M-Sport Ford World Rally Teams

[ouvreur]

yeah. but the meaning is the same. if they cut employees for marketing, it sucks, even if "the marketing" is rally racing. i'm just saying to be aware of it, and not pretend rallying to be a purely romantic sport.
anyway, we can do nothing about it, so at least, we enjoy the race.

Ah, but my point was the opposite. They aren't cutting staff numbers to raise money for marketing. There isn't really any correlation at all, at least not financially. Maybe morally.

Like VW in 2016, as they were laying staff off in the wake of the emissions cheating scandal (more than 20,000 if I remember right), they were still spending money on marketing - probably more than ever as they tried to repair their image. They just couldn't be seen to be having fun using fossil fuel-consuming cars 'rallying the world' with that money.

[wyler]

Ah, but my point was the opposite. They aren't cutting staff numbers to raise money for marketing. There isn't really any correlation at all, at least not financially. Maybe morally.

Like VW in 2016, as they were laying staff off in the wake of the emissions cheating scandal (more than 20,000 if I remember right), they were still spending money on marketing - probably more than ever as they tried to repair their image. They just couldn't be seen to be having fun using fossil fuel-consuming cars 'rallying the world' with that money.

here's exactly where is naive.
in a business company, everything is correlated. They just sit in a board and decide if investing in marketing is worth or not for the business even at the cost of losing some employees.
vw did just as well, they lose lots of money after the scandal, but for them pr to clean up was definitely valuable, so they kept pr and cut workers to counter the loss.
btw: we started this thread on a tweet stating just this: more ford investment in rally is coming at the cost of some cut in other areas. (although not proved).

[EstWRC]

I don’t really understand this guy anymore.

[wyler]

I don’t really understand this guy anymore.

at least now is very clear what was the past role of ford in m-sport, and what is now.

[cali]

He's having a problem with Tänak's salary. Understood, but until someone is willing to pay then it's game on.

Seems like Tänak/Märtin is a hard combination to bargain with.

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[the sniper]

didnt undertand guys.Cansomebody clarify?

I imagine he's confirming that Red Bull really weren't putting in much money to the team.


Regarding the morality of the Ford funding increase. As I think I've said before, without the likes of a Tanak, much of the money Ford were giving M-Sport (we've lately been led to believe even prior to this it wasn't as small an amount as we imagined or was previously the case) was essentially being wasted if they weren't going to invest in the most important part of the package, having a Driver who can actually win. I don't think Tanak is getting anywhere near £20m, but it'd be interesting to know what ratio of the Ford to M-Sport budget he is getting personally. It seems that Ford woke up to the idea that they either had to pay for a Tanak or largely forget/cut the WRC program budget. Thankfully for us and the WRC, they chose the former option.

I highly doubt it'll make any difference whatsoever to the scope of restructuring/redundancies being carried out more widely across Ford, it's a drop in the ocean by comparison. A few less Ford adverts shown during NFL games a season on US TV or a small redistribution of funds from the NASCAR program would probably pay for it.

Hopefully it works out better and lasts longer than the 2019 Citroën throw of the dice with Ogier...

[AndyRAC]

I imagine he's confirming that Red Bull really weren't putting in much money to the team.

Yes; I think it was more a case of Red Bull athletes driving the M-Sport cars, with minimal funding. I suspect it covered the Breen car, as he isn't part of RB; Loeb, Fourmaux are both RB athletes; I'd love to know what Fourmaux did to get RB backing - he's got to be the most anonymous/ unsuccessful RB athlete out there....

I guess they still put more into Nascar and Aussie Supercars than WRC.

[Kenneth]

Speaking about Red Bull, Erik Cais became Red Bull athlete

[er88]

2-5m a year for Tanak is peanuts for Ford regardless of what job losses have occurred in other areas of their company. They invested more than Msport fans like to believe in this car, it was a fully fledged partnership. 5m a year is worth it for a driver who will win rallies and a possible championship. Last year was a disaster after Monte, where that rally generated unreal publicity for them.

Tanak would've stayed at home if the money wasn't right, on top of the commitment of future development. Many on here said last season, why have Ford poured money into the Puma only for Msport to act like a tinpot team with mostly pay drivers?! They needed a top tier driver, now they've put up the money to get one.

Motorsport is motorsport/marketing. Hyundai used to chuck 15m a year at Chelsea football club just to have a tiny miniscule logo on one of their shirts sleeves.

I feel sorry for anyone losing their jobs, including those at Ford. But the reality is companies restructure. And motorsport and marketing is treated as an entirely different entity anyway. Marketing might even ramp up when a company wants a much needed boost

[WRCStan]

here's exactly where is naive.
in a business company, everything is correlated. They just sit in a board and decide if investing in marketing is worth or not for the business even at the cost of losing some employees.
vw did just as well, they lose lots of money after the scandal, but for them pr to clean up was definitely valuable, so they kept pr and cut workers to counter the loss.
btw: we started this thread on a tweet stating just this: more ford investment in rally is coming at the cost of some cut in other areas. (although not proved).

Ah, but my point was the opposite. They aren't cutting staff numbers to raise money for marketing. There isn't really any correlation at all, at least not financially. Maybe morally.

Like VW in 2016, as they were laying staff off in the wake of the emissions cheating scandal (more than 20,000 if I remember right), they were still spending money on marketing - probably more than ever as they tried to repair their image. They just couldn't be seen to be having fun using fossil fuel-consuming cars 'rallying the world' with that money.

I think the entire VW scandal was more geopolitical than anything else. That fine didn't really exist and the idea that companies employ excess staff to be nice but can fire at any moment 'to pay for something else' is ridiculous. My belief is these staff weren't needed anymore and VW were done with WRC and the reasoning was whatever could be used at the time.

Back on topic, and I don't know Gerard closely enough to know his thesis, but seems he is at odds with the WRC having manufacturer benefactors and an energy drink benefitting. Agree, we often cover this here, but this is where we are.