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  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nitrodaze View Post
    Even in the case of Schumacher, the number two driver was given all the tools and support to get pole positions and win races. But Schumacher always did something special to ensure he was well ahead of his teammates. The relative numbers of pole positions tells the true story of how Schumacher always keeps ahead of his teammates, as there are no team orders during qualification.
    BS. Rewriting history much? Remember Austria 2002? Barichello was given all the tools and support up until the last lap. Then all tools and support were withdrawn and given to the one and only, Schumacher, driver number 1 even before Barichello went to Ferrari. MS won 4 out of the first 5 races of the season. It hardly looked like a very contested championship. They were dominating and there was no need for it. They did it to satisfy the egomaniac, probably just to "fabricate" a record. In the end he won 11 of 17 races and Ferrari won as many points as all the other teams combined.

    Or USA 2005, that charade of a race? Even there they had to "fix" the race for him. Totally pointless for the team. It only served the same egomaniac.

    Yeah, he did do something special to keep always ahead of his team mates at Ferrari. When he went there there was one important condition (among others I'm sure). Whoever they would hire to be his team mate, they would make him be his own personal b****. And they agreed. And his team mates were the kind of drivers who would take that job.

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Ben View Post
    BS. Rewriting history much? Remember Austria 2002? Barichello was given all the tools and support up until the last lap. Then all tools and support were withdrawn and given to the one and only, Schumacher, driver number 1 even before Barichello went to Ferrari. MS won 4 out of the first 5 races of the season. It hardly looked like a very contested championship. They were dominating and there was no need for it. They did it to satisfy the egomaniac, probably just to "fabricate" a record. In the end he won 11 of 17 races and Ferrari won as many points as all the other teams combined.

    Or USA 2005, that charade of a race? Even there they had to "fix" the race for him. Totally pointless for the team. It only served the same egomaniac.

    Yeah, he did do something special to keep always ahead of his team mates at Ferrari. When he went there there was one important condition (among others I'm sure). Whoever they would hire to be his team mate, they would make him be his own personal b****. And they agreed. And his team mates were the kind of drivers who would take that job.
    That is one of the ugly side of the Ferrari team order regime that has pissed off many fans, including myself mind you. We all remember the Alonso is faster than you crap that Massa had to endure. Yes, these sort of things distort the measure of the accomplishments of Schumacher. One of the reasons why Hamilton is so refreshing. There were some team orders that were employed to aid Hamilton, but very seldom. Hamilton takes on his teammate on equal footing without any favoritism in his favor.

    That said, Schumacher may have still won seven championships with the calibre of teammates paired up with him. Though with closer points difference to the stronger teammates like Irvine, Barrichello and even Massa.
    Last edited by Nitrodaze; 15th January 2020 at 17:10.
    Better a witty fool than a foolish wit.
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  3. #53
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    I can understand team orders in the context of a fight with another team. I didn't get it when the team didn't really have much to win from them, just for the sake of favoring one driver. MS would have beaten Barichello anyway in the long run. What was the point? It was nice to see that in similar circumstances Mercedes allowed it's pilot to fight. And proof stands the fact that Rosberg actually won. But I suspect the reason they keep Bottas now is that he is close to that level where he helps the team enough in the constrictor's championship without creating too much internal fight. He's not good enough to fight for the title and nice enough to just get out of the way when other teams get close. He's close to the perfect no. 2 driver.

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Ben View Post
    I can understand team orders in the context of a fight with another team. I didn't get it when the team didn't really have much to win from them, just for the sake of favoring one driver. MS would have beaten Barichello anyway in the long run. What was the point? It was nice to see that in similar circumstances Mercedes allowed it's pilot to fight. And proof stands the fact that Rosberg actually won. But I suspect the reason they keep Bottas now is that he is close to that level where he helps the team enough in the constrictor's championship without creating too much internal fight. He's not good enough to fight for the title and nice enough to just get out of the way when other teams get close. He's close to the perfect no. 2 driver.
    I think Bottas is abit like Hakkinen. If he can get on top of his inconsistent performance, he is good enough to win championships. I think he may do, if given the chance to complete his maturity as Hakkinen did in the end for Mclaren. Unlike Hakkinen, he has a tougher mountain to climb, in that he must beat Hamilton to be world champion while Hamilton is still in Mercedes. If he does that, he would have instant credibility of the same status as Rosberg before him. But can he?

    If he is still around when Hamilton retires, l would bet that would be his very best chance to knick at least one world championship. That would also depend on how quickly, his new team mate can ramp up in the their first season. If paired with a young racer like Russell, then he would most likely get a good run for his money.
    Better a witty fool than a foolish wit.
    William Shakespeare

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