2022 WRC News & Rumours

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Swapping batteries is like cheating if they're trying to promote this tech for the public. This would just show people that battery range is still a problem and put them off switching to electric. Everyone knows EVs works and the acceleration is great but it's the battery range that needs proving.

[bluuford]

Hydrogen cell technology overcomes battery size, power & storage issues

WRC has been always something where new technologies have been tested. Battery technology is old technology and and does not have sustainable future in current format (I say it as a part time geologist - my PhD study was on the borderline of ecology and geology). If we take all known geological resources, we can change all the cars to battery technology, but there are no more resources to replace all those batteries in the future, unless some new technology will be invented.

One of the most important law I studied at school was the law that was telling "the more weight you carry, the more energy you need." So, for me it is very strange that so far this law is ignored. We carry hybrid unit, we carry batteries and in total, depends on the car, proper Tesla battery weight is between 400-500 kg. and now imagine, millions of cars are carrying this extra weight.. does not sound very sustainable?
MK2 is right, we need concentrated energy. Hydrogen is on of them Currently Toyota Mirai fuel tank weight is around 80 kg, fuel capacity is around 5 kg, so, the weight in car is 85 kg. And you can cover approximately 500 km with this tank. For me, this is the way to develop. Hydrogen can be produced when the energy is cheap (too much wind or sun energy, high peaks of nuclear energy production and low consumption at the same time). So, we don't need to carry "power station" in each car, energy can be produced in centralized locations and we use only concentrated fuel.
At the same time it is hard to achieve, car manufacturers have made their investments in electric cars. Normal investment cycle is 30 years, 10 years you develop and spend money, next 10 years you earn back your investment, and final 10 years you earn profit.

WRC does not need to follow it, we can be innovative for once and not use 100+ years old technology and say it is new

[Tanelv]

WRC has been always something where new technologies have been tested. Battery technology is old technology and and does not have sustainable future in current format (I say it as a part time geologist - my PhD study was on the borderline of ecology and geology). If we take all known geological resources, we can change all the cars to battery technology, but there are no more resources to replace all those batteries in the future, unless some new technology will be invented.

One of the most important law I studied at school was the law that was telling "the more weight you carry, the more energy you need." So, for me it is very strange that so far this law is ignored. We carry hybrid unit, we carry batteries and in total, depends on the car, proper Tesla battery weight is between 400-500 kg. and now imagine, millions of cars are carrying this extra weight.. does not sound very sustainable?
MK2 is right, we need concentrated energy. Hydrogen is on of them Currently Toyota Mirai fuel tank weight is around 80 kg, fuel capacity is around 5 kg, so, the weight in car is 85 kg. And you can cover approximately 500 km with this tank. For me, this is the way to develop. Hydrogen can be produced when the energy is cheap (too much wind or sun energy, high peaks of nuclear energy production and low consumption at the same time). So, we don't need to carry "power station" in each car, energy can be produced in centralized locations and we use only concentrated fuel.
At the same time it is hard to achieve, car manufacturers have made their investments in electric cars. Normal investment cycle is 30 years, 10 years you develop and spend money, next 10 years you earn back your investment, and final 10 years you earn profit.

WRC does not need to follow it, we can be innovative for once and not use 100+ years old technology and say it is new

Yes, battery technology is old technology, but it is nowhere near developed to its full potential whereas ICE technology has reached 99,9% of it's possibilities. Battery tech is already showing promising solutions and I am sure as material technology is also helping bring innovative solutions we will see much more energy dense packs in the future. Car industry "big money" has supported battery tech far too short period to call it a dead end. Hydrogen fuel cell cars are also in principle electric cars which carry power plant with them to make electricity from H2 to store it shortly in battery, then use it with electric motor. That's a big issue with H2 in transportation, it has a lot of losses of energy compared to only battery powered cars and it makes cars more complicated.

[AndyRAC]

WRC does not need to follow it, we can be innovative for once and not use 100+ years old technology and say it is new

Yes, WRC hasn't been innovative for a long time; it tends to follow what other series do with technology. One of the reasons it can't attract manufacturers......who will go elsewhere to demonstrate new technology.

[bluuford]

Yes, battery technology is old technology, but it is nowhere near developed to its full potential whereas ICE technology has reached 99,9% of it's possibilities. Battery tech is already showing promising solutions and I am sure as material technology is also helping bring innovative solutions we will see much more energy dense packs in the future. Car industry "big money" has supported battery tech far too short period to call it a dead end. Hydrogen fuel cell cars are also in principle electric cars which carry power plant with them to make electricity from H2 to store it shortly in battery, then use it with electric motor. That's a big issue with H2 in transportation, it has a lot of losses of energy compared to only battery powered cars and it makes cars more complicated.

Yes I know
To me the next evolution would be proper solution to use H2 directly (basically like H2 powered ICE, to say it in a very simple manner). That would be proper innovation for me, lets see, I am not an engine engineer, so far I stick to weather, I know this field slightly better.

But I think we have gone too far from news in this topic

[J4MIE]

I work in the UK gas industry and there is a lot of development towards using hydrogen in the network so it could be within a few years a lot more availability of hydrogen across the country.

We currently have two hydrogen cars at our office, but you have to remember the nearest filling point from here is approx 70km away….

[Mk2 RS2000]

Yes, battery technology is old technology, but it is nowhere near developed to its full potential whereas ICE technology has reached 99,9% of it's possibilities. Battery tech is already showing promising solutions and I am sure as material technology is also helping bring innovative solutions we will see much more energy dense packs in the future. Car industry "big money" has supported battery tech far too short period to call it a dead end. Hydrogen fuel cell cars are also in principle electric cars which carry power plant with them to make electricity from H2 to store it shortly in battery, then use it with electric motor. That's a big issue with H2 in transportation, it has a lot of losses of energy compared to only battery powered cars and it makes cars more complicated.

Take the time to check out the developments in the heavy vehicle industry. For example trucking and fork lifts using electric motors. Powered by hydrogen cells now becoming well developed in Asia and the USA There are a lot of things happening outside of Europe

[Humber]

The happiest people with electric vehicles in my assessment have been used Nissan Leaf owners who live outside small towns (20 to 30 km commute distance drive). Have their own home solar systems to charge the Nissans with.
The 2nd gen Toyota Mirai weighs 1920-1950kg an increase of up to 100kg over the first gen Mirai. The 2nd gen Mirai is heavier than the current edition standard range Tesla Model 3.(1835kg)

I have heard of people driving Teslas into the ground, that these people went back to driving gasoline/ petrol cars.
Any shift to new tech will involve winners and losers.

Ballard and fuel cell buses, Scotland. https://youtu.be/91ZCI9f_nmI

Hopefully Airpod can get their act together (compressed air short distance small vehicle)

The people that are 70km from the hydrogen refuel, might look (if rules allow) to get a few hydrogen cylinders like an oxy-acetylene torch cylinder setup, that can give them local partial hydrogen vehicle refuelling.

[TypeR]

Upgrades for Toyota:
https://dirtfish.com/rally/wrc/the-u...-see-in-tartu/

“Fowler: So yeah, a more powerful engine is coming.”

Hyundai..

[mknight]

Wasn't the petrol engine supposed to be somehow "frozen" since mid-last year? Guess not everything is frozen.

I'd say MSport should be more concerned since even Fowler says this is a reaction to some Hyundai upgrades. Let's hope MSport doesn't start lagging too fast. (At least not before we see more starts with performing drivers)