Customer Cars

[ArrowsFA1]

Looks like there could be a storm brewing over Super Aguri & Toro Rosso's plans to run (their own versions of?) 2006 Honda & Red Bull cars in 2007

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/55924

IMHO they should be allowed to run 'customer cars' if they want to, but apparently this should not happen until 2008.

[Mark]

How can you stop them tho? If they own the rights to the design?

[ArrowsFA1]

I think that's the problem though. Is it their design or not? They argue 'yes' but others say 'no' and proving the case one way or another could be...errrr...difficult.

[Sleeper]

I Super Aguri's case they will probably do what Torro Rosso did this year. Buy the interlectual property rightes from Honda, make a few small changes and then build the cars themselves, it would conform to the letter of the rules I believe.

As for Torro Rosso, I think they're currently trying to work out a way to run the same Newey chassis that RBR will run next year. Cant see that happening myself.

[trumperZ06]

Aren't we really looking at Factory " A " and " B " teams ?

The Factory teams will share information & technology with one another anyway...

so shouldn't F-1 accept the facts and get on with the show ?

mokin:

[baker]

As far as I can tell Super Aguri are within the current rules because their 2007 car is based on intellectual property rights which are NOT held by another F1 constructor. The 2007 Honda will have a different chassis altogether.

However Toro Rosso and Red Bull, according to the link, intend to effectively share the same chassis for 2007 which, again as far I can tell, is not allowed. Presumably because this would mean sharing the same intellectual property rights.

Perhaps some of the other constructors have been miffed by Super Aguri's sudden turn of speed in the recent winter tests.

[Hawkmoon]

Aren't we really looking at Factory " A " and " B " teams ?

The Factory teams will share information & technology with one another anyway...

so shouldn't F-1 accept the facts and get on with the show ?

mokin:

Whilst I agree with you, it makes me smile at all the outrage that surrounded Sauber's relationship with Ferrari a few years ago.

Now it's perfectly OK for 'A' and 'B' teams that are using exactly the same cars, not just similar ones.

If it wasn't OK for Sauber to apparently copy the F2003-GA and run as Ferrari's defacto 'B' team in 2004, then it's not OK for Super Aguri and Torro Rosso to use a any other car than one they have designed themselves. The rules haven't changed since '04 and by the letter of the law, the two 'B' teams should have to wait until 2008 before getting the 'A' team's hand-me-downs.

I can perfectly understand why Spyker are resisting Super Aguri's attempts to get a Honda chassis. Afterall, no one is going to give Spyker a race winning car to play with.

[Valve Bounce]

I Super Aguri's case they will probably do what Torro Rosso did this year. Buy the interlectual property rightes from Honda, make a few small changes and then build the cars themselves, it would conform to the letter of the rules I believe.

As for Torro Rosso, I think they're currently trying to work out a way to run the same Newey chassis that RBR will run next year. Cant see that happening myself.

The point here is whether Super Aguri are buying the intellectual rights from Toshigi and not from Honda. I think that Eiji Matsumata informed us that Toshigi were running a parallel development for Honda last year. So the question here is whether Toshigi is a part of Honda or is it a separately registered company doing R&D for Honda. We need a smart lawyer for Super Aguri here; someone like Danny Crane.

[ArrowsFA1]

Whilst I agree with you, it makes me smile at all the outrage that surrounded Sauber's relationship with Ferrari a few years ago.

Fair point, although the idea of 'B' teams was not on the agenda at that time. It is now, and as Toro Rosso appeared to have been allowed to run a "Jaguar" in 2006 the door has opened for others who want to do something similar.

[harsha]

Spykar has every right to feel agreived...