2008 Rally New Zealand - official thread

[Tom206wrc]

Petter said....

"As I said earlier. I don't know what to do. Struggling a huge."

D.R i am sure he is not smiling :p :



D.R = David Richards ??? :p :

[Tomi]

I still didn't understand, what did Loeb do on the last stage, his splits are fast?

Propably problem with the car, Loeb for sure dont play tactics ;)

[Finni]

Unfortunately there is no good solution for the sweeping problem, both running orders have their inherent problem...

Old system was fine. It was up to driver where he ended to drive Saturday and Sunday.

Only drivers who got inherent disadvantage were championship leaders but it was only funny to see how they dealt little disadvantage for first few stages.

[Finni]

Latvala now happily leading. :) He didn't want to lead but obviously forgot to count Loeb's move.. Lol Yesterday he settled second ahead of Sordo. That guy can't play tactics calmly.

What Loeb is now doing with tactics is a real masterpiece. He is fooling Ford-boys. Ford drivers could have done the same as in Turkey but didn't do.

[Kamikaze]

Again my Question:

Where are all the Guys who called Ford cheaters and a shame for the Sport ?
What are you say now about Loeb and Citroen ?

[Brother John]

Again my Question:

Where are all the Guys who called Ford cheaters and a shame for the Sport ?
What are you say now about Loeb and Citroen ?

:up: :D :s mokin: :?: http://paradise.motorsportforum.com/forums/images/icons/spin2.gif

[Xsara Fan]

Again my Question:

Where are all the Guys who called Ford cheaters and a shame for the Sport ?
What are you say now about Loeb and Citroen ?

It`s a revenge. Malcolm Wilson has started this, not Loeb.

[Mirek]

It's pitty that Baldacci crashed in the fight, but Prokop had sooo much of bad luck this year, that I hope he can keep his first place to the finish :)

[A.F.F.]

Latvala now happily leading. :) He didn't want to lead but obviously forgot to count Loeb's move.. Lol Yesterday he settled second ahead of Sordo. That guy can't play tactics calmly.



Or maybe he was ordered to sweep the road.

[A.F.F.]

Again my Question:

Where are all the Guys who called Ford cheaters and a shame for the Sport ?
What are you say now about Loeb and Citroen ?

I'm here :wave:

I call citroen cheaters and shame for the sport.

[ste898]

Again my Question:

Where are all the Guys who called Ford cheaters and a shame for the Sport ?
What are you say now about Loeb and Citroen ?

Ahh but you have to remember its always OK for Loeb and Citroen to cheat but ohhhhhhh not for anyone else........what a complete joke this forum is!!!

I have said fo many years that Citroen are nothing but cheats

[Kamikaze]

I'm here :wave:

I call citroen cheaters and shame for the sport.

Thank you !!!

I´m curios who else is so honest.......

@xsara-Fan:


It`s a revenge. Malcolm Wilson has started this, not Loeb.

In other Words you say:

If Ford do it, it is cheating
If Citroen do it it is OK

Strange.....

[KKS]

Oh Loeb... what are you doing :( ?

[Wim_Impreza]

I just saw the coverage of day 1 and I must say Loeb had very much luck there. He almost rolled, but didn't. The starter problem from Loeb was for sure tactics, good to see on television in the coverage, and he did it again at the end of day 2. Just as Kamikaze and Brother John said, where are all the Ford bashers now?

@ John V: I really hope too that Prokop will win the PWRC, but there is still a long way to go and he had so much bad luck so he really deserved a win. As some of you know, I support the Czech, Finnish and off course Belgian driver(s).

What is P. Solberg doing? He must retire from the sport, he is not motivated enough and he hasn't the speed anymore since years.

[MikeD]

You Ford guys are a bunch of hypocrites.

Did you think that when Ford started using tactics that Citroen would be willing to lose the title on this? Ford forced the problem into the sport this year and now it’s 1-1 and you have tasted your own medicine.

And now we can only hope for FIA to find a solution so we don’t have to watch this tactical crap next year. I simply don’t want to waste my time for two days of good Rally to end up with this.

[ste898]

I dont think so MikeD what I see is Loeb lovers only seeing what they want to see and slagging Ford off but not the cheating Citroens

[Kamikaze]

I dont think so MikeD what I see is Loeb lovers only seeing what they want to see and slagging Ford off but not the cheating Citroens

You must understand them, their God Loeb has done the same thing as the cheating Ford-Boys :rolleyes:
Hard for them.....

[A.F.F.]

I don't believe this forum is cut in two districts, Ford- and Citroen lovers. There are fans of other manufactureres and us, who aren't basicly fans of any manufacturer, or equally support them all but therefore, couldn't care a rat's *** who started the tactics or who's to blame. What I do believe is that if only FIA could find a solution to this starting order issue we could all be happier.

[jonkka]

The only difference may be at the amount of time they are behind, but the current system did not help them to get ahead of the other teams. So tell me how it motivates these teams?

You are correct here and now, the current second rate teams do not get much benefit from the road order rule as it seems that Suzuki is unwilling and Subaru is unable to make technological progress (and B-teams do no development at all). But if we had a true newcomer in class of Toyota or Peugeot, the longer uphill struggle to the top in form of reversed running order might discourage them. This very argument was brought up by teams like Hyundai and Skoda at the time when we had seven works teams in WRC. Oh, those were the times...


It is far worse for the image of Rallying that drivers stop on the side of the road! How can a manufacturer commit money to that kind of farce? It is supposed to be a sport where the fastest and smartest wins on the course of a few days. Now it is who is fastest on the last 1/2 day!

It is a problem, there is no doubt of that. But how big problem it is really? For us fans, I think that most do not like the associated game in tactics. But for casual observer and manufacturers (who are in for those casual observers, not us hardcore fans), I do not think they see much of it or even know about it at all.

That's because news on papers, TV or net do mention it but do not gloat about it (at least those I've read or seen). And if casual observer doesn't know any better, he thinks it's natural part of the game. Which it in fact is because of the rules.

Those who know better or happen to stand near stop control of the final SS it is detrimental, of course. I would, as I've said already, rather see flat out driving for three days but I understand FIA's reasoning behind this rule change.

[pettersolberg29]

What I dont understand is why are people calling for Petter to retire?

Surely there are lots of drivers who should retire first because they're worse. Drivers like Wilson, Henning and Galli are worse, despite having an equal or better car, and recently Petter has been better than Atko as well, but no-ones calling for them to retire.
All Petter needs is a better car where there is a chance for a win - he wont win the drivers championship, but he could still be an asset for the sport, and perhaps create a great fight for third next year.
Loeb and Mikko will be top 2, with JML, Sordo, Atko and hopefully Petter close battle for third. I think next season will be great.

[Simmi]

There's some very naive forum members on here thats for sure. If it's in the regulations and they aren't being disqualified for it, then how exactly is it cheating?

Just because people cant comprehend a rally being won by anything other then a right foot. This type of thing always used to happen and I'm sure it will continue to happen again in the future. If I was a team principal and I'm dealt a duff set of regulations (thanks FIA) that penalises my driver for leading the rally, then I will try to gain back some of that advantage any way I can.

It isn't cheating, and if anything it adds extra talking points to the gravel rallies, where as last year a rally was usually dead in the water before Day 2 had even started.

So strategy, risk vs reward, chance and pure guess all work get thrown into the mix for us to talk about. Instead all people can do is be one-dimensional and cry about it.

Just because you feel cheated, doesn't mean they are cheating!

[Wim_Impreza]

What I dont understand is why are people calling for Petter to retire?

Surely there are lots of drivers who should retire first because they're worse. Drivers like Wilson, Henning and Galli are worse, despite having an equal or better car, and recently Petter has been better than Atko as well, but no-ones calling for them to retire.

Look at the podiums scored by Atkinson and P. Solberg this year, than you couldn't say that Petter is better than Atkinson. The Australian driver has also a lot more points and I shouldn't say Galli is a worse driver. Henning is driving for his pleasure, you can't compare him with his brother. We all know that Matthew Wilson is not good enough for the WRC.

[MikeD]

You must understand them, their God Loeb has done the same thing as the cheating Ford-Boys :rolleyes:
Hard for them.....

Pffff

What lame debating skills!

You think I see Loeb as a god, because of a debate reagarding tactics? That's simply the most pathetic argument in here for a long time (And takes some beating)

I have never claimed that Ford cheats, because they have used tactics which are a part of the rule. But it's poor sportsmanship, and by starting to use that in a close championship they have forced Citroën to do the same.

Don't expect Citroën to sit back losing both championships by a small margin, because they wouldn't use the same tactics as Ford. Ford startet it and of course by doing so they force their nearest competitor to do the same.

If you don't get that, you never will.

[Tomi]

I dont think so MikeD what I see is Loeb lovers only seeing what they want to see and slagging Ford off but not the cheating Citroens

Exactly, if theese "nice livery" guys would have been following rally for some time they would know that in the past when the starting order rules was the same, all teams tryed to benefit from it, why would Citroen be different, and try to make it more difficult for them self?

[Daniel]

I dont think so MikeD what I see is Loeb lovers only seeing what they want to see and slagging Ford off but not the cheating Citroens
Malcolm, shouldn't you be busy running your team? :)

[Kamikaze]

But it's poor sportsmanship, and by starting to use that in a close championship they have forced Citroën to do the same.

Ford startet it and of course by doing so they force their nearest competitor to do the same.

Let me resume.....

When Ford uses Tactics they are poor Sportsman.
When Citroen do the same, Ford was the reason that they do it.

Ford are always guilty :rolleyes:

Never heard so much B.S !

[MikeD]

Let me resume.....

When Ford uses Tactics they are poor Sportsman.
When Citroen do the same, Ford was the reason that they do it.

Ford are always guilty :rolleyes:

Never heard so much B.S !

Pffff

Like I said, you just don't get it!

[ste898]

Pffff

Like I said, you just don't get it!

More Bull from the man from Denmark!!

[c4]

Day 2 article and vids
http://rallybuzz.stagetimes.com/rally-new-zealand-2008-day-2-results-latvala-leads/

[A.F.F.]

Day 2 article and vids
http://rallybuzz.stagetimes.com/rally-new-zealand-2008-day-2-results-latvala-leads/

Great website you got there. Keep up the good work :up:

[Dingardo]

some of my day 2 pics are up.

http://gallery.wrcfm.com/main.php?cmd=album&var1=RallyNZ+2008%2FDay+2%2F

all of SS8 and all of the WRCar's on SS11 (using the original stage names, not the revised WRC.com ones)

[jparker]

I hate the FIA! If they dont change the rule for next year i wont follow any gravel events!
I dont know who's the idiot that though this year running order was a good idea, but the guy should be nailed to tommorow's front runner car bumper and use as a sweeper!
I like and enjoy the new rules, far better then knowing your oponents times and drive acordinglly.

[dimviii]

@Dingardo
have you got any fotos of Mason/Mason?

[c4]

Great website you got there. Keep up the good work :up:

Thanks for that A.F.F. and I do intend to keep at it :D

[jparker]

Hmmm, I have to admit I didn't expect Loeb to play tactics, but still don't mind the outcome so far. There is great amount of risk involved in this kind of games, and nothing can be certan. I hope JML takes that one and make everyone think about it in the future.

[COD]

More Bull from the man from Denmark!!

Denmark, even more famous rally country than Greece :laugh:

[N.O.T]

Denmark, even more famous rally country than Greece :laugh:

No they are not....

Tommorow wiull be interesting day to see....with Latvala not having any racing lines to follow i don;t expect him to win, especially when the manyfacturer battle is also close...4 seconds i think its a small gap between Hirvonen and Loeb so i expect Loeb to be ahead by around 4-5 before the start of the repeated stages...certainly all leading crews must try to their limit and when this happens things hardly go smooth for all of them.

[Finni]

That's pure naivety to think Ford forced Citroen to do tactics. Citroen is shrewd winning team and they of course uses tactics when beneficial. At least if Loeb and Citroen had the position of Ford drivers (=underdogs) they would certainly use everything possible tactic. We know that Loeb even had unofficial crew from Citroen to searching stages in Finland few years ago. Citroen is far from sentimental "soft-boys-team".

[Simmi]

Exactly right Finni - you dont become the best team in rallying without having a ruthless streak!

[Daniel]

That's pure naivety to think Ford forced Citroen to do tactics. Citroen is shrewd winning team and they of course uses tactics when beneficial. At least if Loeb and Citroen had the position of Ford drivers (=underdogs) they would certainly use everything possible tactic. We know that Loeb even had unofficial crew from Citroen to searching stages in Finland few years ago. Citroen is far from sentimental "soft-boys-team".
I'll say it again. No one is really whinging about the Ford Abu Scooby Dooby Doo team using tactics but about Wilson using cars from a satellite team as if they were part of his team. Team orders are fine. But using another team is not. Imagine the outcry if Ferrari got another team to impede McLaren or someone in a race or qualifying session?

Telling your own drivers to slow down is fine and well within the rules and I accept that even if I don't like it. But using Henning and Galli is something that should really be looked at. If Malcolm wants to run a 4 car team then he should. He shouldn't however use drivers from another supposedly independant team. You either have a 4 car team or two 2 car teams.... not both.

These rules have this year and in previous years made for some of the worst rallying ever. People will point to the margins the rallies are won by but it's all so artificial and carefully orchestrated that unless you're one of these people who just supports a team or a driver it's boring from a sporting point of view. It's not even clever..... F1 pit strategies can be clever but telling your drivers to fall back behind the leader so they get a better road position? Any 5 year old could work that one out.

[playmo]

Yes, Ford started using tactics, but if they hadn't are you ALL sure that citroen wouln't have started already (o would start eventually)??
It's part of the game, but blaming ford for starting it it's like little kids when they have fights: "he started it..." get over it.
One thing i still believe is that is not Loeb thats doing this, it's mr. Quesnel (or whatever) if seb won finland (fair and square) he would, by pure right foot, win Zealand without tactics, and he knows it.
The current system is better than the previous, but far from GOOD for the sport (go figure what the other was).
The way the time table looks, pont to be a citroen 1-2 come sunday at 3 pm.

[playmo]

I don't believe this forum is cut in two districts, Ford- and Citroen lovers. There are fans of other manufactureres and us, who aren't basicly fans of any manufacturer, or equally support them all but therefore, couldn't care a rat's *** who started the tactics or who's to blame. What I do believe is that if only FIA could find a solution to this starting order issue we could all be happier.

And amen to that too!

[Daniel]

Yes, Ford started using tactics, but if they hadn't are you ALL sure that citroen wouln't have started already (o would start eventually)??
It's part of the game, but blaming ford for starting it it's like little kids when they have fights: "he started it..." get over it.
One thing i still believe is that is not Loeb thats doing this, it's mr. Quesnel (or whatever) if seb won finland (fair and square) he would, by pure right foot, win Zealand without tactics, and he knows it.
The current system is better than the previous, but far from GOOD for the sport (go figure what the other was).
The way the time table looks, pont to be a citroen 1-2 come sunday at 3 pm.

NZ and Finland are very different events despite what people say. Fast and flowing is about all they share, New Zealand has far more camber to the corners and doesn't have nearly as many jumps either. Finland is also grippier too.

[playmo]

I mean, he's won the most demanding event, in front of quite some challenge (by the locals, of course) so he can win wherever (at this pont, with the current competition)

[tmx]

Oh my god I haven't follow the news since for a day and now it's even worse than before. I can't watch this anymore.

What makes me sad is that after all that slowing the people behind can't catch up.

[White Sauron]

Don't wanna continue all this negative trend, but...
That's the first overseas rally in many years that I don't follow on-line at night. I mean I used not to sleep during rallies Japan, Argentina or New Zealand, following the action lots of hours behind/in front of me, but this season... Well, I haven't seen a single stage "on-line" yet. And despite there're 4 people capable of winning the rally, It's not gonna happen tonight too.

[tmx]

I would like to see Richard Mason passing Villagra and Rautenbach tomorrow.

[Finni]

I'll say it again. No one is really whinging about the Ford Abu Scooby Dooby Doo team using tactics but about Wilson using cars from a satellite team as if they were part of his team.

Mike from denmark and Xsara fan implied that today's tactical game wouldn't have happened in pure and honest Citroen-world. Bad Ford team forced Citroen to do this. My response was for them.

By the way, If Citroen had satellite team and their situation would be difficult for fair racing (as in the case of Fords) they would do the same as Ford.

[Helstar]

Some people could say that actually Loeb started tactics even before, in Mexico. But let's get over it and stop this useless fight :p no matter what do you think, they will still do it.

Teams are all the same. Everybody wants to win, and they use any possible way, fair or not.

I personally like these new rules because a lot of drivers are very close at the start of the third day for the win, while in the past I wasn't even following it anymore as it was cruise mode for almost everybody.

[Torsen]

Some people could say that actually Loeb started tactics even before, in Mexico. But let's get over it and stop this useless fight :p no matter what do you think, they will still do it.

Teams are all the same. Everybody wants to win, and they use any possible way, fair or not.

I personally like these new rules because a lot of drivers are very close at the start of the third day for the win, while in the past I wasn't even following it anymore as it was cruise mode for almost everybody.

yeah... i see pro's and con's to the rules... i do agree... can't wait for day 3 tomarrow! :eek:

[ste898]

I'll say it again. No one is really whinging about the Ford Abu Scooby Dooby Doo team using tactics but about Wilson using cars from a satellite team as if they were part of his team. Team orders are fine. But using another team is not. Imagine the outcry if Ferrari got another team to impede McLaren or someone in a race or qualifying session?

Telling your own drivers to slow down is fine and well within the rules and I accept that even if I don't like it. But using Henning and Galli is something that should really be looked at. If Malcolm wants to run a 4 car team then he should. He shouldn't however use drivers from another supposedly independant team. You either have a 4 car team or two 2 car teams.... not both.

These rules have this year and in previous years made for some of the worst rallying ever. People will point to the margins the rallies are won by but it's all so artificial and carefully orchestrated that unless you're one of these people who just supports a team or a driver it's boring from a sporting point of view. It's not even clever..... F1 pit strategies can be clever but telling your drivers to fall back behind the leader so they get a better road position? Any 5 year old could work that one out.

Daniel wake up into the real world that is what the Stobart team is there for to SUPPORT the WORKS team and dont insult me by telling me that Citroen would'nt fo the same!!!

[Helstar]

Daniel wake up into the real world that is what the Stobart team is there for to SUPPORT the WORKS team and dont insult me by telling me that Citroen would'nt fo the same!!!
Truth is that they would love to do, but Aava and Rautenbach (in spite of all) aren't close to lead drivers so often :p !

[Daniel]

Malcolm. In the past teams like Peugeot had teams with a few drivers to support the top drivers. Stobart is a totally different team. Perhaps Citroen might do the same but the thing is they haven't. That's like grouping murderers along with people who might just murder someone some day.

[Daniel]

Truth is that they would love to do, but Aava and Rautenbach (in spite of all) aren't close to lead drivers so often :p !
and if they did that I would be just as critical of them.

[ste898]

Malcolm. In the past teams like Peugeot had teams with a few drivers to support the top drivers. Stobart is a totally different team. Perhaps Citroen might do the same but the thing is they haven't. That's like grouping murderers along with people who might just murder someone some day.

Stobarts is the Ford M2 team (Manufacturer 2) if you look in the service area it is run from the M-Sport trucks with same hospitality and yet you say it is a different team?
If Ford pull the plug then Stobarts could be the top Ford team!!!

[Daniel]

It's not uncommon for a works team to run a program on behalf of another team. It's still a different team.

[Helstar]

and if they did that I would be just as critical of them.
Oh yes, like Loeb today tactics. You would blame Ford as always ^^

[Daniel]

Oh yes, like Loeb today tactics. You would blame Ford as always ^^
You don't get it do you? You said that if Aava and Rautencrash were good enough Citroen would do the same and I said IF they did I would be just as critical of them. So then you say "Like Loeb today tactics" which is absolutely nothing like what you were talking about before. Stop putting words in my mouth........ I don't accuse you of saying things you haven't and I'll be happy if you do the same for me thanks.....

Citroen have NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER used another team in their team orders to give their drivers an advantage in road position. Ford have and I don't like it at all! If Citroen did it I wouldn't like that at all. Thing is Citroen haven't done it yet and you'll just have to take my word on it.

[Halvis]

One NZ related question - when does next stage begin?

[DonJippo]

In half an hour.

[Halvis]

In half an hour.

Thanks!

[pino]

In half an hour.

Thanks ;)

[Helstar]

You don't get it do you? *cut*
Let's start from the beginning:

1) Slowing the car in the last SS of the day so you lose first position on the road on purpose (no sweeping next day)

- Ford does it. "OH NOZ they're cheaters !!! F**k Ford !"

- Citroen does it. "OH it's all Ford blame. They've started it !"

2) Have an M2 team who can help you to fight against the opponent (sweeping roads etc.)

- Ford does it. "OH NOZ they're cheaters !!! F**k Ford !"

- Citroen, not yet (they aren't able at the moment). But if they'll do in the future "OH it's all Ford blame. They've started it !"

Do YOU get it now ? http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/images/icons/rolleyes.gif

[Daniel]

That's not what i've said. Do you get it now? :)

[Mr Lopez]

just logged on and see you guys are still at it !

[Mr Lopez]

It`s a revenge. Malcolm Wilson has started this, not Loeb.

oh what planet are you on

[N.O.T]

5 mins till the start....

[Finni]

That's not what i've said. Do you get it now? :)

Yes, it's not your line of reasoning but others used it. Don't you get it now? :)

[alleskids]

All trough the day today I read the site and wondered when the moderaters are sending in the Kindergartnen cops to give all of you a new sweet diaper and some candy to keep you sweet :( :(. Playing tactics and using other drivers in the team to favour 1 is from all ages, so we cant blame Wilson or Ford or Citroen for using what ever methode that is givento them. Go all to the FIA and scream to them like you screamed and yelled to each other here all day.
Lets celibrate an exciting two days of cat and mouse game, of drivers trying to run far away from the group but cannot succceed and have to wonder what the others will do. And most of all we have a magnificant firewirk on the last day. Or do you want to have a borring last day were everybody is allready 4 minutes away from eachother and all cruise to the fat lady that sings at the finish and gives the winner a wetty kiss?
Grow up and enjoy the last exciting day.

[N.O.T]

Latvala in the stage

[Mr Lopez]

ok bets on. JML quicker than Mikko but Seb will be 5 secs quicker than both of them?

[Mr Lopez]

or should we discount sordo....??

[N.O.T]

hirvonen already 1 second faster in 1st split

[Carlo]

Good morning from NZ, It is about time for the first stage of the day to start and we are watching it live on TV on the feed that we should be getting on wrc.co.

In the Northern Hemisphere it musy be about time for the day for all those naughtly childish peiole who have been keeping themselves amused by throwing their respective Citreon and Ford toys out of the cot to go to sleep so that real rally people can enjoy their sport without interuptions

[pino]

Go Jari-Matti :D

[pettersolberg29]

Hirvonen 1 up already

[Finni]

My prediction of results after morning loop:

1. Loeb 2. Latvala +3 3. Hirvonen + 5

[N.O.T]

Loeb made a mistake !!!!!

[pettersolberg29]

4 up now!

[Mr Lopez]

loeb made a mistake

[DonJippo]

All trough the day today I read the site and wondered when the moderaters are sending in the Kindergartnen cops to give all of you a new sweet diaper and some candy to keep you sweet :( :(. Playing tactics and using other drivers in the team to favour 1 is from all ages, so we cant blame Wilson or Ford or Citroen for using what ever methode that is givento them. Go all to the FIA and scream to them like you screamed and yelled to each other here all day.
Lets celibrate an exciting two days of cat and mouse game, of drivers trying to run far away from the group but cannot succceed and have to wonder what the others will do. And most of all we have a magnificant firewirk on the last day. Or do you want to have a borring last day were everybody is allready 4 minutes away from eachother and all cruise to the fat lady that sings at the finish and gives the winner a wetty kiss?
Grow up and enjoy the last exciting day.

Couldn't have put it better :up:

[pettersolberg29]

Trouble for Loeb!!!!

[Finni]

Seems like Latvala will loose everything already in this one.

Hirvonen seems to be so fast in second split that he might be tough bone to Loeb. It seems that Hirvonen just finds something in these tight battles.

[N.O.T]

Spin for Mr loeb

[pettersolberg29]

Aava made an error?

[Mr Lopez]

toni fastest at first split, shows how much the road is cleaning. Wilson for a fastest time i reckon

[rus]

Spin for Mr loeb


Naah; it's just tactics :D :D

[pettersolberg29]

Petter faster than a trying Sordo and Mikko and Loeb!

[White Sauron]

Wow... Sordo... Ahead of Loeb - on gravel! And fighting for victory!

[Finni]

toni fastest at first split, shows how much the road is cleaning. Wilson for a fastest time i reckon

Te Hutewai is perhaps the dirtiest stage in NZ.

[KKS]

Petter fastest!!! Mr Richards find good word :D

[A.F.F.]

Petter struggling to top time.

[Mr Lopez]

Te Hutewai is perhaps the dirtiest stage in NZ.

worse than whaanga coast?

henning 3.2 secs quicker in just over a minute !

[A.F.F.]

Gardemeister fighting against Villagra must be a dream come true. :rolleyes:

[pettersolberg29]

Hope Petter and Henning get top 2 - something good in a terrible weekend for the Solbergs...

[Mr Lopez]

where are the wilson knockers now?

[DonJippo]

Gardemeister fighting against Villagra must be a dream come true. :rolleyes:

For Villagra you mean?

;)

[N.O.T]

latvala started the last stage of the loop

[White Sauron]

where are the wilson knockers now?

together with Ford's tactics bashers)

[Finni]

Petter faster than a trying Sordo and Mikko and Loeb!

I wouldn't highlight it because the road is enormously faster at that point of running order. This is also Petter's favourite stage. 2004 he won Grönholm here by 5 sec even Grönholm was overally catching.

[N.O.T]

Latvala must be really suffering Hirvonen 1.6 faster in just 35 seconds

[Finni]

where are the wilson knockers now?

Wilson justified. Case closed. :)

[Mr Lopez]

toni fastest at first split, shows how much the road is cleaning. Wilson for a fastest time i reckon

looks like 2nd quickest...

[pettersolberg29]

Mikko 1.6 secs faster after 35 secs!

[N.O.T]

Loeb 2.1 faster than Latvala and 0.5 faster than mikko

[Buzz Lightyear]

where are the wilson knockers now?

im still here.

road position fattering him.

watch the second loop.

[Mr Lopez]

im still here.

road position fattering him.

watch the second loop.

i think you're probably right, but you have to be impressed with his first time

[N.O.T]

and sordo faster of them all
.....

[White Sauron]

Sordo for victory on this farse rally!

[N.O.T]

Loeb lost his rythm...

[pettersolberg29]

Slow-ish Loeb?

[White Sauron]

Another mistake by Loeb??

[DonJippo]

Mikko faster than Loeb on split two and Sordo as well, Seb maybe trying a bit too hard now?.

[A.F.F.]

Mikko controlling so far...

Not bad, not bad at all :)

[White Sauron]

And seems like nobody is going to praise Duval, who's doing a great sensible, yet impressive rally!

[N.O.T]

very nice pace by mikko....

[PuddleJumper]

Interesting fact from WRC radio - the 2 presenters are 11,358.5 miles apart. I wonder if that's a record.

[WRC1]

again slow 2 nd split for seb.... nerves??

[KKS]

I be glad when Mikko win this rally.
Seb lost his rally at Saturday

[jonkka]

The interesting question revolves around Sordo. He's on place to challenge Latvala, given his speed so far. But if Loeb cannot up his speed, will Citroen allow Sordo drive freely? Hirvonen-Sordo-Latvala-Loeb would be interesting result, historically...

[Finni]

The interesting question revolves around Sordo. He's on place to challenge Latvala, given his speed so far. But if Loeb cannot up his speed, will Citroen allow Sordo drive freely? Hirvonen-Sordo-Latvala-Loeb would be interesting result, historically...

Sordo can't keep with J-M and Loeb might take him even without order. But if Sordo is too fast then Citroen will employ team-order in all likelihood. It's not nice-guy team. :)

[Tomi]

The interesting question revolves around Sordo. He's on place to challenge Latvala, given his speed so far. But if Loeb cannot up his speed, will Citroen allow Sordo drive freely? Hirvonen-Sordo-Latvala-Loeb would be interesting result, historically...

it looks like they are holding him back already.

[A.F.F.]

Henning seem to have a lot of fun driving this rally :up:

[KKS]

Henning again faster. And what a time

[Glee]

Road possition or not: Henning is fast!

[jonkka]

Sixth stage win for Henning, more than anyone else so far...

[A.F.F.]

Hänninen has a good pace too. Too bad he ruined his rally at the first leg :mark:

[jonkka]

Time to eat the first kiwi of the weekend... yellow variant this time...

[Halvis]

Henning seem to have a lot of fun driving this rally :up:

Absolutely. Pity he had all the troubles on Friday. He surely wouldn't have won all this stages without the road position, due the the misery on first day, but still very good driving from him.

[turves]

Mikko controlling so far...

Not bad, not bad at all :)

Definately game on, and I hope Mikko comes out on top...

[Mirek]

Prokop without ALS...

[Finni]

Hänninen 0.1 faster than Latvala between splits 5. and 6. Yes it's road-position but still quite interesting. I have never seen that group N driver is on the pace of wrc leaders in any single split.

[A.F.F.]

Hänninen 0.1 faster than Latvala between splits 5. and 6. Yes it's road-position but still quite interesting. I have never seen that group N driver is on the pace of wrc leaders in any single split.

Better put that in your Excel ;)

[bt52b]

Quote of the rally: "Five bananas in that car Bexie"

[N.O.T]

I think Loeb can only target Latvala, hirvonen without a problem is not a realistic target but a small mistake from these 3 guys and anyone can win even Sordo.

[John V]

]Prokop without ALS...
But loosing not much to Patrik Sandell and Martin Rauam, so hopefully he will made no mistake on final section. Fingers crossed. And very nice performance from Hanninen

[Carlo]

Hänninen 0.1 faster than Latvala between splits 5. and 6. Yes it's road-position but still quite interesting. I have never seen that group N driver is on the pace of wrc leaders in any single split.

Best you look at SS 3. Overall stage results were
Wilson 14.24.6
Atkinson 14.24.9
Richard & Sara Mason GP N Subaru 14.26.1
Gardemeister 14.27.4
Petter Solberg 14.36.3

[Finni]

Best you look at SS 3. Overall stage results were
Wilson 14.24.6
Atkinson 14.24.9
Richard & Sara Mason GP N Subaru 14.26.1
Gardemeister 14.27.4
Petter Solberg 14.36.3

I was speaking driving at the same pace with leaders. Those drivers were far from the top-crews.

Still impressive time by Mason. He has took stage wins in group N when Hänninen has had difficulties or poor stage (note from rallyforum.com: this is fanboy observation Finni!)

[PuddleJumper]

Time to eat the first kiwi of the weekend... yellow variant this time...
Do they have a problem with their kidneys?

[John V]

We had some race yesterday here ...

[Carlo]

I was speaking driving at the same pace with leaders. Those drivers were far from the top-crews.

Still impressive time by Mason. He has took stage wins in group N when Hänninen has had difficulties or poor stage (note from rallyforum.com: this is fanboy observation Finni!)

Both impressive drivers and of course Hanninen does have a very strong NZ connection so we all most claim him as one of ours too.

A wee bit concerned that results have stopped coming through for all the cars on the road after Richard & Sara.

Update, results through, no Mason though

[Carlo]

Mason stopped in stage, engine failure.

[N.O.T]

Hirvonen flies once more....

[Finni]

Hirvonen has peculiar ability to stretch himself when needed (last year Norway and Finland, this year Turkey)

[jonkka]

Mikko has risen to the challenge much better than I expected, barring his loss at home.

[MartijnS]

Very fast split of Loeb.

[MartijnS]

2.3 secs faster.

[jonkka]

JML only 5,5s ahead of Loeb, that's too little I am afraid

[A.F.F.]

Loeb won't risk it me thinks :mark:

[DonJippo]

Loeb won't risk it me thinks :mark:

He will target JML, Mikko is too far and for the championship battle second is enough for Seb.

[PuddleJumper]

Ah well, time to go to bed now. :s nore:

NOT!!

This is going to be thrilling. :bounce:

[Leon]

29 KM stage too long for safe bets. lets see

[SubaruNorway]

If this is a result of tactics, who cares!

[jonkka]

If JML could hold 2nd (or Loeb settles for 3rd), Mikko and Seb would be on equal points...

[bt52b]

Loeb has to attack. Should at least get second.

Shame its not as good as last year, but then few rallies will match last years NZ WRC.

[A.F.F.]

Henning still on very good pace.

[DonJippo]

If this is a result of tactics, who cares!

I could name few ;)

[jonkka]

And the decider is underway...

[A.F.F.]

I could name few ;)

Name me.

[Finni]

Latvala always looses in the start.

[A.F.F.]

Loeb and Mikko hand in hand at the first split. 1 second faster than Latvala.

[jonkka]

4,5secs to go...

[bigreddog]

latvala out - hit bank

[jonkka]

nou....

[Carlo]

JML spin hit bank retired

[A.F.F.]

No split for Latvala :eek: ?!??!

[KKS]

retired? can't believe it

[PuddleJumper]

Oh crap. :(

[Leon]

Not again....

[jonkka]

That almost certainly is nail on the coffin for Ford's title hopes...

[N.O.T]

Latvala stopped....

[A.F.F.]

Latvala's star is falling faster than Porin Ässät.

[N.O.T]

and citroen now takes a good lead in the manufacturer championship as well...

[KKS]

Sordo too?

[PuddleJumper]

No splits for Sordo?

[Leon]

What this guy had to do more? Hire another psycologist?

Lets see if Loeb fights for 1st

[PuddleJumper]

Ah, split for Sordo appeared now.

[N.O.T]

Latvala is very young and this is his first true year where he has the pressure of an official team....i bet he will get things together in 1-2 years...

[N.O.T]

Loeb will not risk anything now......no need to....he has championship lead and 2 tarmac rounds following.

[A.F.F.]

Latvala is very young and this is his first true year where he has the pressure of an official team....i bet he will get things together in 1-2 years...

I'm sorry but who are you and what are you doing with N.O.T's keyboard???

[Carlo]

After 11km Seb has gained 1.1 sec on Mikko but looks a bit loose in doing so. Pity you guys are not able to watch it live. Looks like Sordo has backed off now

[Leon]

Latvala is very young and this is his first true year where he has the pressure of an official team....i bet he will get things together in 1-2 years...


Yes but I wonder if his paymasters, Wilson, Jouhki or whoever have that much patience and cash (for fixing cars and loosing championships).....

feel sorry for this guy

[atchoum]

My God, Latvala!!! At Citroën, they fired Duval for less than this!! :dozey:

[DonJippo]

I'm sorry but who are you and what are you doing with N.O.T's keyboard???

Must be one of his sick dogs I believe :p

[Halvis]

Halfways, Seb has taken 5 secs, if he steps it up, it will be possible...

[N.O.T]

I'm sorry but who are you and what are you doing with N.O.T's keyboard???

I am his sane side..... the other one only works in normal day hours.

[jonkka]

I'm sorry but who are you and what are you doing with N.O.T's keyboard???

:laugh:

[N.O.T]

if you don;t like this one i can wake the real one up....

[jonkka]

My God, Latvala!!! At Citroën, they fired Duval for less than this!! :dozey:

Actually, Duval literally put Citroens on fire until he was fired. A bit different thing...

[gloomyDAY]

Mikko choked!

[Halvis]

Hirvo has had a spin!

[N.O.T]

Loeb Is In The Lead !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[KKS]

Mikko hit a bank

[xavier]

Mikko spined!
wow, so bad for Ford

[COVENANT]

what the f... +27.2?

[Leon]

My God, Latvala!!! At Citroën, they fired Duval for less than this!! :dozey:

Didn' t fire him...just rested him for two rallies....NOT that he learned a lot afterwards

[SubaruNorway]

Loeb 27 up on Mikko!!!!

[N.O.T]

Hirvonen is going slowly.....according to radio

[PuddleJumper]

Now I wish I HAD gone to bed.

Ford have managed to snatch failure from the jaws of victory. :(

[Carlo]

Mikko has just had a 360 spin and has slowed but still going, has lost front bumper and tweeked something, limping now

[N.O.T]

Duval also stopped......

[Buzz Lightyear]

doomsday for ford!!
championship over.
im away to bed.

[bt52b]

Dudu problems too?

Incredible finish.

[N.O.T]

Hirvonen didi almost the same time as latvala this morning.....

[N.O.T]

well hirvonne will lose his place to sordo as well as it seems.....

[N.O.T]

Puncture for mikko...... :( :( :( pity because he deserved 1st place his pace was superior to Loebs for the first time this year

[PuddleJumper]

From Ford 1-2 to Citroën 1-2 in 1 stage. Whaanga Coast has done its worst again!

[Carlo]

Duval off the road, nosed over bank and into trees

[N.O.T]

1-2 for Citroen....... amazing result for the team and now both titles are hard for the ford team and drivers

[A.F.F.]

Yep....

Congrats to Loeb and Elena. Congrats to Sordo too :up:

Not too good stage Finnwise :(

[Leon]

If I was Wilson I would eat my pride, and hire Petter hoping for the best (his old motivation to come back).....

What a suiside for Ford..too much pressure for the young fins.

Only a miracle can stop Citroen gaining both titles now....

"Interesting" rest of the year

Pity I did not went to bed earlier

[COVENANT]

Game over for championship

[A.F.F.]

Nite guys ....

[N.O.T]

its a real pity for mikko because even though he was handicapped by starting order compared to Loeb he did some amazing times and showed that tactics could sometimes be overshadowed by true skill and heart....but thats rallying....no matter how cruel it is.

[Leon]

Congrats to Citroen and his drivers. Pity for Mikko. he looked faster than Loeb for a change

[Leon]

Night everybody

I hope I will dream a good reason to watch the rest of the WRC...

[KKS]

C. RAUTENBACH stopped too

[jonkka]

Interesting:
JML stopped
Mikko lost 1 minute
Duval off
P-G about to lose 2 minutes
Rautenbach losing 7 or more minutes

[xavier]

Pity for Mikko. he looked faster than Loeb for a change

Indeed impressive 1st morning loop for Mikko. That's good news for the future of the WRC.

Drama packed day... let's just revert to a proper running order so we can have 2.5 day of action and not only 0.5!

[Mirek]

Tragicomic performance from Fords...

[bt52b]

Great to see Suzuki improve a little

[quimrally]

What a rally.
The Rally of NZ is propor to make history.
Last year was the duel between Gronholm and Loeb, with the finn winning in the last stage for 0.3 seconds.

this year, lika a chess game, the teams try to play the right move, losing time, tryng to achieve the best position, and in one stage everything changes.
Latvala and Duval out, Mikko had a puncture and it's a one two for Citroen.

Well, going to bed. See you in the morning

[playmo]

Nooooo, damn! this takes a lot of spice away...
Congratulations to Seb, Dani and the whole team!

[xavier]

Will Mikko make it to the SSS? It seems his car had some damages...

[Lalo]

I've just got back from having dinner with some friends. It's unbelievable what happened to the Ford's.. It's the saddest face I've had all year long!

Farewell both driver and manufacturer titles for the blue oval. Only a series of retirements from Loeb and some outstanding results from Mikko can stop the frenchman and Citroën from claiming both titles another year. I still can't believe it.

[Helstar]

Unbelievable xD from the stars to the stairs (in Italy we would say "dalle stelle alle stalle"). Loeb and Citroen are the best in everything, luck included. No doubts !

I'm not big fan of rallying but as this round is in my home country I thought I'd watch the "live" coverage but I've seen hardly any actual coverage of the stages, it mostly seems to be a panel of guys going bla bla bla bla interspersed with some talk of where the cars are and sometimes a bit of actual live coverage. Uh?

[tmx]

Wow just got home from a crappy day at work and first news I read, I'm shocked and sad for Ford, especially Mikko. I think it is Citroen's driver and manu champion this year at this stage unless some amazing luck comes to Ford.

[Helstar]

Suzuki got 6th and 7th place, but I don't know if it's enough for them to stay also in 2009 ...

[GigiGalliNo1]

So.... what did I miss? Anything exciting?

[Helstar]

Nothing special dude. I think Malcom is thinking about suicide or somethin' ... needs some voodoo rituals ^^

[gravelman]

Aww great another self destruct mission from Ford. Tom Cruise may star in the next episode as the tape will have the same ending. Why has the WRC come to the stage where if one team encounters issues it falls over itself that just one. YES ONE, driver walks it handy as ever. Its so frustrating. Dont get me wrong no one mistakes Loeb for a useless bag of Kerrs Pinks.Anyone who has witnessed him in the flesh (or metal if you will) will concede that he is without doubt up there with any of the best we have had the plaesure of seeing either at home or abroad, but the fact remains that he is continuously being having it handed to him on a plate must surely be cause for concern for for those who love the
sport and the championship at large, and want to see the sport prosper in good health in the years to come. Lets be fair hes the best pilot around at the moment, but as they say in the Scottish Premier League, you can only beat whats put in front of you. At the moment all thats being put of front of him is Ford, and as much as it pains me to say it, being a man of the blue oval, the opposition is not quite there. His own team mate does not seem to be even within a second per km of him, or to put a conspiracy theory is not allowed to get within a second per km of Citroens golden boy. Telemetry may prove me wrong, but I get the feeling there are some members who will get the angle I`m coming from on this.

[N]

I just woke up, first thing to check wrc.com and see this, wow, what a finish to the rally.

[GigiGalliNo1]

Andrew Lambie's photographs from NZ

http://www.rallysportmag.com.au/home/index.php?option=com_ponygallery&Itemid=122&func=viewcategory&catid=23

[Tom206wrc]

Fantastic that final Citroën 1-2 whereas it wasn't well started that last leg against Ford !!!! :D

[Wim_Impreza]

Fantastic that final Citroën 1-2 whereas it wasn't well started that last leg against Ford !!!! :D

All your dreams come true this year. :(

Incredible that Latvala again crashed, he is now more 'crashdummy' than Duval and C. McRae in their crash years. Why goes Duval also off road? He has nothing to lose, the top 4 was way before him and Petter was a minute behind him. Very silly mistake from Duval.

Even the Loeb fans must say that he had again very much luck this weekend. First of all that fault at day 1 where he rolled half and that spin in the last day. Hirvonen made a spin also, but off course he didn't has the luck of Loeb.

Note that Per-Gunnar Andersson (6th) and Martin Prokop (10th, nice that he win PWRC) scored their best career result in WRC.

[ste898]

3rd rally in a row I wont be watching.....no interest in watching rubbish!!!!!!!!!!

[pino]

Too bad for Ford, but most of the time Lady Fortuna is with the stronger so I am neither surprised nor mad about Loeb's win...he's the best ! I am a bit disappointed by Jari-Matti off though :(

[Daniel]

Wilson justified. Case closed. :)


Hahahaha famous last words :rotflmao:

[Daniel]

I think this is hilarious. Not because I wanted Citroen to win when a rally which they didn't have the pace to win, but because of who it will annoy and the fact that in my opinion it's payback for Ford tactics earlier this year.

Mikko deserved to win and anyone with any sense will realise that although the trophy has Seb's name on it this was Mikko's rally.

As Nelson Muntz says though..... HAW HAW! :p

[gloomyDAY]

I think this is hilarious. Not because I wanted Citroen to win when a rally which they didn't have the pace to win, but because of who it will annoy and the fact that in my opinion it's payback for Ford tactics earlier this year.

Mikko deserved to win and anyone with any sense will realise that although the trophy has Seb's name on it this was Mikko's rally.

As Nelson Muntz says though..... HAW HAW! :p I hate you.

[tmx]

I think some people may missed out the performance of Henning on this rally where he won 7 stages. Atleast Petter gets to be 4th from all the mayhem.

Talks about luck, when Loeb took that super big cut through all the rocks nothing bad happened from it. I don't know if it's his talent or the Citroen suspension is built so strong or both.

[Tom206wrc]

3rd rally in a row I wont be watching.....no interest in watching rubbish!!!!!!!!!!



"Rubbish" because Ford lost the event ??? ;)

[Tom206wrc]

I think some people may missed out the performance of Henning on this rally where he won 7 stages...



Don't forget he had nothing to lose in superrally ;)

[cut the b.s.]

Wow, if Hollywood made it you'd say it was too far fetched! Really thought Mikko deserved this one.

Interesting to note that despite so much practice our resident xenophobic Ford 'fan' is still a very bad loser :-)

[Tom206wrc]

...
Interesting to note that despite so much practice our resident xenophobic Ford 'fan' is still a very bad loser :-)



You target Ste898 aren't you ??? :D

[tmx]

Don't forget he had nothing to lose in superrally ;)
Yes maybe he should drives like that for Japan and GB since his results this year hasen't been good anyway, not much to lose.

[Daniel]

Cut the bs. Brilliant. Just brilliant. Perhaps I should chuck a hissy fit whenever Ford wins a rally through hard work and skill and refuse to watch the coverage :)

[cut the b.s.]

You target Ste898 aren't you ??? :D

what would ever make you think this?

Passion is a good thing, within reason, sometimes a certain unnamed mamber comes across as a bigot.
You seem to me to be very passionate about the French side of WRC, yet I have yet to read a daft post from you when Loeb, Citroen etc have failed, its a shame some other 'fans' could not be a little calmer. Its how a man reacts in defeat that shows his true quality.

[Daniel]

Passion is a good thing, within reason, sometimes a certain unnamed mamber comes across as a bigot.

I read that as Paasonen is a good thing, within reason, :mark:

People on this forum fly off the handle when the slightest thing goes wrong. Back in his Ford days McRae had a slump and everyone was saying he was past it, then he took a few victories in close succession and it was all forgotten. Now when Citroen or Ford have one bad rally it's like the sky is falling down on our heads :mark: I remember when a Peugeot would be missing a split Tom would be on here going crazy when we didn't even know what had happened yet..... :mark: Like you say, passion is a good thing within reason.