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  1. #481
    Senior Member Andre Oliveira's Avatar
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  2. Likes: Rally Power (26th September 2018)
  3. #482
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    Fiesta bad (we dont need R1,R2,R4 and R5 from same car)

    Dacia yes please !
    "quattro best 4wd rallycar ever"

  4. #483
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    Have anyone seen a price for a turnkey R4 from any of the tuning firms?
    www.parcferme.no

  5. #484
    Senior Member racerx1979's Avatar
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    All I keep hearing is how R4 is already dead??

  6. #485
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    In Finnish championship R4 was not allowed 2018, main reason is/was that no one did know speed of R4, does it belong to same class with "R5" or with "N4". Own class is not option because minimum 10 entries is basic rule for class and 2 different 4wd classes is enough.
    "quattro best 4wd rallycar ever"

  7. Likes: AnttiL (26th September 2018)
  8. #486
    Junior Member m-ast's Avatar
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    For me it's a little bit strange that a spanish company invest in R4 when in our national chamiponships we have N5 that are more or less the same and actually are quite common, probably more than 30 units have been built

  9. #487
    Senior Member Andre Oliveira's Avatar
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    R4 are FIA, so can be easly sold to everywhere.

  10. Likes: pantealex (26th September 2018)
  11. #488
    Senior Member Rally Power's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by racerx1979 View Post
    All I keep hearing is how R4 is already dead??
    R4 is not dead, but its biggest problem seems to be R5 success. Like some have pointed here, a new R4 is supposed to cost more than a used R5 and most amateur drivers will think twice before paying more for less; besides, for many of those drivers runing costs (one of R4 advantages) aren’t a big issue, as they usually do a limited number of low mileage national events and in most cases they also have the option to rent a R5 car at competitive prices, which probably is the most rational way to do a handful of events per year.

    Quote Originally Posted by m-ast View Post
    For me it's a little bit strange that a spanish company invest in R4 when in our national chamiponships we have N5 that are more or less the same and actually are quite common, probably more than 30 units have been built
    N5 is the spanish version of Argentinian Maxi Rally. They use Subaru stock transmission and a ligth tuned PSA engine, but they still cost a lot more than a similar proto from Dytko using Mitsubishi mechanics and they don’t have FIA approval, like R4 has. Somehow N5 failed to attract manus attention (with Suzuki exception) and they’ve only become interesting to privateers as there’s a strong pressure from the main tuner (RMC) to sell them and a limited number of local rally companies renting R5’s.

    Quote Originally Posted by Andre Oliveira View Post
    R4 are FIA, so can be easly sold to everywhere.
    Probably the best solution is to get a FIA rule for Europe inspired on AP4 regulation, allowing all sort of 4wd protos (MR, N5, AP4, R4, Dytko, etc) to run on a separate class from R5. It’d be easier than having different cars from country to country and would allow drivers to also run and sell their cars abroad. Clearly a win win situation.
    Last edited by Rally Power; 26th September 2018 at 17:28.
    Rally addict since 1982

  12. Likes: mArvAlcao17 (27th September 2018)
  13. #489
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rally Power View Post
    R4 is not dead, but its biggest problem seems to be R5 success. Like some have pointed here, a new R4 is supposed to cost more than a used R5 and most amateur drivers will think twice before paying more for less; besides, for many of those drivers runing costs (one of R4 advantages) arent a big issue, as they usually do a limited number of low mileage national events and in most cases they also have the option to rent a R5 car at competitive prices, which probably is the most rational way to do a handful of events per year.

    Probably the best solution is to get a FIA rule for Europe inspired on AP4 regulation, allowing all sort of 4wd protos (MR, N5, AP4, R4, Dytko, etc).
    Rental for gentleman drivers I guess will be even cheaper for R4.

    R3 could become this protoclass. If safety is ok, and you have a hp/kg rule, the rest is free.
    Or you go the opposite direction. FIA approve a regulation and all tuners can build their proto cars accordingly. Tested by local ASN.
    www.parcferme.no

  14. #490
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    But gentlemen drivers tend to have finances and are less result-orientated, they prefer the best, which in some cases is not less than a WRC car...even if they have no competition or can't provide any.

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