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Thread: WRC future

  1. #1011
    Senior Member Mirek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sulland View Post
    It is hard to control cost if you keep changing the regulations, and use political reasons to do so.
    Change of regulations is the basic tool to keep the championship atractive by giving newcommers and unsuccessful ones a chance of restart. Like it or not without this restart the sport is down to two manufacturers after five years or so and the public interest falters in boredom. That was proved over and over again in the past when the period between the changes was kept too long. Yes, it costs money but it brings much more benefits.
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    Senior Member Sulland's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mirek View Post
    Change of regulations is the basic tool to keep the championship atractive by giving newcommers and unsuccessful ones a chance of restart. Like it or not without this restart the sport is down to two manufacturers after five years or so and the public interest falters in boredom. That was proved over and over again in the past when the period between the changes was kept too long. Yes, it costs money but it brings much more benefits.
    In normal circumstanses i agree, but now we do not have normal economical circumstances for car manufacturers, since they have red number on the bottom line. Hard to convince the board, that now is the time to develop a complete new beast.

  4. #1013
    Senior Member Rally Power's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mirek View Post
    Change of regulations is the basic tool to keep the championship atractive by giving newcommers and unsuccessful ones a chance of restart. Like it or not without this restart the sport is down to two manufacturers after five years or so and the public interest falters in boredom. That was proved over and over again in the past when the period between the changes was kept too long. Yes, it costs money but it brings much more benefits.
    Sulland is right on the political motivation for the rules changes and we all know they’re not made to attract new manus but mainly to keep the current ones, making hard to believe the WRC interest will raise because of '22 rules. Besides, apart Gr.B, WRC+ era is about to become the shortest in the series history.

    Probably a R5 based solution (on an upgraded mild hybrid form) would allow a larger top field, but once the new rules were finished a year ago and the teams are already working on them, despite the Covid, it seems there’s little point to keep disputing them.
    Last edited by Rally Power; 1st December 2020 at 13:10.
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  5. #1014
    Senior Member AnttiL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rally Power View Post
    Besides, apart Gr.B, WRC+ era is about to become the shortest in the WRC history.
    The original 1.6 rules lasted for six years (2011-2016), only one year longer than the current era.

  6. #1015
    Senior Member Rally Power's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AnttiL View Post
    The original 1.6 rules lasted for six years (2011-2016), only one year longer than the current era.
    That doesn't change what I've write: WRC+ is about to become the shortest WRC era, apart Gr.B (actually if we consider '82 as the beginning of Gr.B era, WRC+ will actually become the shortest one, alongside Gr.B). Besides, '17 rules were mostly an evolution of previous WRC1.6T, quite different from a fundamental change as '22 rules are.
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  7. #1016
    Senior Member Mirek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rally Power View Post
    Sulland is right on the political motivation for the rules changes and we all know they’re not made to attract new manus but mainly to keep the current ones, making hard to believe the WRC interest will raise because of '22 rules.
    The manufacturers themselves are part of the political motivation. It's them calling for hybridization and electrification for years. The point is that without the change even the current manus would likely loose reason to stay and the new ones would definitely not come (nobody jumps on the running train which moreover doesn't carry what you want). Also the restart gives everyone a free sheet of paper which is especially important for Ford/M-Sport which at this moment is just adding numbers.

    Also the use of tubular spaceframe is much easier for whatever manufacturers to jump in than the current cars. Such cars have good potential to attract big private teams, just like in Dakar or various circuit series if the homologation process will allow that (if not it's a huge mistake from FIA).
    Last edited by Mirek; 1st December 2020 at 13:34.
    Stupid is as stupid does. Forrest Gump

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  9. #1017
    Senior Member AnttiL's Avatar
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    And remember that the manufacturers are deciding the rules together with FIA, it's not just FIA telling the teams what to do.

    I'm sure that if all the manufacturers would have wanted R5 to be the main class in 2022, FIA would have agreed.

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  11. #1018
    Senior Member Rally Power's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mirek View Post
    The manufacturers themselves are part of the political motivation. It's them calling for hybridization and electrification for years. The point is that without the change even the current manus would likely loose reason to stay and the new ones would definitely not come (nobody jumps on the running train which moreover doesn't carry what you want).
    That’s exactly what I’ve said; these rules aren’t made to attract more manus but to keep the current ones. That seems a recipe to disaster, especially when a R5+ Mild Hybrid solution was pretty easy to adopt.

    Btw, for sure spaceframe chassis are used in many motorsport series, actually since almost ever, but the only time the WRC use them it was a heck of a mess.
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  12. #1019
    Senior Member Mirek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rally Power View Post
    That’s exactly what I’ve said; these rules aren’t made to attract more manus but to keep the current ones. That seems a recipe to disaster, especially when a R5+ Mild Hybrid solution was pretty easy to adopt.
    No, the R5+hybrid is a solution for current manufacturers (and not for the new ones) and something manufacturers clearly don't want. R5 rules have been great but they are not rules for the future because they are absolutely bound to the stock production which in the future will continue distancing itself from anything useful for racing activities.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rally Power View Post
    tw, for sure spaceframe chassis are used in many motorsport series, actually since almost ever, but the only time the WRC use them it was a heck of a mess.
    For reasons completely unrelated to the spaceframe.
    Last edited by Mirek; 1st December 2020 at 14:17.
    Stupid is as stupid does. Forrest Gump

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  14. #1020
    Senior Member Rally Power's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AnttiL View Post
    I'm sure that if all the manufacturers would have wanted R5 to be the main class in 2022, FIA would have agreed.
    How can you be sure of that? From what it was known, these rules making was full of ups and downs and it’s pretty clear that they’re a compromise, not what each manu would really wanted (apparently, Toyota asked for a hi-tech in-house developed Hydrib system, MSport was interested on a R5 based solution and Hyundai almost jumped off for the cars costs). Btw, besides the current 3, do you know if the FIA consulted any other manu, especially those with previous WRC experience?

    We should look on WEC new rules; initially, the FIA and the series promoter only managed to attract 2 top manus into the new and expensive Hypercar class, condemning the series to another tedious era. Fortunately, other manus and events organizers pushed for being allowed another top category, the affordable LMDh protos, which will fight for the overall wins thanks to a BoP system. Who knows, maybe on a near future the FIA will consent a BoP leveled R5+ category alongside Rally1 cars, enlarging WRC top field. Fingers crossed!
    Rally addict since 1982

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