[WRC] News & Rumours 2019

[pantealex]

In Finland R4 is same class (SM2) as NR4 (Lancer, Impreza)
but as we all know
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I really hoped for some cars.

Riku Tahko promised MINI R4 for 2nd round, 3rd round is next weekend and still no sign of MINI R4...

[dimviii]

Being uncompetitive is really just down to FIA choosing to cripple it with regulations to stop it challenging R5 though isn't it... so saying R5 is better because RGT isn't competitive is just circular reasoning. R5 is favoured because its faster and its faster because its favoured.

r5 havent got to be favoured to be faster from rgt cars.
to say the truth rgt are enough favoured compared to everything else,and still slower.

[Mirek]

Yes, Adam surely good. But I´m talking on national level, not international or European level. Juniors/beginners always starts in their home country. It´s on national level there should be R1 cars or like in Sweden Group E/F. Everyone starts somewhere. But surely not even in an Adam Cup car. Costs for Adam? Not under 30000 Euros I guess ...

Adam Cup is national car and very popular in many national championships as a perfect starter level. It's not internationally homologated. In fact it even can not be because it doesn't have FIA fuel tank.

[Mirek]

Being uncompetitive is really just down to FIA choosing to cripple it with regulations to stop it challenging R5 though isn't it... so saying R5 is better because RGT isn't competitive is just circular reasoning. R5 is favoured because its faster and its faster because its favoured.

No. Of course you can give it larger restrictor but you can give that to R5 as well. So let's play your game. Let's add more and more air to the engine. Which car will last longer? R4 or R5? R5 of course. So it's not a circular argument. The cars are set to be not only at certain performance level but also on a certain reliability level. The R4 will not be cheap at all if you will rebuild it after every rally because some genius found that with 5 mm larger restrictor it's faster than R5.

Couldn't agree more. Current technology level is not enough for the restrictions over RGT class.

Even unrestricted GT cars are slower than R5 in 90% of occasions. And these unrestricted half-carbon supercup-based cars are not that cheap you know...

[Mirek]

Big flat strong statements invite questions. A) always about money? B) why is the word "sport" in the word? Motorsport




I think American conservatives who think that all discussion is 7th Grade Debate club would say that is a False Red Straw Herring...Nobody has suggested that there needs to be a situation where money plays no role.

Some people might be suggesting that its the role of the various ASNs ---who represent to overwhelming majority of people doing rally as a sport to try and find ways to moderate the role of sheer unlimited expenditure of money as being THE decisive factor is deciding results...so as to retain some element of sport.

Well, I am from a country which once used to be called Czechoslovak Socialistic Republic. We used to have this rallysport for everybody here for decades. It worked to some extend. It was really very very cheap. The only issue was that this didn't apply for the top level. Everytime someone appeared who was able to bring himself a used powerful western car and won or a Škoda works team thought that it would be fun to win also at home. So we were still in the same situation like today with one difference. Guess in which period more local drivers made it on the international scene? Yes, today. Not in those days when the sport was cheap but the advance lead to nowhere.

Of course it was always about money. And it was the most about money at the very beginning of our sport when only the most rich people in the world had some cars. That's why it's called rallye after all.

[GravelBen]

No. Of course you can give it larger restrictor but you can give that to R5 as well. So let's play your game. Let's add more and more air to the engine. Which car will last longer? R4 or R5? R5 of course. So it's not a circular argument. The cars are set to be not only at certain performance level but also on a certain reliability level. The R4 will not be cheap at all if you will rebuild it after every rally because some genius found that with 5 mm larger restrictor it's faster than R5.

I wasn't talking about R4 (we have AP4 and it is working well, still not cheap but cheaper than R5 and with more car variety), I was talking about RGT.

R5 cars are running what, >100hp more than the production cars they are based on? Along with totally different drivetrain etc. While some RGT cars are forced to run >100hp less than the production cars despite being heavier than R5 and only 2wd.

If R5 cars are really so much better then you shouldn't need to castrate a 911 GT3 to beat it.

[Mirek]

I wasn't talking about R4 (we have AP4 and it is working well, still not cheap but cheaper than R5 and with more car variety), I was talking about RGT.

R5 cars are running what, >100hp more than the production cars they are based on? Along with totally different drivetrain etc. While some RGT cars are forced to run >100hp less than the production cars despite being heavier than R5 and only 2wd.

If R5 cars are really so much better then you shouldn't need to castrate a 911 GT3 to beat it.

We had here maybe the best ever rally-taylored Porsche of all times with a multiple champion behind the steering wheel. The car had no restrictor. Had 150 Hp more than R5, used carbon parts from the circuit cars, had longer suspension travel and had the shortest ever Porsche sequential gearbox (top speed 210 km/h). It wasn't faster than the R5 cars with comparable drivers and it wasn't cheap for sure (also wasn't reliable). The only occasion when these extreme Porsches were faster than R5 were certain Spanish asphalt events when dry. Otherwise you can find more or less non restricted Porsches in many championships and nowhere they fight with top R5 cars (France, Belgium for example).

Though I admit that it ws great fun to watch it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0wck5qccy8c

[stefanvv]

Even unrestricted GT cars are slower than R5 in 90% of occasions. And these unrestricted half-carbon supercup-based cars are not that cheap you know...

You killed everything childish in me. Let me enjoy it a little bit.

EDIT: AUDI already showed us 35+ years ago 4WD cars are just faster than 2WD cars, I'm aware of that. We don't need to prove it anymore, don't You agree

[denkimi]

We have had abbring here in a 650 bhp porsche gt3, and he was quite a bit slower than the fastest r5 cars.
He was still faster than half of the r5 cars tho.

https://www.ewrc-results.com/results...2018/?s=174004

[racerx1979]

650 HP GT3?? GT3's do not make that kind of power. Unless it was turbocharged GT2?