Rally Jordan 2010

[dimviii]

Ketomaa fastest @ss8

[ridder]

I think some people were slightly overdoing the tactics yesterday. Hard to say how Hirvonen would do, but for Sordo it seems like it will ruin his rally.

[Mirek]

dimviii: Yes but I think that now when 7 of 9 SWRC competitors are on superally with huge time gaps it's not real fight between them. Most them just drives through stage without much attack I think.

[Langdale Forest]

Citroën might apply team orders to place Sordo in front of Ogier.

And BTW, I think that Ogier is a better driver.

[dimviii]

]dimviii: Yes but I think that now when 7 of 9 SWRC competitors are on superally with huge time gaps it's not real fight between them. Most them just drives through stage without much attack I think.

Know that Mirek,that there are only 2-3crews without super rally.All the super rally competitors have to push to gain final positions 3to 8 and valuable points for the championship.So they have to push even under super rally regulations. :)

[Mirek]

Sousa has damaged steering from a stone...

[Moriarty]

Less then 1 second between leaders in SWRC. It'll be funny if they drive flatout and have superrally tomorrow.

[dimviii]

PGA is flying,but i am waiting for Ketomaas splits :eek:

[Fly]

Is Araujo's time correct?

[Mirek]

Colin said that Nasser had two days of testing with Juho Hänninen in Jordan. Definitely he is now much faster than in previous events.

[Fly]

I see... Nasser's time is wrong too.

[RS]

Know that Mirek,that there are only 2-3crews without super rally.All the super rally competitors have to push to gain final positions 3to 8 and valuable points for the championship.So they have to push even under super rally regulations. :)

I agree with Mirek, the gaps between the crews is too large for them to bother. Better just to try to get to the end now after what happened yesterday.

On first 2 stages yesterday PGAs gap to the leaders was about 1.3s/km, but gaps are much bigger now, even Ketomaa's. Good start by Jari though, but I think we'll have to wait till the next round now to see if the hype is justified about him.

[RS]

]Colin said that Nasser had two days of testing with Juho Hänninen in Jordan. Definitely he is now much faster than in previous events.

Interesting. I guess Nasser realised after Argentina he needed some Fabia driving lessons :)

[dimviii]

@RS
positions in SWRC from 3-8 are going to be gained from all the super rally crews.
If you count the limited reliability we see in Jordan from cars and drivers,and that Sousa and Pons are not the best guns at Jordan,and that we have the 2/3 of rally ahead everything is possible.Even with positions 1 and 2.
Lets wait and see.

[RS]

@RS
positions in SWRC from 3-8 are going to be gained from all the super rally crews.
If you count the limited reliability we see in Jordan from cars and drivers,and that Sousa and Pons are not the best guns at Jordan,and that we have the 2/3 of rally ahead everything is possible.Even with positions 1 and 2.
Lets wait and see.

Yes, but position changes will be because of car/driver reliability and not speed. Looks like we are going the way of Mexico again where top 3 was separated by over half an hour!

[harriswrc]

Seems that Ketomaa is out again

[Mirek]

Ketomaa out again :(

[kolvas]

Let´s hope that Latvala can go faster in the afternoon.

[wwbroe]

Petter is loosing quite a lot on splits :(

[dimviii]

Petter looses alot

[tmx]

If its just tires wear and not problem with the car I wouldn't worry too much. Service park next and long day to go tomorrow. Due to the road sweeping, its not ideal for him to be in lead by today either, as long as he don't drop back too far.

I can't listen to rally radio though, so I don't have too much clues beside the splits.

[WRC1]

noooo..petter is loosing too much, already 11sec down to seb after split4

[wwbroe]

Looks like Latvalla made an error also, because if you have look at splits, there i suddenly big difference. :(

[jonkka]

Interestingly Ogier does equal times with Sordo, despite running 2nd and Sordo 5th...

[wwbroe]

Henning stopped on stage? :(

[wwbroe]

Araujo is loosing more then one minute at first split. :eek: :confused:

[jonkka]

JML retains his lead...

[Langdale Forest]

Petter is loosing quite a lot on splits :(

It's a sad sad situation. :bigcry:


Looks like Latvalla made an error also, because if you have look at splits, there i suddenly big difference. :(

I knew it would happen.

[wwbroe]

Petter is loosing almost half a minute compared to Seb :(

[Mirek]

Araujo is loosing more then one minute at first split. :eek: :confused:

It looks like some mistake as he doesn't loose much in second split. Semerád has diffrential problem and looses constantly.

[Langdale Forest]

JML will have to fight for this win.

We gotta fight fight fight fight fight for this win... :D

[AlfaWRC]

Ogier is incredibly quick! Fantastic talent! Great to see...

[wwbroe]

Nasser stopped again on stage? :( Incredible splits by PG :eek: :eek:

[FAlonso]

I think Armindo's time may be wrong again. - 1minute I believe should be the correct time.

[WRC1]

PG ANDERSSON!!!!! 6th fastest!! and faster than slowson (who is quiet satiesfied with his performance....) incredible

[RS]

Nasser stopped again on stage? :( Incredible splits by PG :eek: :eek:

6th fastest :D

I think anyone who spectated on WRC events in previous years and said S2000 cars are too slow should have waited until they saw a proper driver behind the wheel ;)

[Mirek]

Nasser finished with broken accelerator wire keeping it in his hand all the stage...

[Woodeye]

Just woke up... :)

Catastrophic morning for Mikko. It's a long season, but this is a tough blow for his championships dreams.

[ridder]

Petter lost the rally in one stage. After this his best hope is to manage 3rd.

[WRC1]

what happend to sandell?? out again?

[amilk]

Time to wake up for Sr. Wilson with his satelit teams (especially Jr. Wilson but Henning , Villagra also has their on limits)

Citroen has Ogier and Petter - no answer from Ford to this guys.More top 3 Citroen podium will come this year. But at least the business running well at MS

[Red bull]

]Ketomaa out again :(
holy s**t jordan is becomig a safari rally :mad: :mad: :mad:

[bretddog]

Petter lost the rally in one stage. After this his best hope is to manage 3rd.
A familiar boring Solberg critic? Petter is perfectly positioned for 2nd place. Even a fight for the win, but obviously then he needs to mirror Sebs times the rest of the day.

[AlfaWRC]

Time to wake up for Sr. Wilson with his satelit teams (especially Jr. Wilson but Henning , Villagra also has their on limits)

Citroen has Ogier and Petter - no answer from Ford to this guys.More top 3 Citroen podium will come this year. But at least the business running well at MS

Absolutely right.
Citroen has a perfect line-up. 4 top guys and additionally Kimi for the PR.
...and Ford? No one behind the two Finnish boys!

[ridder]

I'm actually a Petter-fan. Just stating the facts, the situation vs the other 4 drivers has been pretty consistent so far. He has had about same speed as Latvala and Loeb, a bit faster than Ogier and Sordo. For today his best hope is 3rd some 25 seconds off lead. What happens on Sunday is harder to predict.

[Red bull]

Time to wake up for Sr. Wilson with his satelit teams (especially Jr. Wilson but Henning , Villagra also has their on limits)

Citroen has Ogier and Petter - no answer from Ford to this guys.More top 3 Citroen podium will come this year. But at least the business running well at MS
its better he replaces wilson jr with sordo at stobert as citroen dont need him much with ogiers current form :(

[tmx]

Absolutely right.
Citroen has a perfect line-up. 4 top guys and additionally Kimi for the PR.
...and Ford? No one behind the two Finnish boys! Well there is Ken, but it would be nice to give Henning better machinery and some testing, though not going to happen. I can think of an Australian and an Italian looking for a drive.

[Langdale Forest]

When will the next stage be on?

Hopefully Latvala will keep ahead of Loeb

[Mirek]

Times of Al Quassimi comepeting in MERC compared to SWRC times:

SS8: 5:39,0 (+4,8)
SS9: 12:47,8 (+13,8)
SS10: 29:22,0 (+38,6)

[Boudica]

The retirement was a hard hit for Hirvonen's championship battle.

- I guessed that it's going to happen at some point since we have been driving through so many races without retirements. But to have the car go to a ditch on a nearly straight road, roll and brake the front wheel. Things like that shouldn't happen, Hirvonen said.

His co-driver Lehtinen was surprised too.
- I understand if we have a tough attack going on, that you can go wide, but how can you make a mistake in a place like that where there was a corner turning to right and good visibility. We both wondered about that, Lehtinen said.

- In the morning we started to drive seriously. We knew that Petter Solberg and Sebastien Loeb tried to run away. The first bit of the stage went well. I found a good rhythm but then I made a gross mistake, Hirvonen remembered.

- The crash tore up the left front suspensions, everything. You couldn't continue. Probably they will get it in order so that we can continue on Saturday.

[bretddog]

I'm actually a Petter-fan. Just stating the facts, the situation vs the other 4 drivers has been pretty consistent so far. He has had about same speed as Latvala and Loeb, a bit faster than Ogier and Sordo. For today his best hope is 3rd some 25 seconds off lead. What happens on Sunday is harder to predict.
Well, when you above say "lost the rally" and "best hope is to manage 3rd" in the same go, that doesn't sound like you are talking about the 2nd leg finish. But Petter was disappointed with the setup for SS10, so nothing is written in stone yet. It should be clear to anyone that Citroen has a vast data collection of ideal setups for the C4 on various surfaces, not available for PSWRT, so for Petter to go a little yoyo on the setups and stage-times is not surprising.

[Langdale Forest]

SS11 started but no splits?

[jonkka]

Yeh - splits are quite selective... JML still leads but Loeb at equal time with him...

[Langdale Forest]

JML - Loeb = Joint lead.

[jonkka]

JML - Loeb = Joint lead.

Not quite. Equal time, yes, but JML still leads by tie breaker.

[Langdale Forest]

it is in theese situations when JML makes mistakes.

[jonkka]

Maybe JML doesn't want to take the lead for tomorrow...

[Francis44]

Solberg is on a flyer.

[Langdale Forest]

JML and Loeb will probably drop behind Ogier at the end of the day.

Splits have stopped for Loeb.

JML finished, Petter very quick!

[jonkka]

Splits have stopped for Loeb.

:eek:

[Langdale Forest]

:eek:

He probably hasn't stopped. ;)

Solberg is amazing!

[Finni2]

Petter is genuinely on top form in this stage. Let's see if the next time is ok this time.

Sordo is metally beaten man at the moment. He is so much slower than Ogier.

[pettersolberg29]

Petter is loving this stage Kafrain.

[Langdale Forest]

Loeb has finished.

Could Petter still win the rally?

[PJRevs]

I'm really dissapointed by Sordo this time

[bluuford]

Yes, Sordo has been really disappointment.. at the same time Latvala has been superb first on the road!

[Langdale Forest]

The next stage will probably see the return of tactics.

[Juha_Koo]

A very weird mistake by Mikko... A big blow for his championship dreams obviously.

But I'm so happy for JM. :) The guy is just so happy when he gets to fight for the victory. It's a pleasure to watch.

[sarally]

Des anyone know what happened to Ketamaa this morning??? I believe he restarted this morning.

[Viking]

Interesting stage ahead, will Latvala ”give” Loeb 25sec just to see if he would take it?
Will Citroen play the Ogier card instead?
Will Petter loose just as much as this morning’s run?

[COD]

Des anyone know what happened to Ketamaa this morning??? I believe he restarted this morning.

Was fastest S2000 on the first stage this morning, no idea what happened then...

[pettersolberg29]

Petter losing again. Why does he do this? He has a great chance of winning if he can stay within 30s but he has little chance now...

[Francis44]

Petter losing again. Why does he do this? He has a great chance of winning if he can stay within 30s but he has little chance now...

He said that he had no ideia why he was losing so much on this stage.

[Fide]

Petter losing again. Why does he do this? He has a great chance of winning if he can stay within 30s but he has little chance now...

He mentioned this morning he hadn't a proper setup for this split...

[MartijnS]

Does Loeb turn off his splits himself?

[WRC1]

loeb´s splits missing....let the games beginn :(

[DonJippo]

Was fastest S2000 on the first stage this morning, no idea what happened then...

Broken alternator belt.

[MartijnS]

It's back :)

[xavier]

bah, what's the point of rallying when, down the line, they will slow down!
The day will end with JML, Seb O, Seb L and Petter in that order. I guess all 3 have a reasonbale chance to pass JML tomorrow.

the FIA must change that running order and bring back 3 real day of rallying.

[bretddog]

I think Seb will take 25sec and stay in front..

[Rallyper]

bah, what's the point of rallying when, down the line, they will slow down!
The day will end with JML, Seb O, Seb L and Petter in that order. I guess all 3 have a reasonbale chance to pass JML tomorrow.

the FIA must change that running order and bring back 3 real day of rallying.

Yeah, this ridicoulous. :mad:

[pettersolberg29]

No tactics I think - Loeb will lead, Ogier 2nd, JML 3rd. Fair and square.

[WRC1]

petter much better than in the morning...but everything depends on tactics...thats really sad

[bluuford]

Seems that Sordo was also just fooling around today.. until now

[MartijnS]

Hahaha, great that Ogier made that mistake. This could definitely not be the plan.

[Ghostwalker]

I think Seb will take 25sec and stay in front..

good prediction ;)

Anyway Tomorrow brings us two stages more but the total distance is about 38km less and Loeb has 27 down to JML.

[WRC1]

surprise, surprise!!
no tactics from loeb, he takes the lead!! well done!

[wwbroe]

surprise, surprise!!
no tactics from loeb, he takes the lead!! well done!

Yes, but he is admitting himself that this is maybe not the smart thing to do. Anyhow we will see tomorrow, with Solberg and Sordo being just behind Latvalla, they will also have their role to play. :)

[Rallyper]

Sandell with oil leakage from gearbox. And finally gearbox broke down. Will restart tomorrow.

[tmx]

It is tactic by Loeb, I hate it when he turns off the split and he should be disallowed to do that. He's a very clever man. Fine the other are playing tactics, but if no split by him, then he should not be allow to see anyone else split as well. I am much more annoyed by this behavior than other drivers slowing down.

What I predict is if Petter can see the splits, maybe he can increase his driving, that way he won't be too far back. But Loeb decided to turn off the splits so no one behind can control their pace base on him, ideally Petter should be a bit further a head, now he is maybe too far behind.

But should be good fight tomorrow between Ogier, Latvala, Petter and maybe Sordo. I can accept now that Loeb will win.

[Mauri A]

Is it really allowed to turn off one´s splits?

[tmx]

I don't know and I know Petter didn't get the rhythm with this stage, but I know Loeb has done it multiple times in the past.

[RS]

It's great that we have seen no tactics on the last stage, but it is a pity that we will not have a straight fight tomorrow. I hope Loeb wins, I applaud his decision to fight from the front :up:

[Viking]

Is it really allowed to turn off one´s splits?

Dont think they turn it off, prob some sort of jammer ;)

[Juha_Koo]

Is it really allowed to turn off one´s splits?

No. There's no "OFF" switch in the GPS system because it's the same system which is used for safety purposes.

It's just a problem with the system that is a bit old fashioned. The splits are send first to a plane that relays them to a satellite. I guess the distances in Jordan are so big and there might be some airspace restrictions that prevent the plane to relay all the splits.

The only way to "turn off" one's splits is to loosen some cables in the GPS system and I think only Marcus and Timo have done that. :D I guess nowdays the cable connections are sealed.

[pucky54]

No. There's no "OFF" switch in the GPS system because it's the same system which is used for safety purposes.

It's just a problem with the system that is a bit old fashioned. The splits are send first to a plane that relays them to a satellite. I guess the distances in Jordan are so big and there might be some airspace restrictions that prevent the plane to relay all the splits.

The only way to "turn off" one's splits is to loosen some cables in the GPS system and I think only Marcus and Timo have done that. :D I guess nowdays the cable connections are sealed.

Nice explanation, but why are only Loeb's splits "getting lost" when it is going into the "interesting" phase of the day?

[Mauri A]

Nice explanation, but why are only Loeb's splits "getting lost" when it is going into the "interesting" phase of the day?
A good question!

[Viking]

Nice explanation, but why are only Loeb's splits "getting lost" when it is going into the "interesting" phase of the day?

Simple

http://gpsjammers.net/gmc07.html

well I guess they will hide it somewhere else than plugging it in the dash :)

[Juha_Koo]

Nice explanation, but why are only Loeb's splits "getting lost" when it is going into the "interesting" phase of the day?

A good question indeed... Maybe Daniel does some magic with some cable connections just like Timo used to do. :s mokin:

[Francis44]

All this mess was created by this stupid FIA rule....

Beeing first at the end of the day should be rewarded with a prize (last WRC position on the road). What's the point to go fast when you're going to clean the day after. Instead of beeing rewarded, the first driver geats the road cleaning penalty, I seriously dont understand this bull c***.

BTW, this Loeb conspiracy theory sounds great written here but I dont think they would be able to do all this with all those multiple in-car camera angles, probably just a system bug.

[MartijnS]

I really dont believe its a bug, which happens only to Loeb.

[Mauri A]

A very convenient system bug for Mr Loeb, nobody else didn´t have it.

[Francis44]

A very convenient system bug for Mr Loeb, nobody else didn´t have it.

It can happen to everyone, and I've already seen it happen to other drivers on other rally's, they can even later get those missing splits times
when cars arrive to service.

Like someone said before, Loeb is a clever man and do this kind of stuff would get him much more attention that he wants to have.

[Viking]

This is maybe a better choice
http://gpsjammers.net/gmt04.html
or even better get some of your highly paid engineers to build it into the co drivers mobile phone ;)

[Mauri A]

No. There's no "OFF" switch in the GPS system because it's the same system which is used for safety purposes.

It's just a problem with the system that is a bit old fashioned. The splits are send first to a plane that relays them to a satellite. I guess the distances in Jordan are so big and there might be some airspace restrictions that prevent the plane to relay all the splits.

The only way to "turn off" one's splits is to loosen some cables in the GPS system and I think only Marcus and Timo have done that. :D I guess nowdays the cable connections are sealed.
Looks like you are a bit old fashioned according to Viking´s posts!

[Kamikaze]

... they can even later get those missing splits times
when cars arrive to service.

Very helpfull for other Drivers who want to ply Tactics too :rolleyes:

[xavier]

A very convenient system bug for Mr Loeb, nobody else didn´t have it.

Since the beginning of the rally
Seb Loeb: 6 missing splits
Petter Solberg: 3 missing splits
Mikko Hirvonnen: 1 missing splits

Before accusing someone of cheating, maybe one should check the facts.

[Mauri A]

Since the beginning of the rally
Seb Loeb: 6 missing splits
Petter Solberg: 3 missing splits
Mikko Hirvonnen: 1 missing splits

Before accusing someone of cheating, maybe one should check the facts.
I did not accuse anybody, I was just wondering.

[Viking]

Since the beginning of the rally
Seb Loeb: 6 missing splits
Petter Solberg: 3 missing splits
Mikko Hirvonnen: 1 missing splits

Before accusing someone of cheating, maybe one should check the facts.

That is the beauty of it, the system isn’t stable in itself so it is very difficult to point fingers at someone.

[awake27]

Ogier helped Latvala get a better road position and he says that was the team plan! :s pin: Either the Citroen strategists are stupid or either Ogier screwed up and unintentionally slotted in front of Latvala. Jari-Matti has a golden chance to win it now.

[chryby]

some pictures from second leg:
http://www.rally-mania.cz/photogallery.php?id=679&fseason=2010

[Viking]

I guess Jordan River isn’t among Petters favorite stages, he lost 50seconds to Loeb over two runs and he is 43seconds behind in total.

[snellman]

golden road position for J-M now :)

[pettersolberg29]

Am I the only (blindly optimistic) person who still thinks Petter can win this rally? He's only about 20s behind Ogier, and I think he can make that up. It then only takes a small mistake by Loeb like a spin or stall and petter is right on his tail. 2nd is more likely but if he makes up 3s a stage on Ogier then he'll catch him at least.

[amilk]

Am I the only (blindly optimistic) person who still thinks Petter can win this rally? He's only about 20s behind Ogier, and I think he can make that up. It then only takes a small mistake by Loeb like a spin or stall and petter is right on his tail. 2nd is more likely but if he makes up 3s a stage on Ogier then he'll catch him at least.

yes quite optimistic....he need several things together

but would be nice...he deserve good results after fanatic work to put together this season.

[bluuford]

Am I the only (blindly optimistic) person who still thinks Petter can win this rally? He's only about 20s behind Ogier, and I think he can make that up. It then only takes a small mistake by Loeb like a spin or stall and petter is right on his tail. 2nd is more likely but if he makes up 3s a stage on Ogier then he'll catch him at least.

And where the hell you put Latvala?

[Mauri A]

[quote="bluuford"]And where the hell you put Latvala?[/QUOTE
In a ditch I presume!

[bretddog]

Am I the only (blindly optimistic) person who still thinks Petter can win this rally? He's only about 20s behind Ogier, and I think he can make that up. It then only takes a small mistake by Loeb like a spin or stall and petter is right on his tail. 2nd is more likely but if he makes up 3s a stage on Ogier then he'll catch him at least.
Win? Of course, anything can happen, but it's not really realistic.. As I think even Ogier will be hard to catch tomorrow. If Petter can't get his set-up optimal he may not even reach the podium. Still, with a good setup and going a bit nuts, he should be able to close up on Ogier.

[pettersolberg29]

And where the hell you put Latvala?

Either in a ditch, or more likely about level with Petter. Remember Petter has very little to lose, whereas the whole Ford team are relying on JML for Manufacturer points.
You've also got to remember that if it weren't for the two Jordan River stages where his setup wasn't right, Petter would be in the lead, or within about 10s of it. He has had the pace this weekend in every other stage, and from 4th on the road I think he can charge up the standings.

[bluuford]

Yes, I can confirm that your class is half full :-) How can you be sure that there wont be a stage where his set up does not suit? And anyway. You know, the point system really favors winning. If Latvala wins and Hirvonen can pass Henning somehow then they get at least 29 points. If loeb finishes second, and Sordo cannot pass Ogier then Citroen gets only 1 points more that means 30 points. So, Sordo has to pass Ogier tomorrow for sure. That means he has to pass Ogier or Ogier should fell behind Solberg and Sordo. Anyway, Podium for Ogier looks unrealistic when you look from teams point of view.

[FREDDIEFROG]

Either in a ditch, or more likely about level with Petter. Remember Petter has very little to lose, whereas the whole Ford team are relying on JML for Manufacturer points.
You've also got to remember that if it weren't for the two Jordan River stages where his setup wasn't right, Petter would be in the lead, or within about 10s of it. He has had the pace this weekend in every other stage, and from 4th on the road I think he can charge up the standings.

HE WILL NOT BE ALLOWED TO WIN.

[pettersolberg29]

Perhaps I will tone down my optimism then ;) . Let's aim for 2nd and just see what happens.

[Mirek]

Anyone knows what happened to Tuohino?

[pettersolberg29]

Ogier admits a mistake, although not his fault in my opinion.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/82628

[Viking]

HE WILL NOT BE ALLOWED TO WIN.

You’ve been here since 2006 and this is what you chose for your first post??

[Ondra WRC]

There are records from Jordan? http://wrc.mirafiori.com/wrc_2010/

[RS]

]Anyone knows what happened to Tuohino?

Broken propshaft.

[Tom206wrc]

So what next for tomorrow ??? Mistake from JML and Citroën's first 1-2-3-4 ???? :p :

[MJW]

So what next for tomorrow ??? Mistake from JML and Citroën's first 1-2-3-4 ???? :p :

No, I cant see a mistake from J-M this time.

[René]

You’ve been here since 2006 and this is what you chose for your first post??

:rotflmao:

[Kamikaze]

So what next for tomorrow ??? Mistake from JML and Citroën's first 1-2-3-4 ???? :p :

No !!

All Citroen will be told to stop for a Minute after the last split on the last SS for tactical Reasons :rolleyes:

[Mirek]

Broken propshaft.

Thanks

[DonJippo]

Ogier admits a mistake, although not his fault in my opinion.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/82628

There is an intresting detail in this article that got me thinking:

A source in the team said the problem had been the small window of time to get the time to Ogier's C4. Hesaid: "We only had about 15 seconds to get the data and send it - via a text message - to the car."'Was there somesort of delay in getting stagetimes to the system or do they always have this little time for this?

How about if they would use one minute between cars on stage as it used to be years ago instead of current two minutes? Would we see less tactics then?

[RS]

Bernado Sousa had a problem at the end of the day and had to superally so now Pons is the only sWRC driver not to have retired at least once and has a 9 minute lead :D

[Langdale Forest]

Just watched the wrc.com video of Hirvonen's accident this morning, he was very lucky not to roll!

[alleskids]

Sousa was out of gasoline before the park ferme and had recieved illegal help and is excluded for the Jordan rally
(translation from Portuguese: )
The navigator of Sousa, Nuno Rodrigues da Silva explained how it happened: "We gave up to do the Superrally. But we were pushed into the closed park. In between the commissioners saw the car being pushed. As we had not yet delivered the letter, found that we were still in evidence and therefore excluded them because they could not be pushed, "he said.
Rodrigues da Silva has called even the absurd decision of the commissioners, to the extent that "we were on track to deliver the letter. Our decision had already been taken," added the navigator.
Bernardo Sousa confessed himself astonished: "For me this is all strange. The Stewards were based on regulations, whereas, as we had not delivered the letter control, judged according officially given up and thus we could not be taken to our assistance. As such, assured us that they had left no other decision is not to exclude us from the competition, "said the pilot at the end of a day when bad luck if they were succeeding.

[fmcv]

I wonder where did you get that info about the lack o fuel! It was a malfunctioning fuse and the car wouldn't work!
What if Pons brakes down? We would then have a S-WRC winner who has not completed the itinerary...
Would that be the first time ever?

PS. Of course i'm not wishing bad luck over Xevi!

[alleskids]

http://autosport.aeiou.pt/gen.pl?p=stories&op=view&fokey=as.stories/83444 misinterruption in the translation. problems with fuel instead of not enough fuel. although both give the same result :)

[RICARDO75]

But wy is Bernardo Sousa on the star list for the last day?

Start list day 3:
http://www.wrc.com/jsp/index.jsp?lnk=40b&season=2010&rally_id=HKJ

Retirements:
http://www.wrc.com/jsp/index.jsp?lnk=407&season=2010&rally_id=HKJ

[6789]

Wow, extreme tactics from Ford & Citroen.. Unreal!!

[bretddog]

This looks to be a very interesting morning.. If my head is right, here are time loss to Loeb yesterday, and what they have to gain on him today to reel him in. Well.. Ogier is not in the equation anymore..

http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/5295/031073.gif

Obviously Latvala is in a really good position. And I'm sure Malcolm will let him 100% lose today.. It will be really crucial for the points, and his position is just perfect.

But wow, these tactics are a bit over the top by Citroen in my taste.. Where is the sporting attitude?

[FAlonso]

Pathetic situation. Rules need to be re-thinked urgently.

[RS]

What on earth is going on? Big penalty for Ogier and first on the road? And what about Mikko??

[jonkka]

I am confused too...

[bretddog]

This is really a sad game by Quesnel.. He can't just blame the regulations.. this is just a tragic decision by him.. No honor left in my book.

[Xsara Fan]

What on earth is going on? Big penalty for Ogier and first on the road? And what about Mikko??

8:50 for Ogier
15:00 for Mikko
:( (((

[jonkka]

8 M EARLY AT TC 14 (nets 8:00)
and
5 M LATE AT TC 13E (nets 50)

wow...

[jonkka]

This is really a sad game by Quesnel.. He can't just blame the regulations.. this is just a tragic decision by him.. No honor left in my book.

What?

[RS]

So both teams checked their cars in early so they could have extra roadsweepers?

Really harsh on Ogier!

[bretddog]

What?
what what? you got more words than that?

[jonkka]

So both teams checked their cars in early so they could have extra roadsweepers?

Really harsh on Ogier!

Then again, Ogier needs experience on running 1st on the road and this is good way to get it and benefit the team as well. But why he needed to check in 8 minutes early? If gap between cars is 2 mins as usually, 4 mins would have been sufficient, no?

[jonkka]

what what? you got more words than that?

What sad game? What decision? What the hell?

[RS]

Then again, Ogier needs experience on running 1st on the road and this is good way to get it and benefit the team as well. But why he needed to check in 8 minutes early? If gap between cars is 2 mins as usually, 4 mins would have been sufficient, no?

Yes, odd because now he drops behind many of the slow guys and will lose manufacturers points to the Ford teams.

[RS]

Raikkonen seems to have taken a different approach this weekend - slower but he is still on the road...

[6789]

With only two manufacturer teams the tactics are worse, it would be different with 4 manufacturer teams i think

[jonkka]

Raikkonen seems to have taken a different approach this weekend - slower but he is still on the road...

He can't wreck any more C4's because those aren't being built no more... :)

[bluuford]

This is really stupid by Quensel. What happens if Ogier goes off road and destroys his car due to the inexperience being first on the road?

[harriswrc]

Then again, Ogier needs experience on running 1st on the road and this is good way to get it and benefit the team as well. But why he needed to check in 8 minutes early? If gap between cars is 2 mins as usually, 4 mins would have been sufficient, no?If I get it right, the first order to Ogier from Citroen team should be to check after Latvala and P. Solberg and give them the disadvandage of 1 road position early.
Then, Ford ordered Mikko to check before Latvala and give him back 1 road position late.
After that, Citroen ordered Ogier to check before Loeb, to be 1st on the road, so that's the 8 mins early check...

[awake27]

This is really a sad game by Quesnel.. He can't just blame the regulations.. this is just a tragic decision by him.. No honor left in my book.
Malcolm just did the same with Hirvonen :s pin:. Ogier moved 1 place up and Hirvonen 7 to help their team-mates for better road position. Extreme tactics and time for FIA to think bringing back the system of 2003-2007. Enough of artificial competition on gravel rallies.

[RS]

I think Quesnel wants to expose the system but it's a shame he uses Ogier as his pawn. Mikko has retired, but Sebastien was rallying.

[jonkka]

If I get it right, the first order to Ogier from Citroen team should be to check after Latvala and P. Solberg and give them the disadvandage of 1 road position early.
Then, Ford ordered Mikko to check before Latvala and give him back 1 road position late.
After that, Citroen ordered Ogier to check before Loeb, to be 1st on the road, so that's the 8 mins early check...

That's a plausible explanation.

Edit: Apologies bretddog, you apparently meant this game?

[awake27]

This is really stupid by Quensel. What happens if Ogier goes off road and destroys his car due to the inexperience being first on the road?
He will drive steady and safe. Not with his eyes blinded. The cleaning effect is more or less the same either you drive like rautenbach or mcrae.

[jonkka]

JML seems to give up chase but Petter is coming behind and fast...

[Salist]

Good morning guys. Petter the fastest on SS15. :)

[6789]

Good morning guys. Petter the fastest on SS15. :)
Go Petter.. Two 2nd's in a row for Petter?? :D

[Salist]

Ogier penalty 8:50 min...Why?

[Salist]

...and Mikko 15:00 min. What happend?

[bretddog]

That's a plausible explanation.

Edit: Apologies bretddog, you apparently meant this game?
yea
I don't think Loeb is very happy with this. I think he kept his lead yesterday on his own discretion, and that he really believed he could pull off the win even with the disadvantage and minor time lead he had. Now it will be no such glory.

[René]

I don't know which person can quickly clean regulations of these sports, but it becomes urgent to make something before these excesses remove definitely the rally of the sports.

[RS]

Problems for Ketomaa again?

[ridder]

well with this, todays stages have become much less interesting.

On the other hand as was just mentioned on rally radio, it was basically 1-day rally with the intermediate reverse starting order.. The one leading on friday won just about every time. (specially Gronholm was perfect at that).

Anyway time for some statistics:
http://www.ewrc-results.com/profile.php?profile=5

Stage wins for Solberg:

2010 (C4) - 12 - after almost 3 rallies

2009 (Xsara)- 12
2008 (Subaru factory team) - 15
2007 (Subaru factory team) - 13
2006 (Subaru factory team) - 38
2005 (Subaru factory team) - 49
2004 (Subaru factory team) - 94
2003 (Subaru factory team) - 48
2002 (Subaru factory team) - 32

If he keeps current stage win rate he'll get something like 40 wins this season.
Sure stage wins are not what really counts, but they are kind of the best indicator of pure speed.

[6789]

If I get it right, the first order to Ogier from Citroen team should be to check after Latvala and P. Solberg and give them the disadvandage of 1 road position early.
Then, Ford ordered Mikko to check before Latvala and give him back 1 road position late.
After that, Citroen ordered Ogier to check before Loeb, to be 1st on the road, so that's the 8 mins early check...
This is what happened :)

[6789]

They just mentioned this site on World Rally Radio.. lol

[Salist]

I don't know which person can quickly clean regulations of these sports, but it becomes urgent to make something before these excesses remove definitely the rally of the sports.

I agree with you!!!

[awake27]

snip.

On the other hand as was just mentioned on rally radio, it was basically 1-day rally with the intermediate reverse starting order.. The one leading on friday won just about every time. (specially Gronholm was perfect at that).

snip.
So Latvala probably would have won this. Where is the problem? :D

Oh I forgot. A certain Mr. Loeb going so fast in most rallies that only this way he may lose some rallies and have some competition. Why don't we just ban Loeb from the WRC?

[Fide]

I agree with you!!!

This situation really sucks...............

[Salist]

This situation really sucks...............

Yes... :(

[sarally]

Anyone heard about Ketamaa's third withdrawal??? What happened??

[ridder]

Oh I forgot. A certain Mr. Loeb going so fast in most rallies that only this way he may lose some rallies and have some competition. Why don't we just ban Loeb from the WRC?

Actually this starting order favors Loeb more than the reverse, because he's the one starting from 1st position on day one just about every time.

[Moriarty]

Anyone heard about Ketamaa's third withdrawal??? What happened??

Some fault between gearbox and flywheel.

[sarally]

Thnx Moriarty.... Hope they sort that car out...

[Salist]

Ketoma was 2nd on SS15 behind PG +s. :)

[sarally]

I see that now thanks, so he's got the speed, just got to get the car sorted out.

[awake27]

Actually this starting order favors Loeb more than the reverse, because he's the one starting from 1st position on day one just about every time.
Starting 1st position in day 1 is only disadvabtage in both systems:

1) In reserve system you lose time in day 1 and hoping you are fast enough the next 2 days to beat the competition with probably equal road position.

2) In the current system you lose time in day 1 and hoping not everyone will slow down at the end of the day to get you till Sunday cleaning the road and eventually lose the rally, like Turkey 2008 or Australia 2009.

[Salist]

Starting 1st position in day 1 is only disadvabtage in both systems:

1) In reserve system you lose time in day 1 and hoping you are fast enough the next 2 days to beat the competition with probably equal road position.

2) In the current system you lose time in day 1 and hoping not everyone will slow down at the end of the day to get you till Sunday cleaning the road and eventually lose the rally, like Turkey 2008 or Australia 2009.


I think the "reverse system" was better than the current system.

[ridder]

Starting 1st position in day 1 is only disadvabtage in both systems:

1) In reserve system you lose time in day 1 and hoping you are fast enough the next 2 days to beat the competition with probably equal road position.

2) In the current system you lose time in day 1 and hoping not everyone will slow down at the end of the day to get you till Sunday cleaning the road and eventually lose the rally, like Turkey 2008 or Australia 2009.

Difference is that in 1) the first one on the road goes as fast as he can trough the first day to hope he doesn't loose as much, in 2) it's actually a bad idea to try to go fast on friday, instead it's better to keep it controlled and loose some 30 seconds.

So for the 1st one on the road the reserve system is more difficult.

[RS]

Where is Pons?

[Fide]

What if FIA removes both systems and put 4 or 5 of non A8 cars to run before anyone of the A8's (doesn't matter the day) to level the posibilities of all posible contenders ????

[RS]

IMO superralliers should run first on the road on days 2 and 3.

[jonkka]

What if FIA removes both systems and put 4 or 5 of non A8 cars to run before anyone of the A8's (doesn't matter the day) to level the posibilities of all posible contenders ????

That is good idea but:
a) where would the funding come from?
b) who would drive those cars, because it takes skill to use the same line as the works drivers coming up behind?

If those two questions could be sorted out, that'd be ideal solution.

[sarally]

Still no POns but see Ketomaa quickest S car at 1st split

[RS]

Still no POns but see Ketomaa quickest S car at 1st split

Looks like Kosciuzko out too, thats all sWRC crews failed to complete the whole distance.

[sarally]

Reliability of just overdriving from them all???

[azblk]

Wheres Rautencrash when we need him?

[Mauri A]

That is good idea but:
a) where would the funding come from?
b) who would drive those cars, because it takes skill to use the same line as the works drivers coming up behind?

If those two questions could be sorted out, that'd be ideal solution.

In the "old good days" we had the East-German Trabants starting first and nobody was complaining!!!

[RS]

Reliability of just overdriving from them all???

I think most of the problems were driver errors, but there seem to be a lot of rocks in the road here, especially for the sWRC crews who run after the main WRC crews.

[sarally]

SEe Pons did finish SS16, jst slow time

[ridder]

Reading the full explanation of what happened:

"This morning, Ogier checked-in five minutes LATE to the pre-stage service, incurring a 50 second time penalty and dropping to fifth in the start order.
Ford reacted, checking Mikko Hirvonen EARLY out of service (by nine minutes) and into the SS14 start control (by six minutes), to slot him ahead of team-mate Jari-Matti Latvala in the running order.
In a final move, Ogier checked-in EARLY at the start of SS14 (by eight minutes) jumping ahead of all the drivers and saving Sebastien Loeb from running first on the road by sacrificing his own position in the top five."


I have to say that it tells the most about Citroen. Specially the last move was worthy of a 5 year old who has to get it his way no matter what.

Loeb was perfectly capable of wining from first place with Latvala even 4th on the road, specially when 2 of the stages are really fast with patches on tarmac.

[RS]

Loeb was perfectly capable of wining from first place with Latvala even 4th on the road, specially when 2 of the stages are really fast with patches on tarmac.

I agree. Loeb has been faster than Latvala on all morning stages despite running earlier on the road.

Citroen's move with Ogier was unnecessary, on the other hand Ford started the silly business.

The difference is that Quesnel hates these tactics and Wilson loves them.

Personally I'd prefer if the fights came from real competitiveness on the stages.

[Ondra WRC]

Kosciuszko out?

[bretddog]

The appropriate next move will be Hirvonen crashing into Loebs car on the way out of the service park from mid day service, and Ogier responding by crashing into Latvala just after his finish of SS18.

Then I think we are all satisfied! :D

[Viking]

Ironic that Latvala with his team#2 carefully approach will possibly be a chunk of points ahead of Hirvonen who did have a typical “Latvala moment” :)

[kolvas]

I think most of the problems were driver errors, but there seem to be a lot of rocks in the road here, especially for the sWRC crews who run after the main WRC crews.

just like you say, alot of stones that causes problems for the drivers.
PG has seven stage wins in S-WRC so far, it´s impressive, and also Patrik Flodin in P-WRC is very impressive with 11th place overall after SS17

[TMorel]

I cant seem to get WRC.com to load so can someone tell me where Mikko was before all the silly tactics started.
Could he have still managed to get into the points? If so, is a JML victory worth more than the long term view of Mikko getting a point - we all know how important that was last year.

[Viking]

I cant seem to get WRC.com to load so can someone tell me where Mikko was before all the silly tactics started.
Could he have still managed to get into the points? If so, is a JML victory worth more than the long term view of Mikko getting a point - we all know how important that was last year.

No chance for points, he was nr. 20 and some 20min behind 10th.

[bretddog]

I cant seem to get WRC.com to load so can someone tell me where Mikko was before all the silly tactics started.
Could he have still managed to get into the points? If so, is a JML victory worth more than the long term view of Mikko getting a point - we all know how important that was last year.
In any case a JML victory would secure 14 relative manu's championship points, and pull 7 points from Loebs driver's points.

[bluuford]

In regroup do they restore the normal starting order?

[wwbroe]

In regroup do they restore the normal starting order?

No they don't, except when somebody is ofcourse checking in late or early. :D

[John V]

Kosciuszko out?
Rolled, Michal transported to medical check as his eye problem reported (less visibility). Probably as they landed on the roof and hard to say how long they stay upside-down hanged in seat-belts.

[jonkka]

The appropriate next move will be Hirvonen crashing into Loebs car on the way out of the service park from mid day service, and Ogier responding by crashing into Latvala just after his finish of SS18.

Then I think we are all satisfied! :D

Satisfied? No - because Petter would win.

[Red bull]

Wheres Rautencrash when we need him?
Busy winning african rallies :D

[sarally]

Busy winning african rallies :D
BUt only just!! He's got his work cut out for him..

[Juha_Koo]

Ironic that Latvala with his team#2 carefully approach will possibly be a chunk of points ahead of Hirvonen who did have a typical “Latvala moment” :)

It's also a bit ironic that not taking into account Sweden, Latvala has been faster than Mikko this year. :) And what is this guy doing? Being a second driver supporting the team? WTF?

I hope Malcolm realises the situation and rescues what there is left to rescue and dismantles the 1st-2nd driver scheme inside the Ford team.

[jonkka]

It's also a bit ironic that not taking into account Sweden, Latvala has been faster than Mikko this year. :)

Interesting mathematics - disregarding Sweden leaves just two rallies to take into account. So outpacing Mikko in two rallies makes JML a team leader? Considering that both of them have crashed out on super special, I still think JML is bigger ape having done it on final stage and on course to 2nd. He should have been sacked there and then.

[bluuford]

So, three stages to go, so I hope Loeb gets puncture or turbo blows and he fell behind Solberg. Turbo would be better.. in terms of team :-) I hope Quensel wont stay too long in this sport. He has done so much bad for it already.

[havk]

What an absurdal move by Citroen. Most probably they hand in Latvala 3 extra points, as Ogier had big chances to finish 2nd, not saying that they ruined good rally for Sebastien. I'd just wait one or two stages to do such a move if Latvala threatened Loeb then I'd start considering if Ogier should go earlier to time control. Ford? Obviously Hirvonen had nothing to lose...

[Ghostwalker]

So, three stages to go, so I hope Loeb gets puncture or turbo blows and he fell behind Solberg. Turbo would be better.. in terms of team :-) I hope Quensel wont stay too long in this sport. He has done so much bad for it already.

he haven't done anything that Malcom Wilson / Ford haven't already done.

[Mirek]

And now something completely different...

Does anyone know what happened to Khalid Al Quassimi in SS16? He was doing only MERC but compared to SWRC he did really good times yesterday...

[muscrae]

he haven't done anything that Malcom Wilson / Ford haven't already done.

Totally agree.

[sarally]

Only 6 seconds between S car and Flodin...Interesting. Will Pns push or just take the S win???

[Mirek]

I think that Pons doesn't push at all.

[muscrae]

]I think that Pons doesn't push at all.

Yes for sure. He has 12 mins in his hand already.. :)

[bluuford]

he haven't done anything that Malcom Wilson / Ford haven't already done.

Well, I think that Wilson has played with the tactics mostly in sensible way. Slowing town on the last stage and playing with the position is quite interesting quite often.. but those decisions that gave Loeb a Title (last year in Poland) forcing satellite team drivers to stop for nearly half hour and now playing with time penalties when failing to play the game that most of tactics fans consider as interesting.. well. He ruined the few interesting parts that FIA had left. Sorry, no respect to Quensel anymore. This time Wilson just did what he had to do. Quensel did the first bad move and Wilson didn't had a choice. Hopefully PSA will not get any titles this year.

[azblk]

he haven't done anything that Malcom Wilson / Ford haven't already done.
Still doesn't make it right

[muscrae]

I think game is over for Petter to catch JML. Okey then, he is just "perfect" in last two rallies... :)

Petter: "I stopped pushing, I kept the line, nothing more. I lost too much time on the Jordan Rover stages yesterday and now it is too late. We can't push hard now."

[AndyRAC]

Almost unbelievable what's happened this morning. These 'tactics' don't make the sport more 'interesting'. They make it look pathetic. Jean Todt should do something pretty soon, as this is a step too far. Why punish the leader by running first? It really frustrates me, I really want the WRC to succeed and be strong, but things like this make me want to pull my hair out.
Both Ford/Citroen are to blame, if there were more manufacturers, it would be harder to implement these pathetic schemes.

[bretddog]

What an absurdal move by Citroen. Most probably they hand in Latvala 3 extra points, as Ogier had big chances to finish 2nd, not saying that they ruined good rally for Sebastien. I'd just wait one or two stages to do such a move if Latvala threatened Loeb then I'd start considering if Ogier should go earlier to time control. Ford? Obviously Hirvonen had nothing to lose...
Well, I'm sure manufacturer points were the main motive in this move. So give Latvala 3 and Sordo 3 makes no change. While securing the 14 relative gain from a sure win by Loeb.

[Juha_Koo]

Interesting mathematics - disregarding Sweden leaves just two rallies to take into account. So outpacing Mikko in two rallies makes JML a team leader? Considering that both of them have crashed out on super special, I still think JML is bigger ape having done it on final stage and on course to 2nd. He should have been sacked there and then.

You're right, my mathematics are interesting. :) It's also very interesting to see people not talking much about Mikko's (in my opinion) incredibly stupid crash. If that would have been JM, I'd be 110% sure that there would be three pages of laughing and idiotic comments here plus fiery comments in the "Time's up for Latvala" thread.

I actually rate Mikko's bank clip even higher in my unnescesary crashes list than his or JM's crashing on superspecials. SSS's are very techincal and after all it's rather easy to do a mistake in there. But a flat right over a crest with nothing special in it... I just don't get it.

Don't get me wrong, I'm *not* patronizing Mikko! I'm just utterly surprised by his weird mistake and so is Mikko too. After the crash you can hear Jarmo saying "How did you manage to do that?" and "laughing" a little.

[alleskids]

]And now something completely different...

Does anyone know what happened to Khalid Al Quassimi in SS16? He was doing only MERC but compared to SWRC he did really good times yesterday...

were do yu follow MERC rally times compared with the WRC? Nasser Al Attiyah may have a bad SWRC weekend, but is still competing in MERC mode also

[Mirek]

The easiest way is to put this link and rewrite the number of stage in url: http://www.jordanrally.com/MERC_2010/Results/ss17.aspx

Otherwise it's on http://www.jordanrally.com/MERC_2010/Default.aspx page.

[alleskids]

Results day 2
Anderson 1.33,51
Kosiuszko 1.34,55
Pons 1.35,18
Al Qassimi 1.35,20 MERC
Brynildsen 1.35,55
Al Rahji 1.38,02 MERC Peugeot
Al Marri 1.38,31 MERC Subaru
Touhino 1.41,15
Sousa 1.45,23
Al Attiyah 1.46,43 SWRC/MERC
Nasser Al Attiyah is losing big time also in MERC. But Al Qassimi looks to be retired on day 3

[Ghostwalker]

Still doesn't make it right

I never said it was.

[muscrae]

What a "splitless" end to the rally !!!

[RS]

just like you say, alot of stones that causes problems for the drivers.
PG has seven stage wins in S-WRC so far, it´s impressive, and also Patrik Flodin in P-WRC is very impressive with 11th place overall after SS17

Are you Swedish? :D

Seriously though, both impressive. PGA is clearly the fastest driver in sWRC but Al-Attiyah also has been good this weekend - it will be interesting to see what he can do in IRC now that he has learned to drive the car. Ketomaa has been fast on the few stages he has completed, but hard to tell relative competitiveness since nobody is trying that hard any more.

Tuohino slow as I expected, and Brynildsen and Sandell either make too many mistakes or have too many technical problems. However Eyvind will pick up good points here and Pons is looking good for the championship with his steady drive.

Koscuizsko again impressive on speed, pity about his accident.

[Mirek]

Don't underate Brynildsen, he is clear 2WD winner :D

[RS]

]Don't underate Brynilden, he is clear 2WD winner :D

Lol, yes :) His times were not bad yesterday considering!

[Viking]

]Don't underate Brynildsen, he is clear 2WD winner :D

What’s this about that they couldn’t change the rear diff?? rules or just low on spare parts :confused:

[RS]

What’s this about that they couldn’t change the rear diff?? rules or just low on spare parts :confused:

No spare.

[RS]

From Autosport.com:

"Ford wants to win this rally, that's very important to us, of course it is, but not at any cost. Our integrity is equally important to us.

"My concern on the back of this is that this could frighten off potential manufacturers coming to the sport. It would be good to find a way around this before it becomes damaging for the sport. But, as I said, we're not prepared to compromise our integrity or to damage the sport. I'm very firm on this."

What a load of horse****! Ford haven't exactly been shy in playing the tactical card in the past, and in fact Wilson was saying the other day that he wants them to stay as it's the only thing that makes WRC interesting.

[bluuford]

Well, they have done it in sensible way. I dont see nothing bad in slowing down for some seconds to get better position for next day.. and such a cat and mouse play.. but to play with time penalties.. it is completely unacceptable. Imagine, I have one reserve driver just for in case sitting in 8-9th place. When i need I put him 9 minutes before everybody on road and voilaa My team driver nr 1 is not first anymore.

[Ghostwalker]

Well, they have done it in sensible way. I dont see nothing bad in slowing down for some seconds to get better position for next day.. and such a cat and mouse play.. but to play with time penalties.. it is completely unacceptable. Imagine, I have one reserve driver just for in case sitting in 8-9th place. When i need I put him 9 minutes before everybody on road and voilaa My team driver nr 1 is not first anymore.

ford HAVE played with time penalties many times but obviously you Ford boys seems to have "forgotten" that.
Not to mention ho whey have used team orders to slow down other Ford drivers so that MH and JML could finish in a higher position.
I know Citroen have done it too but as I said anything Citroen have done Ford have done before.

[Viking]

From Autosport.com:

"Ford wants to win this rally, that's very important to us, of course it is, but not at any cost. Our integrity is equally important to us.

"My concern on the back of this is that this could frighten off potential manufacturers coming to the sport. It would be good to find a way around this before it becomes damaging for the sport. But, as I said, we're not prepared to compromise our integrity or to damage the sport. I'm very firm on this."

What a load of horse****! Ford haven't exactly been shy in playing the tactical card in the past, and in fact Wilson was saying the other day that he wants them to stay as it's the only thing that makes WRC interesting.

Damage control? Smelling a FIA sanction coming for bringing the sport into disrepute?

[N.O.T]

Can all the ford little girls in here gather their tears ? I plan to shower with them...

Hirvonen fan tears are also good so gather them also....

Citroen and ford did a shameful LEGAL thing that the F.I.A ALLOWS them to do...now with Ogier the story is very harsh but i doubt the Citroen team will not repay him in other ways....

did you miss me ?? be honest

[bluuford]

Yes, ford have done it before but not like that. They have done it before the end of rally to switch positions. As I mentioned, I like that cat and mouse slowing game before the end of day.. bust to do such nasty thing like Quensel did today and Malcolm followed, I can see only one way, exclude cars nr 1-4 from the standings and drivers as well.

And I dont consider myself as ford fan.. I was a few years ago.. but now I am just a fan of rally :-) And for me, This is the worst thing that has happened in last ten years that Quensel did today.

[tmx]

All that was unnecessary and comical. Loeb would win anyway without Ogier, so the only one to lose is Ogier himself. I was hoping for a very exciting 3 way fight between Latvala, Ogier and Petter. Too much tactics ruined that.

I also feel Jari could fight for the win if he was driving not with a 2nd driver mindset.

F1 Sepang qualifying was more interesting.

[bluuford]

Can all the ford little girls in here gather their tears ? I plan to shower with them...

Hirvonen fan tears are also good so gather them also....

Citroen and ford did a shameful LEGAL thing that the F.I.A ALLOWS them to do...now with Ogier the story is very harsh but i doubt the Citroen team will not repay him in other ways....

did you miss me ?? be honest

Yes I missed you, the spirit of Forum was missing for a long :-)

I tought that this was the worst rally weekend ever.. But now.. it is not anymore :-)

[wwbroe]

What happened with Brynildsen? I don't see him in standings after stage 20? :confused: :(

[Mirek]

All that was unnecessary and comical. Loeb would win anyway without Ogier, so the only one to lose is Ogier himself.

I'm sure he didn't choose to play this ridiculous game himself.

[Francis44]

exclude cars nr 1-4 from the standings and drivers as well.


Thas was the most stupid thing I've read here in awhile.

What does Latvala and Solberg have to do with this??!! Nothing, so leave them alone.

[bluuford]

Solberg does not wear number 4 I mean manufacturer entries. Just to bring them back on earth. Solberg wins, Wilson second, Ogier third.. etc.