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  1. #41
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    Historic caused problems also, but I remember Tänak and Ogier having pretty strong words towards the organisers for the unplowed roads. I happened to be on this section and this was far from rallying.

  2. #42
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    Stupidest comment... comparing unblowed 20cm of snow and gravel rallies.

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    Senior Member Rallyper's Avatar
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    However the stage was unplowed even after Ott and Seb, wasn´t it?
    "Reis vas pät pat kaar vas kut"
    Tommi Mäkinen, back in the years...

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    Senior Member Fast Eddie WRC's Avatar
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    This issue lead to Ogier eventually dropping his starting position after losing so much time due to snow-ploughing.

    This has since lead to all sorts of road position tactics.

  5. #45
    Senior Member AnttiL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rallyper View Post
    However the stage was unplowed even after Ott and Seb, wasn´t it?
    Latvala mentioned it as well in his comments as third car. Obviously every car cleared the road bit by bit.

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  7. #46
    Senior Member AnttiL's Avatar
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    [WRC] Arctic Rally 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by Fast Eddie WRC View Post
    This issue lead to Ogier eventually dropping his starting position after losing so much time due to snow-ploughing.

    This has since lead to all sorts of road position tactics.
    Only on the power stage, and it helped him get points. Ogier then did some other tactics in 2019 when restarting in slushy conditions. This was only to help his teammate Lappi.

  8. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jakem View Post
    Stupidest comment... comparing unblowed 20cm of snow and gravel rallies.
    6 km less plowed road with 5-10 cms... with these increases we will soon end up to 2 meters of snow and car tunneling trough.

    On gravel rallies 50 km of cleaning 1-2 cm gravel is standard. Get some perspective.

    Yes drivers complain almost all the time. Haven't heard anyone blaming organizers on gravel rallies for it though, just FIA for starting order.



    Quote Originally Posted by AnttiL View Post
    In Sweden 2018 the issue was that the last road of the stage was left unplowed. In generally roads are plowed for rallying. If they are not, the first cars have to do it and it's not competitionally interesting. Remember this stage in Monte 2018? Breen was first on the road and lost 3:25. And Andrea Nucita on an RGT car was fourth. https://www.ewrc-results.com/results...2018/?s=154131 Hardly comparable to sweeping in gravel rallies.
    Roads are almost never not plowed for rallying 1-2 hours before the stage start and in that period it can snow a lot. Gravel doesn't fall down from the sky unexpectedly....

    In Monte 2018 it was also turning warm so for later cars the snow both got cleaned and melted (same in Monza SS11).

    Imo it's anything but competitionally uniteresting, it's rallying, conditions change. As long as it's "reasonably" safe it is how it should be. Sometimes you gain on it, sometimes you loose. (in Sweden when it is warm earlier drivers can gain before the ice breaks up for example)

  9. #48
    Senior Member Rallyper's Avatar
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    Remember 1996 (?) Tommi protested by stopping before finish on a stage, bcs he had to plow. He was furious over Kenneth Eriksson was second on stage... Smth like that.

    Think Tommi was fined for that protest, and upset reporters in Swedish Television.

    There always has and also will be issues with starting first in winthery conditions... However Asunmaa and Oliver handled it well last weekend.
    "Reis vas pät pat kaar vas kut"
    Tommi Mäkinen, back in the years...

  10. #49
    Senior Member AnttiL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rallyper View Post
    Remember 1996 (?) Tommi protested by stopping before finish on a stage, bcs he had to plow. He was furious over Kenneth Eriksson was second on stage... Smth like that.

    Think Tommi was fined for that protest, and upset reporters in Swedish Television.
    No, Mitsubishi had 1-2 at the end of Saturday and they made a team order to freeze competition. Eriksson was leading so he was allowed to win. On the last day Tommi still kept pushing and got the lead back, but made his "protest" at the end of the last stage.

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  12. #50
    Senior Member AnttiL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mknight View Post
    6 km less plowed road with 5-10 cms... with these increases we will soon end up to 2 meters of snow and car tunneling trough.

    On gravel rallies 50 km of cleaning 1-2 cm gravel is standard. Get some perspective.

    Yes drivers complain almost all the time. Haven't heard anyone blaming organizers on gravel rallies for it though, just FIA for starting order.





    Roads are almost never not plowed for rallying 1-2 hours before the stage start and in that period it can snow a lot. Gravel doesn't fall down from the sky unexpectedly....

    In Monte 2018 it was also turning warm so for later cars the snow both got cleaned and melted (same in Monza SS11).

    Imo it's anything but competitionally uniteresting, it's rallying, conditions change. As long as it's "reasonably" safe it is how it should be. Sometimes you gain on it, sometimes you loose. (in Sweden when it is warm earlier drivers can gain before the ice breaks up for example)
    mknight I usually like your posts, but now I can't agree...gravel sweeping is not same as an unexceptional snowfall or road plowing mistake. And you can't say no one has ever complained about having to sweep on a gravel rally! And no one has lost 3 minutes on one day due to gravel sweeping, like Breen did on that one stage. However, there's also benefits to being first on the road on a gravel rally, like not having dust or rocks pulled onto the road. And if it is raining, you might have the best position after all. Finally, sudden snowfall can also benefit first starters like in Monte 2017 power stage when the first cars drove a dry stage and the last cars a snow stage. Do I remember correctly that Monza SS11 was stopped for a while, giving Scandola some extra time for the weather to dry?
    Last edited by AnttiL; 18th January 2021 at 18:18.

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