Dismantling an empire

[Eki]

Large nations with influence, whether it be the USSR/Russia, or the USA, or China will maintain a large military because in the end, that is how they stay a large nation with influence.

And why in your opinion they should have influence over their own borders?

[Mark in Oshawa]

And why in your opinion they should have influence over their own borders?

If it makes the world safer, yes it isn't a bad idea. One thing is for sure, if the USA wasn't projecting themselves, only a fool would believe the USSR and China wouldn't have in the years of the Cold War. Even today, the US could probably do without a lot of the places they are in, but it isn't going to make the world better if they ignore things happening elsewhere. Isolationism until 1941 worked for the US, but look how well the world went to hell in a handbasket after 1919, when the US helped form the League of Nations and then walked away from it.....

Face it Eki, there are and always have been superpowers. Spain was one, the Dutch in an alliance with Spain and Venice were part of one, then the English at the time of the Armada, and then after 2 epic wars where European powers tore the guts out of each other, we have now the USA, the USSR and now Russia, and China in the Far East. Naive people think they will just mind their knitting. They influence other nations just by existing. Military power is just part of the responsbility.....to their interests and that is just the reality.

[anthonyvop]

And why in your opinion they should have influence over their own borders?

Because we can.

Just like every other country tries to influence outside their borders....even Finland.


F.Y.I. Every U.S. Embassy is considered a military installation. Embassy security is handled by the U.S. Marines and each one has a small contingent of Jar Heads.

[Easy Drifter]

Which would explain the 130 countries.

[Mark in Oshawa]

Because we can.

Just like every other country tries to influence outside their borders....even Finland.


F.Y.I. Every U.S. Embassy is considered a military installation. Embassy security is handled by the U.S. Marines and each one has a small contingent of Jar Heads.

Jarheads....don't let your son grow up to be a Marine I guess your motto? Uncle Sam's Misguided Children...lol....

[Jag_Warrior]

Country by GDP Rank ($ Amt.) / Military Spending $ Amt / % of Global Milit. Spending

#1 United States ($14.430 Trillion) / $607 Billion / 41.5%
#2 Japan ($5.108 Trillion) / 46.3 Billion / 3.2%
#3 People's Republic of China ($4.814 Trillion) / $84.9 Billion / 5.8%
#4 Germany ($3.273 Trillion) / $46.8 Billion / 3.2%
#5 France ($2.666 Trillion) / $65.7 Billion / 4.5%
#6 United Kingdom ($2.198 Trillion) / $65.3 Billion / 4.5%
#7 Italy ($2.090 Trillion) / $40.6 Billion / 2.8%
#8 Brazil ($1.499 Trillion) / $23.3 Billion / 1.6%
#9 Spain ($1.466 Trillion) / $19.2 Billion / 1.3%
#10 Canada ($1.335 Trillion) / $19.3 Billion / 1.3%
#11 Russia ($1.232 Trillion) / $58.6 Billion / 4.0%

*Data from 2009 CIA World Factbook.


At an expenditure of $607 Billion in 2008, the United States spent more on the military than the next 14 countries COMBINED.

For those who have read more about ancient Rome than what was taught in elementary or high school, you know that the Roman Empire did not fall (solely) because of some hairy character named Atilla. He just laid some of the final blows to a sick and bloated empire... that was already in deep decline. Rome had neither the ability to govern its (non-income) producing territories, nor the support of its (once proud) citizens. It had spread itself too thin and didn't possess an effective means of governing, balancing its budget or providing for its people (near the end, Roman infrastructure projects became almost nonexistent). Sound familiar? And just like now, there were those who believed that it was the duty of Rome to maintain the illusion of empire and power... even though trying to maintain that illusion is what helped to kill the (Western) Roman Empire.

Whether it's military expenditures or entitlements, or more likely, a combination of the two, this path that we're currently on will not lead to a good place - of that much I feel certain. And on that point, I agree with the Tea Party people. If they could just rid themselves of the ignorant rabble, loons that seem attracted to conspiracy theories and GOP'er plants, more (sane & sensible) people would probably get involved in that movement.

[Tazio]

This is a rather old article I'm only posted it because it is a little different slant on what I've read so far.
The U.S. Military Idustrial Complex in many areas is directly linked to the livelihood of the local businesses. I think "Ike" suggested we be prudent, and cautious, as well as benevolent in this arena when he was leaving office in 1961.
BTW this is not a knock on Bush. Just an example of what could happen in every country that our empire maintains a substancial military pressence long enough to create an economically dependant community around it.

http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/0,,1299315,00.html

Despite substantial anger among the German populace at US actions in Iraq (photo), and protests at some bases, many Germans see the economic considerations outweighing moral ones when it comes to a continuing presence of American troops in the neighborhood. Officials have begun doing what they can to convince the Americans to stay

[Tazio]

Country by GDP Rank ($ Amt.) / Military Spending $ Amt / % of Global Milit. Spending

#1 United States ($14.430 Trillion) / $607 Billion / 41.5%
#2 Japan ($5.108 Trillion) / 46.3 Billion / 3.2%
#3 People's Republic of China ($4.814 Trillion) / $84.9 Billion / 5.8%
#4 Germany ($3.273 Trillion) / $46.8 Billion / 3.2%
#5 France ($2.666 Trillion) / $65.7 Billion / 4.5%
#6 United Kingdom ($2.198 Trillion) / $65.3 Billion / 4.5%
#7 Italy ($2.090 Trillion) / $40.6 Billion / 2.8%
#8 Brazil ($1.499 Trillion) / $23.3 Billion / 1.6%
#9 Spain ($1.466 Trillion) / $19.2 Billion / 1.3%
#10 Canada ($1.335 Trillion) / $19.3 Billion / 1.3%
#11 Russia ($1.232 Trillion) / $58.6 Billion / 4.0%

*Data from 2009 CIA World Factbook.


At an expenditure of $607 Billion in 2008, the United States spent more on the military than the next 14 countries COMBINED.
For those who have read more about ancient Rome than what was taught in elementary or high school, you know that the Roman Empire did not fall (solely) because of some hairy character named Atilla. He just laid some of the final blows to a sick and bloated empire... that was already in deep decline. Rome had neither the ability to govern its (non-income) producing territories, nor the support of its (once proud) citizens. It had spread itself too thin and didn't possess an effective means of governing, balancing its budget or providing for its people (near the end, Roman infrastructure projects became almost nonexistent). Sound familiar? And just like now, there were those who believed that it was the duty of Rome to maintain the illusion of empire and power... even though trying to maintain that illusion is what helped to kill the (Western) Roman Empire.

Whether it's military expenditures or entitlements, or more likely, a combination of the two, this path that we're currently on will not lead to a good place - of that much I feel certain. And on that point, I agree with the Tea Party people. If they could just rid themselves of the ignorant rabble, loons that seem attracted to conspiracy theories and GOP'er plants, more (sane & sensible) people would probably get involved in that movement.

[youtube]J0Dj3d_bdNM[/youtube]

[Jag_Warrior]

[youtube]J0Dj3d_bdNM[/youtube]

I like that.

Glad to see you back.

[dunes]

On top of landing,refueling,and embassys we also hold a base in every country we've been into a war with. This is for far more sophisticated reasons.
There are "too many naval vessels"- because the Navy has a complete machine shop set up in half of its fleet. We can remanufacture everything we have in our arsenal while at sea. There not just for transporting troops and veichels.Theres also the red cross and hospital ships all beloning to the US Navy that have aided in many tragic event that had nothing to do with us. and most people don't even know we were there.Not to mention the clean ups and assistance we provide for other universal tragedies.

Before someone says WE spend too much or have too much maybe they might look back through history and see just what we've done for everyone elses safety. Furthermopre there is alot of open water and many possible places if an attack started at three different locations on the globe we could be at all of them in an instant because most likely were allready there or close by.

Sorry but after all we've provided for all the other nations and people I would think people would be grearful that we are that accesable and ready for them.