Instead of just saying "he didn't have any serious competition", look at my post (#116) and write why you think he had no competition between 2008 and 2012. Oh and for sure in 2008, 2011 and 2012 Citroen cars were definitely not far above Fords.
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i remember duval saying the same thing.
https://www.rtbf.be/sport/moteurs/de...ade?id=5601953
hard to tell what's true and what's not, but usually if there are a few smoke plumes there's a fire somewhere.Quote:
"En Allemagne je suis en tête. On rentre à l'assistance, je repars et ma voiture ne va plus. Ils avaient mis volontairement ma voiture un peu malade pour que Sébastien gagne. Mais autant dire : laisse le passer, car Sébastien était devant moi au Championnat"
its not hard to tell if its true,if you examine properly every stage,and Duval vs every driver.
time stages dont show a slow car after any service.Except that Duval was only at ss3 in front of Loeb for 3,2 sec.
Impossible to have less power car and at second pass of stages to go faster by 10 seconds,and Gronholm to be 10 sec slower from Duval,while he was also 10 sec faster from his first pass.
Loeb just was faster for 15 sec from first pass,while everybody was from 9-10 sec faster.
Stage is ss3 and ss6.After ss 3 must be a service if i understand well watching the itenary.
https://www.ewrc-results.com/results...nd-2005/?s=560
no its not like this.
at day 1 he is 1,3sec faster from Loeb
at day 2 at ss 7 was out of road 2 times losing 16,5 sec to Loeb
at ss 8 loosing 10,3 to stage winner Loeb at 19 km stage
at ss 9 loosing 6,2 to Loeb at 16,51 km stage
at ss 10 losing 10,1 sec his comment was ''it wasnt bad'' at 30,55 km stage
at ss 11 faster from Loeb for 0,3 at 16,37 km stage
at ss 12 losing 2,7 to Loeb at 19km stage
at ss 13 loosing 5,9 to Loeb at 16,5 km stage
at ss 14 losing 0,3 to Loeb ay 30 km stage
at last stage his comments were "I've been pushing a lot tonight, I'm happy, it's amazing after 8 months."
i dont see any lost of power at his car.
at long 30km stage he was equal
at one stage was faster
at all the rest he was loosing from less than 0,1 sec per km and at some stages he was loosing more like 0,55 sec /km
he was loosing more at first pass of stages.He was loosing a lot less time at second pass.
he wasnt constant,that was his problem,except the 2 offs at one stage where he lost 16 sec.
i think the fact that people who do not credit Loeb for his achievements resort to conspiracy theories and bullshit talk about internal sabotage instead of facts shows how great Loeb was...
the fact that a has been brings so much pain and agony to little pig kids shows his greatness... nobody bothers with the titles of the others because compared to Loeb they are garbage dogs.
My short answer to the original question "How good was Sebastien Loeb?" would be "very" (and I would also correct the original question by saying that he still is good rather than was good!).
I personally think that direct comparisons are very difficult, if not impossible. Drivers who were very successful in one era would not have fared as well in others as the design of the cars - and the optimum driving style for getting the best out of them - evolved: you don't have to look too hard to find plenty of examples of drivers that fall into that category.
I do think that Loeb would be held in higher esteem if there had been more competition (i.e. more manufacturers) in his prime seasons, but for me he was an incredible driver, in the right team in the perfect era for his driving style. Of course a change in team would have allowed him to demonstrate versatility (which I think is the mark of a true great), but the options weren't really there at the time. I also agree with previous comments that it's a real shame we never got see a full season of Loeb/Citroen versus Ogier/VW.
Perhaps slightly off topic, but I feel that the achievements of Ogier with VW are viewed in a similar fashion to Loeb as he (Ogier) looked to be in a different league at times. Not to undermine his previous results, but I think Ogier taking the Championship last year was his finest career moment to date: proof that he could take a Championship when he wasn't in a car that was clearly better!