't have any tire advantage for PS. But they already have a road order disadvantage.

[meh]

So, probably the best chance to catch stage win by M-Sport drivers is on that stage...

[denkimi]

What would the fresh tires for PS change though? It would still not give the super-rally guys any more motivation to push - why take more risk if you have nothing to gain. Just cruise through to be able to start the PS. Points for every stage win, or points for fastest of the day has more merit. Want to see action on every stage then give them something to fight for on every stage.
It would make them drive at a fast but safe pace instead of grandma-going-to-the-market-on-sunday pace.

It's not as if those guys like driving this slow. For spectators it would make a noticable difference.

[meh]

Btw, how it's going with your pickems? You had Katsuta, Fourmaux and Greensmith all in Top6? :)

[Tauri_J]

Sunday has become a save ryres for powerstage day.
To bad really, take away good fights tha could have been.

5 points is way too muvh for a PS win in 3 classes. That means almost everyone on the list will try to keep staus quo on the rally, to fight for "easy" PS poimts.

Something needs to be done about this!

Points for every stage, been saying this for a while

[Franky]

Points for every stage, been saying this for a while

Points for every stage win, points for longest jumps, biggest air time, for the longest power slide, the coolest livery (car, overalls, helmets) and for the best stage end comments.

It's not a gigantic rally sprint.

[Tauri_J]

I think you got a little carried away with your analogy.

Points for every stage would remove sunday's episodes of granny driving to the store. We would also see drivers pushing more on fridays and saturdays.

[mknight]

Points for every stage would fundamentally change the nature of rallying.

Win from 2km SSS by 0.1s should give same points as win by 30s on 30km stage? Obviously not. So you given different points depending on stage length? Well that's almost the same as using time and much less logical.

How about a situation where a driver gets a big lead early? Should he be "punished" for that and forced to push vs crashed out drivers that have nothing to loose?

What could be done is "support"/"additional" points per day. But those only need to be a small fraction of total points, and then the question is if they have any real effects or if they just confuse point counting.(some local championships have those, can't say I see much effect there)

[AnttiL]

Sunday has become a save ryres for powerstage day.
To bad really, take away good fights tha could have been.


How fast people forget? Just the preious rally in Croatia was a crazy three way fight for the win up to the last corner of the rally! Sometimes it's like this and sometimes like that. But nothing fundamentally wrong in the rules.

[AnttiL]

In addition i would look into killing off Superrally. If You for some reason are out, you are out of the rally.

You would rather have only five WRC's in the rally today? I don't understand this logic.

[AnttiL]

Currently super-rally is actually solving a problem. You can think about removing it when you have 5+ manu teams.

Or service after every stage. Or even mid-stage like in the 80's.

[AnttiL]

Btw, how it's going with your pickems? You had Katsuta, Fourmaux and Greensmith all in Top6? :)

My 6-7-8 were Fourmaux, Lappi and Suninen :) However I put Katsuta only 5th

[meh]

Just some thoughts - extra points per stage win, power stage, extra point for Sunday etc are for entertainment for spectators and for extra drama.

Rally is "marathon". Should marathon (42.1km running) have extra medals for "last 10km", "every 1km in last 10km", "best finish" etc point? Probably not. If someone ran away with first 10km, then this is how it is for rest of the marathon.

[EstWRC]

me reading all the proposals here

http://www.rallifoorum.ee/foorum/download/file.php?id=713

[mknight]

Camilli and Bulacia start after all WRCs and they have a really good chance for PS points (see first pass).

Similar to Monte with Gryazin and Solberg, but then they didn't score points.

Kinda inevitable consequence of good WRC2 competition and wish to show WRC2 crews on TV. ( In Arctic, they "fixed" this by running all of them after WRCs)

[EstWRC]

Thierry and Ott should have very good chances, starting from 6th and 8th

lets see

[meh]

Time to fill waiting with PowerStage predictions:
1. Tänak
2. Neuville
3. Ogier
4. Rovanperä
5. Evans

[EstWRC]

Kaur crash https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PeytPwCj7Tc

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Solid rally by Suninen.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Congrats EP - excellent victory.

[Lead]

VW looks really smooth here.

[Katvala]

Well done Lappi! https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210523/f8b53be5e8146eb479bc17ecd46cbcd6.jpg

Sent from my F8331 using Tapatalk

[EstWRC]

Lappi class of his own at the moment in WRC2

[Jewy46]

Lappi excellent again.

M-Sport could do worse than put him as number 1 in the team for 2022 now that none of the top drivers appear to be available.
I know if I was Rich Millener/Malcolm Wilson that's what I'd be doing.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Think thats the PS win for Tanak.

[EstWRC]

that was quite a ride from both Hyundai guys

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Nice jump by Fourmaux, learning from this morning.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Very good rally by Greensmith, decent pace and no mistakes.

[Jewy46]

Great drive by Katsuta, prob worthy of driver of the rally considering his battle with Ogier.

Definitely not seen as a second rate token driver anymore!

[EstWRC]

Evans slower than Ogier, so Ogier must clean the road again in Sardegna it seems if Evans suddenly doesnt up his pace

[meh]

Time to fill waiting with PowerStage predictions:
1. Tänak
2. Neuville
3. Ogier
4. Rovanperä
5. Evans

100% :)

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Brilliant consistent drive Elfyn. Great win.

[meh]

Great drive by Katsuta, prob worthy of driver of the rally considering his battle with Ogier.

Definitely not seen as a second rate token driver anymore!

Taka did really good job, but just need to take in account, he did not fight with Ogier for 1st place, Ogier was way out of his usual pace.

[dimviii]

Congrats to Evans Martin,well deserved victory.
Also congrats to Lappi,clearly faster and no mistakes at all

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210523/4951f1b5dacd04530a64aae1f894d013.jpg

[Rally Hokkaido]

Congrats Elfyn and also to Dani. In many ways both are similar in their consistent WRC performances and putting up reliable results. No doubt that is why their respective teams choose them as second or third driver. OK, Elfyn could have been Champion, last year, but I'm sure he wasn't drafted in to the Toyota team with that in mind.

[EstWRC]

Congrats Evans, consistent drive like always

really gutted for Tänak (last without technical problems gravel rally was Estonia for him) but gave a strong warning for his competitors on gravel at least. Said he hasnt felt this good in one and a half years.

Sordo showing again that he is the best 3rd driver in the series IMO.

Ogier being Ogier again but his pace is a little worrying, from the body language it seems for him too.

Very good showing again from the youngsters apart from Loubet.

Like i already said, Lappi in his own class in WRC2 at the moment.

[mknight]

Lappi class of his own at the moment in WRC2

After friday he had same time as Suninen and 2s ahead of his teammate Gryazin who drove Portugal for first time. That's even after Østberg got a puncture from same time.

Then Gryazin immediatelly hit engine issues and Suninen dropped 15s before running into multiple issues of his own.

Great drive by Lappi and staying out of trouble, but nothing like Arctic.

Wonder what they plan next. For WRC2 championship they have to do a round outside of Europe (so Safari or Japan), which is expensive. For getting WRC drive (which surely is the goal) he should do some tarmac and not just Estonia/Finland where "everyone" expects he will be fast.

[mknight]

Bulacia and Camilli 2nd and 3rd on PS from that spot after WRCs.

[EstWRC]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E2EoQP0WYAUj9WT?format=jpg&name=large
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E2EoRMAXEAIurZQ?format=jpg&name=large

[dimviii]

Ogier's rant: "Making a regulation for losers, that was never my vision"

"I feel annoyed but that's the usual feeling after opening days. Those kind of days are very long. What Neuville did today is not bad. It is sure he was a little faster than me starting second but that makes a difference compared to the first place. He certainly drives faster than me throughout the day. About thirty seconds separate us: I think that twenty are due to our positions, "slipped the reigning world champion to Olivier Gaspard, RTBF special correspondent in Sardinia.

And to conclude, in a tone that sticks to his annoyance: "What do I hope for tomorrow? That the weekend is over and we go home. My speech is the same as last year, ca This has been going on for several years. This is not the vision I have of sport. Making a regulation for the losers (editor's note: the losers), that was never my vision. But that's how it is ... "

https://www.rtbf.be/sport/moteurs/rallye/wrc/detail_le-coup-de-gueule-d-ogier-faire-un-reglement-pour-les-losers-ca-n-a-jamais-ete-ma-vision?id=9629948

[dupanton]

Veiby suspended for 6 months of wrc events for breaching Covid rules. Anders son also 3 months. They left Portugal and went to Spain. Also didn't declare a risk contact with a positive person.

[Andre Oliveira]

Mayr-Melnhof and Welsersheimb rolled. Heli transportation to hospital

Pic: Maciej Niechwiadowicz

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E2EzMbIXsAECSeG?format=jpg&name=medium

[TWRC]

Mayr-Melnhof and Welsersheimb rolled. Heli transportation to hospital

Pic: Maciej Niechwiadowicz

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E2EzMbIXsAECSeG?format=jpg&name=medium

Looks very similar to a crash that happened here exactly like this some years ago. That was a Fabia R5 if I remember well. Hopefully they are not injured.

Edit: looked it up, it was Gilbert in 2017 with a Fabia.

[Andre Oliveira]

The clip. Very hard impact

https://twitter.com/ewrcresults/status/1396477503389192195?s=21

[dimviii]

Veiby

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E2FRKA9WQAsla40?format=jpg&name=large

[krissucool]

Anyone has a count of how many rallies Tänak has lost from a leading position due to crash, tyre failure or mechanical failure?

[meh]

Anyone has a count of how many rallies Tänak has lost from a leading position due to crash, tyre failure or mechanical failure?

I had the same question in my head, but I think it's not always that clear - like are those damages or failures with car caused by some rough driving or they are just failures. Like small avoidable mistakes here and there which results later with some failure. And then we may have endless discussion, should car be just stronger or driver should take care of car the way it reach to finish.

As fan of Tänak (like usual Estonian), the count is anyway "too big".

[mknight]

At VW Latvala's car was always breaking down while the other 2 weren't.

[Mirek]

And then we may have endless discussion, should car be just stronger or driver should take care of car the way it reach to finish

That question has actually an easy answer. When the driver drives the car, it already exists and therefore the driver has to take into account its limits ;)

[Eli]

When you think about it, Neuviile lost here a potential win because if not for his accident, and considering Tanak's car would still fail, Neuville would achieve another win which could've propelled him to the championship lead. But again, a lot of if's and but's in this championship doesn't win you a championship. Really impressive form from Katsuta & Greensmith, hopefully they'll continue with that pace, as for Sordo, 4 months away from the car and 7 months since his win last year to get his best ever result here, pretty impressive, Ogier as always, knows how to take the maximum from each weekend, Bring on Sardegna!

[krissucool]

I had the same question in my head, but I think it's not always that clear - like are those damages or failures with car caused by some rough driving or they are just failures. Like small avoidable mistakes here and there which results later with some failure. And then we may have endless discussion, should car be just stronger or driver should take care of car the way it reach to finish.

As fan of Tänak (like usual Estonian), the count is anyway "too big".

Yeah, I am not even thinking that he is so unproportionally unlucky but rather that the events he has lost due to mistakes of with his, the cars or a combination of both seems massive.

Just from the top of my head: Poland 2016, Portugal 2017, Poland 2017? (Dont remember if he was leading),Finland 2017, GB 2018, Catalunya 2018, Sardegna 2019, Tour de Corse 2019, Portugal 2021.

[mknight]

Well Neuville lost at least 3 championships due to his crashes:
2017 - MC, SWE, GER
2019 - CHIl, TUR
2020 - EST, MONZA

[mknight]

I see I forgot 2018 Australia, last crash was a desperate attempt, but hus first crash on friday was definitely a mistake.

[EstWRC]

great vid https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ILrBqnSkU0s

[KKS]

I have old (?) itinerary saying 8:30 for Fafe1... Maybe they used that one?
But rest of cars running by "8:38 itinerary" and it's a 8min time gap on a stage between 1st and 2nd cars

[Pršljen]

Well, Ogier doesn't crash and that's why he is multiple WDC and Neuville and Tanak aren't. We can talk about cars, issues and so on but it all comes down to this.

[EstWRC]

Well, Ogier doesn't crash and that's why he is multiple WDC and Neuville and Tanak aren't. We can talk about cars, issues and so on but it all comes down to this.

Tänaks last crash was Monte 2020, while Ogiers was Arctic this year and Neuville on this rally. Before Monte 2020, the last crash Tänak had was in Australia 2018. In 17 he definitely lost the title due his own mistakes (Finland, Poland, France, Portugal)

But in 2018 I would say Tänak definitely lost the title due technical/mechanical failures. Kind off also in 2020, kind off because we can also say he lost the title due to Monte crash and 0 points but he also had technical failures again in Turkey and Sardegna where he didnt get many points, which was very vital which such a short season.

[EstWRC]

Best of by Passats De Canto https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDBH2__w3M4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DjZAthzRKsE

[Fredouye]

Ogier's rant: "Making a regulation for losers, that was never my vision"

"I feel annoyed but that's the usual feeling after opening days. Those kind of days are very long. What Neuville did today is not bad. It is sure he was a little faster than me starting second but that makes a difference compared to the first place. He certainly drives faster than me throughout the day. About thirty seconds separate us: I think that twenty are due to our positions, "slipped the reigning world champion to Olivier Gaspard, RTBF special correspondent in Sardinia.

And to conclude, in a tone that sticks to his annoyance: "What do I hope for tomorrow? That the weekend is over and we go home. My speech is the same as last year, ca This has been going on for several years. This is not the vision I have of sport. Making a regulation for the losers (editor's note: the losers), that was never my vision. But that's how it is ... "

https://www.rtbf.be/sport/moteurs/rallye/wrc/detail_le-coup-de-gueule-d-ogier-faire-un-reglement-pour-les-losers-ca-n-a-jamais-ete-ma-vision?id=9629948

Article from 2017 ;)

[EstWRC]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZlA5mu3xZU

[Ds3]

It is not normal in this competition and such a high pace for Tanak to beat them for 5 minutes per section. This means that he does not know how to protect his car. That is why his results will be like this. Most stop at the very turn only Ott comes to one side from the middle of the line. I apologize, but there is no car to withstand it, he is to blame for most of the dropouts. He will have to change his style because of poor Hyundai .... I apologize for my English ....

[EstWRC]

It is not normal in this competition and such a high pace for Tanak to beat them for 5 minutes per section. This means that he does not know how to protect his car. That is why his results will be like this. Most stop at the very turn only Ott comes to one side from the middle of the line. I apologize, but there is no car to withstand it, he is to blame for most of the dropouts. He will have to change his style because of poor Hyundai .... I apologize for my English ....

really?

i remember very clearly Tommi saying in an interview back in 18 or 19 that when Ott comes back to the service with the car it looks good and well held.

of course he could lie too.

[meh]

It is not normal in this competition and such a high pace for Tanak to beat them for 5 minutes per section. This means that he does not know how to protect his car. That is why his results will be like this. Most stop at the very turn only Ott comes to one side from the middle of the line. I apologize, but there is no car to withstand it, he is to blame for most of the dropouts. He will have to change his style because of poor Hyundai .... I apologize for my English ....

are you really sure that you know exactly what you are talking about?

[krissucool]

I dont know. It seems weird for me that for every rally Tänak has won there is at least 1 if not more where he has either crashed, had tyre failures costing him the win or technical issue.

The same with Hyundai, the big advantage for Hyundai compared to Toyota was supposed to be reliability. Somehow Tänak has had technical problems now in 3 out of the 5 gravel rallies he has raced with Hyundai.

Meanwhile suddenly Ogier has 1 and Evans 0 (if I am not forgetting anything) with Toyota.

Also seems crazy Ogier, driving with so many different manufacturers has so few of these technical issues with each car.

How many rallies has Ogier lost from a leading position due to crash, tyre or mechanical failure? Dont think we can compare the rate of wins to lost wins ratio with Tänak. When Ogier is comfortably leading a rally you basically know he will win it.

With Tänak you always have that feeling there is at least a 25-30% chance of something going horribly wrong.

[mknight]

Ogier does drive much less sideways than others on gravel. Would think that has an effect on the mechanical parts.

After Tanak came to Hyundai the behaviour of the car changed a lot. From hard-brick like suspension into much more "moving/diving" like Toyota was before that. It seems like this made the Hyundai much faster in faster gravel rallies, but maybe also more vulnerable to mechanical damage from rough surface.

There was also a nice comparison of Sordo and Evans om the last stage before PS where Evans goes "slowly" with a hint of understeed into corner and then a bit of power-oversteer out. Sordo was entering every corner sideways.

[bomber21]

I think Sordo’s style is this no matter what car he is driving.

[dimviii]

another angle from the Fafe crash
https://twitter.com/eWRCresults/status/1396559059860533249

[dimviii]

here is also NikiMayrMelnhof roll
https://twitter.com/SaariJarno/status/1396559615744151558

[denkimi]

It doesn't matter how much stronger the cars will be build, drivers will just hit things harder and break them anyway.

Knowing when to back off is perhaps the most important thing any driver should be able to. Going over that big rock might instead of avoiding it might save you a tenth of a second, but it might just as wel wreck your car.

I have noticed how some drivers make notes to try and avoid things like big potholes or dangerous rocks, while others just stick to the perfect line and expect the material to be able to handle it.

[EstWRC]

Ogier does drive much less sideways than others on gravel. Would think that has an effect on the mechanical parts.


maybe less sideways, def not much IMO. (yeah much compared to Gus, Sordo and etc)

our rally legend here in Estonia said that Ogier and Tänak are the two smoothest and tidiest on gravel. I remember he said it last year before Mexico when asked about his prediction for that rally (he put Ogier and Tänak 1-2 for that reason) and in the end Ogier and Tänak were 1-2 on that rally.

[Ds3]

maybe less sideways, def not much IMO. (yeah much compared to Gus, Sordo and etc)

our rally legend here in Estonia said that Ogier and Tänak are the two smoothest and tidiest on gravel. I remember he said it last year before Mexico when asked about his prediction for that rally (he put Ogier and Tänak 1-2 for that reason) and in the end Ogier and Tänak were 1-2 on that rally.

That's right, but the problem is that rallies like Portugal, where there are many surprises, need compromises. Portugal's speed is very high and the tracks are very deep. I do not give advice, this is just my opinion ...

[AnttiL]

Yes, Tänak definitely learned a lot from Ogier in 2017 and his style became tidier. But I would say Ogier is the master of preserving the tyres and also preserving the components of the car by controlling the braking and handling of the car in detail that most other drivers cannot achieve. That surely must make a difference in not having as much mechanical failures (compared to Latvala who only has two positions on the throttle and brake)

It's true that Tänak's weekend was so much like on Toyota in 2018. He's constantly fastest but the car doesn't withstand the pace although a distinct driving mistake didn't occur. Anyway I was happy to see Tänak feeling again natural in the car for the first time since 2019.

[SubaruNorway]

Is it not some of this bedrock that Tänak hits?
Seems to be a bit closer than the others and it always looks smaller than it is on these pixelated onboards

[dimviii]

https://i.postimg.cc/kgXjC7nY/FB-IMG-1621833660767.jpg

[dimviii]

WRC Portugal, Andrea Adamo: "Neuville's mistake? It can happen ... he's a guy who always comes back stronger"

"The analysis of the weekend is easy to establish: we have shown that the speed of the car is there, that the constant work done by the team pays off. However, we were not able to reduce certain points to the home. The feedback from the drivers on the performance of the car is positive, I take that point too. I have already spoken to the team, I thanked the guys because I know how hard they work. I am happy to work with such a strong team, "said Andrea Adamo at our microphone at the end of the event.



"There are 12 races in a season. Neuville's mistake, it can happen so. I'm not worried, Neuville is a guy who always comes back stronger. For Tanak, I don't know. I don't want to take defense of someone, but that sort of thing must not happen. We will analyze all this, I am sure that we will have provided the necessary work before Sardinia. In our situation, we must do a very good rally there. I am confident in the fact that we have a team capable of winning everywhere. I am not a guy who gives up, I do not intend to do it this time either ", continued the boss of the Hyundai Motorsport team.

https://www.rtbf.be/sport/moteurs/rallye/wrc/detail_wrc-portugal-andrea-adamo-l-erreur-de-neuville-ca-peut-arriver-c-est-un-mec-qui-revient-toujours-plus-fort?id=10767887

[meh]

Katsuta slapped a tree:
https://twitter.com/voiceofrally/status/1396779773456699392

[dimviii]

Katsuta slapped a tree:
https://twitter.com/voiceofrally/status/1396779773456699392

very lucky escape!

[dimviii]

Κatsuta nice jump
https://twitter.com/RPHSportPhoto/status/1396843123209379841

[dimviii]

Colin Clark’s 2021 Rally Portugal driver ratings

There were plenty of standout performances and one big disappointment on the fourth round of 2021

https://dirtfish.com/rally/colin-clarks-2021-rally-portugal-driver-ratings/

[mknight]

I only have an objection to Fourmaux, but actually not so much to the rating itself (7 or 8 is ok), rating and performance is fine given the starting point.
It's the text itself that I'd object to. His performance in Portugal was definitely not more impressive than Croatia. In Croatia he has shown that he can drive at a speed just behind the top 4 (Rovanpera didn't post times) on tarmac.

In Portugal while doing good he also confirmed that there is still some learning to do before he can do the same on gravel. He did good time on SS3 (with road cleaning advantage) and on Sunday morning with 2 WRC cars pushing, else was always slowest WRC. Again it's good performance with his starting point, but he really should be given more opportunities to improve on gravel. If the funding is for 2 gravel rounds in R5 or one in WRC I'd say he should do R5.

--------------------------

I also like that Dirtfish point out Gryazin as a surprise and I totally agree. After Friday he was 2.2s behind Suninen and Lappi (in same car!) and seemingly didn't have any moments like he is known for, then the engine issues hit. Anyway huge difference compared with his 2020 performances and also seemingly much more safe than the multiple moments and crash in Croatia.

[denkimi]

Does anyone actually know what happened to loubet? I have not seen any reason for his DNF so far, nor any images or video's of a crash or the car afterwards.

[PLuto]

Does anyone actually know what happened to loubet? I have not seen any reason for his DNF so far, nor any images or video's of a crash or the car afterwards.

Reason for his retirement was crash.

[dimviii]

here is also NikiMayrMelnhof roll
https://twitter.com/SaariJarno/status/1396559615744151558

Niki was already able to leave the hospital today.
Poldi is due out on Wednesday.
Both are shaken and have big bruises.
Many thanks to everyone for all the calls, messages and wishes.
Niki and Poldi send their greetings to all fans and friends and thank you for the encouragement

[mknight]

Does anyone actually know what happened to loubet? I have not seen any reason for his DNF so far, nor any images or video's of a crash or the car afterwards.

The only thing we know is that he went out way below the road and that the car was too damaged to continue. I think Julian Porter said he saw it on Saturday and that it looked heavily damaged.

[denkimi]

The only thing we know is that he went out way below the road and that the car was too damaged to continue. I think Julian Porter said he saw it on Saturday and that it looked heavily damaged.
Weird to see that there seems to be no footage what so ever. I would assume he has onboard camera's and at least someone must have whitnessed the wreckage.

[Fitz]

I don’t often reply but follow this forum regularly but a couple of points worth making & related are that Ott has obviously ‘bounced’ off a compression in the stage & broken the suspension which has obviously bottomed out & thus broke. A similar situation to Monte in ‘20 as that’s what sent him off the road then also. It reminds me of the C3 & when Kris bounced it off into a car park in Mexico 🤔

Of course there’s an advantage to running lower & maybe that’s where Otts speed came from on Saturday.

[EstWRC]

maybe...we will never know because for that one of us should work in the team.

After the rally he said to Estonian media that finally the hard and long work with engineers is starting pay off, so i think it means something else than just lowering the car.

[EstWRC]

well basically the same interview for Dirtfish published today https://dirtfish.com/rally/wrc/tanak-starting-to-find-feeling-from-toyota-years/

[br21]

I saw Loubets car after the crash and it was quite heavily damaged.

[EstWRC]

if you want to win a PS stage, make a little siesta before it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nO5UKg6hg3E

[AnttiL]

I saw Loubets car after the crash and it was quite heavily damaged.

It's still weird we haven't heard an official explanation or seen any pictures.

Loubet had a really bad rally, his time on SS1 was really slow and he seemed to be upset upon seeing the times, and then crashing already on SS2 with no chance to restart.

[henzo]

i doubt its just about lowering the car, otherwise it wouldnt have taken 1.5 years?
hyundai has had pretty catastrophic suspension failure before too (neuville front suspension through the hood, also not driver induced) so it could just be that tänak found another weakpoint of the hyundai, good that it came before kenya :D

[mknight]

hyundai has had pretty catastrophic suspension failure before too (neuville front suspension through the hood, also not driver induced) so it could just be that tänak found another weakpoint of the hyundai, good that it came before kenya :D

That failure in Turkey 2018 was due to a mechanic error in service. Mikkelsens driveshaft failure on same rally was supposedly also due to mechanic error (some screws were missing).
Nandan said one or more people were kicked afterwards.
Arguably without any of those two issues Hyundai would have won manu championship that year.

[steve.mandzij]

It's still weird we haven't heard an official explanation or seen any pictures.

Loubet had a really bad rally, his time on SS1 was really slow and he seemed to be upset upon seeing the times, and then crashing already on SS2 with no chance to restart.I had higher expectations for him than for Gus Greensmith going into the year, but so far he's done nothing but go backwards. He needs a miracle to get back on track.

Sent from my Pixel 3a using Tapatalk

[mknight]

I wonder how his performance would change if he would run something closer to current spec car (for example Estonia 2020 spec). Like Solberg did in Arctic.

We'll see if this spec difference will continue on Sardinia.

[AnttiL]

I wonder how his performance would change if he would run something closer to current spec car (for example Estonia 2020 spec). Like Solberg did in Arctic.

We'll see if this spec difference will continue on Sardinia.

Portugal and Sardegna should be paired events, same chassises. Although if Loubet binned his Portugal car, they can offer a new one?

[bluuford]

Yes, if you retire, you can take new. There is also limit for the season

[EstWRC]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u7XprdVW1wo

[dimviii]

Νeuville at 7,02!^^

[AnttiL]

Yes, if you retire, you can take new. There is also limit for the season

Yeah, I meant that maybe the new one comes with newest parts?

[dimviii]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E2QhFRTXIAgIvbB?format=jpg&name=large
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E2QhG1lXsAU1u3l?format=jpg&name=4096x4096

[bluuford]

Yeah, I meant that maybe the new one comes with newest parts?

I think it depends on his contract and availability of old and new parts.

[TypeR]

Hopefully he gets new ,,please stay on the road'' parts..

[pantealex]

Yeah, I meant that maybe the new one comes with newest parts?

Portugal and Sardinia are still paired so even with "new chassis" he has to use same old components
or
Take big time penalty ( 5min ? )

[TypeR]

Loubet
https://www.upload.ee/image/13176635/20210526_102420.jpg

[bluuford]

Portugal and Sardinia are still paired so even with "new chassis" he has to use same old components
or
Take big time penalty ( 5min ? )

If you retire, no penalty, retirement is already penalty.

[pantealex]

If you retire, no penalty, retirement is already penalty.

Well, NO

If you change your engine between paired rallies you get 5min penalty (that has happened like many here now)

[EstWRC]

Tänak vs Evans: Onboard Comparation ⚔️ WRC Vodafone Rally de Portugal

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O8dUXruEii8

[mknight]

From SSS.....

[1988senna]

Guys . Scott Martin said the co driver's job on gravel is much easier than the tarmac . is that true ?? why for that?

[Mirek]

Guys . Scott Martin said the co driver's job on gravel is much easier than the tarmac . is that true ?? why for that?

IMHO You need to deliver a lot more information on asphalt, be more precize and do a lot more corrections in the notes. The main reason being much greater variety of grip in places and a need to be as smooth and tidy along the optimal line as possible. Also in some events the road changes greatly from first to second run and so does the optimal line.

[AnttiL]

Also the tarmac is more unforgiving, the movements in the car are harder. Also you need to add in the gravel crew notes.

[dimviii]

The Rovanperä mystery explained

Rovanperä's Rally Portugal was on the up when he suddenly pulled out without explanation. DirtFish now has the answers

https://dirtfish.com/rally/wrc/the-rovanpera-mystery-explained/