Lets talk Bottas

**journeyman racer** · 16th June 2019, 10:08

lololol

How precious can you get???

Btw, in half of Hamilton's wins in 16, he locked up and made errors. But Rosberg didn't punish him by being conservative, and he didn't get penalties (Like he should've) in other races. So your generalisation is wrong (Again).

I was hypothetically concluding had Bottas qualified behind him.But since Bottas' best in qualifying has been better than Hamilton so far. Whatever Hamilton would've done is irrelevant and it could've been Bottas that could've benefited form the penalty.

But he's given Hamilton a margin of error, when Hamilton hasn't done so for him. He has to deal with that.

**The Black Knight** · 16th June 2019, 10:44

Oh dear, it’s not my generalisation, it’s yours. You said Bottas was not there to capitalise. I am simply pointing out it’s unlikely Hamilton would have made those lockup’s had Bottas been there. I’n agreeing with your post just adding the point the lockups are perhaps not as relevant as you’re making them out to be.

You’re obsessed with 2016.

**journeyman racer** · 16th June 2019, 13:05

Mine weren't generalisation. They were Hypotheticals.

They were done so to highlight how Bottas has performed, where he's lost out and what subtle factors contribute to him losing ground.

I point out 2016 because I remember it better than other season. This season potentially could lead that way where little moments here or there could have a bigger impact on the championship than what they normally do.

**The Black Knight** · 17th June 2019, 09:21

Well hypothetically Hamilton wouldn’t have made those lockups were Bottas behind him and there’s no guarantee Bottas would have been able to be in such close contention anyway as he generally seems to not have Hamilton’s race pace although his qualifying has improved drastically.

Little moments didn’t decide the 2016 title, reliability did. If you remember 2016 well then you should remember that.

**journeyman racer** · 17th June 2019, 10:08

I remember the failing engine Rosberg had in Monaco. This meant MB enforced team orders which favoured Hamilton. That, and not getting a penalty for the same thing Vettel copped in Montreal, contributed to Hamilton's win that day . Had there been no mechanical problem for him in Monaco, Rosberg would've won easily.

**journeyman racer** · 17th June 2019, 10:32

Objectively, it just shows how insecure Hamilton fans like TBK are.

I brought up an hypothetical that gave the benefit of the doubt that Hamilton would've beat Bottas in qualifying had Bottas not made a mistake!

The probability was likely that Bottas might got pole of outqualified Hamilton.

But no. Hamilton wouldn't have made those errors had Bottas had been behind him, only if he was a long way behind or in front.

edit: Although even if Hamilton didn't make any errors during the race because Bottas was behind him (he made at least 2). What could've happened was that Bottas would've been just that little bit behind that he could've made the correct decision to go left, instead going right and off track limits like Hamilton did.

So my original point is made. He could've won anyway had he not screwed up his qualifying.

**The Black Knight** · 17th June 2019, 11:23

Rosberg was struggling with brake temperatures in Monaco 2016. Hamilton was also struggling with the same issue of brake temperatures, Hamilton simply managed his better and Mercedes ordered Rosberg to let him through so they could win. But then again, you remember this very well and your objective isn’t scewed at all.

Just like I’m sure you remember the 5 races that year where engine issues cost Hamilton points while Rosberg had a pretty much perfect season reliability wise (as near perfect as it gets anyway).

**journeyman racer** · 17th June 2019, 12:29

It had nothing to do with brake/tyre temperatures. You're just hanging onto that. As Ricciardo has proved you can win at Monaco in a failing car. Team orders benefitted Hamilton, otherwise he wouldn't have won.

You're not acknowledging all the factors that went in favour of Hamilton that year (More so than for Rosberg). I've already done so, and will be happy to bump the relevant threads again.

The point is that this thread is about Bottas. He's gone toe to toe with Hamilton this year, but the points gap to Hamilton is disproportionate and doesn't reflect his performance .

I'll repeat. He qualified 2nd in Monaco, which is the minimum you could expect. By not beating Hamilton off the line, this became disproportionally disadvantageous in the subsequent safety car period. He had lost more ground in the title race than he deserved.

Then in Montreal, his own error in qualifying cost him a chance of the win. It was possible to win even had he qualified 3rd, as I've demonstrated.

His best has been better than Hamilton this year. But Hamilton has a comfortable margin atm without doing anything exceptional (2 of his wins have been inherited), and this will be hard for Bottas to overcome on his own performance. It's all due to minor lapses that have been costly, as opposed to any superiority Hamilton has.

Now let's see how your insecurities come up in your next post.

**The Black Knight** · 17th June 2019, 14:55

It was brake issues for Rosberg and Hamilton in Monaco 2016.
Rosberg himself confirmed it as did Mercedes. Both drivers had the same issue.

You’re the one that keeps mentioning 2016 as well as Monaco that year, also claiming your memory is top dog of that season but can’t get basics right. I didn’t bring them up first, you did, so hardly my insecurities. I know reliability decided the 2016 F1 title and have zero doubt about it either.

Agreed re Bottas. Hamilton hasn’t been superior speedwise really. He has simply delivered when it matters most. One might count that as superiority though, depending on how you look at it.

**journeyman racer** · 19th June 2019, 09:55

Of course you think reliability decided the 2016 F1 title. You live vicariously through Hamilton due to your lack of self esteem.

Right, I'm going to have to sort this **** out. Your insecurities has clogged up this thread. I will be starting other threads so you don't ruin this one.

Brake or engine issues, it was a faulty mechanical part on Rosberg's car that meant he was forced to comply with team orders to let Hamilton through (His championship rival). Hamilton received a cheap, hollow win that day, and the final championship points flatters him.

If you want to carry on, you can do so when I start a thread about it.