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  1. #1
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    Is Horner toast at Rdbull?

    There seems to be a non-descript inappropriate conduct in question. The grapevine suggests it involves a woman {as it always is}. Whether a cigar was involved or not is not disclosed. Due to the very non-transparent nature of how this is handled, it is looking more like a witch-hunt than an investigation. However, covertly they have tried to do this, Horner's reputation is now tainted. The lack of transparency is causing wild imaginations of what could be serious enough to warrant this sort of hidden investigation. Is it a matter of him banging one of his female underlings or are we talking rape here?

    Whatever the case, he claims no wrongdoing. We have known him as Redbull's stalwart team principal for years. You may or may not like the guy, but it is hard to see him in any of the above scenarios. However, we must reserve judgment for when all the facts are released to the public.

    But let us look at the worst-case scenario. What if something gross happened and Redbull did the unthinkable of sacking Horner, where does that leave the team?

    I am thinking Redbull shall become a victim of mass scavenging as other Teams would systematically relieve Redbull of their best talents. Without Horner, Redbull would slowly disintegrate. Firstly, Verstappen would jump ship to Mercedes. Adrian Newey would most certainly head to Ferrari. Redbull's best engineers and designers would also get poached by various teams in the paddock. With a majority going to Mercedes and Ferrari. The rest may end up in Mclaren and Aston Martin.

    All the hard work of the last ten years may dissipate leaving a Williams-like team in its wake.

    The last time Ferrari won multiple construction championships, it had a French Team principal, a British Engineer and a new signing of a driver's world champion in the form of Jean Todd, Ross Brawn, and Michael Schumacher. Newey joining Fred Vassuer and Lewis Hamilton is a similar setup. This combination is very likely to be unstoppable.

    If you are a betting man, l bet you would be heading to the bookies right now to wager on Ferrari's resurgence to dominate in the 2026 regulation era.
    Last edited by Nitrodaze; 8th February 2024 at 15:15.
    Better a witty fool than a foolish wit.
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  2. #2
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    " However, we must reserve judgment for when all the facts are released to the public."

    Don't bet on it being your worst case scenario .
    Please .

  3. #3
    Senior Member F1nKS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nitrodaze View Post
    There seems to be a non-descript inappropriate conduct in question. The grapevine suggests it involves a woman {as it always is}.
    From the leaks I have read, it is indeed a woman, but not of a sexual nature. She took exception to his authoritarian leadership style. Ultimately this seems to be about an internal RB battle. It looks like Marko is going to end up beating Horner.

    It was reported that RB asked Horner to resign voluntarily. He responded he did nothing wrong. Ideally for RB, they wanted Horner to voluntarily to go so they didn't have to pay him. Horner is saying, you can let me go, but you have to pay me my contract.

    I expect that Friday's meeting/investigation is actually about negotiating the Horner buyout. I would say by the weekend, Horner will be out.

    If RB is really concerned about the management culture - then they will go outside for their hire to replace Horner. If this is just to get Horner out, they will hire internally.

    If Horner is gone, this is the beginning of the end of RB.

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    Senior Member F1nKS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by F1nKS View Post

    If Horner is gone, this is the beginning of the end of RB.
    from reporting they say that investigation leakage came from the Verstappen/Marko camp.

    The surfacing of the investigation was also telling. It originated from Dutch media with a source close to the Verstappen camp which began speculation that Jos Verstappen and Marko were behind it.
    Two things kill great teams - complacency and ego's (and helicopter dad's)

  5. #5
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    In case he goes, it would be interesting to see if Red Bull would be able to keep its dominance.
    FanAmp and r/GrandPrixTravel - Two Wonderful Places for F1 Fans

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    Quote Originally Posted by F1nKS View Post
    From the leaks I have read, it is indeed a woman, but not of a sexual nature. She took exception to his authoritarian leadership style. Ultimately this seems to be about an internal RB battle. It looks like Marko is going to end up beating Horner.

    It was reported that RB asked Horner to resign voluntarily. He responded he did nothing wrong. Ideally for RB, they wanted Horner to voluntarily to go so they didn't have to pay him. Horner is saying, you can let me go, but you have to pay me my contract.

    I expect that Friday's meeting/investigation is actually about negotiating the Horner buyout. I would say by the weekend, Horner will be out.

    If RB is really concerned about the management culture - then they will go outside for their hire to replace Horner. If this is just to get Horner out, they will hire internally.

    If Horner is gone, this is the beginning of the end of RB.
    Horner can be quite an annoying moaner but for the life of me, l wonder why they still hang on to Marko. If what you say is the case, then they have underestimated the true impact of Horner departing. I can see a rude shock in the aftermath. It may not be instant but gradual over time.

    I wonder if he is being pushed because of the Ford deal.
    Last edited by Nitrodaze; 14th February 2024 at 16:21.
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  7. #7
    Senior Member F1nKS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nitrodaze View Post
    Horner can be quite an annoying moaner but for the life of me, l wonder why they still hang on to Marko. If what you say is the case, then they have underestimated the true impact of Horner departing. I can see a rude shock in the aftermath. It may not be instant but gradual over time.

    I wonder if he is being pushed because of the Ford deal.
    It would seem that with this slow walking, there may be an internal battle in Red Bull. Maybe the Thai owners are fighting to keep Horner.

    If it is true this complaint was this, this whole thing doesn't make much sense. If they are going to fire Horner for mean words, then FIA needs to get rid FIA President Sulayem.

    "It's a matter of abuse of power. For European tastes, Horner did not communicate very politely with his employee and they filed a denunciation to the Red Bull head office in Austria."
    I agree with you that if Red Bull gets rid of Horner, they will be in for a rude shock in the future. I would not be surprised to see it all unravel rather quickly. Horner is Redbull.
    Last edited by F1nKS; 15th February 2024 at 05:26.

  8. #8
    Senior Member Sulland's Avatar
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    The case in question is in my book, from what I know today, something btw him and his wife.
    But in a perfect business world, where very little is allowed, Redbull might see it different, and he has to go.

    After 5 minutes, he will be picked up by another team, due to his wast competence i running a top team.
    What teams are prepping to pick him up in your book?

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sulland View Post
    The case in question is in my book, from what I know today, something btw him and his wife.
    But in a perfect business world, where very little is allowed, Redbull might see it different, and he has to go.

    After 5 minutes, he will be picked up by another team, due to his wast competence i running a top team.
    What teams are prepping to pick him up in your book?
    Horner being available puts a lot of pressure on many team bosses in the top teams, including Mercedes. Like Hamilton going to Ferrari, l expect a similar thing in the Team Bosses space. He is invaluable, not only for his experience but for his connections to quality engineers. The silly season would now be properly absurd as drivers and team bosses shuffle in very extra-ordinary way as a consequence.

    I can see him in Aston Martin Green, actually. It would be a good fit as he has had a past relationship with Aston Martin.
    Last edited by Nitrodaze; 21st February 2024 at 05:37.
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  10. #10
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    Interesting, the time it's taking. If he was in the clear I'm pretty sure there'd have been an announcement by now. So the question is, how serious was what he did. They are probably arguing over that now. Is there a way he can be allowed to stay? If he stays what sanction will be imposed on Horner and what compensation for the victim? If he has to go, can they put him on "gardening leave" until the end of the season before he has to depart so that he can't work for anyone else until next year? We have to wait and see.

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