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  1. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firstgear View Post
    Dazey, you shouldn't be so quick to pull out the Haters card. Looks to me like Baggy is asking an honest question. As for your question: "That all the drivers were told during the stewards meeting where to practise start?"

    Looks like the answer is yes. A quote from an article on another site has the following:
    I have to say, l could not stop laughing to see that Masi and his stewards thought that Hamilton had gained an advantage by doing his practise start where he did. Hence, deemed it to be a sporting offence. I wait to see what kind of advantage that is. It is laughable how they keep digging themselves deeper into the "we are out to get him" hole.

    The excuse that it is a sporting offence; hence the in-race punishment, sets a new precedent. And defines a new kind of infraction not defined anywhere in the regulations. If it was, they would be very quick to quote the rules in question. I understand Masi wants to defend his stewards, but at the expense of being seen as part of the problem.
    Last edited by Nitrodaze; 1st October 2020 at 19:11.
    Better a witty fool than a foolish wit.
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  2. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nitrodaze View Post
    The excuse that it is a sporting offence; hence the in-race punishment, sets a new precedent. And defines a new kind of infraction not defined anywhere in the regulations. If it was, they would be very quick to quote the rules in question.
    The stewards did quote the rules they thought Hamilton violated in their report: https://www.autoweek.com/racing/form...-even-started/

    Article 12.1.1. of the FIA International Sporting Code and Article 36.1 of the FIA Formula One Sporting Regulations. The latter quite clearly defines what is - and what isn't - allowed on the installation lap.
    Oct. 31, 1999 - one of the blackest days in motorsports.

  3. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by gm99 View Post
    The stewards did quote the rules they thought Hamilton violated in their report: https://www.autoweek.com/racing/form...-even-started/

    Article 12.1.1. of the FIA International Sporting Code and Article 36.1 of the FIA Formula One Sporting Regulations. The latter quite clearly defines what is - and what isn't - allowed on the installation lap.
    I think Article 36.1 could be successfully disputed. Unfortunately, they did not provide the complete wordsing of item 19.1 of the Event Note v3 for to have a clear understanding of where the designated place for practise start is.
    Better a witty fool than a foolish wit.
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  4. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by gm99 View Post
    The stewards did quote the rules they thought Hamilton violated in their report: https://www.autoweek.com/racing/form...-even-started/

    Article 12.1.1. of the FIA International Sporting Code and Article 36.1 of the FIA Formula One Sporting Regulations. The latter quite clearly defines what is - and what isn't - allowed on the installation lap.
    I think Article 36.1 could be successfully disputed. Unfortunately, they did not provide the complete wording for item 19.1 of the Event Note v3 for us to have a clear understanding of where the designated place for practise start is. I think the rules around this area is woolly and confusing. Masi has not explained the main reasons for the designated area. when it applies and when it doesn't. If the designated place for practice start is not suitable for that purpose, what do drivers do? Can they move further to use virgin surface just ahead of the designated area?

    This is the reason why this sort of infraction ought to be looked at after the race. To allow proper analysis of the situation to understand where this rule should be relaxed out of necessity.

    It is easy to say a specific rule has been broken. They miss the point that they have failed to follow a fair procedure and have been hasty to impose a penalty on Hamilton. They have deprive everyone of the chance to have a dialogue about all permutation of the use of the designated area and then determining if and what level of penalty is actually due based on the evidence and better understanding of the situation.

    I think item 19.1 ought to make allowance for situation where the designated practice spot is no longer suitable due to too much rubber for instance. The stewards being gun ho with punishment has place Masi in position where he is unable to review and revise 19.1 to allow driver to explore other immediate appropriate surfaces to do practice starts if the designated area is unsuitable.

    The result of the punishment is such that the first few driver to get to the designated area would enjoy a good condition of the surface for their practice starts. Everyone else is now condemed by this ruling by the stewards to use the poor surface or face a penalty if they use any other surfaces. This is how bad the stewards ruling actually is.
    Last edited by Nitrodaze; 2nd October 2020 at 07:32.
    Better a witty fool than a foolish wit.
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  5. #95
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    EVENT NOTES 24/09/2020 10:55 - Michael Masi Race Director

    19) Practice starts
    19.1 Practice starts may only be carried out on the right-hand side after the pit exit lights and, for the
    avoidance of doubt, this includes any time the pit exit is open for the race.
    Drivers must leave adequate room on their left for another driver to pass.
    19.2 For reasons of safety and sporting equity, cars may not stop in the fast lane at any time the pit exit is open without a justifiable reason (a practice start is not considered a justifiable reason).

    According to 19.1, there is no specific spot where practice starts must occur but a general area which is on the right hand side anywhere after the pit exit lights.

    It also stipulates that the driver must leave adequate room on the left for other drivers to pass.

    It is very hard to show from the wording of this rule how Hamilton has contravened this instruction in 19.1. Especially since it could be shown that drivers have done the same in the past. And that it makes sense that it is a general area due to one specific spot not being sufficient for all drivers to do a practice start; due to degradation of the surface at a single spot after the first few drivers have used the spot.

    Micheal Masi had the opportunity to clarify the extent of the area on the right that applies to this rule but has failed to do so because it would make the stewards look very bad as a consequence. So the paddock is left with an unclear indication of what is and is not in the extent of the zone in the pit exit that should be used for practice starts.

    Now, don't you just miss Charlie Whiting!


    You could argue that Hamilton caused other drivers to cross the pit line. But is that unsafe with all cars heading to the grid for the start of the race. This would be a good argument if this occurred during active practice sessions for instance. As one would expect fast moving cars to be passing the pit exit, thus crossing the line may be deemed dangerous in that situation. But this is not the case.

    Whichever way you look at this, it still looks like the instruction in the event notes was poorly interpreted. And the following punishment was consequentially grossly heavy handed. And Masi is not covering himself with glory here, as he has displayed that he lacks objectivity.
    Last edited by Nitrodaze; 2nd October 2020 at 20:42.
    Better a witty fool than a foolish wit.
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  6. #96
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  7. #97
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    It is always great to see another perspective on the matter raised in this thread. Check out what Marc Priestley has to say on the matter here
    Last edited by Nitrodaze; 13th October 2020 at 11:02.
    Better a witty fool than a foolish wit.
    William Shakespeare

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