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  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by truefan72 View Post
    I'm in the same boat with you on Stroll.
    On pure talent and merit, he probably should be toiling away somewhere in the top 15 in GP2 but somehow has managed to get an F1 ride now for a 4th year.
    I really struggle to respect his racing, but recently felt that his 3+ years of experience probably has given him some kind of an improvement in his race craft worthy of my tepid acknowledgment.
    Then came this weekend and it was a bit embarrassing. How they blew it on the car not being able to start is beyond comprehension. and is either gorss incompetence or the fluke of the century.
    Hulkenberg's pace was excusable due to the circumstances of his drive, not to mention a severely compromised cockpit setup for him. And despite that he quickly came to grips with the car I'm glad he got that shot and i was beyond disappointed that the he didn't even make it to the starting grid. (almost like team stroll was afraid of being embarrassed by Hulkenberg)

    I honestly feel like if they had temporarily bumped Russell up into that seat for the next 2 races, he would have given them a podium. If you had put DeVries in that seat, i would have expected probably a top 5 finish same with wherlein. This racing point car should legitimately be fighting with the Red Bulls and Ferrari's. It reminds me of toyota in 2009. A superb car let down by average drivers, dubious race strategies, and mechanical blunders. This car should be 2nd or 3rd in the WCC standings and include a driver in the top 5. I wonder how much (poor) influence stroll and his dad have on strategy and the overall decisions this team is able to take. As of right now, it's not working and I fear they are throwing away an amazing opportunity to be at the very top end of the grid.

    I'm starting to revert back to my previous opinion of stroll, but would love to be proved wrong.
    Stroll qualified well but his race pace was poor. That was due to the poor race setup of the car which suggests that Perez's inputs has been crucial to the team. Also that Stroll has not mastered the art of setting up an F1 car. But given a well setup car, he has performed really well in past races, with one podium last season and two solid forth to show that he certainly has talent, l think he just needs to build up his maturity around car setup.

    I subscribe to the fact that Racing Point is not fully capitalizing on the true performance of their 2020 car. Can we fairly put Racing Point's poor showing at Silverstone down to Stroll per ce? I think this weekend exposes a gap in the engineer crew. In the absence of Perez, they ought to have enough engineers present to setup the car for its optimum performance. Lance is the one that stands out in this poor showing because he is the visible one in the car.

    The racing point simply had poor race pace due to poor race setup. This may be because the team were knocked of balance due to Perez's COVID test failure since they had to scramble to find a replacement, hence were slightly distracted

    I think Lance's poor race was due to the car rather than his personal afforts.
    Last edited by Nitrodaze; 3rd August 2020 at 22:14.
    Better a witty fool than a foolish wit.
    William Shakespeare

  2. Likes: truefan72 (4th August 2020)
  3. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by truefan72 View Post
    I'm in the same boat with you on Stroll.
    On pure talent and merit, he probably should be toiling away somewhere in the top 15 in GP2 but somehow has managed to get an F1 ride now for a 4th year.
    I really struggle to respect his racing, but recently felt that his 3+ years of experience probably has given him some kind of an improvement in his race craft worthy of my tepid acknowledgment.
    Then came this weekend and it was a bit embarrassing. How they blew it on the car not being able to start is beyond comprehension. and is either gorss incompetence or the fluke of the century.
    Hulkenberg's pace was excusable due to the circumstances of his drive, not to mention a severely compromised cockpit setup for him. And despite that he quickly came to grips with the car I'm glad he got that shot and i was beyond disappointed that the he didn't even make it to the starting grid. (almost like team stroll was afraid of being embarrassed by Hulkenberg)

    I honestly feel like if they had temporarily bumped Russell up into that seat for the next 2 races, he would have given them a podium. If you had put DeVries in that seat, i would have expected probably a top 5 finish same with wherlein. This racing point car should legitimately be fighting with the Red Bulls and Ferrari's. It reminds me of toyota in 2009. A superb car let down by average drivers, dubious race strategies, and mechanical blunders. This car should be 2nd or 3rd in the WCC standings and include a driver in the top 5. I wonder how much (poor) influence stroll and his dad have on strategy and the overall decisions this team is able to take. As of right now, it's not working and I fear they are throwing away an amazing opportunity to be at the very top end of the grid.

    I'm starting to revert back to my previous opinion of stroll, but would love to be proved wrong.
    Holy crap , dude .
    One mediocre race and he's firmly under the bus .

    We have no idea at all why he was slower than we expected , and without the Hulk involved , we have nothing to compare him with .

    And , to suggest they sabotaged the Hulk to make the boy look better somehow , is waaaaaaaay beyond the pale .

    By the way , they get the engine and transmission from Merc , and it was apparently a bolt that broke inside , jamming the drive line , so it wouldn't start . Bad bolt , or bad torque setting , but it seems that it was on Merc's end , not theirs .
    Perhaps you'd like to speculate that Merc doesn't want them too close , so gives them the cheap bolts ?

    Your last words there : "I'm starting to revert back to my previous opinion of stroll, but would love to be proved wrong."
    I don't believe you .

  4. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by N4D13 View Post
    At this moment I need to retract my previous criticism of Pirelli as the evidence is mounting that the tire failures were caused by debris:

    - Horner has come out saying that Verstappen's hard front left tire had "50 little cuts" in it: https://www.motorsportweek.com/2020/...0-little-cuts/

    - Albert Fabrega, journalist, claims to have found a piece of metal in the racing line after the race: https://mobile.twitter.com/AlbertFab...60595171115010

    Hopefully this will be it and we'll be able to have our next race without tire dramas now.
    I have a hard time criticizing Pirelli at all , as they are still creating tires to a spec they were asked for .
    Part of the game is changing tires when it is best to do so .

    That would generally be before they go pop .

    You might get a puncture from debris , which is unlucky , but all those tires that did pop were visibly ragged .
    Bottas complained for quite a few laps of vibration before his tire went south , and nobody is suggesting he hit any debris .


    But , it's not Pirelli's fault at all .
    Teams and drivers make those calls .
    And they went too far , literally .

    Once they take delivery , the only thing the tire company has any say in is tire pressures , which the teams would also stretch the limits of , if they were allowed .

    As it turned out , it should have been a two-stop race for Merc , and the next race will likely be three .

    It will be interesting , and different from the last race because of the different compounds , but it won't be something to beat Pirelli up for .

  5. Likes: Tazio (4th August 2020)
  6. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nitrodaze View Post
    Pirelli tyres are not so crap after all. This leads us to wonder if Silverstone needs more marshalls as it took a long time for them to remove Kyvat's Alpha Tauri. The track cleaning effort was very light as well it appeared.
    I think they reduced the number of marshalls due to covid-19
    Also if it was debris, it was probably from where the Kimi incident happened.
    you can't argue with results.

  7. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by truefan72 View Post
    I think they reduced the number of marshalls due to covid-19
    Also if it was debris, it was probably from where the Kimi incident happened.
    Yes I think Kimi's wing was responsible for late race debris. Also Ocon brought up an interesting point:
    There is a new thing out of Turn 13; Maggots, Becketts, Chapel, this combination of corners. At the right-hander, Turn 13 exit, now there is no kerb anymore. Which there was before. So you run in the dirt and then you go on to the kerb, and that could also damage your tyres.
    I can see how this combination could be quite hard on tires!
    May the forza be with you

  8. Likes: truefan72 (4th August 2020)
  9. #56
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    In case there is any doubt as to the cause of Kvyat's crash:
    https://streamable.com/pvsn5e
    May the forza be with you

  10. #57
    Senior Member truefan72's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bagwan View Post
    I have a hard time criticizing Pirelli at all , as they are still creating tires to a spec they were asked for .
    Part of the game is changing tires when it is best to do so .

    That would generally be before they go pop .

    You might get a puncture from debris , which is unlucky , but all those tires that did pop were visibly ragged .
    Bottas complained for quite a few laps of vibration before his tire went south , and nobody is suggesting he hit any debris .


    But , it's not Pirelli's fault at all .
    Teams and drivers make those calls .
    And they went too far , literally .

    Once they take delivery , the only thing the tire company has any say in is tire pressures , which the teams would also stretch the limits of , if they were allowed .

    As it turned out , it should have been a two-stop race for Merc , and the next race will likely be three .

    It will be interesting , and different from the last race because of the different compounds , but it won't be something to beat Pirelli up for .
    Not at all.
    I've praised him when he has performed well and if you go through some of my posts from earlier you would see that to be true.
    Even his Baku podium was well deserved and i praised him highly for it.
    Being able to understand your car and extract the best from it is also part of a driver ability.
    I'm not saying to outdrive it or exceed it's abilities, but to at the very least allow it to perform at its baseline level, and i'm afraid that Stroll doesn't have that ability yet. Or better yet, never really had to work at it for a number of reasons. Absolutely true that not everything is down to his fault (and the hulk car mishap was more tongue and cheek) and as i've said, serious 2009 toyota vibes. It took the entire team underperforming for them to squander that season.
    you can't argue with results.

  11. Likes: Jag_Warrior (4th August 2020)
  12. #58
    Senior Member truefan72's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tazio View Post
    In case there is any doubt as to the cause of Kvyat's crash:
    https://streamable.com/pvsn5e
    Yeah, Kvyatt was way too hard on himself about that incident.
    Dangerous stuff
    Glad he walked away from it unscathed.
    you can't argue with results.

  13. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tazio View Post
    In case there is any doubt as to the cause of Kvyat's crash:
    https://streamable.com/pvsn5e
    I didn't think it was his fault, glad to be proven correct. The next race is going to be interesting with softer tyres. I wonder who thought that one up?
    Last edited by Nitrodaze; 4th August 2020 at 15:40.
    Better a witty fool than a foolish wit.
    William Shakespeare

  14. #60
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    It was a rotten race for Bottas, Vettel, Albon, Sainz, Kyvat and Magnussen
    Better a witty fool than a foolish wit.
    William Shakespeare

  15. Likes: Tazio (4th August 2020)

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