2021 - Race 22 Abu Dhabi

[Nitrodaze]

Hamilton taking him out in silverstone cost him lost likely 32 points.

There were a lot of incidents and mistakes by both drivers and teams, but silverston was the real game changer.

Verstappen taking out Hamilton at Monza cost Hamilton 25 points. We could do this all day. It was what it was. F1 machinery has handed the championship to Verstappen. So go party with it. Just don't be saying stuff to make you feel better that the title was stolen and not won in a fair fight. You can quote all the statistics to try to make it all look legitimate. The fact remains he was given the title, not won.

[F1nKS]

You can quote all the statistics to try to make it all look legitimate. The fact remains he was given the title, not won.

If Mercedes would have made the right strategy calls instead of sitting on their hands through the race, they would not have been at risk of a late yellow flag.

[airshifter]

And the only reason we even had the chance to see such a close finish was due to questionable decisions and suspicious actions throughout the season.

Without bottas and hamilton taking him out, max would have been a long way ahead in abu dhabi.

The fia and masi did everything to make it end close, and they succeeded.

This really isn't anything new with questionable decisions. What has changed is that the title fight remained very close, and in part probably due to those questionable decisions. That's why personally I've never worried much about the titles in those years in question. Often the FIA and/or race directors are in a position that no matter what they do people will be unhappy. Some will feel their driver or team of choice was unfairly punished, others will feel it was rigged, still others will see it as a tough call in either case.

I personally don't think the FIA and/or Masi have intentionally "rigged" or "fabricated" anything. I think they've just been put under a more powerful microscope than many past seasons, and that brings the flaws of the system to light.


So really in the end I find that by ignoring the inconsistencies and making my own decision on who was the better driver through the season, I don't really get upset no matter what happens. It takes out the stress of being too invested in the whole thing, and puts into better perspective who has had more good or bad luck, car issues, saved by the misfortune of others, etc.

[squibby]

... I think they've just been put under a more powerful microscope than many past seasons, and that brings the flaws of the system to light....

I've been watching F1 on paid subscription TV since 2009, and have probably missed maybe one or two races since then in over 10 years thanks to being able to record everything. I used to watch it before then sporadically on free-to-air TV as a kid, but that's not with the same intense interest. So with respect, many fans have always had a 'powerful microscope' on each race, for me personally that spans about 12 seasons now.

I can say that the end of the last race was unique. Anyone who argues to me that it was 'same-same' , or we just saw it this time because of new access to radio messages, I disagree. Not sure why the stewards didn't make Hamilton give the position back to Verstappen on the second lap incident, I'm a Hamilton fan and I agree he was pushed wide, but at the same time, Verstappen threw it up the inside and made the corner, I mean what more does he need to do? - but that controversial piece of stewardship is not unique, it has precedent and it's about 50/50 which way it tends to go.

At the end why they didn't have a Red flag, well same again, sometimes they just leave it too late and go for the safety car when a flag would be better. It's not unprcedented, nothing particularly unusual.

However, to not unlap cars in full thus compromising Sainz and Ricciardo's chances to do anything in the last couple laps to show massive favouritism for the Max and Lewis shootout, yet be totally ignorant of the vastly unequal tyres or the great lead lost by Lewis in the prior 50 plus laps was just the dumbest clumsiest piece of race management I've ever seen and completely unprecedented and against the regs. First time I ever saw it.

If I was thinking about joining F1, The message I would derive from this is that unless I'm running 1st or 2nd, nobody in the sport cares about my race compared to the leaders. I would also be concerned that I can lead 50 laps of a race only to have the rules re-hashed in the last two laps. - How can I strategize for situations with no precedent? No-No, Perhaps I'll invest my money elsewhere, or even worse, perhaps I can have a quite discussion behind closed doors that If I do invest, I can get a few decisions my way at discretion of race direction who seemingly can do whatever it likes right?

Honda and Raikonnen are probably thinking - good riddance to this crap shoot.

[airshifter]

If I was thinking about joining F1, The message I would derive from this is that unless I'm running 1st or 2nd, nobody in the sport cares about my race compared to the leaders. I would also be concerned that I can lead 50 laps of a race only to have the rules re-hashed in the last two laps. - How can I strategize for situations with no precedent? No-No, Perhaps I'll invest my money elsewhere, or even worse, perhaps I can have a quite discussion behind closed doors that If I do invest, I can get a few decisions my way at discretion of race direction who seemingly can do whatever it likes right?

Honda and Raikonnen are probably thinking - good riddance to this crap shoot.

In this light, I essentially agree. Though I doubt any appeals will go anywhere, and it appears the FIA are covered by multiple articles involving the unlapping of cars and authority.... they are doing what they want to do in multiple situations, often without consistency, and often in blatant disregard of regs. The precedent is that the FIA does as it wishes. This is not due to Masi, it's been going on for decades.

The USGP in 2005 had 6 cars start the race. FIA approved.

Sometimes the safety car is cut short by a red flag. Sometimes they stay under the safety car. Sometimes that move it legal, other times that apex of the corner and a cars width don't matter. Sometimes track limits matter, sometimes they don't. Contact may be ok today, but not tomorrow, and never for certain drivers. The politics behind the radio calls just gets worse and worse, and the drivers are in on it too.

Though I agree consistency and enforcement need to be addressed, in the 30 or so years I've watched the sport it's generally a case of they decide race by race. With the proper structure and regs they could easily remove grey areas, but for the most part they don't bother until pushed by the teams acting as a group.




Which all combined, as I stated before, is why I don't pay much attention to the drama and make my own decisions. The titles mean next to nothing to me personally.

[Nitrodaze]

If Mercedes would have made the right strategy calls instead of sitting on their hands through the race, they would not have been at risk of a late yellow flag.

To be fair, l reviewed the thinking of the Mercedes strategist. With Lafiti crashing so close to the end, they anticipated the Marshalls would need at least 4 out of the five laps to clear the track. Which would essentially result in a safety car finish. So there was no need to change tyres if the regulation was followed. With hindsight, we would say they should have anticipated that Masi would alter the regulations under the guise of racing to the finish. This is not a fair comment really.

Every team go about their strategy relying on the stability of the regulations, race control doing their jobs according to this regulation and the situation laid out currently in front of them on track. Mercedes in this case did their strategy expecting the regulations to be followed. If the regulations were followed, they would have done the right strategy. They have no way of knowing Masi was going to do something out of the ordinary.

[Nitrodaze]

I've been watching F1 on paid subscription TV since 2009, and have probably missed maybe one or two races since then in over 10 years thanks to being able to record everything. I used to watch it before then sporadically on free-to-air TV as a kid, but that's not with the same intense interest. So with respect, many fans have always had a 'powerful microscope' on each race, for me personally that spans about 12 seasons now.

I can say that the end of the last race was unique. Anyone who argues to me that it was 'same-same' , or we just saw it this time because of new access to radio messages, I disagree. Not sure why the stewards didn't make Hamilton give the position back to Verstappen on the second lap incident, I'm a Hamilton fan and I agree he was pushed wide, but at the same time, Verstappen threw it up the inside and made the corner, I mean what more does he need to do? - but that controversial piece of stewardship is not unique, it has precedent and it's about 50/50 which way it tends to go.

At the end why they didn't have a Red flag, well same again, sometimes they just leave it too late and go for the safety car when a flag would be better. It's not unprcedented, nothing particularly unusual.

However, to not unlap cars in full thus compromising Sainz and Ricciardo's chances to do anything in the last couple laps to show massive favouritism for the Max and Lewis shootout, yet be totally ignorant of the vastly unequal tyres or the great lead lost by Lewis in the prior 50 plus laps was just the dumbest clumsiest piece of race management I've ever seen and completely unprecedented and against the regs. First time I ever saw it.

If I was thinking about joining F1, The message I would derive from this is that unless I'm running 1st or 2nd, nobody in the sport cares about my race compared to the leaders. I would also be concerned that I can lead 50 laps of a race only to have the rules re-hashed in the last two laps. - How can I strategize for situations with no precedent? No-No, Perhaps I'll invest my money elsewhere, or even worse, perhaps I can have a quite discussion behind closed doors that If I do invest, I can get a few decisions my way at discretion of race direction who seemingly can do whatever it likes right?

Honda and Raikonnen are probably thinking - good riddance to this crap shoot.

That Masi removed Sainz, Ricciardo and Alonso from the fight is the other reason this was unfair. Most of these guys were on fresh soft tyres. Any one of them could have ended up on the podium at the Abu Dhabi race if they were given the chance to unlap themselves and rejoin behind the leaders; which would have meant so much for their teams. Sainz could have had a great opportunity to challenge Verstappen for second or even Hamilton if he had a better start than the front two. Even the competition between those five cars was as important as the race at the front, if the race had restarted without unlapping the cars.

[denkimi]

Verstappen taking out Hamilton at Monza cost Hamilton 25 points. We could do this all day. It was what it was. F1 machinery has handed the championship to Verstappen. So go party with it. Just don't be saying stuff to make you feel better that the title was stolen and not won in a fair fight. You can quote all the statistics to try to make it all look legitimate. The fact remains he was given the title, not won.

First, let me admit i was wrong in my calculation there, no 32 points were lost.

But no, neither of them finished in monza so no points were lost. Only the race.

In silverstone we have seen a 7 points advantage turn into a 7 points deficit. Hamilton putting him in the wall thus cost him 14 points. The fact hamilton got away with it was the biggest farce this whole season.

But this whole season has been a farce in terms of penalty's. One time you can push someone off, other times not. Some times the one being pushed has to give the position back, sometimes they can just cut the corner. There is just no line in it.

It's time for new stewards and rules that get actually aplied. Especially the rule that says you have to leave space when someone is behind you, that would make close racing possible again.

[The Black Knight]

First, let me admit i was wrong in my calculation there, no 32 points were lost.

But no, neither of them finished in monza so no points were lost. Only the race.

In silverstone we have seen a 7 points advantage turn into a 7 points deficit. Hamilton putting him in the wall thus cost him 14 points. The fact hamilton got away with it was the biggest farce this whole season.

But this whole season has been a farce in terms of penalty's. One time you can push someone off, other times not. Some times the one being pushed has to give the position back, sometimes they can just cut the corner. There is just no line in it.

It's time for new stewards and rules that get actually aplied. Especially the rule that says you have to leave space when someone is behind you, that would make close racing possible again.

What I akin these incidents to is a foul in football. In football referees sometimes make mistakes when giving fouls and there's rarely a case where the entire crowd agree with his decision on any call he has to make. I think a 10 second timed penalty was harsh for Hamilton there as I think both were equally to blame for the accident as both could have given more room. Generally these things even themselves out over the course of a career.

What happened on Sunday was not the same. Sunday was the equivalent of a world cup final and a referee just awarding a trailing team a goal followed by a penalty because some guy fell in midfield. It's something that has never been done before and likely to never be done again. This would never be acceptable in football or any other sport. There are certain incidents that are open to opinion like fouls. Then there are the regulations which are a legal doctrine that must be adhered to at all times. Masi took a regulation from a legal framework and modified it on the fly so the trailing team could win. I don't think he realized what he was doing at the time or that he did it intentionally, he simply cracked under pressure.

This is not acceptable and the only way faith can be restored in F1 is to revert the result. At a very minimum, Masi must NEVER work in F1 again and the Stewarding processes needs a serious overhaul.

I honestly did not mind Max becoming champion. I'm not a fan but he's an amazing driver, but as far as I'm concerned he didn't win the title on Sunday it was handed to him.

[Franky]

Black Knight, Abu Dhabi wasn't the world cup final. It was the final minutes of a game that started in spring and ended now.