Lets talk Bottas

[journeyman racer]

You could see that coming a mile off. The only reason why TBK hasn't already shit on Bottas earlier this year is because Bottas had lifted. Which a chump like him begrudgingly acknowledges.

As far as the young guns and other lifting? Well, I'd say that would have to be confirmed. There's a huge difference between doing well in the midfield cars, and doing well in the best car with Hamilton as your tram mate. Unless they pick Ricciardo, it's not necessarily an easy decision for MB. It's not even an easy decision even with Ricciardo available.

[truefan72]

So much for Bottas v2.0. Surely he has to be dropped now. 62 points behind Lewis after 12 races. 2 mistakes on the first lap, nearly taking his teammate out of it in turn 3. Can’t see why Mercedes would keep him except to play second fiddle to Hamilton.

The problem is, all things considered, bottas is still 2nd in the championship. Mercedes is still leading the WCC by a huge margin and his pace, while sporadic, is still good enough for the race win here and there. Also the mercedes isn't as dominant as some would have you believe which is testament to Hamilton's skill more so than Bottas' shortcomings. I think that's where the tough decision lies. What would be the effect of putting Ocon in instead of Bottas? would the standings look any different? Would Ocon have 188 points before the summer break?
I could clearly see the logic with adding leclerc in the case of ferrari. Vettel seemed to be in decline and an extremely fast and talented young driver was the boost the team needed.
But Mercedes is coming off the back of 5 straight WCC and WDC years with their lead driver in the form of his life and a strong chance of winning this year's WDC and in position to challenge for next year's WDC and match Schumi as well. The team will be a contender until 2021. The stability is there, and both sides of the garage are GP winners. I think the fact that wolff managed ocon is more of a factor than an honest need for a driver switch. I am one of the hardest bottas critics out there, but i'm also very aware that he has done a solid job, all things considered, and especially has a teammate to already one of the all time greats currently in the form of his life. without leclerc side swiping him, it would probably have been a 1-3 finish for them today.
I'm not sure what Wolff and mercedes are going to do, but it would make more sense trying to get ocon into the williams seat for 2020 ( i think kubica is out) and then groom both he and russell to take over eventually at mercedes.

[The Black Knight]

How about you just stfu?

A lame arse like you just couldn't wait to lay the boots into him, you *****.

Nearly taking out his team mate? You just exaggerate any danger towards Hamilton because you're a loser that lives vicariously through Hamilton.

Why would MB keep him? Well, if they do replace him, you'll see why they would because aside from Ricciardo, there's no one who could you could say could really do better. That's why.

Another reason is because he outqualifies Hamilton regularly. Again, aside from Ricciardo, there's no one likely to be available to do that.

******* pathetic lame arse fans Hamilton has.

You’re such a sensitive little soul.

The problem is, all things considered, bottas is still 2nd in the championship. Mercedes is still leading the WCC by a huge margin and his pace, while sporadic, is still good enough for the race win here and there. Also the mercedes isn't as dominant as some would have you believe which is testament to Hamilton's skill more so than Bottas' shortcomings. I think that's where the tough decision lies. What would be the effect of putting Ocon in instead of Bottas? would the standings look any different? Would Ocon have 188 points before the summer break?
I could clearly see the logic with adding leclerc in the case of ferrari. Vettel seemed to be in decline and an extremely fast and talented young driver was the boost the team needed.
But Mercedes is coming off the back of 5 straight WCC and WDC years with their lead driver in the form of his life and a strong chance of winning this year's WDC and in position to challenge for next year's WDC and match Schumi as well. The team will be a contender until 2021. The stability is there, and both sides of the garage are GP winners. I think the fact that wolff managed ocon is more of a factor than an honest need for a driver switch. I am one of the hardest bottas critics out there, but i'm also very aware that he has done a solid job, all things considered, and especially has a teammate to already one of the all time greats currently in the form of his life. without leclerc side swiping him, it would probably have been a 1-3 finish for them today.
I'm not sure what Wolff and mercedes are going to do, but it would make more sense trying to get ocon into the williams seat for 2020 ( i think kubica is out) and then groom both he and russell to take over eventually at mercedes.

I totally see the logic in what you’re saying. Ultimately I think they want someone that will run Hamilton closer. I think they believe they have a talent in Ocon that they want to keep. Personally, I think Ocon is a complete and utter idiot and wouldn’t put him in my race car in a million years, especially after Brazil last year. That is likely to be the most deciding factor rather than any great performance by Bottas. Bottas is a known entity now. Generally starts the seasons well and fades as the year goes on. He couldn’t even win a race in 2018. Two race wins in 1.5 seasons in a Mercedes is pretty abysmal at the end of the day.
The telling signs for me were after the race Totto stating that Bottas blew it and he said Bottas had a shite race in Germany as well. Totto never makes statements like that.

[truefan72]

You’re such a sensitive little soul.

I know right?
completely uncalled for.
sad.

[truefan72]

I totally see the logic in what you’re saying. Ultimately I think they want someone that will run Hamilton closer. I think they believe they have a talent in Ocon that they want to keep. Personally, I think Ocon is a complete and utter idiot and wouldn’t put him in my race car in a million years, especially after Brazil last year. That is likely to be the most deciding factor rather than any great performance by Bottas. Bottas is a known entity now. Generally starts the seasons well and fades as the year goes on. He couldn’t even win a race in 2018. Two race wins in 1.5 seasons in a Mercedes is pretty abysmal at the end of the day.
The telling signs for me were after the race Totto stating that Bottas blew it and he said Bottas had a shite race in Germany as well. Totto never makes statements like that.

I also don't rate ocon that highly too. He will be servicable but Nothing i saw at force india leads me to believe that his is anything special
I keep going back to the fact that Ocon is managed by Wolff.
rumor also has it that he will be leaving the team or his post at the end of 2020, os he might want to get "his guy" in there before that happens.
I'm not sure what the rushed decision making process is all about. telling bottas he is out with 9 races to go, demoralizes the team in general and puts bottas in an awkward position.
I also find it really classless for Wolff to be so public with his statements about bottas to the media and anyone who would listen. Why would bottas give 2 cents about any team stipulations from now on.
He will do his own thing and if the team don't like it, then they could release him. TBH i think his time is up at mercedes anyway, but it would seem odd to replace the guy who is in all likelihood gonna finish in the top 3 of the championship and help secure another WCC for mercedes.
Finally, the real jewel here is Russell, but Wolff has already gone out of his way to say that Russell is too young for the mercedes seat. Ridiculous

[Nitrodaze]

I also don't rate ocon that highly too. He will be servicable but Nothing i saw at force india leads me to believe that his is anything special
I keep going back to the fact that Ocon is managed by Wolff.
rumor also has it that he will be leaving the team or his post at the end of 2020, os he might want to get "his guy" in there before that happens.
I'm not sure what the rushed decision making process is all about. telling bottas he is out with 9 races to go, demoralizes the team in general and puts bottas in an awkward position.
I also find it really classless for Wolff to be so public with his statements about bottas to the media and anyone who would listen. Why would bottas give 2 cents about any team stipulations from now on.
He will do his own thing and if the team don't like it, then they could release him. TBH i think his time is up at mercedes anyway, but it would seem odd to replace the guy who is in all likelihood gonna finish in the top 3 of the championship and help secure another WCC for mercedes.
Finally, the real jewel here is Russell, but Wolff has already gone out of his way to say that Russell is too young for the mercedes seat. Ridiculous

I share your view on this matter. I seriously doubt Ocon is the right man for the seat. He is quick, but l doubt much quicker than Bottas on his day. Then, there is the reckless crashing of Ocon with teammates and more memorable with Verstapenn in Brasil last season. I doubt in a head to Head with Russel that he can beat the 2018 F2 world champion. Hence, l admit that it is a bit suspect that the pool from which Mercedes is making its selection for Bottas' seat is so small. They are hiding something, l think, they are probably talking to Verstapenn.

[Big Ben]

...and more memorable with Verstapenn in Brasil last season.

Totally Verstappen's fault but never mind... it fits the narrative more like that.

Both Ocon and Verstappen are worse for Mercedes than Bottas. The Finn is exactly what they need right now. The other two would cause way more problems. But Verstappen is more likely to be seen as a replacement for Hamilton. I wonder how that transition would work.

[Big Ben]

Also the mercedes isn't as dominant as some would have you believe which is testament to Hamilton's skill

I rolled my eyes so hard I pulled a muscle

[truefan72]

I rolled my eyes so hard I pulled a muscle

ok, ok, perhaps dominant is the wrong word.
it is not as easy to drive or handle than some might think.
In perfect conditions it is awfully impressive and dominant, but it's operating window is smaller and the car is temperamental too.
It is very finely balanced. Hamilton talent has pretty much mastered the car (despite being less involved than bottas in the winter in its development) and Bottas, despite his flaws has also come to grips with it.
To me it is also telling that ocon did not participate in any of the in season testing. Russell in Bahrain and Nikita Mazepin in spain. Both doing stellar work with the car.
That's why it is still baffling as to why Ocon, who at this point is pretty much relegated to being their sim driver, is even in the running to make the leap.
go figure

[Nitrodaze]

Mercedes may also be talking to Ricciado for all we know.