2021 - Race 19 Brazil

[Nitrodaze]

Haha you guys are beyond biased. This is where this forum has jumped the shark. So let me get this straight. Hamiltons car was summoned to the stewards because there was a very minor infraction to his rear wing drs system that was off by millimeters in all likelihood because max Verstappen touched and probably tampered with his rear wing and then had his mechanic call for an investigation ( i mean who bloody touches the competitors rear wing in parc ferme like that???) with that new evidence max and the mechanic have been called into the stewards…and the general takeway from you lot is that max tampering with hamilton’s rear wing is ok, but hamilton should be banned for said rear wing infraction caused by verstappen? Ridiculous.
It is pointless to have any kind of discussion here anymore. A sad state for this forum.


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It is not clear if the test of the wing happened before or after Verstappen touched the wing. Toto believes the wing was damaged during qualifying. I fail to see how that is an excuse though. The fact that Bottas' wing passed the test suggests that Mercedes were not cheating in any way.

Nonetheless, it is unclear if the test was done before Friday qualifying or after qualifying before or after Verstappen touched the wing

Once they had found the infringement, disqualification was unavoidable. The situation clearly impacts the championship fight but does not make it impossible. Mercedes would be expecting Bottas to win the race tomorrow. From 10th tomorrow, Hamilton may end up on the podium with the sort of pace we saw in the sprint race.

[airshifter]

unless something happens, either bottas or verstappen is going to win this. after only 24 laps everybody else was almost or more than 20 seconds behind.

although hamilton looked to be very fast compared to the others, his fastest lap was still slower than those of both verstappen and bottas. except perez, both ferraris and norris, everybody else was more than a second per lap slower.

We will see. I don't expect Bottas to lead beyond a pit stop. If Lewis has a good run and gets to Bottas that will be a free position unless he simply defies a team order. I expect Perez to fade as well, but he could at least slow Lewis down some.

Keep in mind that margin included Lewis having to pass 14 cars, though some were no doubt easy. But I don't think Max pushed that hard either really. But I'm fully expecting Lewis to make it to the podium, and with the speed he had today I would be surprised if he didn't.

Setups, strategy, and conditions/tires will all factor in no doubt. But I think often Lewis performs his best when he starts further back. I think he just gets his head into it and drives, rather than question the team as much. I really don't expect many cars ahead of him to slow him much until he is in the top 5 or so. He seems to have figured out the optimum attack to use his DRS down the main straight and let the new engine do the work from there.


Either way, I think we still have a race on our hands.

[Nitrodaze]

We will see. I don't expect Bottas to lead beyond a pit stop. If Lewis has a good run and gets to Bottas that will be a free position unless he simply defies a team order. I expect Perez to fade as well, but he could at least slow Lewis down some.

Keep in mind that margin included Lewis having to pass 14 cars, though some were no doubt easy. But I don't think Max pushed that hard either really. But I'm fully expecting Lewis to make it to the podium, and with the speed he had today I would be surprised if he didn't.

Setups, strategy, and conditions/tires will all factor in no doubt. But I think often Lewis performs his best when he starts further back. I think he just gets his head into it and drives, rather than question the team as much. I really don't expect many cars ahead of him to slow him much until he is in the top 5 or so. He seems to have figured out the optimum attack to use his DRS down the main straight and let the new engine do the work from there.


Either way, I think we still have a race on our hands.

Firstly, Bottas would need to do another great start. If he can do that, he has the pace to keep Verstappen behind. He has won one race this season, he can win this one with good strategy. If Sainz can have another great start, he may put Perez in Hamilton's reach. Which would make podium a possibility for Hamilton. But if Perez can pass Sainz, chances are that there would be two Redbull's on the podium.

[The Black Knight]

Firstly, Bottas would need to do another great start. If he can do that, he has the pace to keep Verstappen behind. He has won one race this season, he can win this one with good strategy. If Sainz can have another great start, he may put Perez in Hamilton's reach. Which would make podium a possibility for Hamilton. But if Perez can pass Sainz, chances are that there would be two Redbull's on the podium.

I have to say learning about Hamilton's disqualification and that it was actually wing damage and not anything of intent or error on the part of Mercedes- I can't believe they gave him a penalty- this a dangerous stupid precedent.

[Bagwan]

I have to say learning about Hamilton's disqualification and that it was actually wing damage and not anything of intent or error on the part of Mercedes- I can't believe they gave him a penalty- this a dangerous stupid precedent.

It is a good point , Mr. Knight .
But , if he had not been penalized , would it prompt teams to actually make parts designed to fail into a faster configuration ?

[Nitrodaze]

I have to say learning about Hamilton's disqualification and that it was actually wing damage and not anything of intent or error on the part of Mercedes- I can't believe they gave him a penalty- this a dangerous stupid precedent.

If it is actually wing damage, then it would suggest they are trying to fix who wins the championships. Objectively, a team should not be punished for parts failure if it did not present a dangerous situation.

I always said this season smelled of a fix from the start. There is a rotten smell in the air of premeditated efforts to see Mercedes not win one or both of the championship titles.

[Nitrodaze]

It is a good point , Mr. Knight .
But , if he had not been penalized , would it prompt teams to actually make parts designed to fail into a faster configuration ?

Good point, but then both cars would fail similarly. Clearly, this is not the case. I am quite interested in how it happened to break in the first place. Was it struck by debris or did Verstappen unintentionally break it. Too many unknowns.

[The Black Knight]

It is a good point , Mr. Knight .
But , if he had not been penalized , would it prompt teams to actually make parts designed to fail into a faster configuration ?

I think that would become very obvious very quickly... plus the damage actually cost them performance and they were able to show that. They weren't even allowed to fix it ffs. This penalty is completely wrong.

[Nitrodaze]

I think that would become very obvious very quickly... plus the damage actually cost them performance and they were able to show that. They weren't even allowed to fix it ffs. This penalty is completely wrong.

They probably were punished because the failure was seen to have created an increased performance. Even so, the punishment did not fit the situation. It was not intentional and it is a very hard-fought championship situation where their punishment was going to have a profound impact on the championship outcome. In this instance, the driver is punished the most.

[airshifter]

I think that would become very obvious very quickly... plus the damage actually cost them performance and they were able to show that. They weren't even allowed to fix it ffs. This penalty is completely wrong.

1.3.3 If an Automobile is found not to comply with the applicable technical regulations, it shall be no defence to claim that no performance advantage was obtained.

The regulations do as much as possible to not allow for gray area. There is even a specific technical directive on how this test is done.

It sucks for Mercedes but they are fortunate that this happened after qualifying and not after the Sprint or the main race. Similar to the situation with Vettel the penalty would be without conditions attached. Intention does not create compliance.