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Thread: Paying Drivers

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    Senior Member RAS007's Avatar
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    Paying Drivers

    Genuine question: when did the scourge of paying drivers really begin in earnest and who/what is responsible? I can't really remember many during the 1990s, or early 2000s, when there were *paid* drivers at various times at Lancia, Toyota, Ford, Subaru, Mitsubishi, Peugeot, Citroen, Seat and Hyundai. Is it as simple as a lack of factory seats?

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    2003 Hirvonen is the first in works seat nominated for ponts as far as I remember. there were some guys in Prodrive All Stars team but that was not works seat, just rented cars

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    So Hirvonen is the first paying driver in WRC ever? He must also be the best ever, because he almost won the championship

    Wasn't Luis Climent a paying driver before Hirvonen? Spanish sponsors (Airtel) appeared on Octavias WRC after he joined Skoda Motorsport in 2000 and disappeared when he left.
    https://www.skoda-motorsport.com/en/...f-octavia-wrc/

    I think that paying drivers is an idea that came from Forumula 1.

    Last edited by Jarek Z; 1st March 2019 at 00:48.
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    Senior Member RAS007's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarek Z View Post
    So Hirvonen is the first paying driver in WRC ever? He must also be the best ever, because he almost won the championship

    Wasn't Luis Climent a paying driver before Hirvonen? Spanish sponsors (Airtel) appeared on Octavias WRC after he joined Skoda Motorsport in 2000 and disappeared when he left.
    https://www.skoda-motorsport.com/en/...f-octavia-wrc/

    I think that paying drivers is an idea that came from Forumula 1.

    I was going to mention Climent, as I'm pretty sure he bought that seat, but, I think there's a difference between paying for a drive, like we see nowadays, and bringing sponsorship to a team, like Loix with Marlboro, for example.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Barreis View Post
    2003 Hirvonen is the first in works seat nominated for ponts as far as I remember.
    A statement that does not represent the truth. The whole concept of "paying driver" is way too sketchy to be used as an attribute. And Hirvonen most definitely wasn't "the first" in any paying category. Climent probably was the first in factory teams in 00's, but we've had plenty of them before as well. The nature of the paying business was maybe different in the past, but at the end of the day it's about the same thing. If Hirvonen was a paying driver, how come Alex Fiorio wasn't?
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    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JBEVSBOraCQ

    This Finnish report of Tour de Corse 1993 states at 7:40 that Andrea Aghini must pay Lancia for every rally, but the Italian ASN is supporting him. So this would imply it's not a totally brand new concept...

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    Scanning the list of 1973 entrants, I'm going with Shekhar Mehta but I could be wrong there.

    I was watching some footage from 1997 yesterday, and as far as I can work out there were only between 6-8 works seats that year, which is a similar number to this year.

    I suspect the real answer to your somewhat loaded ("scourge", really?) question is that it has to with fewer and fewer external sponsorship deals (no tobacco, not worth it for alcohol, lesser ROI for other brands due to reduced mainstream exposure) and teams looking to save money to invest it elsewhere if one driver can bring sponsorship and another can't.

    If you were starting a WRC team for a manufacturer this year, and you couldn't take any of the guys currently under contract (being paid) for a seat, which three would you choose? And after you've chosen those, could your mind be swayed on any of them, if your 4th or 5th choices could offer you a financial incentive?
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    Quote Originally Posted by dodge33cymru View Post

    I suspect the real answer to your somewhat loaded ("scourge", really?) question is that it has to with fewer and fewer external sponsorship deals (no tobacco, not worth it for alcohol, lesser ROI for other brands due to reduced mainstream exposure) and teams looking to save money to invest it elsewhere if one driver can bring sponsorship and another can't.
    This. Also, car manufacturers aren't as wealthy as they were 20-30 years ago and similarly motorsport isn't as important marketing channel today as it used to be.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dodge33cymru View Post
    If you were starting a WRC team for a manufacturer this year, and you couldn't take any of the guys currently under contract (being paid) for a seat, which three would you choose? And after you've chosen those, could your mind be swayed on any of them, if your 4th or 5th choices could offer you a financial incentive?
    Oh what a lovely problem to have.

    Well, I'm definitely having Breen and Paddon. Then I would see whether Mikkelsen "becomes available" under the right circumstances. If he doesn't, it's between Tidemund and Ostberg. If Ostberg helped financially, that might sway me.

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    Senior Member RAS007's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dodge33cymru View Post
    Scanning the list of 1973 entrants, I'm going with Shekhar Mehta but I could be wrong there.

    I was watching some footage from 1997 yesterday, and as far as I can work out there were only between 6-8 works seats that year, which is a similar number to this year.

    I suspect the real answer to your somewhat loaded ("scourge", really?) question is that it has to with fewer and fewer external sponsorship deals (no tobacco, not worth it for alcohol, lesser ROI for other brands due to reduced mainstream exposure) and teams looking to save money to invest it elsewhere if one driver can bring sponsorship and another can't.

    If you were starting a WRC team for a manufacturer this year, and you couldn't take any of the guys currently under contract (being paid) for a seat, which three would you choose? And after you've chosen those, could your mind be swayed on any of them, if your 4th or 5th choices could offer you a financial incentive?
    Perhaps "scourge" was too strong a word, although it's important to differentiate between a "tourist", say like Bertelli, and a "paying driver", like Ostberg. I don't think I need to point out the difference. I don't object to the likes of Bertelli, it's his money and he can spend it however he wishes. What annoys me is when someone like Breen is left on the sidelines due to lack of cash, or someone like Ostberg has to pay a professional outfit to get a drive; the operative word is "professional", meaning you get paid to do it, not the other way round.

    I think the answer to my question lies in your third paragraph; everything you've said there is true, sadly. To paraphrase: no sponsorship deals due to lack of exposure. I think that is the real problem. For example: why have M-Sport, with all the success they've had, still been unable to find a title sponsor?

    Regarding your hypothetical question about which currently not-under-contract-drivers I'd choose if I was starting a team today, it'd be Paddon, Breen, Suninen and Ostberg. In the admittedly unlikely event that one of them could also bring in a huge sponsor, say like Loix with Marlboro, then that may be part of the equation, but they'd have to be competitive also.

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