[WRC] News & Rumours 2018

[Fast Eddie WRC]

If Ogier loses the 2018 Championship by a few points it could be said that running first in Sweden cost him the Title. Is that fair, will it give the new champion credibility as the best ?

[focus206]

If Ogier loses the 2018 Championship by a few points it could be said that running first in Sweden cost him the Title. Is that fair, will it give the new champion credibility as the best ?

I don't see how is that unfair. If there wasn't as much snow, he would have been fine with it. A lot of snow? Well, tough luck, it happens. He wasn't the only one to suffer from it, Latvala and Tanak had a hard time dealing with it as well. In Mexico it's Neuville's turn to swipe the road.

[Franky]

If Ogier loses the 2018 Championship by a few points it could be said that running first in Sweden cost him the Title. Is that fair, will it give the new champion credibility as the best ?

Life is a bitch

[mknight]

If Ogier loses the 2018 Championship by a few points it could be said that running first in Sweden cost him the Title. Is that fair, will it give the new champion credibility as the best ?

If he didn't win Monte he wouldn't have to go first in Sweden... but wouldn't have so many points from Monte.

With different rules he maybe wouldn't start first in Sweden... but that means he also wouldn't start first on Monte. If he didn't start first in in Monte he'd loose some time during first leg due to gravel on the road... and that means he'd not run as "last" WRC in the snow on Saturday and wouldn't be able to get 1 min up on Tanak and 30s on Latvala.

...
Should we go on like this for every rally?

[Mirek]

If Ogier loses the 2018 Championship by a few points it could be said that running first in Sweden cost him the Title. Is that fair, will it give the new champion credibility as the best ?

Yes, of course. The one who copes with the circumstances best is the best.

[Simmi]

If Ogier loses the 2018 Championship by a few points it could be said that running first in Sweden cost him the Title. Is that fair, will it give the new champion credibility as the best ?

13-round championship Eddie.

[steve.mandzij]

If Ogier loses the 2018 Championship by a few points it could be said that running first in Sweden cost him the Title. Is that fair, will it give the new champion credibility as the best ?100% fair. Sainz and Hirvonen lost titles to mechanical failures, and that was fair. Latvala's car killed itself three times in a row while he was in the championship fight, and that was fair. There was a dusting of snow on the stages in Sweden, and that was fair.

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[N.O.T]

just a friendly reminder... you are arguing with british people....

you can continue now...

[Timmy]

100% fair. Sainz and Hirvonen lost titles to mechanical failures, and that was fair. Latvala's car killed itself three times in a row while he was in the championship fight, and that was fair. There was a dusting of snow on the stages in Sweden, and that was fair.

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What you are doing is comparing something that can't be foreseen to something that could be avoided by adjusting the rules.


I think there are a couple of things we are not giving the right attention

1) Rules does not penalize always the same driver, they penalize the first crew in the general ranking.

2) Rules does not penalize always the crew who open the road. As said before Monte, Germany, Corsica, Galles, Sweden with few snow and every gravel rally with rain are an advantage for that crew. It means that in almost 5 events out of 13 there is not a penalization. It is 40% of the whole championship, it's not exceptional.
The difference is that at these events nobody at the end of the road order is crying the hell out of him at the end of the stages.

3) As we all said Sweden was exceptional, in normal condition on gravel rallies the leading driver will sufer from road order mainly in the first 3 stages of the first leg. Friday afternoon is quite better and on saturday the situation is much more balanced. In 2014, Ogier was capable to win a lot of events with these rules, even Sardinia.


The fact that it doesn't always penalize the same driver is irrelevant. The fact that the first crew in general ranking, whoever they might be, is getting the short end of the stick is where the problem lies.
Albeit Sweden was an extreme case it did shift the focus a little to the bigger underlying problem in my eyes.
If there is something that can be done to improve the current system then it should be done.

To N.O.T - If it's targeted at me, then no, I'm not British. I don't see why it would matter anyhow. Is there a saying I'm not aware of?

[N.O.T]

To N.O.T - If it's targeted at me, then no, I'm not British. I don't see why it would matter anyhow. Is there a saying I'm not aware of?

no kid it wasn't.

but it would matter a lot if you were... it would explain a lot as well....

[stefanvv]

Actually not. Current rules are fair as well - simply because they are given and fixed well ahead so everyone knows how they work. They make it tougher for the leading crew for sure but for every leading crew. It doesn't matter which one it is at the given moment. They have to cope with the same conditions - and that is fair.

Fair to who? For the 15% of the current wrc drivers who can actually lead the championship for the first 2-3 rallies, or fair to the rest of them 85% so they can have a chance to win a rally or 2? Just the drivers know how the rules are ahead doesn't make them fair. Or You suggest who doesn't like to rules just to quit? May be its bit extreme, but what lies under the "fair" concept? Everybody are under the same rules, yes sure, but that doesn't make them fair for the ones who are actually are already on top of the board. It is uneven handicap for them.

Current WRC cars rules already are enough equalizing all drivers, why we need to stick with these ancient running order rules? The sport needs refreshing, the 1st part - cars is already done, the other must come accordingly.

[Mirek]

The fact that the first crew in general ranking, whoever they might be, is getting the short end of the stick is where the problem lies.

In rallying everytime someone has to get the short end off the stick. Everytime. Do You really believe that it's better idea to make the life even worse for those who struggle even without it?


Fair to who? For the 15% of the current wrc drivers who can actually lead the championship for the first 2-3 rallies, or fair to the rest of them 85% so they can have a chance to win a rally or 2? Just the drivers know how the rules are ahead doesn't make them fair. Or You suggest who doesn't like to rules just to quit? May be its bit extreme, but what lies under the "fair" concept? Everybody are under the same rules, yes sure, but that doesn't make them fair for the ones who are actually are already on top of the board. It is uneven handicap for them.

Someone has to take the handicap. There is no way how to avoid that. Do You believe that those who struggle even without that shall bear the handicap to have zero chance instead of at least some chance? Tell me why is that better and why it's more fair.

[stefanvv]

Someone has to take the handicap. There is no way how to avoid that. Do You believe that those who struggle even without that shall bear the handicap to have zero chance instead of at least some chance? Tell me why is that better and why it's more fair.

You know I'm big supporter of the underdogs. But is it fair to them to take some advantage, because the faster ones are handicapped? How is that in their favor, and how is that in favor of the spectators? Just because they like variety in the winner board. Then they don't understand the sport and just watching the show?!?

[Mirek]

You know I'm big supporter of the underdogs. But is it fair to them to take some advantage, because the faster ones are handicapped? How is that in their favor, and how is that in favor of the spectators? Just because they like variety in the winner board. Then they don't understand the sport and just watching the show?!?

A qeuestion is not an answer. Why is it more fair to chose the slow guys everytime instead of the fast guys sometimes (current rules don't penalize them in every round)?

[Franky]

Any news or rumours?

[stefanvv]

A qeuestion is not an answer.

It was a rhetoric. You know we just keep asking ourselves the same stupid question, and the answer is in the question.

[Timmy]

In rallying everytime someone has to get the short end off the stick. Everytime. Do You really believe that it's better idea to make the life even worse for those who struggle even without it?




A qeuestion is not an answer. Why is it more fair to chose the slow guys everytime instead of the fast guys sometimes (current rules don't penalize them in every round)?

It's hard to make sense of your arguments here. Rallying isn't a kindergarten sports day where everybody should get a prize just for attending.
You want to be at the top? Work for it!
Since the cars are so closely matched and the top drivers are as close as ever, the old rules are just taking away from the excitement and the fight.

[ESTR]

True. And they get payed for that a lot more than we make in our jobs. So it's right that it should be hard. It's worth it.

[Mirek]

Since the cars are so closely matched and the top drivers are as close as ever, the old rules are just taking away from the excitement and the fight.

It's the rules You fight against which makes it look like that.

[steve.mandzij]

When the same driver has been winning titles for the past five years with all the methods you people propose you notice there's no need for change. The best win regardless.

Also, QS, while fair, made for very dull 2013-2015(?) seasons for anyone not a VW fan. 2016 was a total witchunt against Ogier and he still won the title comfortably. Just because he had a bad rally doesn't mean the rules are wrong. You wouldn't bring back the rule that eliminates the lowest score, would you?

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[seb_sh]

Too much talk about this. We've tried all options and the current rules are the most balanced imo. The only thing they need to change is to apply the penalty for starting late to the stage time instead of directly to the overall, that way they close the loophole for the power stage.

[Andre Oliveira]

Why not a rule to 30kg extra to Seb Ogier?

[tommeke_B]

Why not a rule to 30kg extra to Seb Ogier?
Loeb had it too, in the codrivers seat. Didn't help much. :D

[A FONDO]

Loeb had it too, in the codrivers seat. Didn't help much. :D

But he is too short himself so both together are average total weight.

[seb_sh]

Loeb had it too, in the codrivers seat. Didn't help much. :D

but it was useful that one time in Mexico!

[racerx1979]

True. And they get payed for that a lot more than we make in our jobs. So it's right that it should be hard. It's worth it.

Also means they worked a lot harder than those who make less :)

[stefanvv]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rEdncmqV6VY

[GravelBen]

Also means they worked a lot harder than those who make less :)

Not necessarily, hard work helps but plenty of people work their asses off for much less because of circumstances outside their control.

[Toyoda]

I suspect the likes of Paddon, Breen, Evans Suninen, Lappi won't be making much TBH

[racerx1979]

Not necessarily, hard work helps but plenty of people work their asses off for much less because of circumstances outside their control.

Well ESTR is saying rally drivers get paid a lot more so their work should be hard. What I am saying is they are getting paid more because they put a lot of effort and time to get to where they are. That goes with anything in life. Nobody can force you to do anything or control you unless you let them.

[ESTR]

Well ESTR is saying rally drivers get paid a lot more so their work should be hard. What I am saying is they are getting paid more because they put a lot of effort and time to get to where they are. That goes with anything in life. Nobody can force you to do anything...

Well that's why Ogi is complaining if he doesn't get his 10 million on his paycheck. Try working on a post and you will see that you will die your ass out for what.. For nothing. And with so many people behind all these drivers I think that they are the kings and they do what they really want.

[AnttiL]

I haven't been following this discussion anymore for a while...the latest idea is to use the payroll thickness to decide the starting order?

[Rallyper]

So guys, any news or rumours lately?

[stefanvv]

FIA intend to punish Ogier for his arrogance at Rally Sweden by put him at the back of the start order each rally to the rest of the season.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

13-round championship Eddie.

But Sweden has affected the Championship through its own rules and it's own actions or inactions. The other 12 wont.

[steve.mandzij]

But Sweden has affected the Championship through its own rules and it's own actions or inactions. The other 12 wont.How are you so certain? I'm not quite getting how weather can be deemed unfair and a reason for a rule change. Unforseen weather events are a part of rally as much as retiring to unpreventable circumstances.

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[N.O.T]

How are you so certain?

see post 1013 for all the answers you are looking for kid....

[Hartusvuori]

But Sweden has affected the Championship through its own rules and it's own actions or inactions. The other 12 wont.

As far as I know Rally Sweden was ran according to FIA's regulations for WRC events. Championship leader runs first on day 1, as usual. Weather can change, as usual. Weather can be charasteristic to the location, as usual. WRC events run national events between WRC stages, as usual.

[GravelBen]

But Sweden has affected the Championship through its own rules and it's own actions or inactions. The other 12 wont.

Did you really just say the other 12 rounds won't affect the championship?

https://media.giphy.com/media/Zb4Cwdpub5g0U/giphy.gif

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Did you really just say the other 12 rounds won't affect the championship?



Not in the same way, smartass.

Name me another rally that has or will disadvantage the first car so badly and for so long ?

[er88]

Not in the same way, smartass.

Name me another rally that has or will disadvantage the first car so badly and for so long ?Pull yourself together ffs. Even Ogier will have put it behind him now

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[dimviii]

RallySport Magazine
45-year old Italian co-driver, Giovanni Bernacchini, has been appointed Sporting Director of Abarth Racing.

[mknight]

Not in the same way, smartass.

Name me another rally that has or will disadvantage the first car so badly and for so long ?

Using about 2s of thinking.....
Sardinia and Argentina last year. First car on Friday lost a lot and then went into Saturday as one of first again and lost again on top of that.

Turning it around for the late starters.
Late starters in Poland last year lost on Friday morning in mud... and then they had to go first in dry-ish on Saturday and lost again. (Breen as reference here)

It happens all the time. Not sure why Sweden suddenly is supposed to be all that different.

[ToughMac]

This is such a hullabulloo over nothing. If Seb Ogier didn't want to run first on the road in Sweden he didn't 'have to' go and win in Monte Carlo. It is not as if the second round of the championship being in Sweden where it snows a lot was a surprise. He knows the rules as do the rest of them and as ever will be a long season to come.

[Rallyper]

It was psychological for SebO in Sweden. He thought he was beaten even before the rally started. And he then made it happen that way. All by himself.

[kamei]

If Ogier (M-Sport) wants to start later on Day 1 he can actually make late check in. He could be 7 minutes late right at the first stage in Sweden and be 4th on the road. I guess this would also be an option for better chance to fight for more points.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Pull yourself together ffs. Even Ogier will have put it behind him now



Like I'm the only one discussing this...

I dont come on here every day and I have the right to reply to those who have quoted me.

[steve.mandzij]

Like I'm the only one discussing this...

I dont come on here every day and I have the right to reply to those who have quoted me.If M-Sport had finished in the top 5, how would you have reacted?

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[Andre Oliveira]

People are so angry to see a non Sébastien champion that forget how it is unfair since they changed that.

And people forget how tactics and team orders taked a big tool to Loeb reach those 9 titles.

So, as Ford fan, i said: even in VW i was against such rule. By your ideas, KKK never won 4, Tommi same. This is not to be fair, this sport, and the pure best need win! Call him Seb, Thierry or Ott...

[tommeke_B]

And people forget how tactics and team orders taked a big tool to Loeb reach those 9 titles.


Tactics, yes. But team orders? I don't think Loeb ever needed it since he never had a teammate who was faster than him..

[Tarmop]

Tactics, yes. But team orders? I don't think Loeb ever needed it since he never had a teammate who was faster than him..

Umm, Ogier?

[tommeke_B]

Umm, Ogier?

Right, I almost forgot... :D So indeed some team orders for one of the 9 titles.

[SubaruNorway]

Right, I almost forgot... :D So indeed some team orders for one of the 9 titles.

And Sordo backing off on Catalunya 2009 which was quite crucial

[OHL]

Tactics, yes. But team orders? I don't think Loeb ever needed it since he never had a teammate who was faster than him..

Loeb was great but he wasn't invincible.
There were instances where team orders were employed, like this one: https://uk.reuters.com/article/rallying-argentina/rallying-citroen-tell-hirvonen-to-stay-behind-loeb-in-argentina-idUKL4E8FS04B20120428

Also in 2011 Hirvonen narrowly lost out on winning the championship. In Argentina he was only 2.4 seconds behind Loeb at the finish and that one result could have turned the championship to his favor if he had found that time during the rally.

[Mirek]

Umm, Ogier?

Ogier wasn't faster when he was in Citröen. We can say he could challenge Loeb but we can't say he was faster.

[Zeakiwi]

Ogier wasn't faster when he was in Citröen. We can say he could challenge Loeb but we can't say he was faster.

Ogier at least won rallies while driving in the same team as Loeb. Sordo did not.
What years have the points scores been changed and start positions/ qualifying stage etc?

[Tarmop]

Ogier wasn't faster when he was in Citröen. We can say he could challenge Loeb but we can't say he was faster.

You could say that but in the end he was ahead of him several times and he was told to let Loeb pass. So there was quite a bit of tactics.

[Mirek]

You could say that but in the end he was ahead of him several times and he was told to let Loeb pass. So there was quite a bit of tactics.

That still didn't make him faster than Loeb.

[stefanvv]

There were instances where team orders were employed, like this one: https://uk.reuters.com/article/rallying-argentina/rallying-citroen-tell-hirvonen-to-stay-behind-loeb-in-argentina-idUKL4E8FS04B20120428

Uh, I remember this one, he nearly broke his car down 2-3 times before that.

[Zeakiwi]

Paddon interviewwith NZ sport radio -Saturday 3/3 Paddon is back in NZ for the autumn
Paddon discusses Sweden. Bland vanilla interview. Only comment of note id that Paddon hints the car was designed for Neuville's driving style (Mikkelsen' driving style closer to Neuville's than Paddons is too Mikkelsen's)?
http://www.radiolive.co.nz/home/articles/saturday-sport/2018/03/saturday-sport---in-case-you-missed-it.html (Page down to bottom)

[denkimi]

That still didn't make him faster than Loeb.
so you are claiming citroen never asked ogier to slow down to let loeb win because loeb was always faster?

sometimes i think people have actually forgotten why ogier preferred to drive a season in a s2000 car instead of driving a wrc next to loeb.

[N.O.T]

sometimes i think people have actually forgotten why ogier preferred to drive a season in a s2000 car instead of driving a wrc next to loeb.

because he had a contract with VW...

why bother with something that hurts so much ??

[ESTR]

because he had a contract with VW...

Yes true and he develop polo for that reason. Look where he were next for years for that.

[denkimi]

because he had a contract with VW...

you are such a genious. why are you even on this forum instead of solving world hunger?

[Fast Eddie WRC]

People do forget there were some close seasons when Loeb won the title. Also remember the fact that Ford M-Sport won two Manu titles beating Citroen.

[focus206]

People do forget there were some close seasons when Loeb won the title. Also remember the fact that Ford M-Sport won two Manu titles beating Citroen.

People who? I don't see anyone forgetting that. Anyone with a minimal knowledge of recent WRC seasons knows that.

[Mirek]

so you are claiming citroen never asked ogier to slow down to let loeb win because loeb was always faster?

You have a comprehansion problem. First of all I have never claimed Loeb was always faster. Secondly Ogier being few times faster doesn't mean he was the faster driver of the two in that time. Simple as that.

[N.O.T]

you are such a genious. why are you even on this forum instead of solving world hunger?

world hunger is the reason we have normal lives.... in nature someone has to suffer in order for someone else to prosper.

[steve.mandzij]

People do forget there were some close seasons when Loeb won the title. Also remember the fact that Ford M-Sport won two Manu titles beating Citroen.Beat them once when they weren't even a proper manufacturer team and then again when they introduced a brand new car. I'd argue the second Manu title was more valuable than the first (against Citroen, not Kronos) but it's disputable, if not a little likely, Ford had the advantage in 06 and 07.

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[Fast Eddie WRC]

People who? I don't see anyone forgetting that. Anyone with a minimal knowledge of recent WRC seasons knows that.

Just an impression I get whenever Loeb is mentioned... like he and Citroen were winning with virtually no contest.

He and they were great, but Gronholm, Latvala and Hirvonen certainly kept them honest. Watching them in action the speed difference wasnt much... they were all world class.

[dimviii]

from next rally Evans will have a focus rs as recce car.

[rayh_mx]

It is very possible that Benito won't run :bandit:

[KiwiWRCfan]

from next rally Evans will have a focus rs as recce car.

I was under impression recce cars went sea freight from one long haul event to the next long haul event. While Elfyn is expected to have a Focus RS for recce in Corsica it will be interesting to see what is used as recce car in Argentina & Australia.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

@SebOgier
Happy to see an “old” friend back in #WRC 😊 @SebastienLoeb @RallyMexico @redbullmotors
#FrenchPower 🇫🇷💪
🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 https://t.co/z3gRna5n3S

[Tarmop]

I remember reading it in 2015/2016 that M-Sport will retire its Volvo fleet. So, lets wait for it first.:D
There should be new generation Focus out in near future and RS is discontinued in this month i believe? Hard to believe, but maybe there isn`t such a big demand anymore for those, because of the head-gasket issues and long waiting time (last year was about one year, whereas Leon Cupra and Golf R come as hatchbacks /estates in a much faster time).

[KKS]

@SebOgier
Happy to see an “old” friend back in #WRC  @SebastienLoeb @RallyMexico @redbullmotors
#FrenchPower 
 https://t.co/z3gRna5n3S
I suppose he quotes a wrong word :D

[Fast Eddie WRC]

I remember reading it in 2015/2016 that M-Sport will retire its Volvo fleet. So, lets wait for it first.:D
There should be new generation Focus out in near future and RS is discontinued in this month i believe? Hard to believe, but maybe there isn`t such a big demand anymore for those, because of the head-gasket issues and long waiting time (last year was about one year, whereas Leon Cupra and Golf R come as hatchbacks /estates in a much faster time).

A Focus RS is always made in limited numbers... that's part of the reason why it's special.

[Tarmop]

Well, yes, but there is a new generation coming and i believe this is the case here.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Well, yes, but there is a new generation coming and i believe this is the case here.

The RS always comes towards the end of a model run to boost it's image as its nearing replacement.

The Focus IV probably wont have an RS version til 2021 so expect the current RS recce cars to continue for a while...

[jbmarcus21]

Wrc Tour de Corse Google Earth Map is online ► http://bit.ly/2zbO0Ck

[AnttiL]

Did I hear correctly on All Live that Suninen is going to do Argentina?

[seb_sh]

Did I hear correctly on All Live that Suninen is going to do Argentina?

Yes

[AnttiL]

https://twitter.com/eWRCresults/status/973461714741219328

The ewrc-results fundraising campaing succeeded! Among the supporters were Seb Marshall, Craig Breen, Esapekka Lappi, Hayden Paddon, Jari-Matti Latvala, Erik Veiby, Wevers Sport, Printsport, Becs Williams and Julian Porter

EDIT: also Ott Tänak and Toni Gardemaister

[EstWRC]

Awesome to hear and to see so many estonian names there too along with Tänak.

i use this site every day i must say.

[Andre Oliveira]

Many thanks guys. We will keep pushing for more, much more info and stats.

[mknight]

Many thanks guys. We will keep pushing for more, much more info and stats.

Tbh for the future it would be better with low monthly (or every 2-3 months) donations than one big chunk once a year, just something to think about.

[Franky]

Tbh for the future it would be better with low monthly (or every 2-3 months) donations than one big chunk once a year, just something to think about.

That's not a feasible business.

[mknight]

That's not a feasible business.

Instead of a long answer that I wrote first let's simplify it:

I pay for house, car, electricity, internet, newspaper, mobile phone and lot's of other things in monthly fees. Somehow it works. ;)

[Franky]

Instead of a long answer that I wrote first let's simplify it:

I pay for house, car, electricity, internet, newspaper, mobile phone and lot's of other things in monthly fees. Somehow it works. ;)

It's wrong place to discuss this. But ...

The site is running advertising to gather funds. And if on top of that there would be regular donation rounds... That is not a thought through plan.

[AnttiL]

How about paying 0.99 a month to get rid of the ads? I would do it.

[dimviii]

Many thanks guys. We will keep pushing for more, much more info and stats.

i would add also average speed at stages times results.

[PLuto]

Did I hear correctly on All Live that Suninen is going to do Argentina?

It is no surprise that they will use same cars for Mexico and Argentina. And I think there is no other option for Ford to set different driver as number three to Argentina. There are some options for tarmac events (Beouffier and maybe Kremer), but for gravel?

[mknight]

It is no surprise that they will use same cars for Mexico and Argentina. And I think there is no other option for Ford to set different driver as number three to Argentina. There are some options for tarmac events (Beouffier and maybe Kremer), but for gravel?

Østberg, with respect to Sunninen at the moment he would have likely gotten better results from Mexico and Argentina. For the future, for sure Sunninen has more "potential". But I still think it's too early for him with many rallies in WRC.

[PLuto]

I think that Ostberg is only one driver (from drivers who did drive new WRC) who can make any speed and not to be slowest. But I am not sure if he can be so much faster than Suninen there.

[Allez Andruet]

I haven't been too impressed with Suninen this year. It's understandable that he's more focusing on getting the experience than trying to always set the fastest time, but still. He didn't manage to post a single top five stage time in Mexico (not counting super specials) and got beat by R5 (Rovanperä) on PS. I'd definitely pick Östberg over Suninen for Argentina.

[AnttiL]

I haven't been too impressed with Suninen this year. It's understandable that he's more focusing on getting the experience than trying to always set the fastest time, but still. He didn't manage to post a single top five stage time in Mexico (not counting super specials) and got beat by R5 (Rovanperä) on PS. I'd definitely pick Östberg over Suninen for Argentina.

We must remember that Suninen didn't have any testing before Mexico, and it had been half a year since he drove that car on gravel, and the first time he ever drove on that kind of conditions. I believe he was just first trying to find his pace and settings, and when Evans retired he was told to finish to secure manufacturer points. That added pressure could also mess up with the rhythm, probably resulting in his offs on the Friday afternoon. Actually Suninen's best stage result (apart from that super special win) was SS20 where he was fourth, but then again, by that time the Rally2 guys were saving tyres and Meeke went off.

It's a dilemma of a driver needing to drive more rallies to get experience but not getting to do rallies because he has not enough experience.

[PLuto]

I should also point that Mexico is also difficult event with high altitude.

[jbmarcus21]

V-Rally4 the game is back from this september ► http://bit.ly/2pedXwT

[Allez Andruet]

We must remember that Suninen didn't have any testing before Mexico, and it had been half a year since he drove that car on gravel, and the first time he ever drove on that kind of conditions. I believe he was just first trying to find his pace and settings, and when Evans retired he was told to finish to secure manufacturer points. That added pressure could also mess up with the rhythm, probably resulting in his offs on the Friday afternoon. Actually Suninen's best stage result (apart from that super special win) was SS20 where he was fourth, but then again, by that time the Rally2 guys were saving tyres and Meeke went off.
That's all true, but IMO they don't apply as such for Suninen. The guy's something special, that we saw last year in Poland and Finland. You shouldn't be able to post fastest times and fight for podiums in your first WRC events, but that's exactly what he did. That's why I expected more from Sweden and Mexico. He also lost his testing slot in Finland (due to Ogier's crash), but it didn't matter that time. I think it's just a case of maybe thinking too much or something, Teemu should just go for it. I'd rather see him taking a podium and then crashing out on the next two rallies than "getting the experience" and finishing 8th. Don't know if Malcolm would agree though :D

[A FONDO]

That's all true, but IMO they don't apply as such for Suninen. The guy's something special, that we saw last year in Poland and Finland. You shouldn't be able to post fastest times and fight for podiums in your first WRC events, but that's exactly what he did. That's why I expected more from Sweden and Mexico. He also lost his testing slot in Finland (due to Ogier's crash), but it didn't matter that time. I think it's just a case of maybe thinking too much or something, Teemu should just go for it. I'd rather see him taking a podium and then crashing out on the next two rallies than "getting the experience" and finishing 8th. Don't know if Malcolm would agree though :D

Lappi was also fast on his debut in home rally but where he is now -nowhere. With current rules everyone can be fast for a while on his favorite event. But for the championship you need versatility.

[steve.mandzij]

Lappi was also fast on his debut in home rally but where he is now -nowhere. With current rules everyone can be fast for a while on his favorite event. But for the championship you need versatility.Nowhere? Sure? IIRC he was the highest placed Toyota in Sweden (at least he was at one point)

[stefanvv]

Nowhere? Sure? IIRC he was the highest placed Toyota in Sweden (at least he was at one point)

You really ignore road order significance.:rolleyes:

[Tarmop]

Well, road order will be the case anyway, but he was in a quite good position before his mistake in RMC also. All three events new for him in a WRC (although Sweden could be counted as his home event) and never been to Mexico i believe? Shouldn`t really complain yet, all of them don`t have "Sebastian" in their name. Some progress by speed and breaking, others by being medium and others stay medium or won`t reach even that level.

[AnttiL]

That's all true, but IMO they don't apply as such for Suninen. The guy's something special, that we saw last year in Poland and Finland. You shouldn't be able to post fastest times and fight for podiums in your first WRC events, but that's exactly what he did. That's why I expected more from Sweden and Mexico. He also lost his testing slot in Finland (due to Ogier's crash), but it didn't matter that time.

I think Suninen had a test before Poland, and we could consider all of Poland as a test event for Rally Finland. And he had a half day of testing before Finland with the same car he did the rally with. But before Mexico, no testing at all. Very different conditions, no gravel driving in a WRC car for months.

[Andre Oliveira]

M-Sport begins work on all-electric rally car

https://www.motorsport-news.co.uk/news/m-sport-begins-work-on-all-electric-rally-car/

[Fast Eddie WRC]

M-Sport begins work on all-electric rally car

https://www.motorsport-news.co.uk/news/m-sport-begins-work-on-all-electric-rally-car/

Enjoy the current WRC cars while you can people !

https://youtu.be/lvP_tP8Ruk0

[Simmi]

Can't wait to be walking through a forest and find myself met with a silent oncoming rally car.

[stefanvv]

Can't wait to be walking through a forest and find myself met with a silent oncoming rally car.

Take a spray with You. Those beasts might be dangerous.

[kirungi okwogera]

Can't wait to be walking through a forest and find myself met with a silent oncoming rally car.

I have no objection. I like the excitement of noisy cars but I feel that motorsport will continue and continue to be fun at a lower volume. If volume seems to be people's biggest problem with it, I can tell it's coming.

Maybe it's my own hearing sensitivity (I have to block my ears when I'm close to rally cars, even ambulance sirens), but I think that in time today's complaints will look like the people who didn't believe in wearing helmets in American football, or drivers' aids, or any other new feature that detracts from the "purity" of any motorsport.

And electric power gives you the opportunity for a 350-380hp world rally car to have maximum torque at any time, which (with the right regulations) can make for extremely exciting driving, especially on gravel/snow/ice/mud. As several people on this forum have pointed out, loads of torque and less grip = more sideways (of course sacrificing cornering speed). Not everyone may want that style of rally, but not everyone wants ever cleaner tarmac-like performance on every surface either. In the end I think there is enough give and take that it will still be a fun sport to watch and participate in if this shift were to happen in the future.

[N.O.T]

I have no objection. I like the excitement of noisy cars but I feel that motorsport will continue and continue to be fun at a lower volume. If volume seems to be people's biggest problem with it, I can tell it's coming.

Maybe it's my own hearing sensitivity (I have to block my ears when I'm close to rally cars, even ambulance sirens), but I think that in time today's complaints will look like the people who didn't believe in wearing helmets in American football, or drivers' aids, or any other new feature that detracts from the "purity" of any motorsport.

And electric power gives you the opportunity for a 350-380hp world rally car to have maximum torque at any time, which (with the right regulations) can make for extremely exciting driving, especially on gravel/snow/ice/mud. As several people on this forum have pointed out, loads of torque and less grip = more sideways (of course sacrificing cornering speed). Not everyone may want that style of rally, but not everyone wants ever cleaner tarmac-like performance on every surface either. In the end I think there is enough give and take that it will still be a fun sport to watch and participate in if this shift were to happen in the future.

https://i.imgur.com/CkWRIwd.gif

[Mirek]

I have no objection. I like the excitement of noisy cars but I feel that motorsport will continue and continue to be fun at a lower volume. If volume seems to be people's biggest problem with it, I can tell it's coming.

Maybe it's my own hearing sensitivity (I have to block my ears when I'm close to rally cars, even ambulance sirens), but I think that in time today's complaints will look like the people who didn't believe in wearing helmets in American football, or drivers' aids, or any other new feature that detracts from the "purity" of any motorsport.

And electric power gives you the opportunity for a 350-380hp world rally car to have maximum torque at any time, which (with the right regulations) can make for extremely exciting driving, especially on gravel/snow/ice/mud. As several people on this forum have pointed out, loads of torque and less grip = more sideways (of course sacrificing cornering speed). Not everyone may want that style of rally, but not everyone wants ever cleaner tarmac-like performance on every surface either. In the end I think there is enough give and take that it will still be a fun sport to watch and participate in if this shift were to happen in the future.

Have You ever seen an electric race or rallycross car live? It's fast but it's boring as hell. I'd rather stay home than to watch and listen this again. And honestly nearly everyone around me felt and expressed the same...

[RS]

Have You ever seen an electric race or rallycross car live? It's fast but it's boring as hell. I'd rather stay home than to watch and listen this again. And honestly nearly everyone around me felt and expressed the same...

Listening yes, but watching isn't too bad:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5844VCjRpv0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIeD56BnI-o

[danon]

The sound won't be a problem at all.

With just another button on the steering wheel for the sound settings the driver will be able to change even the roar for every Special Stage acording to his/her mood.

It's coming...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ac35Lv-ndKI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nY2wB_PCEm8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SpX4rNtVP-g

[mknight]

The sound won't be a problem at all.

With just another button on the steering wheel for the sound settings the driver will be able to change even the roar for every Special Stage acording to his/her mood.

It's coming...



Prbly. You already have this on a quite a few roadcars with normal petrol engine.

"Sound enhancement".

[Mirek]

Listening yes, but watching isn't too bad:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5844VCjRpv0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIeD56BnI-o

Believe me it is boring. I saw among others exactly this car together with petrol cars on the same track and I didn't find it exciting at all.

[stefanvv]

I suggest we start cooking petrol in the next years so NOT these "batteries" endanger our sport.

[Mirek]

Eh, what?

[stefanvv]

what, what, what. Haven't You herd about artificial fuels? - https://www.audi-technology-portal.de/en/download?file=758

[N.O.T]

I strongly start to believe that the mental asylums of the world use these forums as a way for their imprisoned retards to express themselves....

[GravelBen]

I strongly start to believe that the mental asylums of the world use these forums as a way for their imprisoned retards to express themselves....

I guess that could explain why you are here at least. :imubash:

[AnttiL]

In my view, M-Sport has made a huge step in securing manufacturer interest for rallying. Rallying is a method of developing technology and marketing the cars, and if the car manufacturers are going electric, they are not going to be interested in putting their money in combust engine rallying. Instead, electric rallying could spark up interest in new manufacturers.

At the same time, this change won't happen overnight, maybe not even in a decade. The technology is still new, especially to the sport. Even if WRC became all electric, all the combustion engine rally cars would not disappear and would most likely be used in historic/clubman rallies as long as there's some liquid to burn in them.

[Francis44]

Relax, the next set of regulations will surely consist on some kind of Hybrid system (mild or not), before going all electric.

Regarding the sound, it is a known problem by manufacteurs and there are some very good engineers working to solve that, Mclaren for example has completely dismissed an all electric car for the foreseeable future until they find a solution to make it sound as exciting as there other models (even if they already have an all electric mule running).

Regarding the popularity of electric car racing, I think the low volume of engagement of the Fomrula E page of this forum is pretty self explanatory.

[RS]

Believe me it is boring. I saw among others exactly this car together with petrol cars on the same track and I didn't find it exciting at all.

I do think the sound is a big part of the experience, no matter how the car performs or handles.. ie. S2000 cars were much more entertaining than R5 despite being slower.

But we can’t do anything about it, the future is electric. In the not too distant future I doubt any manufacturer will want to market a petrol car.

[Mirek]

In the not too distant future I doubt any manufacturer will want to market a petrol car.

Don't worry, petrol engines will be still around at least for few more decades. There is no realistic alternative now.

[Francis44]

In the not too distant future I doubt any manufacturer will want to market a petrol car.

Petrol?! For sure! Combustion engines not so sure, new biofuels are just around the corner afaik, Mazda is very keen on algae biofuel and they were making several moves to help it being mass produced.

[AL14]

Petrol?! For sure! Combustion engines not so sure, new biofuels are just around the corner afaik, Mazda is very keen on algae biofuel and they were making several moves to help it being mass produced.

I hope it will not happen if we want people not to starve.

[Francis44]

I hope it will not happen if we want people not to starve.

That could be a problem for sure, I would also not like to have more major holes drilled on our planet to mine lithium. I think we have made enough through the years.

[AL14]

That could be a problem for sure, I would also not like to have more major holes drilled on our planet to mine lithium. I think we have made enough through the years.

Yes I know. We have huge issues in these regards and we are not dealing with them enough and effectively.

[AndyRAC]

Regarding the popularity of electric car racing, I think the low volume of engagement of the Fomrula E page of this forum is pretty self explanatory.

Whereas on the Autosport forum the Mexican E-Prix got 3 pages of comments - WRC Mexico got a handful of comments. I actually find it staggering that people are more interested in 'scaletrix' racing than WRC. I think it's doing a lot better than many on here may realise.

[Francis44]

Whereas on the Autosport forum the Mexican E-Prix got 3 pages of comments - WRC Mexico got a handful of comments. I actually find it staggering that people are more interested in 'scaletrix' racing than WRC. I think it's doing a lot better than many on here may realise.

What is true is that FE promoters are doing a fantastic job promoting what they are given, they know it's difficult to promote the series (empty stands), so they are spending quite a lot of money on social media (some of the comments of the FE twitter page are from people being paid to do so).

Also, having celebs like Leonardo Dicaprio or Orlando bloom attending the races via invite does wonders for you sport you know smh.

[kirungi okwogera]

I just accept that it's going to happen in some years, and while some of the experience is lost I think the sport will still be fun to watch and/or drive. If there was some other futuristic way to power racing cars that kept things the same forever, I'd prefer that, but I don't see it.

N.O.T what do you think manu's are gonna do in 10 years when half their sales are coming from electric, or in 20 years when it's 75%? Keep making petrol WRC's?

[Mirek]

Petrol?! For sure! Combustion engines not so sure, new biofuels are just around the corner afaik, Mazda is very keen on algae biofuel and they were making several moves to help it being mass produced.

May I ask how a petrol non-combustion engine is supposed to work? :)

[Francis44]

May I ask how a petrol non-combustion engine is supposed to work? :)

Im not and engineer but are there not already engines running on biofuels not petrol-based?! I guess if some manufacteurs are pumping money into it there may be some possibilities :).

[Mirek]

Im not and engineer but are there not already engines running on biofuels not petrol-based?! I guess if some manufacteurs are pumping money into it there may be some possibilities :).

That was not the question :)

Every engine which burns something is combustion one by principle. I asked because I do not know about any serial petrol/diesel/bio-fuel engine which is not based on combustion principle.

Anyway I am strongly against bio fuels as they are known now. They made much more harm than good and the only thing they have been good for is to tunnel billions on subsidies.

[Francis44]

That was not the question :)

Every engine which burns something is combustion one by principle. I asked because I do not know about any serial petrol/diesel/bio-fuel engine which is not based on combustion principle.

Anyway I am strongly against bio fuels as they are known now. They made much more harm than good and the only thing they have been good for is to tunnel billions on subsidies.

I understand, however wont you agree that a mini-algae fuel, neutral in terms of CO2 emissions, can be an interesting alternative aswell?!

Sorry for the off-topic.

[AL14]

Sorry for the off-topic.

Not at all, nothing is happening in the rally world and it is nice to discuss some related topic from time to time.

[Mirek]

I understand, however wont you agree that a mini-algae fuel, neutral in terms of CO2 emissions, can be an interesting alternative aswell?!

Sorry for the off-topic.

For the moment it sounds a bit like perpetuum mobile to me but for sure I don't have enough chemical background and information to judge.

[Tarmop]

When there is something done by a human or something burnt, there will always be a siginificant amount of CO2. Not such a big issue as diesel NOx imho.

BTW, what is the composition of Panta racing fuel this season. I remember something E85 like, anyway bioethanol had quite a big percentage in it.

[Mirek]

When there is something done by a human or something burnt, there will always be a siginificant amount of CO2. Not such a big issue as diesel NOx imho.

Sure but I understand that the Audi research mentioned by Francis and Stefan is focusing on algaes which live from consuming CO2 and by that creating bio-mass for the fuel - i.e. sort of a zero-sum CO2 cycle. I do not have enough background to judge whether such idea is realistic or not.

What I can say is that there is definitely enough oil for many more decades and it's not the lack of it what drives the development of alternatives.

[N.O.T]

N.O.T what do you think manu's are gonna do in 10 years when half their sales are coming from electric, or in 20 years when it's 75%? Keep making petrol WRC's?

That alternative universe you are in has cows producing chocolate milk ? because if they do i would love to join you.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

I've been concerned about the lack of noise also... but it does appear that it can be created artificially which will be better than nothing. :)

Jamie Edwards
@jemsport Replying to @Becsywecsy 9 others
M-Sport told me that they can sort out sound. It could be a WRC turbo noise, or even V10 or V8 apparently. (Also the cars may be significantly cheaper to run).

But I think that hybrid will be next with a small petrol motor for real noise... :D

[Mirek]

I've been concerned about the lack of noise also... but it does appear that it can be created artificially which will be better than nothing. :)

Jamie Edwards
@jemsport Replying to @Becsywecsy 9 others
M-Sport told me that they can sort out sound. It could be a WRC turbo noise, or even V10 or V8 apparently. (Also the cars may be significantly cheaper to run).

Kind of like a sex with an inflatable doll.

[AL14]

The artificial sound is good only and exclusively for safety reason.
The feeling to hear an artificial sound is not even a feeling.

[AL14]

Kind of like a sex with an inflatable doll.

You explained it better :)

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Swiftly changing the subject...

Julian Porter @The_Rally_Guru
Ever wonder what all the aerials are for on the roof of a WRC car? On the @MSportLtd Fiesta there are seven in total, including three for the live tv, one team-to-car radio, one each for timing and FIA tracking devices, and one for the mobile phone.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DYaS-cFXkAAWrTe.jpg

[sonnybobiche]

And yet for all the interference they generate, no one seems to be able to get a reliable, high-quality signal from them. Live onboards have been spotty at best, the live timing is constantly broken, position updates once every 10 seconds (at least from what WRC+ users can see on the map).

[sonnybobiche]

You ever tried using GPS up in the areas where rallys take place?

What's the excuse when the terrain is billiard table flat, like Sweden?

[Tarmop]

Trees?

[SubaruNorway]

I don't think GPS is an issue these days with 24 satellites, I've never had mine drop out unless I'm in a deep tunnel so must be something else, the map wasn't this slow last year.

[Mirek]

I don't think GPS is an issue these days with 24 satellites, I've never had mine drop out unless I'm in a deep tunnel so must be something else, the map wasn't this slow last year.


Exactly, I have never ever had any issue with GPS in the mountains around RMC stages (except obviously for tunnels). There is often no GSM signal but GPS works always.


Trees?

Hmm, 1/3 of my country is forest and I normally use GPS on my trips through them. Never had any issue.


I guess the issue is not in the GPS signal but in the way how the GPS position is transmitted to the rally HQ. I mean the GPS unit is in the car but it has to communicate with the rally HQ and for that it needs working connection. I guess here lies the issue. Here in CZ we use mobile GSM transmitters around stages to cover 100% of them for safety reasons but even then I can imagine the signal isn't continuous.

[denkimi]

You ever tried using GPS up in the areas where rallys take place?

gps makes a connection with satellites high in the sky. so unless you're in a faraday cage,a rock tunnel, or a thick concrete building, getting gps signal shouldn't be a problem.

[br21]

just remember that what can be seen on WRC+ is not the same organizer see using tracking system. during this years rallies I follow Rallysafe system and almost no problems with it, splits are coming, gps also, so comparing to what wrc+ offers it's completely different level

[Simmi]

Has Eric Camilli to Volkswagen R5 been reported anywhere?

I follow him on Instagram and spotted he replied to a comment on a post which asked what his plans were. I put it through Google translate and it said:

"Yes we hope to ride soon for M-Sport with the same ambition. You have to be patient and prepare yourself carefully to hope for a place. In addition, we have the opportunity to drive for Volkswagen in parallel on 2018 and participate in the development of the Polo R5."

[RS]

Has Eric Camilli to Volkswagen R5 been reported anywhere?

I follow him on Instagram and spotted he replied to a comment on a post which asked what his plans were. I put it through Google translate and it said:

"Yes we hope to ride soon for M-Sport with the same ambition. You have to be patient and prepare yourself carefully to hope for a place. In addition, we have the opportunity to drive for Volkswagen in parallel on 2018 and participate in the development of the Polo R5."

Will be interesting to see which drivers they pick for their debut in Germany.

[Msportwrcfan]

I wonder how much money he is chucking at vw then

[Tarmop]

Winner of ADAC 2017 WRC2 may just get the chance for free this time.

[BigWorm]

I wonder how much money he is chucking at vw then

Isn't funding one of his problems in this business?

[ESTR]

They need crash test also to improve the car so why not bring Camilli to the game for that.

[dupanton]

They need crash test also to improve the car so why not bring Camilli to the game for that.

He doesn't crash very often, just look at his results from last year, with victory in RC2 in Germany and Sardinia and 2nd place in Mexico, Finland and Wales etc
https://www.ewrc-results.com/profile/39567-eric-camilli/

He is one of the best choices to debut the car, certainly in Germany.

[Msportwrcfan]

Isn't funding one of his problems in this business? VW must want him to test on asphalt. How did he get the m-sport Wrc drive, backing I believe, then was simply dropped for not being up to scratch. Surely has developed in wrc2 r5 class after but simply not good enough at the moment

[Tarmop]

Why, if you look at the ewrc results.

[Rally Power]

VW must want him to test on asphalt. How did he get the m-sport Wrc drive, backing I believe, then was simply dropped for not being up to scratch. Surely has developed in wrc2 r5 class after but simply not good enough at the moment

Wilson said several times that Camilli wasn’t a paying driver ant that he believed in the French potential; apparently he got tired of believing.

Btw, Camilli never had big personal sponsors but he’s close to Michelin WRC top staff; maybe it was them who suggested him to VW.

[salamaja]

BS

http://mmuk.realviewdigital.com/?iid=158356#folio=48

[N.O.T]

BS

http://mmuk.realviewdigital.com/?iid=158356#folio=48

finally some great news...

[dimviii]

Barritt suffered concussion during the pair’s sixth-gear roll at Rally Guanajuato Mexico earlier this month. After hospital checks, he was advised not to continue and the pair retired their M-Sport Ford Fiesta.
He has since been recuperating at home in Britain and experienced co-driver Stuart Loudon partnered Evans for the Welshman’s two-day test on the Mediterranean island roads which started yesterday (Monday).
Barritt will undergo a medical examination ahead of the Corsican event to check his fitness, but M-Sport is confident he will be given the green light for the fourth round of the FIA World Rally Championship.
http://www.wrc.com/en/wrc/news/march-2018/barritt-test/page/5308--12-12-.html

[sonnybobiche]

BS

http://mmuk.realviewdigital.com/?iid=158356#folio=48

Wow. It finally makes sense. The teams have literally been paying these "journalists" the whole time to ensure nothing bad is ever said about anything the teams do. No wonder everything they say is pure fluff, especially Becs Williams. I know everyone here likes her, but I don't. To me, she's represents everything wrong with WRC reporting.

And the promoter sidelining Colin Clark? A guy who has the temerity to actually say something interesting once in a while on his own YouTube channel? Pathetic. Pathetic, and very bad for the sport. Bernie never sidelined Ted Kravitz because he asked a tough questions once in a while. Oliver Ciesla must have a very, very fragile ego.

That said, I've never been happy with the coverage on WRC Radio. 99% of it is Becs making puns, talking about the weather, giving split times, or apologising because we couldn't hear the stage end interview because the equipment isn't working.

Your only job is to keep the audience interested. If you can't do that because Ciesla is swinging the sword of Damocles over your head, resign and go work for Red Bull TV. Mike Chen and co have been doing really great stuff over there without fear of upsetting some vain idiot. I've been going back after each rally and watching the RBTV coverage and, frankly, it's still better than anything All Live has done since Monte.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

EXCITING NEW-LOOK ROUTE FOR 2018 DAYINSURE WALES RALLY GB

This year's Dayinsure Wales Rally GB (4-7 October) will feature an exciting new-look route and a shift of focus to the forests and venues of north Wales.

Click to read more ➡️*https://t.co/cQbBCvy2rF

#WRGB #WRC https://t.co/vsgH1Cd7XC

[bearclaw]

EXCITING NEW-LOOK ROUTE FOR 2018 DAYINSURE WALES RALLY GB

This year's Dayinsure Wales Rally GB (4-7 October) will feature an exciting new-look route and a shift of focus to the forests and venues of north Wales.

Click to read more ➡️*https://t.co/cQbBCvy2rF

#WRGB #WRC https://t.co/vsgH1Cd7XC

For us it’s our fist Wales Rally GB. Is Betws-y-Coed a good spot for an accommodation? The stages on Saturday around Aberystwyth are a bit far away from Betws-y-Coed. But Thursday, Friday and Sunday should be ok? What do the experts say?

[AL14]

Wow. It finally makes sense. The teams have literally been paying these "journalists" the whole time to ensure nothing bad is ever said about anything the teams do. No wonder everything they say is pure fluff, especially Becs Williams. I know everyone here likes her, but I don't. To me, she's represents everything wrong with WRC reporting.

And the promoter sidelining Colin Clark? A guy who has the temerity to actually say something interesting once in a while on his own YouTube channel? Pathetic. Pathetic, and very bad for the sport. Bernie never sidelined Ted Kravitz because he asked a tough questions once in a while. Oliver Ciesla must have a very, very fragile ego.

That said, I've never been happy with the coverage on WRC Radio. 99% of it is Becs making puns, talking about the weather, giving split times, or apologising because we couldn't hear the stage end interview because the equipment isn't working.

Your only job is to keep the audience interested. If you can't do that because Ciesla is swinging the sword of Damocles over your head, resign and go work for Red Bull TV. Mike Chen and co have been doing really great stuff over there without fear of upsetting some vain idiot. I've been going back after each rally and watching the RBTV coverage and, frankly, it's still better than anything All Live has done since Monte.

I find her a nice person and enjoyable to listen to but I admit that I can't disagree with you when you say "The teams have literally been paying these "journalists" the whole time to ensure nothing bad is ever said about anything the teams do. No wonder everything they say is pure fluff."

I would not blame Becs and Colin too much though, everyone in their shoes would have done the same... It's this system that is pure cancer. Promoter should have done different if they want the sport to be told in a proper and effective way.
Maybe I was naive but I was sure that they were too "kind" with drivers and teams to ensure their collaboration with them, not because they were literally paid by the teams. That's not journalism, that's press office...

[Simmi]

For us it’s our fist Wales Rally GB. Is Betws-y-Coed a good spot for an accommodation? The stages on Saturday around Aberystwyth are a bit far away from Betws-y-Coed. But Thursday, Friday and Sunday should be ok? What do the experts say?

Yeah seems like a good shout to me. A bit hard to say without seeing the route in full. But that should put you in position for Shakedown (probably), Penmachno (if that runs) and anything around Brenig/Alwen etc. You're never going to get a perfect location for all four days so you just have to make the best compromise.

We should know more in April. This pre-press release press release is the new strategy now it seems.

[Mk2 RS2000]

BS

http://mmuk.realviewdigital.com/?iid=158356#folio=48

For those in Europe that can sit in front of a screen all day then WRC+ is quite a good option, but for those of us in the Southern Hemisphere tucked up in our beds at night then Rally Radio takes the place of computer screen. With your I Phone headset on you don't wake the wife and all is at peace in the household

[N.O.T]

For those in Europe that can sit in front of a screen all day then WRC+ is quite a good option, but for those of us in the Southern Hemisphere tucked up in our beds at night then Rally Radio takes the place of computer screen. With your I Phone headset on you don't wake the wife and all is at peace in the household

get a laptop.

[Mariusz]

get a laptop.
Yep, great idea.
lappocket1.jpg (https://iteducationnews.files.wordpress.com/2011/09/lappocket1.jpg)

[KiwiWRCfan]

get a laptop.

It is up to each person to choose how they follow WRC. I-phone, Android phone, I-pad, Macbook, PC, Laptop, Smart TV or whatever it simply does not matter. We can choose free content only or choose to buy some paid content. Make the choice that suits you and your personal circumstances. Audio feed on phone thru headphones is perfect for me sometimes while at other times I am able to enjoy live streaming video on my PC or Smart TV.
No rights or wrongs, just personal choices.
Let's just be grateful we have a range of choices to suit our different personal circumstances and respect other peoples choices. We do not know their circumstances.

[Franky]

It is up to each person to choose how they follow WRC. I-phone, Android phone, I-pad, Macbook, PC, Laptop, Smart TV or whatever it simply does not matter.

What, no Android tablet? The Apple mania must be strong in the civilized Western world

[AL14]

It is up to each person to choose how they follow WRC. I-phone, Android phone, I-pad, Macbook, PC, Laptop, Smart TV or whatever it simply does not matter. We can choose free content only or choose to buy some paid content. Make the choice that suits you and your personal circumstances. Audio feed on phone thru headphones is perfect for me sometimes while at other times I am able to enjoy live streaming video on my PC or Smart TV.
No rights or wrongs, just personal choices.
Let's just be grateful we have a range of choices to suit our different personal circumstances and respect other peoples choices. We do not know their circumstances.

I don't envy you guys in NZ and Australia. Uncomfortable hours to follow the rallys when they are in Europe (most of the times).

[steve.mandzij]

What, no Android tablet? The Apple mania must be strong in the civilized Western worldAndroid tablets are dead (maybe never born to begin with)

[Franky]

Android tablets are dead (maybe never born to begin with)

I hope that's a joke

[AnttiL]

For those in Europe that can sit in front of a screen all day then WRC+ is quite a good option, but for those of us in the Southern Hemisphere tucked up in our beds at night then Rally Radio takes the place of computer screen. With your I Phone headset on you don't wake the wife and all is at peace in the household

did you know that you can pause and/or re-watch All Live? If you cannot watch it truly live, just turn off all social media so you don't get spoilers and re-watch it when you find the time. For me this is a huge improvement over WRC Radio, which had no pause/rewind functions at all.

[Rallyper]

And two screens with live-footage on one and the live GPS-map on the second one! :) :)

[AL14]

And two screens with live-footage on one and the live GPS-map on the second one! :) :)

And a smartphone or even thrid screen to follow the discussions on Twitter and forums ;)

[KiwiWRCfan]

once again Dave Evans of Autosport is first to bring us the news
"WRC stakeholders and Commission members were asked to vote on a simple change which meant any time penalties taken on the final day of an event would make the crew ineligible for any bonus points"
"Autosport understands the that electronic vote concluded on Wednesday, with the alteration expected to be ratified by World Motor Sport Council in time for the Tour de Corse"
Link to full article https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/134972/wrc-set-for-powerstage-rule-change

Seems like a sensible outcome

[KiwiWRCfan]

And a smartphone or even thrid screen to follow the discussions on Twitter and forums ;)

I also need 4th screen for split times, I personally prefer the WRC.com view showing all splits of all drivers on a single screen rather than WRC+ tracking map splits which show just a single split point. Again it is a personal preference thing.
Does anyone else currently use both WRC ALL Live and WRC Radio audio and keep alternating volume settings up and down between them

[jbmarcus21]

My full report from Loeb Racing Xperience ceremonial yesterday to Futuroscope ► http://bit.ly/2pJc7FB

[AL14]

Interview to Takamoto Katsuta after Rally il Ciocco where he competed (and I attended!) from my friends at rally.it

The english version is below the article.
Topics: Italian rallys, Sweden victory, relationship with Arai, 2018 goals and future in WRC.

He has been very nice and kind, also I think his answers are pretty mature and smart.

https://www.rally.it/2018/03/lintervista-katsuta

[dimviii]

Christophe Besse
‏


@ChBesse
Today was my last day at @CitroenRacing
It is time for me to come back to business at @TracksideEetS
Team coordination #TeamDB Race strategy #RaceCTRL Data analysis #LapMonitor

[TWRC]

Christophe Besse
‏


@ChBesse
Today was my last day at @CitroenRacing
It is time for me to come back to business at @TracksideEetS
Team coordination #TeamDB Race strategy #RaceCTRL Data analysis #LapMonitor
Well, that's a bit unexpected

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Solberg's old co-driver Phil Mills back in WRC - I never expected to see that !

https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/135121/mills-to-codrive-evans-at-corsica-wrc-round

[steve.mandzij]

Solberg's old co-driver Phil Mills back in WRC - I never expected to see that !

https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/135121/mills-to-codrive-evans-at-corsica-wrc-roundI'm excited for those onboards!

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Just looked him up on Wiki... he's 54. :eek:

[AnttiL]

Not the first time Mills steps in for an M-Sport co-driver in Tour de Corse. Last time was just 21 years ago...

[SubaruNorway]

Just looked him up on Wiki... he's 54. :eek:

If you count Novikov as a factory driver in 2012 Giraudet was 56 back then, so Mills is still not the oldest factory co driver believe it or not

[AnttiL]

Seppo Harjanne was 49 when he won the championship with Mäkinen

[tommeke_B]

Don't forget John Kennard, he was 58 last year, when he still competed with Paddon.

[Andre Oliveira]

Stuart Loudon was the man that codrived Evans on TdC tests. Why not him?

[AnttiL]

Stuart Loudon was the man that codrived Evans on TdC tests. Why not him?

Mills has been in Evans's gravel crew team for a long while, and also has experience from the rally itself.

[Mk2 RS2000]

Just looked him up on Wiki... he's 54. :eek:

Age is only a state of mind for a healthy person

[BigWorm]

Has he ever worked with father Gwyndaf?

[Mirek]

Age is only a state of mind for a healthy person

Not for the sportsmen. Even being a co-driver is physically demanding especially in hot weather. There is a reason why the profi crews do a lot of gymnastics and stuff to keep themselves in the best shape. Not saying he can't do that but for sure not that good like years a go.

[AnttiL]

Has he ever worked with father Gwyndaf?

Actually, yes

https://www.ewrc-results.com/entryinfo/2397-rallye-el-corte-ingles-1993/270789/
https://www.ewrc-results.com/entryinfo/6461-drivesouth-rally-of-otago-2012/205355/

[Tarmop]

Not for the sportsmen. Even being a co-driver is physically demanding especially in hot weather. There is a reason why the profi crews do a lot of gymnastics and stuff to keep themselves in the best shape. Not saying he can't do that but for sure not that good like years a go.

Well, yes, but then we have crew no. 11....

[Mk2 RS2000]

Not for the sportsmen..

Is that a fact?

[janvanvurpa]

Not for the sportsmen. Even being a co-driver is physically demanding especially in hot weather. There is a reason why the profi crews do a lot of gymnastics and stuff to keep themselves in the best shape. Not saying he can't do that but for sure not that good like years a go.

Mirek, armchair general this is not opinion...Physical training is good for BRAIN function and to reduce the perception of stress..
CARs are not physically demanding compared to some REAL manly sports.

But STRESS---specially the individual's subjective perception of stress IS a real thing..
If as has been the trend for a lobf time now, they recruit young boys who are from privileged background to " bring up" in the sport...I mean just look at them when tmany begin the sport..They're soft children....
They NEED something physically hard to do so in the mind they have something to compare the NORMAL pressure and stress of rally to something.
Doing all that gym and running in their mind "was hard" so "mere stress" seems less hard...

You can be armchair general, and an engineer....I did harder sport...then did rally..Rally was nothing hard..Good laugh..
(everything is relative..when I retired and come back to Amerika I get to do my real love---on motorcycles --before I do rally. Fun was defined as 300km in the mountains on narrow skinny little trails banging over 10000 rocks and bouncing off of 100 trees in one day..Then 16km --5 laps---around extra long mx track..
That was fun!... One day.. WRC guys sit in nice car and do 300km SS over 3 days..a slight relative difference...
it is STRESS the physical training is for.

[mknight]

Oh, so the wrc drivers looking kind of tired at the end of longer stages on hot gravel rallies is just the stress. Good to know.

* starts searching for the "manly-oh-meter" *

[Barreis]

what was the name of the 60 years old French gentleman driver with 307WRC that used to beat works Fords on some tarmac events (I think in Bulgaria)? that was about 10 years ago

[denkimi]

Mental difficult task are physically exhaustings.
The thing with rallying is that it's not one stage, the crew is busy and has to remain focussed all day. Janvanpuura is not wrong, but he needs to call it exhaustion instead of stress.
It's like walking 80km, it's never not difficult because the speed's to high, it's difficult because it takes so long.

Being old is not a physical problem. The level of fitness required in the wrc can be achieved by a 60 year old. It's a problem of the mind. As you get older your reactions get slower, and there's nothing you can do about it.
For a codriver its doesn't matter that much, because they don't need to react in milliseconds.

[janvanvurpa]

Mental difficult task are physically exhaustings.
The thing with rallying is that it's not one stage, the crew is busy and has to remain focussed all day. Janvanpuura is not wrong, but he needs to call it exhaustion instead of stress.
It's like walking 80km, it's never not difficult because the speed's to high, it's difficult because it takes so long.

Being old is not a physical problem. The level of fitness required in the wrc can be achieved by a 60 year old. It's a problem of the mind. As you get older your reactions get slower, and there's nothing you can do about it.
For a codriver its doesn't matter that much, because they don't need to react in milliseconds.

I am just curious if anybody here has tested their own reactions as they have aged?
See, everybody talks about 'fast reactions' and how younger guys supposedly have "fast reactions"...
But nobody ever puts any numbers to it... ever...
And nobody puts a number to what "normal" reaction is, and how much "faster reaction" is "needed" compared to a base line of "normal" reactions..

And then there are those --like me---who believe --or rather know---that "fast" reactions are trained in.
And that the whole (amateur) discussion --which may be true to some (quantified) degree ignores totally the role of experience, and that you do need "super fast" reactions if you don't get yourself into situations where fast reactions are needed..Experience counts

This is fun testhttp://www.loltimeplayed.com/reactionresults.php



Your reaction speed is 262ms








117,862 players have taken the test*. The mean reaction time of all players is 285 ms and the mean age is 19.7








Q Is there a correlation between reaction speed and ability? YES




Now last few days I have been helping a friend move his rally prep and cage building shop..Long 10-12 hours days, TONS of equipent loaded and moved and unloaded..TONS of jumk scrapped..21 years in that shop and he is a pack-rat.
I am tired, and have not had a cup of tea in 8 hours...I have eaten 1 orange and 2 apples..so hungry..Low energy..
But somehow I beat the mean reaction time of nerdy game players with an average age of 19.7 years...
I turned 65 last December...

Last year when perkier and a recent cigarette I did test 20 times and that day averaged between .181 and .200 milliseconds stomping the sh!t out of the two 18/19 year old boys who were telling me why the driver had "exceptional" reaction times..(yeah exceptionally SLOW!!! averaged .360 milliseconds.

Reaction times, like nearly everything else, is largely learned and then reinforced by practice. It is largely what the US Navy "Top Gun School" calls a "highly perishable skill"

All you guys here are fans in one degree or another. let's see what reaction times you have..Follow the link, take the test, post results.

[janvanvurpa]

Oh, so the wrc drivers looking kind of tired at the end of longer stages on hot gravel rallies is just the stress. Good to know.

* starts searching for the "manly-oh-meter" *


Did I say "just" stress? No I didn't. I said largely...
Do you understand the relative comparisons I mentioned?
Tell me all your active motorsport activities from 15 to now so I can better understand your opinion...

because I repeated that "everything is relative"...

[Ucci]

what was the name of the 60 years old French gentleman driver with 307WRC that used to beat works Fords on some tarmac events (I think in Bulgaria)? that was about 10 years ago
Dany Snobeck

[denkimi]

I am just curious if anybody here has tested their own reactions as they have aged?
See, everybody talks about 'fast reactions' and how younger guys supposedly have "fast reactions"...
But nobody ever puts any numbers to it... ever...
And nobody puts a number to what "normal" reaction is, and how much "faster reaction" is "needed" compared to a base line of "normal" reactions..

And then there are those --like me---who believe --or rather know---that "fast" reactions are trained in.
And that the whole (amateur) discussion --which may be true to some (quantified) degree ignores totally the role of experience, and that you do need "super fast" reactions if you don't get yourself into situations where fast reactions are needed..Experience counts

But somehow I beat the mean reaction time of nerdy game players with an average age of 19.7 years...
I turned 65 last December...

Reaction times, like nearly everything else, is largely learned and then reinforced by practice. It is largely what the US Navy "Top Gun School" calls a "highly perishable skill"

All you guys here are fans in one degree or another. let's see what reaction times you have..Follow the link, take the test, post results.
i think you're not getting it.
yes, reactions can be trained. yes, a 65 year old can have faster reactions than the average 20 year old.

but, at age 65 you will never be able to train your reactions to be as fast as you would have been able at age 20.


what was the name of the 60 years old French gentleman driver with 307WRC that used to beat works Fords on some tarmac events (I think in Bulgaria)? that was about 10 years ago

Dany Snobeck
its either not snobeck, or Barreis's memory is wrong.

snobeck has in his 40 years career only 2 times competed outside france. only once in his 307, in spain 2009.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

It's not just the fact that Mills is 54, more that he has also been out of top level competition for so long.

But for just one event maybe his adrenalin will get him through ok ...

[EstWRC]

and here he is, looks already tired :p



https://scontent-arn2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/29597528_10155967269710733_814764845311220386_n.jp g?_nc_cat=0&oh=2f8d2f86f0b16f5758b6c5a6f8879940&oe=5B6C59CC

[Simmi]

Mills: "What have I done!!??"


Nah I'm sure he'll be fine. Professional guy. Nice to see him back and all the best to them.

[dimviii]

Pierre Budar, Citroën's new sports director, welcomes us at the team's headquarters in Versailles and tells us about his concerns. After the departure of Yves Matton to the FIA, this engineer, who was also a pilot, has taken the reins of the French formation.

How do you see the World Rally Championship after three races?
The difference of points in the championship of marks is very closed. In each rally the four cars that compete have won sections, which shows the great equality there is. We just have to wait for the fight to last until the end.
They got a podium in Mexico, but above all, they had great prominence with the return of Sebastien Loeb.
The starting order favored Loeb in the first stage, but I prefer that in the second, when he was positioned just like his rivals, he was also ahead. In Corsica it will hurt to be delayed, especially if it rains in the first stage. Last year the car went very well, and Loeb feels comfortable at the wheel. He likes how he goes on asphalt and has only made some adjustments in the adjustments to adapt it to his riding.
Do you think you could increase your number of shares? Are you going to convince him to do a complete program next year?
This year's program is three participations and that will not change. It would be a dream to have Loeb in 2019. But it's something I do not think we'll talk about until the end of the Rally of Spain. I do not think I want to do a complete program, because, among other things, some rallies do not want to go. His return has been good for the sport. It's a legend, and it's fine to get it back, but I think it's more important to look for new legends among young drivers.
Will it be a priority for Citroën to recover Ogier?
It is still early to talk about the market. Of course we are going to work on it, but we still do not know if Sebastien will decide to retire at the end of the season, or if he wants to continue.
Could I go back Sordo? Is there a chance that Sainz will run a rally with Citroën?
We know Sordo well and we appreciate him. It's on our list, but I've already said it's still early to talk about the market. Regarding Carlos, the truth is that it is not in our programming.

Until when the continuity of Citroën in the World Cup is assured?
The program will last between three and five years, and we are in the second. Our continuity will depend on many things, for example the regulation. You have to get more brands, or at least not leave any of the four. I do not believe that the future is electric vehicles, but we must offer brands an appetizing championship for their technologies. There are very expensive aspects, such as tests. A test day can cost up to 100,000 euros, and we have 55 per year.

https://as.com/motor/2018/03/31/mas_motor/1522530556_585907.html?id_externo_rsoc=comp_tw

[janvanvurpa]

i think you're not getting it.
yes, reactions can be trained. yes, a 65 year old can have faster reactions than the average 20 year old.

but, at age 65 you will never be able to train your reactions to be as fast as you would have been able at age 20.



Sorry but I think it is you who are getting lost and fixating on one little thing which amateurs love to obsess on...
I said that the physical training for rallydrivers---and those girly-boys who keep to asfalt in F1 is primarily to make the guys MINDS stronger to deal with stress, because the physical strength demands are very low compared or relatif to some other motosports..
I really don't think that can be seriously debated.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WOcDL35YAOw&t=570s

I think its fairly obvious that the physical requirements for the guys in that video above are orders of magnitude higher to do that for 35+ minutes than a rallydriver doing a 10-15 minute SS in a car with servo steering, nice little gearchange, and huge brakes, and no shower of rock peppering him ...
The bike guys still have the mental stress--lines, gearchange, position, etc that a rally driver does, but on top of that extremely hard WORK...and 30 or 35 guys ALL with equipment as good as what you have....

Or as I suggested some guys do this nearly nonstop
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_0TcICyDCo


drive 300km in the woods in one day versus over 3 days and call it fun.. I did when I retired and before I did rally.

One can be a rally fan, sure but is it required to pretend that it is physically the hardest motorsport and requires unusual 'strength"?

I have done the motocross (professionally), long hard enduros in my early 30s for fun (did pretty good too) and when I got old and beat up, and tired of being wet and cold--then I did gravel rally....It seemed to me a natural progression from harder to easier as I got older..

That is why I asked about all the competition you have done..looking for some common ground to assist in both of us understanding..and to see if your opinion is from reading or actual doing it...

(and yes my reactions are slower now but they are still faster than 19-20 year old "gamers"...and yesterday I was very tired after loading and unloading TONs in the last several days...Did you take the test? et le resultat? )

[Mk2 RS2000]

It's not just the fact that Mills is 54, more that he has also been out of top level competition for so long.

But for just one event maybe his adrenalin will get him through ok ...

Don't forget that he is an International level shooter. The stress, mind control and reaction time in trap shooting is of the highest order.

[Mk2 RS2000]

...Did you take the test? et le resultat? )

Just tried it three times, slowest was the first run at 0.248 2nd run 0.201, 3rd run 0.206. I guess my reactions are still quick enough to take my RS2000 out for the occasional outing on gravel.

[janvanvurpa]

Just tried it three times, slowest was the first run at 0.248 2nd run 0.201, 3rd run 0.206. I guess my reactions are still quick enough to take my RS2000 out for the occasional outing on gravel.


I don't know...we have been told you cannot have reactions like a 19 year old...and that's much better than most 19 year old kids<<
You better check with an expert..

[dimviii]

Just tried it three times, slowest was the first run at 0.248 2nd run 0.201, 3rd run 0.206. I guess my reactions are still quick enough to take my RS2000 out for the occasional outing on gravel.

you may be quick enough to take your RS 2000,but we dont know if you quick enough against jan with the volvo.
i bet 2 beers to jan .

[racerx1979]

Great news!

[janvanvurpa]

you may be quick enough to take your RS 2000,but we dont know if you quick enough against jan with the volvo.
i bet 2 beers to jan .


What Volvo_?


my cars are a MIGHTY Saab 96 with a motor ++and a shell way better than they used 'back in the ´day' (we have loose rules) and a group N and a 1/2 4x4 Ford Cosworth 4x4 (getting converted BACK to RWD)..And me against an NedZedder in an Escort??????? YIKES!!!!!


I'm fawked!:arrows:

[Mk2 RS2000]

I don't know...we have been told you cannot have reactions like a 19 year old...and that's much better than most 19 year old kids<<
You better check with an expert..

Perhaps both of us are like good wine, we have improved with age, either that or the test is very flattering and kind to us when we enter our age.

[jbmarcus21]

FIA ended Power Stage strategy with new rule : "No start at time no bonus Points" ► http://bit.ly/2q4nlVc

[AndyRAC]

Changing the rules mid season is a 'no-no' unless for safety reasons...... but it's not the first or last time from the FiA.

[Hartusvuori]

Changing the rules mid season is a 'no-no' unless for safety reasons...... but it's not the first or last time from the FiA.

What makes this change so wrong? All drivers should have had a chance to be late on purpose for PS during the season?

[EstWRC]

oh no if Eddie now sees this....

[PLuto]

Changing the rules mid season is a 'no-no' unless for safety reasons...... but it's not the first or last time from the FiA.

I think everybody should expect that FIA will made this change. They are stupid they didnt think about it before...

[KiwiWRCfan]

Changing the rules mid season is a 'no-no' unless for safety reasons...... but it's not the first or last time from the FiA.

You will be very pleased to read FIA's explanation that it is indeed for safety reasons

This will take place with immediate effect for safety reasons. ...
https://www.fia.com/news/wrc-decision-wmsc-about-powerstage

[Andre Oliveira]

Pfff safety reasons? Ahah television deals

[mknight]

LOL, technically the safety reasons are off course correct. Even though we all know that TV and "sporting" reasons are as much or move important.

Anyway strictly speaking this change should have been done at the same time powerstage points were introduced (2014). That it took so long before someone exploited this is actually quite amazing.

[greencroft]

You will be very pleased to read FIA's explanation that it is indeed for safety reasons

This will take place with immediate effect for safety reasons. ...
https://www.fia.com/news/wrc-decision-wmsc-about-powerstage

I hope that this isn't the wording they used in the actual regulation. "In the given order" seems subject to abuse as if one driver does it out of order, he will have an influence on the order of others therefore potentially denying others of PS points. For example, assume that the "given order" was drivers A, B, C, D, E. If driver B goes late and fits in between D & E, then the new order is A, C, D, B, E. Of the 5 drivers here, none of them have the same driver in front and behind them as they did in the original order. Sure the FIA will have worked this out but you never know!

[KiwiWRCfan]

I hope that this isn't the wording they used in the actual regulation. "In the given order" seems subject to abuse as if one driver does it out of order, he will have an influence on the order of others therefore potentially denying others of PS points. For example, assume that the "given order" was drivers A, B, C, D, E. If driver B goes late and fits in between D & E, then the new order is A, C, D, B, E. Of the 5 drivers here, none of them have the same driver in front and behind them as they did in the original order. Sure the FIA will have worked this out but you never know!

seems like the order is clear enough
13.3 contains various clauses related to Power Stage

"13.3.3 Details of the running of the stage must be included in the Supplementary regulations.
The start order for the Power Stage for all crews which will be covered by Live-TV will be communicated by the Clerk of the Course in the regroup preceding the Power Stage"

[GravelBen]

What makes this change so wrong? All drivers should have had a chance to be late on purpose for PS during the season?

Just that 3 drivers have gained championship points from exploiting the weakness of that rule, changing the rule (even a change to what it probably should have been all along) essentially gives them an unfair advantage because other drivers now won't have the opportunity to gain points in the same way.

From the FIA perspective that is obviously the lesser of two evils when compared with letting drivers/teams carry on with those antics for the rest of the season though.

[PLuto]

I hope that this isn't the wording they used in the actual regulation. "In the given order" seems subject to abuse as if one driver does it out of order, he will have an influence on the order of others therefore potentially denying others of PS points. For example, assume that the "given order" was drivers A, B, C, D, E. If driver B goes late and fits in between D & E, then the new order is A, C, D, B, E. Of the 5 drivers here, none of them have the same driver in front and behind them as they did in the original order. Sure the FIA will have worked this out but you never know!

This new formulation in regulations is stupid. I dont understand why they do it like amateurs... It should be very simple - any penalty in TC before power stage or at the start means no points from Power Stage. Easy way...

[Franky]

Just that 3 drivers have gained championship points from exploiting the weakness of that rule, changing the rule (even a change to what it probably should have been all along) essentially gives them an unfair advantage because other drivers now won't have the opportunity to gain points in the same way.

Apparently there aren't too many running to the barricades shouting for the cheaters to be stripped of all points and banned for the rest of the season for unsportsmanlike behaviour.

No matter how, at least now the mess is sort of sorted.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Whatever happened about M-Sport's appeal of the PS time penalty in Mexico ?

[dimviii]

Opens&Tightens

#WRC News&Updates
@HMSGOfficial's @thierryneuville @nicolasgilsoul will be present during Shakedown at the next @CFRallye round, #LyonCharbonnièresRhône.
They are expected to drive #i20WRC

[SubaruNorway]

Some good news coming from Østberg this or next week
https://parcferme.no/rally/varsler-positive-citroen-nyheter-etter-at-han-har-kjort-down-under/

[N.O.T]

Some good news coming from Østberg this or next week
https://parcferme.no/rally/varsler-positive-citroen-nyheter-etter-at-han-har-kjort-down-under/

is he retiring ?

[BigWorm]

https://www.motorsport-news.co.uk/news/rallying-news/wrc/safari-rally-wont-feature-in-2019-wrc/

No Safari in 2019

[Eli]

On the same subject (as Safari used at least to be an endurance event):

https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/135340/todt-denies-agenda-against-rally-endurance

[AnttiL]

https://www.motorsport-news.co.uk/news/rallying-news/wrc/safari-rally-wont-feature-in-2019-wrc/

No Safari in 2019

I think this is a weird headline because it wasn't even planned to be included in 2019. They were just going to do the candidate event with WRC spec next year for a possible 2020 return to WRC.

[BigWorm]

I think this is a weird headline because it wasn't even planned to be included in 2019. They were just going to do the candidate event with WRC spec next year for a possible 2020 return to WRC.

https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/127315/safari-rally-poised-to-rejoin-wrc-in-2019

Wasn't planned maybe but they we're hoping to include it according to David Evans back in 2016.

[AndyRAC]

Today may want endurance, but the teams, and the Promoter most certainly do not want endurance - as they think it's a 'hard sell'.

Funnily enough, other motorsport series seem to embrace the endurance element, and these events are successful - so who is right?

[Andre Oliveira]

Jokers: https://www.fia.com/sites/default/files/toutesvoitures_2018_05.04.2018.pdf

[jbmarcus21]

Thierry Neuville will drive 2nd round of France Rally Championship (SHAKEDOWN Lyon Charbonnières) with i20WRC ► http://bit.ly/2qtCTkQ

[BigWorm]

Thierry Neuville will drive 2nd round of France Rally Championship (SHAKEDOWN Lyon Charbonnières) with i20WRC ► http://bit.ly/2qtCTkQ

New setup test for the car?

[dupanton]

New setup test for the car?

No, just driving with some VIPs on the shakedown, nothing more.

[jbmarcus21]

Very important week for Chile Rally this weekend with FIA watch �� candidate event around Concepción city ... Details ➡️ http://bit.ly/2HnHSOm

[Andre Oliveira]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Da446JBXUAAmcsO?format=jpg&name=large