Name that Car 2

[Phoenixent]

Yeah, it SHOULD be Wavephore there because I have another picture of the car with road course wings and it clearly has Wavephore there. But it just doesn't look like Wavephore to me in this picture. I don't see any 'w' or 'v'. I have a very very poor picture of his car (#22 Wavephore, design is the same as the Herdez car, just no Herdez logos) from Phoenix in 1995 and the rear wing logo looks very similar. The last few letters look like 'shift' to me. Thanks anyways.

I noticed that on some of Arie's cars the Wavephore on the wings were 180 off so you read them from the rear maybe that is the samething. The problem on the photo is the split element on the rear wing changes the way the graphics look. Are you building a model of the 1996 car? If I remember right wasn't this car upside down when he crashed in Las Vegas?

Sorry I could not help you on this more the early IRL photos are tough to find.

[Phoenixent]

Hello SoCal. :wave:

[Phoenixent]

While we are waiting.

Here a photo.

Driver, Car, Year, & Track

http://shutter03.pictures.aol.com/data/pictures/14/00C/17/F7/E2/03/9Qlgdj+FZU5oYUg6PhiF2y2NenO84+zS0258.jpg

[SoCalPVguy]

These are two photos of thehttp://transfers.mep-llc.com/files/Name.That.car.030808B.jpg
same car/driver...
Car type/mfgr./Track/Driver/Year...

http://transfers.mep-llc.com/files/Name.that.car.030808A.jpg

[SoCalPVguy]

While we are waiting.

Here a photo.

Driver, Car, Year, & Track

http://shutter03.pictures.aol.com/data/pictures/14/00C/17/F7/E2/03/9Qlgdj+FZU5oYUg6PhiF2y2NenO84+zS0258.jpg

49th Annual Indy 500: 16
Len Sutton Bryant Heating & Cooling Vollstedt/Ford 177 Running

[SoCalPVguy]

I meant to add 1965.

[!!WALDO!!]

I meant to add 1965.


Who drove the car later in 1965?

[!!WALDO!!]

This is a very famous Car that Rodger Ward drove in 1955.

1. What happened to this car in 1955
2. What was its biggest claim to fame
3. What year did it race its last National Championship Race.

[Phoenixent]

49th Annual Indy 500: 16
Len Sutton Bryant Heating & Cooling Vollstedt/Ford 177 Running

Hi SoCal. :wave:

Right Car and Year. :up:

Keep Digging.

[Phoenixent]

This is a very famous Car that Rodger Ward drove in 1955.

1. What happened to this car in 1955
2. What was its biggest claim to fame
3. What year did it race its last National Championship Race.

My dad was on Rodger's pit crew. I will have to ask him what year and where. Here goes for your photo.

#1. It was one of several cars involed in the Vukovich crash.
#2. It was Troy Ruttmans 1952 Indy Winner.
#3. Dick Atkins drove it in the 1965 Sacramento 100.

[!!WALDO!!]

My dad was on Rodger's pit crew. I will have to ask him what year and where. Here goes for your photo.

#1. It was one of several cars involed in the Vukovich crash.
#2. It was Troy Ruttmans 1952 Indy Winner.
#3. Dick Atkins drove it in the 1965 Sacramento 100.

#1 The axle broke on the 1951 Kuzma coming out of turn two wrecking on the back stretch and taking Al Keller and Johnny Boyd with him. Vukovich who always said "never make a right turn here otherwise they will take you home in a box", elected to try to squeeze between the spinning Boyd and the outside wall, a right turn and the rest is history. Billy Garrett qualified the car in 1956, the last year a "dirt car" would start the 500. There were 2 others.

#2 Bill Vukovich was leading the 1952 500 when the streering broke in the north end and Troy Ruttman in the #98 Agajanian 1951 Kuzma Offy took the lead and went on to win.

#3 Dick Atkins drove the car, now the San Leandro Pipe Line after the Lynch Mob sold the car. Dee Jones went from 23rd to 9th, 9 laps down at the 1965 PIR Jimmy Bryan 150. Then Dick finished 12th after qualifying 18th fastest. He spun out with 5 laps to go.
Dick qualified for the PIR Bobby Ball 200 and finished 12th after qualifying 25th of 26 and finished 10 laps behind Foyt/Andretti.
The car ran in the CRA from 1966-1971 and was then restored.

I am doing a history some Kuzmas
Here who drove this car:
Walt Faulkner**, Fred Agabashian, Troy Ruttman**, Bill Vukovich**, Tony Bettenhausen, Chuck Stevenson**, Gene Hartley, Johnny Parsons, Rodger Ward, Earl Motter,Billy Garrett, Bill Cheesbourg, Johnny Tolan, Jimmy Davies, Dempsey Wilson, Arnie Knepper, Bobby Unser, Bill Cantrell, Dee Jones and Dick Atkins.
* Won races in this car.

[!!WALDO!!]

Who drove the car later in 1965?

Len Sutton Indianapolis/Milwaukee/Langhorne
Billy Foster Trenton Summer 150, Atlanta 250 (3rd) Milwaukee 150 and 200, Trenton 200 (Wrecked in Practice) and Phoenix, 2 laps behind Adkins in the 1952 winner.
In 1966 the Car was sold to Jim Robbins and carried the #66
Billy Foster at Phoenix 150.
Cale Yarborough Indianapolis, IRP (Wrecked in Practice)
Bobby Unser Atlanta 300
Mario Andretti Langhorne 150 (Wrecked his own car)
Chris Amon Mt Fuji 200 (Non Point: 5th fastest, dropped out)
In 1967 Sold to Don Hayhoe, had a turbo Offy installed.
Don Meacham Missed the show---Indianapolis, Milwaukee
Bruce Walkup Hanford (Wrecked in Practice), Phoenix 22nd to 13rd.
In 1968
Bruce Walkup Hanford 22nd to 13th, First altnernate Indianapolis 500.
Last time I remember it ran. The Cleaver-Brooks Hayhoe team went with a Brabham Chassis in the #59 car and stayed with that from Indy on.

[!!WALDO!!]

What history do these cars share prior to these photos in 1964? Two posts:
7th Dick Ratmmann

[!!WALDO!!]

8th Bob Harkey....

[SoCalPVguy]

These are two photos of thehttp://transfers.mep-llc.com/files/Name.That.car.030808B.jpg
same car/driver...
Car type/mfgr./Track/Driver/Year...

http://transfers.mep-llc.com/files/Name.that.car.030808A.jpg

Don't forget, this one is still in play...

[!!WALDO!!]

Don't forget, this one is still in play...

Not Indy thats for sure. Note the woman on the left.

[!!WALDO!!]

Looking at that picture it has to be from the 1920s. Due to the tires. The problem I am having is AAA had a rule that did not allow cars with the number that ended with ZERO except the number 10 that denoted 10th in the previous years points.

It appears to be on a hard surface in the pit shot. If I didn't know better I would say Langhorne but Champ races did not occur until later there.

Remember prior to 1920 it was two seaters and again from 1930-1937. This car was a beauty and looked real racy.

[SoCalPVguy]

I will give you a hint.
The car is from the 20's but the picture is of an event in 30's.

[!!WALDO!!]

I will give you a hint.
The car is from the 20's but the picture is of an event in 30's.

Looking at it again it is a Board track. Only two that made it in the 1930s were Bridgeville, PA in 1930 one race and Altoona, PA that ran until 1931.

I believe this car was a Fronty Ford and renumber 41 and either Chet Miller or Paul Bost drove that car. I have seen pictures of Chet Miller in the 1950s, killed in a Novi in 1953 at Indy.

My only guess.

[Chris R]

I was thinking it was at Roosevelt Raceway for the Vanderbilt cup race in 1936 - but I cannot find a #40 car - I was also thinking it may be an ERA....

[!!WALDO!!]

I was thinking it was at Roosevelt Raceway for the Vanderbilt cup race in 1936 - but I cannot find a #40 car - I was also thinking it may be an ERA....

Actually no 20,30,40,50,60,70,80,90 was not allowed until 1967. It had to do with scoring.

So the truth be know the STP Turbine of 1967 was the first #40 at Indy and very well could have been the first in Champ Car/Indy Car history.

The picture is taken on the boards, you can see that.

[SoCalPVguy]

Another hint: It is not a board track.

[Chris R]

It does not look like dirt - that leaves Roosevelt/Long Island, Elgin, and Mines Field/LA Airport.

Was the race AAA sanctioned??

[!!WALDO!!]

Another hint: It is not a board track.

Sure, I can see the boards or what appears to be boards.

The other issue since 40 could not be used then it became 4 if 4 was not used if used then up to 41 or higher.

[SoCalPVguy]

It does not look like dirt - that leaves Roosevelt/Long Island, Elgin, and Mines Field/LA Airport.

Was the race AAA sanctioned??

Think outside the continental box...

[!!WALDO!!]

Think outside the continental box...

Well not to many will know of a car outside the U.S. other than Jimmy Murphy's Deusenberg at France in the early 1920's. That car I could pick out.

[Chris R]

Think outside the continental box...

What is the connection to Indycars/Champcars? It is fun to do the research - but I want to make sure I am even looking in the right neighborhood.... ;)

[!!WALDO!!]

What is the connection to Indycars/Champcars? It is fun to do the research - but I want to make sure I am even looking in the right neighborhood.... ;)

The thing is in 1930, the Indy cars/Champ cars became two seaters.

If overseas, then no neighborhood exists.

[Phoenixent]

I would suggest that SoCal submit a new photo that is related to Indycar/Champcars. I agree with Chris, that research is fun but keep it to the scope of the forum. I would also suggest that the photos shown if GP related be posted in the F1 forum. But this is only my opinion. :D

[Chris R]

Well, I think there is some room for latitude... For one thing - given what he has told us so far- the event is in the 1930's - there were single seaters in 1938 & 1939 in all events. Were there any AOWR exhibition races in the during the 1930's??

Rumbledrome.com also shows single seaters in 1933. I think there was a fair amount of leeway in the depression era.... Clearly the Vanderbilt races had single seaters in 1936 and 1937.

Also, if this is say (and I don't think it is) Pete DePaolo in Spain before his accident in 1934 (can't even find out what type of race he was injured in) it is relevant as he was a great AOWR driver of the era...

SoCal has been contributing to this thread for a while and has had some nice contributions - as of now, there is plenty of room for this photo to be on topic... The 1930's was a very diverse era and the general organization of AOWR was well, dis-organized, so if could be many things that are not AAA and still be highly relevant to this thread.

Now, for my observations about the photo - it is not a board track - it is too flat. The seams beneath the car in the second picture appear to be seams in concrete to my eye.

The people around the car are very well dressed for the era and they seems to be pretty warmly dressed.

The two pictures were not taken at the same time since there is no number on the car in the first picture.

The whole car seems more Euro than American to me - but that is just a gut reaction....

The grille sort of reminds me of a Massey/Massey-Harris/ Massey-Ferguson tractor....

The driver looks vaguely familiar - I want to say it is Rex Mays - but I am pretty sure it is not....

[Chris R]

I would suggest that SoCal submit a new photo that is related to Indycar/Champcars. I agree with Chris, that research is fun but keep it to the scope of the forum. I would also suggest that the photos shown if GP related be posted in the F1 forum. But this is only my opinion. :D

of course, despite my last post - if the car is not anything to do with AOWR - a re-post would be in order... ;)

[Chris R]

definitely off topic
Whitney Straight - Brooklands

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/78/WhitneyStaightBrooklands.jpg

my apologies for insisting it could have been on topic.....

[Chris R]

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://blog.hemmings.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/07/DADS%2520DUESENBERG%2520013_1.jpg&imgrefurl=http://blog.hemmings.com/index.php/category/restorations/page/2/&h=337&w=450&sz=32&hl=en&start=11&um=1&tbnid=8rw6vUUpAKGMiM:&tbnh=95&tbnw=127&prev=/images%3Fq%3DWhitney%2BStraight%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den %26client%3Dsafari%26rls%3Den-us%26sa%3DN

here's the car - a Dusenberg!! so it is an American Indycar and an ex-pat....

[Phoenixent]

of course, despite my last post - if the car is not anything to do with AOWR - a re-post would be in order... ;)

I was just thinking about our F1 Forum brothers and sisters. Since they do have the same type of thread but not as many postings as we do have here. :D

Nice restoration articles on that link Chris. :up:

[SoCalPVguy]

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://blog.hemmings.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/07/DADS%2520DUESENBERG%2520013_1.jpg&imgrefurl=http://blog.hemmings.com/index.php/category/restorations/page/2/&h=337&w=450&sz=32&hl=en&start=11&um=1&tbnid=8rw6vUUpAKGMiM:&tbnh=95&tbnw=127&prev=/images%3Fq%3DWhitney%2BStraight%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den %26client%3Dsafari%26rls%3Den-us%26sa%3DN

here's the car - a Dusenberg!! so it is an American Indycar and an ex-pat....

You found it !!! How the heck did you do that ??? I tried to make it as obsure as possible having had so many previous oned anwered immediatley...

Whitney Straight
Dusenberg Indy car (probably from 1929)
Brooklands, England
Photo taken in 1933 for an attempt at the worlds closed course speed record.

[!!WALDO!!]

You found it !!! How the heck did you do that ??? I tried to make it as obsure as possible having had so many previous oned anwered immediatley...

Whitney Straight
Dusenberg Indy car (probably from 1929)
Brooklands, England
Photo taken in 1933 for an attempt at the worlds closed course speed record.


If it was a 1929 car, then who drove it here. I kept looking at the surface as hard and outside of Indy the only hard surface tracks were Boards. After 1931 it was Indy then Dirt. Here is one for you, what track was the next hard surfaced race track Indy cars raced at? Hint: Basement Bessie won it in 1950.

Brooklands killed what Indy "500" Champion? Note the quotations.
In the 1960's the remaining parts of Brooklands was used in a Major Motion Picture (About racing, not car racing though)
What was Brooklands surface?

[Chris R]

I finally realized there was a good chance it was Brooklands - as Waldo said - there were not a lot of paved options in the era.... so I Googled "Americans at Brooklands" and low and behold - there was the car.... so I found it by somewhat focused blind luck!! ;)

As far as Waldo's questions:

According to the Hemmings article the car was a 1927 Dusenberg - one of 7 built and the only one remaining....

Dario Resta - winner of the pre-WWI Indy 350 (??) died at Brooklands in the 1920's

I thought the majority of Brooklands was concrete - I am sure the banks were...

Not sure about the movie or the track - not sure what "Basement Bessie' is....

I found a neat store of pictures at home - I'll post something tonight....

[Chris R]

Right - so basement bessie is the car you were writing about on another thread - duh.... :eek:

looked up the track - really interesting - didn't realize that was only the second paved oval... let's just say that TG didn't exactly have an original idea and see if anyone else knows....

[SoCalPVguy]

I would suggest that SoCal submit a new photo that is related to Indycar/Champcars. I agree with Chris, that research is fun but keep it to the scope of the forum. I would also suggest that the photos shown if GP related be posted in the F1 forum. But this is only my opinion. :D

The picture in question is of an INDY car (Duesenberg) so I believe it is on topic.


The name of the thread is Name THAT Car, if there are some specific rules, maybe it should be renamed Name that INDY car...., although a moot point as the object in question is an Indy car.

SoCal

[Phoenixent]

The picture in question is of an INDY car (Duesenberg) so I believe it is on topic.


The name of the thread is Name THAT Car, if there are some specific rules, maybe it should be renamed Name that INDY car...., although a moot point as the object in question is an Indy car.

SoCal


Not to get in a contest with you socal. This is Name That Car in the INDYCAR forum. Your photo although it's cool would be the same as a photo of a Lola in the USBOSS series in Europe.

Back in the days before World War II car went back and forth across the pond and even copied like the Miller that Maserati copied. But a Miller used in the French GP to me would be a F1 car as it has been modified for used in those races.

[!!WALDO!!]

As far as Waldo's questions:

According to the Hemmings article the car was a 1927 Dusenberg - one of 7 built and the only one remaining....

Jimmy Gleason #53 Duesenberg Duesenberg DuesSc
Fred Winnai #42 Duesenberg Duesenberg DuesSc
Ernie Triplett #47 Buckeye Duesenberg DuesSc
Bill Spence #10 Duesenberg Duesenberg DuesSc
Frank Sweigert #54 Duesenberg Duesenberg DuesSc DNQ
Bill Robinson #24 Duesenberg Duesenberg DuesSc DNQ
Thane Houser #41 Duesenberg Duesenberg DuesSc DNQ

Bets on #10 or #41


Dario Resta - winner of the pre-WWI Indy 350 (??) died at Brooklands in the 1920's

Correct another winner of Scottish and Italian heritage.


I thought the majority of Brooklands was concrete - I am sure the banks were...

Straights were brick. Remember that IMS paved there corners in the 1940's I believe.


Not sure about the movie

Magificent Men In Their Flying Machines

[SoCalPVguy]

Not to get in a contest with you socal. This is Name That Car in the INDYCAR forum.

And before that it was the CHAMPCAR FORUM, so where does that leave us ???? Nothing before 2003 was "Champ car" !

[Phoenixent]

And before that it was the CHAMPCAR FORUM, so where does that leave us ???? Nothing before 2003 was "Champ car" !

Wrong. What is now called Indycars were called Championship Cars. Also photo in 1982 Indy 500 year book licence plate says Champ Car. When my father worked on Rodger Ward's pit crew they were champ cars. They were also known as Indy Cars. So don't start with the Champcar bull, that name has been around since the start. Before it was a sanctioning body.

[SoCalPVguy]

Wrong. What is now called Indycars were called Championship Cars. Also photo in 1982 Indy 500 year book licence plate says Champ Car. When my father worked on Rodger Ward's pit crew they were champ cars. They were also known as Indy Cars. So don't start with the Champcar bull, that name has been around since the start. Before it was a sanctioning body.

Aye Yi Yi, have it your way, Im outta here.

Who died and appointed you moderator ?

One less Name that car participant for you, so you can have the whole darn thread to yourself.

[!!WALDO!!]

Wrong. What is now called Indycars were called Championship Cars. Also photo in 1982 Indy 500 year book licence plate says Champ Car. When my father worked on Rodger Ward's pit crew they were champ cars. They were also known as Indy Cars. So don't start with the Champcar bull, that name has been around since the start. Before it was a sanctioning body.

Interesting you bring this up. The term Indy Car was loosely used for the Roadsters because they only raced at Indianapolis. It wasn't until the late 1950's that they started to show up at Milwaukee for the August 200.
It is interesting, Milwaukee, Springfield programs called the Champ Cars or BIG CARS. Some assumed Big Cars to be Sprints but actually not as I saw a program from a "champ race" at Williams Grove that said BIG CARS.

Open Wheel racing has always had a hard time IDing itself. Midgets in the 1960's became Offy 110s and Compact Sprints. Sprints were Sprints and Spring and Big Cars.

So it was always a problem. So lets use the Lindsey Hopkins effort of 1965. He had a Lola/Ford that Bud Tingelstad raced at Indy, a laydown Kuzma Roadster Bud raced at Milwaukee and Kuzma Dirt Car Bud raced on the pavement at Langhorne in three races in a row. So which is the Indy Car? In my book the car that raced at Indy, the Lola/Ford. The Roadster now could fall into the Champ Car category as it did not race at Indy and the Dirt Car is a Big Car like the 1965 Program at Springfield called them.

[Phoenixent]

Aye Yi Yi, have it your way, Im outta here.

Who died and appointed you moderator ?

One less Name that car participant for you, so you can have the whole darn thread to yourself.

:rolleyes:

[Phoenixent]

Interesting you bring this up. The term Indy Car was loosely used for the Roadsters because they only raced at Indianapolis. It wasn't until the late 1950's that they started to show up at Milwaukee for the August 200.
It is interesting, Milwaukee, Springfield programs called the Champ Cars or BIG CARS. Some assumed Big Cars to be Sprints but actually not as I saw a program from a "champ race" at Williams Grove that said BIG CARS.

Open Wheel racing has always had a hard time IDing itself. Midgets in the 1960's became Offy 110s and Compact Sprints. Sprints were Sprints and Spring and Big Cars.

So it was always a problem. So lets use the Lindsey Hopkins effort of 1965. He had a Lola/Ford that Bud Tingelstad raced at Indy, a laydown Kuzma Roadster Bud raced at Milwaukee and Kuzma Dirt Car Bud raced on the pavement at Langhorne in three races in a row. So which is the Indy Car? In my book the car that raced at Indy, the Lola/Ford. The Roadster now could fall into the Champ Car category as it did not race at Indy and the Dirt Car is a Big Car like the 1965 Program at Springfield called them.


Most don't know the mess with the names Championship Cars, Champ Car, Indy Car or Big Car. The thing that brought the fans to the race was not the name of the cars or the sanctioning body it was the Drivers. The heroes for men and boys nation wide. That is something that has been lost before there was a split.

[!!WALDO!!]

Most don't know the mess with the names Championship Cars, Champ Car, Indy Car or Big Car. The thing that brought the fans to the race was not the name of the cars or the sanctioning body it was the Drivers. The heroes for men and boys nation wide. That is something that has been lost before there was a split.

Did you ever hear of this? At the Arizona State Fairgrounds in 1957, Jimmy Bryan fight for the National Championship and was leading the 100 mile race, the finale for the season. With 5 laps he went though the fence in turn 4 stayed on it and drove around Pat O'Connor with 3 laps left to win the race and win the title of Jim Rathmann.

There is a hero for men and boys. Actually as the drivers started to get paid they became prima donas.

[!!WALDO!!]

What history do these cars share prior to these photos in 1964? Two posts:
7th Dick Ratmmann



Still open

[!!WALDO!!]

http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=439685&postcount=1756
http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=439686&postcount=1757

This is still open and is real good. HINT:both are 1960 Watson Roadsters.

[Chris R]

ok, here's the next one. since it is a little bare hints forth-coming if necessary it is a pretty notable car....

[nanders]

ok, here's the next one. since it is a little bare hints forth-coming if necessary it is a pretty notable car....

looks like a watson. The radiator intake has the same shape and in the right place.

[Chris R]

Actually, I am a little blurry on the "brand" - it is listed alternately as Watson and Trevis......

[!!WALDO!!]

Actually, I am a little blurry on the "brand" - it is listed alternately as Watson and Trevis......


Floyd Trevis built race cars in Alliance, OH and in 1961 built a car from Watson's plans. (Wilkie was mad that in 1960, Watson built all those cars for customers and in 1961 he could only sell plans or build for Leader Card.)
That based on the Roll Bar is a Trevis.

Foyt won the 1961 500 in a Trevis and retired that car after the 1963 season in favor of a 1963 Watson he tried to sell but had to put buddy Ebb Rose in it for the 1963 500. That car went on to win the 500 in 1964.

Trevis built at least two cars for the 1961 season but only one from the Watson plans, that went to the Bob Bowes Team.

From 1963:
http://www.indy500.com/photo/gallery.php?series_id=a:2:{i:0;i:1;i:1;i:6;}&track_id=4&searchType=freeText&freeText=Trevis&photo_id=13649
Note the location of the oil tank...Back

Another pure Trevis (1962)
http://www.indy500.com/photo/gallery.php?series_id=a:2:{i:0;i:1;i:1;i:6;}&track_id=4&searchType=freeText&freeText=Trevis&photo_id=13564

[!!WALDO!!]

http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=439685&postcount=1756
http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=439686&postcount=1757

This is still open and is real good. HINT:both are 1960 Watson Roadsters.

Here is how they looked in 1960:
http://www.indy500.com/photo/gallery.php?series_id=a:2:{i:0;i:1;i:1;i:6;}&track_id=4&searchType=driver&drivername=Rodger%20Ward&offset=20

http://www.indy500.com/photo/gallery.php?series_id=a:2:{i:0;i:1;i:1;i:6;}&track_id=4&searchType=driver&drivername=Jim%20Rathmann&photo_id=12918

And how they looked on the cover of 500 Miles to Go!

http://www.indy500.com/photo/gallery.php?series_id=a:2:{i:0;i:1;i:1;i:6;}&track_id=4&searchType=driver&drivername=Jim%20Rathmann&photo_id=37806

[Phoenixent]

ok, here's the next one. since it is a little bare hints forth-coming if necessary it is a pretty notable car....

Nice photo Chris. :up:

I always wanted to post just a frame photo but did not have any available.

[Chris R]

Thanks Phoenix I thought it was a really cool picture - found it on a website about building models.....

I guess nobody wants to take a guess - I figured this one was purely about guessing....

Here are some hints:

One could say this was the ultimate roadster in a final sort of sense anyway....

The track is Indy.

The big fat tires that might have even been Goodyears ought to help with the year

Oh, and the car won the race....

[!!WALDO!!]

Thanks Phoenix I thought it was a really cool picture - found it on a website about building models.....

I guess nobody wants to take a guess - I figured this one was purely about guessing....

Here are some hints:

One could say this was the ultimate roadster in a final sort of sense anyway....

The track is Indy.

The big fat tires that might have even been Goodyears ought to help with the year



Oh, and the car won the race....

Already showed a picture of the car from 1963, the year that photo was taken.

http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=441982&postcount=1796

Must be on ignore.

[Phoenixent]

Already showed a picture of the car from 1963, the year that photo was taken.

http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=441982&postcount=1796

Must be on ignore.


You are not on my ignore list. It's just that it was Chris R's turn and I commented on his photo. I enjoyed your info but other members have listed photo's according to the way this tread is played. It is Name Car, Driver, Year and Track once that is correct it is your turn. Thanks. :)

[Chris R]

Already showed a picture of the car from 1963, the year that photo was taken.

http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=441982&postcount=1796

Must be on ignore.

Sorry Waldo, I did not realize that was an answer to my post - thought it was just clarification on the chassis manufacturers...

At any rate - you are pretty close with the 1963 picture but wrong year for sure right driver - I guess the jury would be out on the car... For what it is worth - those tires are Goodyears - I looked at some of the other photos in the series to confirm that....

[!!WALDO!!]

Sorry Waldo, I did not realize that was an answer to my post - thought it was just clarification on the chassis manufacturers...

At any rate - you are pretty close with the 1963 picture but wrong year for sure right driver - I guess the jury would be out on the car... For what it is worth - those tires are Goodyears - I looked at some of the other photos in the series to confirm that....

Foyt and Goodyear had a tire test in August of 1963 at IMS. The famous sneeking Firestone Tires to the fence so that Polariods could be taken then Goodyear would bring a tire.

In 1964 Goodyear came to the Speedway but the only car Foyt drove that had Goodyear tires on it was the Huffaker/RE Offy. (Got a picture someplace). The Roadster never had them on as Goodyear would not have tires for the Roadster ready until the second weekend and Foyt went with Firestones.

The Huffaker was a MG Liquid Suspension Car and was entered as #54 and once returned, Bob Vieth qualified it on day 3 with Goodyears.

Foyt did run 200+ at San Angelo, TX with Goodyears tires on the Trevis Roadster in one of its last efforts.

Also remember in 1963 there was a fight between cars running with tall tires ans shorter tires. Firestone did not make them available universally, until near qualifying. Real dung storm.

[Chris R]

ok, here's another photo of the same car - the car is identified as Foyt's 1964 winner at Indy. You can clearly see the car has Goodyear tires on it in the photos - can't say they were one the track on the car or not on the track...

Waldo, you're up!! :)

[!!WALDO!!]

ok, here's another photo of the same car - the car is identified as Foyt's 1964 winner at Indy. You can clearly see the car has Goodyear tires on it in the photos - can't say they were one the track on the car or not on the track...

Waldo, you're up!! :)

As I said there was a Goodyear Tire test in August of 1963. Now Foyt had two cars in 1963. The Trevis and a 1963 Watson that he tried to sell but when Ebb Rose got bumped in Herb Porter's laydown, they pulled the Watson out and Ebb stuck it in and went 500 miles in the car. It was numbered 32.

Now I never knew for sure what car Foyt ran at Indy in that Goodyear test in August. One would assume it was the car that he had driven since Indy of 1961, the 1961 Trevis. In today's world you would test in the spare car, the 1963 Watson.

Interesting that Foyt won the 500 on Firestone Tires in 1964 but wore a Goodyear driving suit. Firestone gave him a check for $5,000 for the win, he returned it. Later he won the Firecracker 400 in a Dodge wearing Goodyear tires but he wore a Firestone driving suit.
http://www.indy500.com/photo/gallery.php?series_id=a:2:{i:0;i:1;i:1;i:6;}&track_id=4&searchType=driver&drivername=1964&photo_id=13194

http://www.indy500.com/photo/gallery.php?series_id=a:2:{i:0;i:1;i:1;i:6;}&track_id=4&searchType=driver&drivername=1964&photo_id=12765

http://www.indy500.com/photo/gallery.php?series_id=a:2:{i:0;i:1;i:1;i:6;}&track_id=4&searchType=driver&drivername=1964&photo_id=56546

http://www.indy500.com/photo/gallery.php?series_id=a:2:{i:0;i:1;i:1;i:6;}&track_id=4&searchType=driver&drivername=Trevis&photo_id=13649

http://www.indy500.com/photo/gallery.php?drivername=Ebb+Rose&track_id=4&series_id=a%3A2%3A%7Bi%3A0%3Bi%3A1%3Bi%3A1%3Bi%3A6 %3B%7D&searchType=driver

[Chris R]

so you think these pictures were taken at the 1963 tire test???

[!!WALDO!!]

so you think these pictures were taken at the 1963 tire test???

Yes. I got a rare picture I am sending to you.

[!!WALDO!!]

Got it







http://www.indy500.com/photo/gallery.php?series_id=a:2:{i:0;i:1;i:1;i:6;}&track_id=4&searchType=driver&drivername=Bob%20Veith&photo_id=13719

After being returned.

[!!WALDO!!]

How about this beauty. Tell me something about its history. This photo is from 1970 but it was in the 500 actually years prior.

[Phoenixent]

How about this beauty. Tell me something about its history. This photo is from 1970 but it was in the 500 actually years prior.

First race Indy 1965 team Dean Racing driver Mario Andretti finishing 3rd scoring one win and three poles that year. In 1966 the car scored nine poles and entered victory lane seven times. It was then sold to Jack Adams and driven by Jim McElreath, Wally Dallenbach and Rick Muther lat race run 1971 Indy 500. Engine originally a Ford DOHC then Adams used a Ford DOHC and Offy's 168TC and 159TC.

[!!WALDO!!]

First race Indy 1965 team Dean Racing driver Mario Andretti finishing 3rd scoring one win and three poles that year. In 1966 the car scored nine poles and entered victory lane seven times. It was then sold to Jack Adams and driven by Jim McElreath, Wally Dallenbach and Rick Muther lat race run 1971 Indy 500. Engine originally a Ford DOHC then Adams used a Ford DOHC and Offy's 168TC and 159TC.

If you were a girl, I would say "Marry Me"!! Damn good!!

[!!WALDO!!]

The history of this car. Also it did something to make the 500 field that year that was extremely rare. I was there on day 3 when it occurred.

[Phoenixent]

If you were a girl, I would say "Marry Me"!! Damn good!!

Waldo you made my day with that one. Thanks :)

It's amazing the history on this car and they just restored it if I am not mistaken.

Also for those who wanted to know the photo I had put up before was of Billy Foster in a Vollstedt-Offy at PIR 1965.

New photo coming up.

[Phoenixent]

Drivers, Cars, Year, & Track. Just look at those crowds watching this race. :eek:

http://shutter12.pictures.aol.com/data/pictures/18/009/6F/7D/21/52/7OFjTySmUAX8evVDHhIGumkwqYU7QNU30258.jpg

[Chris R]

Awesome photo Phoenix!

The leading car is a Dusenberg driver Peter DePaolo
The following car is a Miller

Since it is a dirt track I am going to guess it is Syracuse probably 1924 (the race in which Jimmy Murphy died)

If I am right about the track and year the following car is most likely Tommy Milton - but the number on the hood necessarily doesn't look like "5" so I might be wrong....

[Phoenixent]

Awesome photo Phoenix!

The leading car is a Dusenberg driver Peter DePaolo
The following car is a Miller

Since it is a dirt track I am going to guess it is Syracuse probably 1924 (the race in which Jimmy Murphy died)

If I am right about the track and year the following car is most likely Tommy Milton - but the number on the hood necessarily doesn't look like "5" so I might be wrong....

Right Driver for the 12 car. :up:
Right on both cars. :up:


Still looking for the year and track.

I still can't believe the crowds back then. Their everywhere in the ditch on the roofs and standing deep along the fence. Everyone was brave back then to come to the races both drivers and spectators.

[!!WALDO!!]

Right Driver for the 12 car. :up:
Right on both cars. :up:


Still looking for the year and track.

I still can't believe the crowds back then. Their everywhere in the ditch on the roofs and standing deep along the fence. Everyone was brave back then to come to the races both drivers and spectators.


De Paulo leading the Great Tommy Milton, early in the 1924 Syracuse 150 miler that later, Tommy's "friend" and rival Jimmy Murphy would go through the third turn fence driving a piece of wood through his heart.

Crowds in the 1920's were better than anytime in the history of Open Wheel. By the time the 1962 edition of this race came around the crowd was under 5,000. More things to do, less time to do it in.

[!!WALDO!!]

Also for those who wanted to know the photo I had put up before was of Billy Foster in a Vollstedt-Offy at PIR 1965.

FORD not OFFY

http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=438617&postcount=1746
http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=439678&postcount=1755

[Phoenixent]

FORD not OFFY

http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=438617&postcount=1746
http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=439678&postcount=1755

:laugh: Your right I should have looked a my photo again. Thanks. :)

[Phoenixent]

De Paulo leading the Great Tommy Milton, early in the 1924 Syracuse 150 miler that later, Tommy's "friend" and rival Jimmy Murphy would go through the third turn fence driving a piece of wood through his heart.

Crowds in the 1920's were better than anytime in the history of Open Wheel. By the time the 1962 edition of this race came around the crowd was under 5,000. More things to do, less time to do it in.


Right Driver for the 12 car.
Right on both cars.


Still looking for the year and track.

I looked at the photo again and noticed they railroad rail strapped to those wood post for the infield guard rail. :eek:

[!!WALDO!!]

I d/l the photo and blew it up. I am looking very close to the surface. Peter drove #12 in 1924 and 1925. Syracuse, the NEW YORK STATE FAIRGOUNDS ran the only dirt race in 1924 and because of the death of Murphy, the 1925 season was all boards. This has a Horse Track appearence. Now there was a Laurel, MD Board track that may have been built over the Horse track, 1.25. Since there appears to be "a track" on the inside and the railing was a temp. Could that be it?

So if Syracuse in 1924, then Earl Cooper. If Laurel in 1925 then Peter (looks like the 500 winning car) and Harry Hartz.

With that much pillar work it was a regular fixture and not a temp track.

[Phoenixent]

Here a hint.

It was a non-points race and only one race was held with this track configuration but the track ran more events after.

[Chris R]

hmmm, I am kind of stumped - I tried Brooklands but to no avail.... :D ... If it is DePaolo in the #12 it must be 1924 or 1925. If it is not 1924 (from my last guess), it must be 1925 - but the only dirt in 1925 even in non-championship races I can find record of was Syracuse - but apparently DePaolo was not there... I tried to see if any of the board tracks might have been out of service and a dirt track substituted - but can find not reference....

are we even warm???

[Chris R]

oh and yeah - railroad track for fencing - not exactly "SAFER" walls huh??

[Phoenixent]

hmmm, I am kind of stumped - I tried Brooklands but to no avail.... :D ... If it is DePaolo in the #12 it must be 1924 or 1925. If it is not 1924 (from my last guess), it must be 1925 - but the only dirt in 1925 even in non-championship races I can find record of was Syracuse - but apparently DePaolo was not there... I tried to see if any of the board tracks might have been out of service and a dirt track substituted - but can find not reference....

are we even warm???

You are Correct on the Year. :up:
It not Syracuse but it is up in that part of the country.



I tried to see if any of the board tracks might have been out of service and a dirt track substituted - but can find not reference

Think in reverse of what you said. You are close. ;)

[Chris R]

oh , ok, it must be the July race at Rockingham in New Hampshire. As Waldo said - the second car must be Harry Hartz... By the official Fall race it was a Board track.....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rockingham_Park

good one!!

[Phoenixent]

oh , ok, it must be the July race at Rockingham in New Hampshire. As Waldo said - the second car must be Harry Hartz... By the official Fall race it was a Board track.....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rockingham_Park

good one!!

You are correct on the track. :up: It's Your Turn. :)

I like this photo it shows how we have come a long way on safety but have gone the other direction with crowds.

[Chris R]

here's the latest - a little challenging perhaps since the number is not visible.....

[Alexamateo]

Eddie Sachs
Kuzma-Offy
Indy
1959

[Chris R]

Eddie Sachs
Kuzma-Offy
Indy
1959

You got it!

your turn!

[Alexamateo]

The usual please.

[Chris R]

Gotta love that one -

1972 Antares Manta- Offy

Driver - Roger McCluskey

Apparently the car was designed to provide "jet assist" as air running through the radiators expanded out the back of the car.... It didn't work....

here another picture of another Antares (not sure of year)

[Chris R]

and another one....

I think they are both from 1972 also if so, the #42 is Swede Savage (DNQ) and the blue one is probably the car of Wally Dallenbach that also DNQ -both drivers qualified more conventional cars.... There is a neat little write up about the car in "Design and Development of the Indycar" by Roger Huntington - out of print but awesome book if you can find an old copy....

[Alexamateo]

you got it!

[!!WALDO!!]

and another one....

I think they are both from 1972 also if so, the #42 is Swede Savage (DNQ) and the blue one is probably the car of Wally Dallenbach that also DNQ -both drivers qualified more conventional cars.... There is a neat little write up about the car in "Design and Development of the Indycar" by Roger Huntington - out of print but awesome book if you can find an old copy....


Wally asked, where are the oars when he saw the Antares for the first time.

Ask yourself this other than McCluskey who else suceesfully qualified an Antares an in what year.

Swede and JR drove Gates modified cars. Swede as a 1970 Eagle and JR a 1970 Brabham. One reason Rutherford went to the Jim Malloy vacated Thermo-King car after Indy. Pat Patrick was trying to do things on the cheap.

[Phoenixent]

Wally asked, where are the oars when he saw the Antares for the first time.

Ask yourself this other than McCluskey who else suceesfully qualified an Antares an in what year.

Eldon Rasmussen 1979 Indianapolis Motor Speedway qualified 33rd finishing 23rd with a broken header.
Jan Sneva 1980 Ontario Motor Speedway qualified 23rd finishing 10th.

[!!WALDO!!]

Eldon Rasmussen 1979 Indianapolis Motor Speedway qualified 33rd finishing 23rd with a broken header.
Jan Sneva 1980 Ontario Motor Speedway qualified 23rd finishing 10th.


Very good.
Here is the Brabham "Gatesed"
http://www.indy500.com/photo/gallery.php?series_id=a:2:{i:0;i:1;i:1;i:6;}&track_id=4&offset=40&searchType=freeText&freeText=Johnny%20Rutherford&photo_id=13117

Here is the Eagle "Gatesed"
http://www.indy500.com/photo/gallery.php?series_id=a:2:{i:0;i:1;i:1;i:6;}&track_id=4&searchType=driver&drivername=Swede%20Savage&photo_id=13120

[!!WALDO!!]

Both cars as they appeared in the year of their birth.

http://www.indy500.com/photo/gallery.php?freeText=Jack+Brabham&searchType=freeText

http://www.indy500.com/photo/gallery.php?drivername=Dan+Gurney&track_id=4&series_id=a%3A2%3A%7Bi%3A0%3Bi%3A1%3Bi%3A1%3Bi%3A6 %3B%7D&searchType=driver

The Brabham car came close to winning Ontario that year, who was driving it that day?

[Mihai]

Very good.
Here is the Brabham "Gatesed"
http://www.indy500.com/photo/gallery.php?series_id=a:2:{i:0;i:1;i:1;i:6;}&track_id=4&offset=40&searchType=freeText&freeText=Johnny%20Rutherford&photo_id=13117

Now I know where Williams-BMW F1 team found inspiration for their 2003 ugly looking Grand Prix car. I used to joke about: "Did Chris Bangle design it too?"

http://www.f1-fansite.com/wallpaper/2004/launch/FW26-0800.jpg

[Chris R]

That 1970 Brabham that almost won at Ontario was driven by Lee Roy Yarbrough!! Even some of the NASCAR guys were getting in the Indycar action in those days.... I still find in interesting that the Allison brothers were both Indycar drivers at one point....

Anyway, here is the next one (courtesy of another poster on the board - thanks!!) The usual please (if you wish to make it a challenge please dis-regard the file name!!): Driver and car will get it - but an interesting follow-up question is who was the original intended driver of the car??.....

[Mihai]

Al Miller
Gerhart-Ford
1967 Indy 500

original intended driver: Bill Cheesbourg ?

[!!WALDO!!]

That 1970 Brabham that almost won at Ontario was driven by Lee Roy Yarbrough!! Even some of the NASCAR guys were getting in the Indycar action in those days.... I still find in interesting that the Allison brothers were both Indycar drivers at one point....

Anyway, here is the next one (courtesy of another poster on the board - thanks!!) The usual please (if you wish to make it a challenge please dis-regard the file name!!): Driver and car will get it - but an interesting follow-up question is who was the original intended driver of the car??.....

Yes Lee Roy nearly did it in that ugly car.

Bill Cheesbourg, I do believe drove that car at one point during the month of May but this I believe was who was originially assigned to the car.

So someone else can answer.

[Chris R]

Al Miller
Gerhart-Ford
1967 Indy 500

original intended driver: Bill Cheesbourg ?

car and driver correct - your turn!!

Cheesebourg was a driver of the car - but not the original entered driver - fate dealt a much crueler hand than a drive in the Indy 500 for that driver.....

[Mihai]

I'm curious who that driver might be.

The usual please: driver, car, year, location.
http://imagehosting.evonet.ro/files/29d347CDYL.jpg

[Phoenixent]

I'm curious who that driver might be.

The driver was Lorenzo Bandini. ;(

[Phoenixent]

The usual please: driver, car, year, location.
http://imagehosting.evonet.ro/files/29d347CDYL.jpg

Driver- Al Unser
Year- 1965
Car- Weisman - Maserati
Track- Indianapolis

[Mihai]

Only the track is correct.

I never knew Bandini was supposed to race the 500.

[Phoenixent]

Driver- Bobby Marshman
Year- 1964
Car- Lotus - Ford DOHC
Track- Indianapolis

[Chris R]

Bandini is correct on the first driver of the previous car...

So, I have to wonder - is that tool box mounted permanently on the current picture or is that an early aero device??? :D As someone who is involved in agriculture, it didn't seem odd to see a toolbox "mounted" to a car at first (most tractor have toolboxes)......

[Alexamateo]

So, I have to wonder - is that tool box mounted permanently on the current picture or is that an early aero device??? :D As someone who is involved in agriculture, it didn't seem odd to see a toolbox "mounted" to a car at first (most tractor have toolboxes)......

But, you're not a "real" farmer unless you have a vise mounted to the bed of your pickup! :D :erm:

[nanders]

I'm curious who that driver might be.

The usual please: driver, car, year, location.
http://imagehosting.evonet.ro/files/29d347CDYL.jpg

With this car design, you'd never have to worry about finding your tools :p I wonder if that adds to the weight distribution?

[Mihai]

Driver- Bobby Marshman
Year- 1964
Car- Lotus - Ford DOHC
Track- Indianapolis

The track, car & engine are correct, but the driver & year still no.

That apparent toolbox puzzled me too. I have a hi-res version of this photo, if interested.

[!!WALDO!!]

1963 Dan Gurney car number #91 Lotus-Ford known as the Mule which Dan wrecked and it was sold to Lindsey Hopkins and became Bobby Marshman's ride in 1964, Al Miller's ride in 1965 and 1966 with Larry Dickson in 1967.

Good career considering it was tore up bad. I think Dan left one wheel on it.

[!!WALDO!!]

Only the track is correct.

I never knew Bandini was supposed to race the 500.

Yup, was to race Monaco and leave for Indy.

[Mihai]

1963 Dan Gurney car number #91 Lotus-Ford

Exactly. Your turn now. :up:

[!!WALDO!!]

Exactly. Your turn now. :up:

Thank you but first are pictures of this car as it was in years following this.
http://www.indy500.com/photo/gallery.php?series_id=a:2:{i:0;i:1;i:1;i:6;}&track_id=4&offset=20&searchType=freeText&freeText=Lotus%20Ford&photo_id=14046
The #93 car with the straight pipe set up.

Marshman in the "Mule"
http://www.indy500.com/photo/gallery.php?series_id=a:2:{i:0;i:1;i:1;i:6;}&track_id=4&searchType=freeText&freeText=Lotus%20Ford&offset=20

Al Miller in the "Mule" in Fourth.
http://www.indy500.com/photo/gallery.php?series_id=a:2:{i:0;i:1;i:1;i:6;}&track_id=4&searchType=freeText&freeText=Lotus%20Ford&photo_id=13692

Al Miller in 1966 Wrecked
http://www.indy500.com/photo/gallery.php?series_id=a:2:{i:0;i:1;i:1;i:6;}&track_id=4&searchType=freeText&freeText=Lotus%20Ford&photo_id=13914

Larry Dickson as slowest qualifier in 1967
http://www.indy500.com/photo/gallery.php?series_id=a:2:{i:0;i:1;i:1;i:6;}&track_id=4&searchType=freeText&freeText=Lotus%20Ford&photo_id=14077

[!!WALDO!!]

This car was driven in the 1971 500 by George "Ziggy Schwartz" Snider. It was a Leader Card Entry.
Tell me the History of this car prior to 1971. It was only in one race.
It did something very unique during qualifying. What was it?
This was the first year of the Triple Crown. How many laps did this car do out of 600 laps?

[!!WALDO!!]

I see we do not know. This car was a 1968 Eagle and was a team car to Mike Mosley who won Trenton in 1971 with the car Denny Hulme finished 4th at the 500 with in 1968. The pictured Snider car, won the 1968 500. In 1972 it led for a second then Mosley wrecked again burning himself again.

George did a 52.45 (171.592) on Lap 1, 52.45 (171.592) on Lap 2, 52.44 (171.625) on Lap 3 and 52.45 (171.592) on Lap 4. For a 3:29.79 (171.600)

This car did 21 laps in the three 500s and finshed 33rd at Indy and Pocono and only Mario kept it out of 33 at Ontario as George got 32nd.

Tell me the last year this car won a race and also the last year it raced on the National Championship trail (read the 1968 prelim)

[Phoenixent]

I see we do not know. This car was a 1968 Eagle and was a team car to Mike Mosley who won Trenton in 1971 with the car Denny Hulme finished 4th at the 500 with in 1968. The pictured Snider car, won the 1968 500. In 1972 it led for a second then Mosley wrecked again burning himself again.

WALDO you answers and questions are mixed up.

Is the photo the 1968 winner that ran in other events or is it the 1968 AAR car driven by Denny Hulme?

Most did not answer the questions as it was a little confusing without chassis numbers.

[!!WALDO!!]

WALDO you answers and questions are mixed up.

Is the photo the 1968 winner that ran in other events or is it the 1968 AAR car driven by Denny Hulme?

Most did not answer the questions as it was a little confusing without chassis numbers.

Ok in my 1968 piece I stated that Leader Card was due two 1968 Eagles of the 6 to be built. Jerry Grant got one for the Frienkin team, McCluskey for the Lindsey Hopkins team, 2 for Leader Card and 2 for AAR. They ran out of time so the second Leader Card 1968 Eagle was "leased" back to AAR for Denis Hulme. After the 500 the #42 car went back to Leader Card and the car was not used in 1968, 1969 or 1970. As wasn't the 500 winning car. So in 1971 Watson modifies both cars, and the #4 Mike Mosley car is the #42 from 1968 and the back up to #4 was #80 that was the 1968 Winner.
During the 500 the #4 car was destroyed in a crash where Mosley ended up upside down on top of the parked cars of Donohue and Warren on fire. The car was scrapped and used to keep the #80 running in 1971 and #98 in 1972 only to have that car tore up and then Leader Card/Agajanian bought new Eagles for 1973.

[!!WALDO!!]

Here is the #80 in 1972....

[Phoenixent]

Ok in my 1968 piece I stated that Leader Card was due two 1968 Eagles of the 6 to be built. Jerry Grant got one for the Frienkin team, McCluskey for the Lindsey Hopkins team, 2 for Leader Card and 2 for AAR. They ran out of time so the second Leader Card 1968 Eagle was "leased" back to AAR for Denis Hulme. After the 500 the #42 car went back to Leader Card and the car was not used in 1968, 1969 or 1970. As wasn't the 500 winning car. So in 1971 Watson modifies both cars, and the #4 Mike Mosley car is the #42 from 1968 and the back up to #4 was #80 that was the 1968 Winner.
During the 500 the #4 car was destroyed in a crash where Mosley ended up upside down on top of the parked cars of Donohue and Warren on fire. The car was scrapped and used to keep the #80 running in 1971 and #98 in 1972 only to have that car tore up and then Leader Card/Agajanian bought new Eagles for 1973.

Okay now I am with you. :) Thanks

[!!WALDO!!]

Okay now I am with you. :) Thanks

Car history is actually a lot of fun. The car I put up is a very interesting car from Indy to the mile dirts.
I was there the day George did qualify this car. I was posting time and remember Tom talking about the consistant run but three laps exactly the same and lap 4 George had to do it on a slick tire as he was spewing oil.

In 1968 the car 4 lapped in at 169.507 Fastest non-turbine qualifier.
In 1971 the car 4 lapped in at 171.600
In 1972 the car 4 lapped in at 189.140 fastest nose breather. Fastest lap #2 189.753.

[garyshell]

I have a car that needs identification!!! In the words of the inimitable Tooter Turtle, "Help, Mr. Wizard!"

http://jalopnik.com/assets/resources/2008/04/recycled-can-art_1333.jpg

http://jalopnik.com/375892/and-now-your-jalopnik-moment-of-zen

Gary

[Chris R]

hey, that's MY car!!!! :D :D :D

seriously, what we have here is the Hoop-D Canvertible (The subtle hints are the words on the window and hood).

In the early days of safety awareness (around 1974 or so) it was presented for tech inspection at Indy. Unfortunately, it was a little too advanced for the comfort of the rules-makers so it was dis-allowed. You can clearly see it was the precursor to the SAFER wal - just more of a SAFER car. Unfortunately, it had a hard time holding onto it's protective modules (ok, beer cans) and shed about 50 on its demonstration lap. There was also wide speculation that the unidentified driver was partaking of sponsor, Olympia Beer's product whilst doing the demo lap and that the car actually only lost 48 cans....

I was not aware the car had been preserved - what an awesome piece of history. :p

[nanders]

It looks like to me that the important front crush zone is already crushed. Would this pass the secondary impact test? And one can't help but notice the "Hoop" on the front. This could easily be a projected design for the new IndyCay formula. I hear it's Hydrogen Electric. :s mokin:

[Hoop-98]

I am speechless :)

http://estb.msn.com/i/64/F48CCD58075E672303C5B60713B77.jpg

[Phoenixent]

I am speechless :)

http://estb.msn.com/i/64/F48CCD58075E672303C5B60713B77.jpg

I bet it was more fun get the building material the building the car itself. :D

[garyshell]

Since Uncle Waldo is no longer with us and I think he had the last turn, here is a new picture. The usuals please: year, track, driver etc. (I don't need to know the history of where else the lug nuts on the car were used in the previous seven seasons, or who the mechanics mother dated in high school, etc.) :s mokin:

Gary

[SoCalPVguy]

***** and you guys jumped on me for posting a car that was not technically an american open wheel car, then you post this garbage ???


Sheeesh


I have a car that needs identification!!! In the words of the inimitable Tooter Turtle, "Help, Mr. Wizard!"

http://jalopnik.com/assets/resources/2008/04/recycled-can-art_1333.jpg

http://jalopnik.com/375892/and-now-your-jalopnik-moment-of-zen

Gary

[garyshell]

***** and you guys jumped on me for posting a car that was not technically an american open wheel car, then you post this garbage ???


Sheeesh


Relax man. I never jumped on you and I was the one who posted the picture. It was OBVIOUSLY a joke. Where is you sense of humor?

Gary

[Phoenixent]

***** and you guys jumped on me for posting a car that was not technically an american open wheel car, then you post this garbage ???


Sheeesh

I believe you were jumped about the term Champcar. As Gary said relax it's a joke not part of the Name that Car thread just posted for fun. :)

[johnny shell]

Since Uncle Waldo is no longer with us and I think he had the last turn, here is a new picture. The usuals please: year, track, driver etc. (I don't need to know the history of where else the lug nuts on the car were used in the previous seven seasons, or who the mechanics mother dated in high school, etc.) :s mokin:

Gary

Bobby Rahal

Mid Ohio

1997

that's just off the top of my head... come to think of it I think he was already retired by then???

[garyshell]

Bobby Rahal

Mid Ohio

1997

that's just off the top of my head... come to think of it I think he was already retired by then???


Right track, but that is all.

Gary

[Mihai]

Max Papis
Reynard-Ford
2000

[garyshell]

Max Papis
Reynard-Ford
2000


<ed mcmahon voice mode on>

You are correct, Sir!

<ed mcmahon voice mode off>

Mihai, you are next.

Gary

[Mihai]

The usual please, for all three drivers:
http://imagehosting.evonet.ro/files/ace2cWKA2000091067620_pv.jpg

[Phoenixent]

The usual please, for all three drivers:
http://imagehosting.evonet.ro/files/ace2cWKA2000091067620_pv.jpg

Drivers- Car #32 Patrick Carpentier, Car #16 Michel Jourdain Jr., and Car #18 Martin Blundell
Year- 2000
Car- Car #19 Reynard 2Ki - Ford, Car #16 Lola B2K - Mercedes, and Car #18 Reynard 2Ki - Mercedes
Track- Laguna Seca

[Mihai]

Yep, it's them. Your turn now.

[Phoenixent]

Yep, it's them. Your turn now.

Thats a Cool Photo. :up:

New photo coming up.

[Phoenixent]

Driver, Car, Year, & Track

http://shutter11.pictures.aol.com/data/pictures/17/008/5F/FB/4F/D0/rW5d7WzYFhLP1Q50llOLl6lVDxB2v5FU0190.jpg

[Mihai]

Jimmy Vasser ?
Lola T9100
Vancouver 1992

[Phoenixent]

Jimmy Vasser ?
Lola T9100
Vancouver 1992

Right Year. :up:

Keep Digging. :)

[Chris R]

Is that AJ??
at Surfer's in 1992 in Walker's car?
A Lola Cosworth.....

[Phoenixent]

Is that AJ??
at Surfer's in 1992 in Walker's car?
A Lola Cosworth.....

:bounce: You Are Correct. :bounce:

A.J. ran only two laps at Surfer's then withdrew. I wonder who supplied the pit crew.

Your Turn. :up:

[Chris R]

so what was the story behind that odd pairing??

here's the next one:

[gofastandwynn]

so what was the story behind that odd pairing??

here's the next one:


Duane Carter
1959 IMS
Kurtis/Offy

[Chris R]

you got it!! :D

your turn

[gofastandwynn]

Since this one is different:

Driver
Car
Year & location of it's demise

http://www.derekdaly.com/images/Crash1984Tub.jpg


PS, Don't look at the code since it will give away 2 of the answers

[Chris R]

All I have is a question mark in a box where the image would be....

[Chris R]

nevermind - there it is - ouch....

[Chris R]

Total guess
March 84C
Rick Mears
Sanair, 1984.....

[Phoenixent]

Driver - Derek Daly
Car - March 84C-Cosworth
Year - 1984
Track - Michigan

[gofastandwynn]

Driver - Derek Daly
Car - March 84C-Cosworth
Year - 1984
Track - Michigan

Yep.

If you go to Derek's website he has a write up on the accident.

http://www.derekdaly.com/careerCrash.html

You're up.

[Phoenixent]

Yep.

If you go to Derek's website he has a write up on the accident.

http://www.derekdaly.com/careerCrash.html

You're up.

I remembered see that crash it was the worst I have seen before Krosnoff and Zanardi. I also read the if John Paul had not hit his car Derek most likely would have been killed on the second impact with the wall. 1984 had some big wrecks with Mears at Sanair right before this one.

I will be back with a new photo.

[Phoenixent]

Sorry for the delay.

Here is the next photo.

Driver, Car, Year, & Track

http://shutter14.pictures.aol.com/data/pictures/18/007/34/3B/27/4A/85ioQX158LzADIQzWQG2r7jB4b08niX201F4.jpg

[Chris R]

looks like Tommy Milton to me...

my semi-educated guess:

Tommy Milton
1917
Sheepshead Bay
Dusenberg

[johnny shell]

man, did you all see those pics of DD's crash with his legs hanging out all over the place? he's one lucky ***** to be walking aorund today.

[Phoenixent]

looks like Tommy Milton to me...

my semi-educated guess:

Tommy Milton
1917
Sheepshead Bay
Dusenberg

Right Driver. :up:

Keep digging. :)

[Chris R]

1921
Tommy Milton
Miller/Miller
Tacoma?? - looks too cold to be California

This car was apparently known as the "spot-assed ape" according to Gary Doyle anyway :D

[Phoenixent]

1921
Tommy Milton
Miller/Miller
Tacoma?? - looks too cold to be California

This car was apparently known as the "spot-assed ape" according to Gary Doyle anyway :D

Right Year, Driver and Car. :up:

Keep Digging on the Track.

[Chris R]

Well, maybe it is northern California - how about San Carlos (i.e. San Francisco Speedway)

[Phoenixent]

Well, maybe it is northern California - how about San Carlos (i.e. San Francisco Speedway)

Your Getting Warmer. :D

[Chris R]

then Cotati in Santa Rosa???

[Phoenixent]

then Cotati in Santa Rosa???

90210

[!!WALDO!!]

Beverly Hills Board Track. The track that took Gaston Chevrolet in 1920.

[Chris R]

huh, go figure - I thought it looked like people were a little too bundled up for Beverly Hills.... I found a picture of the same car at Beverly Hills in 1922 (in Gary Doyle's book "king of the boards") and the facilities looked different - as did the car - looks like he added hubcaps for 1922 also .....

Waldo - welcome back...

[!!WALDO!!]

huh, go figure - I thought it looked like people were a little too bundled up for Beverly Hills.... I found a picture of the same car at Beverly Hills in 1922 (in Gary Doyle's book "king of the boards") and the facilities looked different - as did the car - looks like he added hubcaps for 1922 also .....

Waldo - welcome back...

For how long is the question. I am going to do my 1968 and this. I did make a mistake talking about shrill voices complaining about Danica in the booth at LBGP.

Been working on finding the history of the oldest running Kurtis 4000 D. Made it onto the USAC National Championship Dirt Circuit in 1971 and was built in 1952 at least.

[rpralon]

http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/5263/sennanaindyro7.jpg

[Chris R]

hey wasn't there an interesting post by a new guy here a while ago? I was having a hard time figuring it out actually.....

[Phoenixent]

Beverly Hills Board Track. The track that took Gaston Chevrolet in 1920.

Welcome Back WALDO. :up:

You are correct on the track.

It is your turn. :)

Sorry Chris I tried to help but Waldo was quick on the draw. :D
Although the photo does not give the month I think it might be the Nov race. November in California could be hot or cold.

[!!WALDO!!]

Welcome Back WALDO. :up:

You are correct on the track.

It is your turn. :)

Sorry Chris I tried to help but Waldo was quick on the draw. :D
Although the photo does not give the month I think it might be the Nov race. November in California could be hot or cold.

Gaston was killed in November of 1920 there so it is possible.

This car qualified for the 1965 500 by then rookie Arnie Knepper. This is an extremely rare roadster.
Who built it and in what year?

[!!WALDO!!]

Gaston was killed in November of 1920 there so it is possible.

This car qualified for the 1965 500 by then rookie Arnie Knepper. This is an extremely rare roadster.
Who built it and in what year?

Hint: Built 4 500 winning cars, a ton of midgets (One Foyt was the winner of Astrodome GP in 1970 was built in 1946.) a sports car that some say was the greatest ever built and tons of Indy Roadsters but this was the last in the line although he built the Chassis for two Novis after this car and one of the Novi was in the 1965 race with this Roadster. The last time a car built by this person would appear at Indy.

[!!WALDO!!]

Hint: Built 4 500 winning cars, a ton of midgets (One Foyt was the winner of Astrodome GP in 1970 was built in 1946.) a sports car that some say was the greatest ever built and tons of Indy Roadsters but this was the last in the line although he built the Chassis for two Novis after this car and one of the Novi was in the 1965 race with this Roadster. The last time a car built by this person would appear at Indy.

Attached is this 1941 first edition car driven by a future winner.

[Chris R]

Hint: Built 4 500 winning cars, a ton of midgets (One Foyt was the winner of Astrodome GP in 1970 was built in 1946.) a sports car that some say was the greatest ever built and tons of Indy Roadsters but this was the last in the line although he built the Chassis for two Novis after this car and one of the Novi was in the 1965 race with this Roadster. The last time a car built by this person would appear at Indy.

I know it is a Kurtis - but I could dig up nothing more than that.... if only the Novi's followed it must have been built in 1955 or 1956. Based on that I am going to guess it is the Kurtis 500G that Johnny Boyd drove in the 1956 500... but that is just a guess....

[!!WALDO!!]

I know it is a Kurtis - but I could dig up nothing more than that.... if only the Novi's followed it must have been built in 1955 or 1956. Based on that I am going to guess it is the Kurtis 500G that Johnny Boyd drove in the 1956 500... but that is just a guess....

Nope much later. Last Indy car Frank Kurtis built. He built the #6. #56 Novis in 1962 (Numbers in 1963), Numbers in 1964, #3 and #28 and in 1965 #59. This car was built in 1961 and was one of a kind, but sat out for years. Bobby Grim in 1964 and Arnie in 1965.
Nothing difficult just who built the car. Other than the Novis what other famous non winner did Frank Kurtis build for the 1952 race?

[Chris R]

He built the Cummins Diesel car - one I am quite fond of aesthetically...

[Alexamateo]

Sorry if I'm cutting in line, but there's been no activity here for 5 days so I thought I post something up just to stir things up a little bit. ;)

Drivers, Cars, Track, Year

[Phoenixent]

Thanks AM for the photo. Waldo is a little bit off on the time.

It's the infamous pass.

Drivers- Car #26 Paul Tracy, and Car #3 Helio Castroneves
Year- 2002
Car- Car #26 Dallara - Chevy, and Car #3 Dallara - Chevy
Track- Indianapolis

[garyshell]

I just came across this gem. It is a site with pictures of the entire 1952 Indy 500 field.

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/?p=2174

Gary

[Chris R]

I just came across this gem. It is a site with pictures of the entire 1952 Indy 500 field.

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/?p=2174

Gary

awesome site thanks for sharing!! :D

[Alexamateo]

Thanks AM for the photo. Waldo is a little bit off on the time.

It's the infamous pass.

Drivers- Car #26 Paul Tracy, and Car #3 Helio Castroneves
Year- 2002
Car- Car #26 Dallara - Chevy, and Car #3 Dallara - Chevy
Track- Indianapolis

Of course that's it :D

You're up!

[Phoenixent]

Of course that's it :D

You're up!

Nice one. Maybe that will happen this year and stick. :)

New photo coming up.

[Phoenixent]

Driver, Car, Year, & Track

http://shutter15.pictures.aol.com/data/pictures/22/006/5F/EE/61/FF/---MyEL99TMwTL+oxdQF5U-+88sDMkQM01C2.jpg

[champcarray]

Gary -- Thanks for the link to the photos of the '52 field. I saw one of the cars in person: Ascari's Ferrari was shown at a Ferrari concourse in Hartford CT in '01 or '02. It still had the original Indy tires on it! Frankly, I got goosebumps just looking at it. I wish they had fired it up!

I have also seen a Zinc Special at Lime Rock Park's annual Labor Day vintage racing festival. I don't remember whether it's the one that ran in '52, but it was from that era.

[Alexamateo]

Driver, Car, Year, & Track

http://shutter15.pictures.aol.com/data/pictures/22/006/5F/EE/61/FF/---MyEL99TMwTL+oxdQF5U-+88sDMkQM01C2.jpg

Eliseo Salazar
Riley & Scott-Oldsmobile
Texas
1998

[Phoenixent]

Eliseo Salazar
Riley & Scott-Oldsmobile
Texas
1998

You are Correct AM. :up:

Reynard bought Reily & Scott in 1999 hoping to break in to the IRL. But no one was interested in 2000. Reynard built one or two cars for a team but recalled them back to the factory. Sad ending to two companies at one time.

Your Turn. :)

[Alexamateo]

An easy one to start the month of May. :)

Name the car and the track and the driver and year it was made famous.

[cartpix]

An easy one to start the month of May. :)

Name the car and the track and the driver and year it was made famous.


Marmon Wasp

Ray Harroun

1911

Go again. I don' t have the time. It was too easy if I got it. Or maybe I didn't...

Jeff

[Alexamateo]

Marmon Wasp

Ray Harroun

1911

Go again. I don' t have the time. It was too easy if I got it. Or maybe I didn't...

Jeff
No you got it! :D

Anybody sitting on the sidelines that's been dying to post something? Have at it! If not I or someone else will post something in a couple of days.

[Civic]

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a222/HybridsRacing/DSC01053.jpg

[Phoenixent]

Nice Photo Civic. :up:

I will bow out on this one as I was there also. I like the 1984 Eagle that Michael Chandler drove.

[!!WALDO!!]

Sorry for being gone but an illness put me down from Friday before Kansas until today. Pretty much bed ridden or at the hospital. Will be more off than on until the end of the month.

(NO REFERENCE, IMPLIED OR REAL TO ANY POSTER, LIVING, DEAD, or NOT YET BORN.)

[Chris R]

Waldo - hope you are feeling better - sounds a little more serious than the stomach virus that has been running rampant in our neck of the woods.....

[!!WALDO!!]

Waldo - hope you are feeling better - sounds a little more serious than the stomach virus that has been running rampant in our neck of the woods.....


Nope, it was the spitting up of many Firestone Tire type stuff out of the lungs. I heard my dad's famous words after a large hocker, "Let's take it to Indianapolis".

Today having out patient surgery to hopefully cure a PiA once and for all. Otherwise I may name it after some of those that are ignoring me and still insulting me. :D

Got some of 1968 500 done and Tomorrow is the 40th for the day Mike Spence left us.

TRIVIA: Mike went 169.555 in the #60 STP Turbine. What Turbine was he killed in?
A. #20 Unassigned
B. #30 Greg Weld
C. #40 Unassigned
D. #60 Mike Spence.

Also how many people with the last name of SPENCE died at IMS?


(NO REFERENCE, IMPLIED OR REAL TO ANY POSTER, LIVING, DEAD, or NOT YET BORN.)

[Phoenixent]

TRIVIA: Mike went 169.555 in the #60 STP Turbine. What Turbine was he killed in?
A. #20 Unassigned
B. #30 Greg Weld
C. #40 Unassigned
D. #60 Mike Spence.


Mike Spence died testing #30 Greg Welds car. He hit the wall during practice and the wheel struck him in the head causing fatal head injuries. :(



Also how many people with the last name of SPENCE died at IMS?


There were two drivers named Spence that died at Indianapolis. Bill Spence in 1929 during the race and Mike Spence in 1968 during practice. :(

[!!WALDO!!]

Mike Spence died testing #30 Greg Welds car. He hit the wall during practice and the wheel struck him in the head causing fatal head injuries. :(



There were two drivers named Spence that died at Indianapolis. Bill Spence in 1929 during the race and Mike Spence in 1968 during practice. :(


You will find the helmet came off. It is three, a spectator by the name of Everett Spence was killed.

(NO REFERENCE, IMPLIED OR REAL TO ANY POSTER, LIVING, DEAD, or NOT YET BORN.)

[!!WALDO!!]

This is a photo from Indy.

This driver was the first of many drivers to accomplish something that day. Hint: Mario, Mikey, Marco all did it also but Al Unser, Al Jr did not.

Name the car chassis and year.








(NO REFERENCE, IMPLIED OR REAL TO ANY POSTER, LIVING, DEAD, or NOT YET BORN.)

[Chris R]

It is Art Cross in 1952. The first rookie of the year at the Indy 500...

the car is a Kurtis-Offy

Is that last photo still open?? I am not sure what we were trying to ID - the car and when it raced or the museum it sits in????

[xtlm]

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a222/HybridsRacing/DSC01053.jpg

1992 ford Tthunderbird
Dale Earnhardt
Daytona

...?

[!!WALDO!!]

It is Art Cross in 1952. The first rookie of the year at the Indy 500...

the car is a Kurtis-Offy

Is that last photo still open?? I am not sure what we were trying to ID - the car and when it raced or the museum it sits in????

CORRECT.

A 2000 Reynard is pretty much a show car.


(NO REFERENCE, IMPLIED OR REAL TO ANY POSTER, LIVING, DEAD, or NOT YET BORN.)

[Phoenixent]

Is that last photo still open?? I am not sure what we were trying to ID - the car and when it raced or the museum it sits in????


Civic posted the photo. I think he was asking who drove this Reynard.

Location is the last Champ Car race.

[ykiki]

Civic posted the photo. I think he was asking who drove this Reynard.

Location is the last Champ Car race.

Would that be the Telefonica car from Oriol Servia's rookie season? Sounds like the photo was taken in LB.

[Civic]

It's been established that the car is in Long Beach and that it's a Reynard.

What I'm looking for is the sharp-eyed reader who knows the model year of that Reynard.

[Phoenixent]

It's been established that the car is in Long Beach and that it's a Reynard.

What I'm looking for is the sharp-eyed reader who knows the model year of that Reynard.

I did not notice it until now what year that car is. I was to busy at LB looking at the 84 Eagle. :D

[ykiki]

Looking at the indentations on the front of the sidepods and the flaps at the rear....kind of looks like a 1996 Reynard. 2000 Reynard had endplates on the little sidepod "wings" (sorry, I don't know the technical term).

[!!WALDO!!]

What I'm looking for is the sharp-eyed reader who knows the model year of that Reynard.

The rules established in April of 1995, locked in the basic rules of all cars from 1996 through the 2001 season. This went back to the USAC/CART rules of 1989 that set the rules from 1990-1995.

Point is there was not a lot of difference other than under the car from a 1996 Reynard to a 2000 plus since the chassis by rule had to be the same then new body work could be moved to an "older" chassis.

Yes, new teams bought new cars as a way to force other teams to play or leave. Many did just that. leave. It was done to level the playing field but it became an uneven field was car owners were the one's bring in these cars, Carl Haas and Chip Ganassi.

Most show cars are old cars with current bodies if the team has money, otherwise it is an old car. the history of that car could be from 1997 or 1998.

(NO REFERENCE, IMPLIED OR REAL TO ANY POSTER, LIVING, DEAD, or NOT YET BORN.)

[Civic]

ykiki is right. It's a 1996 Reynard. The easiest way to tell is by the sidepod dimples (though the R99I and 2kI have similar dimples) and the cockpit sides. 1997 and newer Reynards have wider cockpit openings with removable "collar pads".

Not all body work is interchangeable, though most of the main stuff like noses, front wings, and rear wings will bolt on. IIRC, Fernandez' Frankenstein had an R97 tub, an R98 undertray, and a mix and match of wings and sidepods from either an R97I or R98I.

[!!WALDO!!]

ykiki is right. It's a 1996 Reynard. The easiest way to tell is by the sidepod dimples (though the R99I and 2kI have similar dimples) and the cockpit sides. 1997 and newer Reynards have wider cockpit openings with removable "collar pads".

Then it is a 1995. I kept looking at the cockpit as the 1996 rule made the cockpit wider. It is a 1995 with some 1996 body work. Sound reasonable?

(NO REFERENCE, IMPLIED OR REAL TO ANY POSTER, LIVING, DEAD, or NOT YET BORN.)

[Phoenixent]

Ykiki is right it's a Reynard 96i not a 95i as the shpe of the tub is different from one to the other.

Great job Ykiki. :up:

[ykiki]

Ykiki is right it's a Reynard 96i not a 95i as the shpe of the tub is different from one to the other.

Great job Ykiki. :up:

Thanks! It was quite a challenge scouring the web for CART Reynard photos from that era. The dimples on the sidepods caught my eye at first, but the more I looked at pics, I found it harder and harder to find Reynards without endplates at the rear of the sidepods once you get past 96.

Haven't played this game in quite some time (a year?) so I'll try to find a pic soon...

[ykiki]

Alright...the usual

Driver
Track
Car
Year

[!!WALDO!!]

Thanks! It was quite a challenge scouring the web for CART Reynard photos from that era. The dimples on the sidepods caught my eye at first, but the more I looked at pics, I found it harder and harder to find Reynards without endplates at the rear of the sidepods once you get past 96.

Haven't played this game in quite some time (a year?) so I'll try to find a pic soon...

Cockpit is too small. The 1996 rules required a wider cockpit. Interestingly a 1995 Lola/Reynard was legal on slow "street courses" like Long Beach. Della Penna with Richie Hearn ran their IRL Legal 1995 Reynard/Ford at Long Beach by just changing body parts to the 1996 rules, which required a raised side pods. The cockpit though could not be changed.
Hearn/Della Penna also ran Toronto and one other place with the 95i/96i Reynard.

It doesn't matter but the cockpit being wider had a direct connection to "other" things.

(NO REFERENCE, IMPLIED OR REAL TO ANY POSTER, LIVING, DEAD, or NOT YET BORN.)

[Civic]

R95I at Long Beach 1996
http://champcar.com/Gallery/gallery96/long_beach/hearn_blur.jpg

R96I at Long Beach 1996
http://champcar.com/Gallery/gallery96/long_beach/robby_wall_of_noise.jpg

R95I front view
http://www.autoracing1.com/Images/Historic/VilleneueveLB95.jpg

R96I front view
http://champcar.com/Gallery/gallery96/08detroit/moore_heat.jpg

[!!WALDO!!]

Got any shots where you can look at the cockpit head on from above because CART rules made a distictive difference between the narrow 1995 and pre to the 20% wider 1996 and later cockpit? This was done to reduce shoulder injures in hard side impacts. 95i could only race on slow tracks and Hearn was only at the LBGP and Toronto and then Della Penna bought a used 1996 for Laguna.
These were the rules that separated CART from the IRL and was done on April 4th, 1995 for the 1996 season. Reynard and Lola told the owners that day that the 1996 car would be brand new and that 1995 could be modified for slow courses. The other thing was moving the driver back in the cockpit.
Also, increasing the heighth of the sidepods taking some downforce away.

Hyatt Regancy O'Hare. I was working as a reporter for a sports radio station.

[Civic]

R95I Toronto 1996
http://champcar.com/Gallery/gallery96/11toronto/an_old_car.jpg

R96I Toronto 1996
http://champcar.com/Gallery/gallery96/11toronto/urban_camoflage.jpg

R96I Portland 1996
http://champcar.com/Gallery/gallery96/09portland/bobbys_windsock.jpg

It's hard to find mid 90s photos. I used to go to indyphoto.com before it was shut down.

[Chris R]

to the naked eye it looks like the 1996 is not much wider (20% would only be 3 inches or so) what is obvious is the higher cockpit sides which are also obvious on the display car - so 1996 it is.....

As for the other photo - it looks like Dennis Firestone in 1985 in a March/Cosworth. I am going to guess it is the Meadowlands where he DNQ....

nice pictures everyone!!

[ykiki]

to the naked eye it looks like the 1996 is not much wider (20% would only be 3 inches or so) what is obvious is the higher cockpit sides which are also obvious on the display car - so 1996 it is.....

As for the other photo - it looks like Dennis Firestone in 1985 in a March/Cosworth. I am going to guess it is the Meadowlands where he DNQ....

nice pictures everyone!!

Clooooooose.....

It was Firestone in 1985 with a March. However, it's not the Meadowlands.

[!!WALDO!!]

to the naked eye it looks like the 1996 is not much wider (20% would only be 3 inches or so) what is obvious is the higher cockpit sides which are also obvious on the display car - so 1996 it is.....

As for the other photo - it looks like Dennis Firestone in 1985 in a March/Cosworth. I am going to guess it is the Meadowlands where he DNQ....

nice pictures everyone!!

Look very carefully, I can see it the difference between Hearn, Target and Rahal. It is there.

A 1995 Reynard had to have the 1996 aero package so it had 1996 Side Pods. In the IRL it needed the 1995 Side Pods which were ILLEGAL in CART.

Driver was 3 inches to forward in the 1995 and cockpit too narrow, thus why they figured these cars with the 1996 Side Pods could compete on slow tracks as they would be safer and the 2% more Downforce would have no effect on the ability of the car to do too well.

(NO REFERENCE, IMPLIED OR REAL TO ANY POSTER, LIVING, DEAD, or NOT YET BORN.)

[champcarray]

Is that Dennis at Road America?

[ykiki]

Is that Dennis at Road America?

Nope, not Road America.

[BobGarage]

Alright...the usual

Driver
Track
Car
Year

Dennis Firestone
Portland International Raceway
March 84c Cosworth
1985

[ykiki]

Dennis Firestone
Portland International Raceway
March 84c Cosworth
1985

You are correct! Nice job BobGarage

[BobGarage]

next one...

driver
year
track
car

[Phoenixent]

Driver- Floyd Roberts
Year- 1937
Car- Miller - Miller
Track- Indianapolis

[BobGarage]

Driver- Floyd Roberts
Year- 1937
Car- Miller - Miller
Track- Indianapolis

all correct. your go

[Phoenixent]

all correct. your go

Thanks BG. :up:

Nice Photo.

New photo coming up.

[Phoenixent]

Drivers, Cars, Year, & Track

http://shutter11.pictures.aol.com/data/pictures/19/001/77/FF/E5/5B/rcbVuA41XvCk058WEjpweaeREAJndfEN0300.jpg

[Phoenixent]

Hello :rolleyes:

[Alexamateo]

#9 Frank Elliot, Miller
#10 Joe Thomas, Duesenberg
#12 Harry Hartz, Duesenberg

Beverly Hills Boardtrack 1922

[Alexamateo]

Hey, you bumped this while I was researching it! :D

[Phoenixent]

Hey, you bumped this while I was researching it! :D

I was worried everyone fell asleep on this photo. :D

[Phoenixent]

#9 Frank Elliot, Miller
#10 Joe Thomas, Duesenberg
#12 Harry Hartz, Duesenberg

Beverly Hills Boardtrack 1922

Right Track and the Duesenbergs are correct. :up:

Keep digging. :up:

[Alexamateo]

1920
Beverly Hills
#9 Tommy Milton Duesenberg
#10 Jimmy Murphy Duesenberg
#12 Ralph Mulford Duesenberg

[Phoenixent]

1920
Beverly Hills
#9 Tommy Milton Duesenberg
#10 Jimmy Murphy Duesenberg
#12 Ralph Mulford Duesenberg

Great Job AM. :up:

Your Turn. :)

[Alexamateo]

Driver, Car, Track, Year

[!!WALDO!!]

Driver, Car, Track, Year

1972 Antares at Indy in 1979. Eldon Rassmussen drove it. Had a Turbo Offy

This is one, so you think you know something.

What Engine was suppose to be used in the Ed Finley owned car?

(NO REFERENCE, IMPLIED OR REAL TO ANY POSTER, LIVING, DEAD, or NOT YET BORN.)

[Alexamateo]

It may be the same car, but the car Rasmussen drove in 1979 was a blue #50. The car in my picture is listed by a different named chassis, although it did start out as an Antares.


Ed Finley first showed up using a 305 cu. in. Chevy. Is that what you are referring to?

[!!WALDO!!]

It may be the same car, but the car Rasmussen drove in 1979 was a blue #50. The car in my picture is listed by a different named chassis, although it did start out as an Antares.


Ed Finley first showed up using a 305 cu. in. Chevy. Is that what you are referring to?

Nope it was for the #70 car. Actually an historic engine.

(NO REFERENCE, IMPLIED OR REAL TO ANY POSTER, LIVING, DEAD, or NOT YET BORN.)

[Alexamateo]

A V-12 Lincoln Zephyr.

[!!WALDO!!]

A V-12 Lincoln Zephyr.

Very close!!!

(NO REFERENCE, IMPLIED OR REAL TO ANY POSTER, LIVING, DEAD, or NOT YET BORN.)


http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=480219&postcount=16

[Phoenixent]

Driver- Eldon Rasmussen
Year- 1977
Car- Mantra - Offy
Track- Indianapolis


And for WALDO the moter was a 16 cylinder job built by Frank Lockhart for the Sampson Special using 2 V-8 Millers.

[Bob Riebe]

Voelker V-12

[Phoenixent]

Congrats Bob. :up:

You are the first to post on Page 100. :bounce:

It's hard to believe that we have already posted on that many pages.

:beer: here's to 1000 more pages.

[Phoenixent]

Driver- Ed Finley
Year- 1977
Car- Mantra - Offy
Track- Indianapolis


And for WALDO the motor was a Voelker V-12 as Bob said. It was also installed in a 72 eagle of Bob Olmstead.

[Alexamateo]

Driver- Ed Finley
Year- 1977
Car- Mantra - Offy
Track- Indianapolis


And for WALDO the motor was a Voelker V-12 as Bob said. It was also installed in a 72 eagle of Bob Olmstead.

That's it Phoenix!, you're up! Although I think it's a Manta, not a Mantra :p :

[Phoenixent]

That's it Phoenix!, you're up! Although I think it's a Manta, not a Mantra :p :

I think your right. :D


Here is the next photo.

Drivers, Cars, Year, & Track

http://shutter14.pictures.aol.com/data/pictures/26/00A/27/3B/05/7B/U4QMLJYbJFrM0hoQeTJQBZ2xRjz7-a9b0300.jpg

[Bob Riebe]

Trenton 1969, hard to tell but Unser, Unser, Foyt, Mosely, McCluskeySirois.

[Phoenixent]

Trenton 1969, hard to tell but Unser, Unser, Foyt, Mosely, McCluskeySirois.

Correct on the Drivers, Track and Year.

Any luck on the cars? :)

[Bob Riebe]

An eagle, a lola, two coyotes, a finlley and a watson.

[Phoenixent]

An eagle, a lola, two coyotes, a finlley and a watson.

You are Correct. :bounce:

Your Turn. :)

[!!WALDO!!]

Voelker V-12

Correct.