New FIA President

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19th December 2021, 16:12
M5

New FIA President

The FIA members have elected a new president, Mr Mohammed Ben Sulayem.
The first non European president in FIAs 117 year history, so that was about time.
But in these days where many speaks of "sportswashing" in regard to what is happening in football, and the world championship in Qatar.
It is about how corruption bought votes to get the votes, and also how they treat people building the stadiums and other infrastructure needed.

I struggle to understand that our sport can let a person from a non-democratic state, even being allowed to run.

This is what wiki say about UAE:
The UAE is an authoritarian state. The UAE has been described as a "tribal autocracy" where the seven constituent monarchies are led by tribal rulers in an autocratic fashion. There are no democratically elected institutions, and there is no formal commitment to free speech.

UAE is not very far ahead on human rights, equality btw the sexes, gay rights, freedom of expression, freedom of religion, and the list goes on and on.

I do not like that they use international sport to whitewash the way they organize their countries, and treat people.
Ben Suayem is probably a nice guy, but that in not the issue. Non democtratic nations should not be eligble to seek international office, and if they slip through, they should not be elected. In most cases for getting championships, they buy enough votes - I hope it is not the case here.

How do you feel about sportswashing from authoritarian states?
19th December 2021, 19:24
F1nKS

From what I can see - most of the European nations are more authoritarian than democratic and freedom-loving.
19th December 2021, 20:20
Zico

That may be true F1nks but other than your weapons ownership rights, as far as I can see you are not really that far behind us. :/

With regards to Mr Mobinsul being from the UAE and allegedly buying his FIA presidency, that is possibly a fair suspicion to have, but are we naive enough to think that does not and has not happened with candidates from other non authoritarian states? We are just as corrupt as any, if not more so.
He may have had the financial clout to buy these votes, but if true, the rest of us must also have accepted these alleged bribes.. so there is no moral high ground to be held.

On a side note: As far as Authoritarian states go, we are are only judging them through Western eyes. Sure Saddam and Gaddafi were bad dudes who gave any tribal groups some serious ass whooping if/when they stepped out of line.. but it worked, it is all these tribal groups understand and respect.
History has shown us the power vaccum shit show we are left with when we remove these tyrants and install 'freedom and democracy'. Look at Libya and Iraq even now, they will only stabilise once the next strong badass authoritarian leader gets into power.

I say give him a chance, not that we have much of a choice on that one, but if he becomes too heavy handed and proves to be too much of a hardliner, he can get voted back out again. Maybe .. lol
20th December 2021, 03:25
F1nKS

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zico

That may be true F1nks but other than your weapons ownership rights, as far as I can see you are not really that far behind us. :/

That is true. The trend line during covid for some parts of the USA is adopting European authoritarianism with no reservations.

We do have a little more "freedom of religion" and "free speech" - but there are elements working hard against these constitutional freedoms.
20th December 2021, 08:35
airshifter

It really doesn't bother me that someone with a racing background has become President of the FIA, regardless of where he is from.

It actually bothers me more that they allow races in countries that still abuse many basic human rights recognized by the rest of the developed world. That falls on the government of the country, not the individuals within it.
21st December 2021, 12:49
sgr

Quote:

Originally Posted by airshifter

It actually bothers me more that they allow races in countries that still abuse many basic human rights recognized by the rest of the developed world. That falls on the government of the country, not the individuals within it.

I don't disagree with you. However, doesn't allowing races actually help bring about change for the better?
22nd December 2021, 23:19
lmmjvss

Maybe its a good thing to have female reporters around the F1 track for 3 days wearing regular western clothes. Maybe its a good thing to have women racing electric SUVs in Saudi Arabia. Maybe the next world cup being held in Qatar could be a little first step into a better direction....
I like to think about the 'Observer Effect'. The phenomenon that causes individuals who might have been inclined to act aggressively, abusively or antisocially to modify their behavior when they know that they are being filmed or recorded.
24th December 2021, 10:48
Sulland

Quote:

Originally Posted by sgr

I don't disagree with you. However, doesn't allowing races actually help bring about change for the better?

How?
24th December 2021, 11:58
WRCStan

Quote:

Originally Posted by M5

Ben Suayem is probably a nice guy, but that in not the issue. Non democtratic nations should not be eligble to seek international office...

How do you feel about sportswashing from authoritarian states?

Maybe there are Emiratis who don't like your way of 'sportswashing'. You like democracy? Good for you. As far as I know Ben Sulayem is not a member of the UAE political/royal family, so it's strange you want to kick him out because of his nationality whilst expressing virtues of freedoms. It is yourself who wants to sportswash. My opinion is that there should be no place in sport for political ideologies from any side. Rainbow laces, taking the knee, funds for gender equality etc are acceptable when they are related to sport participation but introducing politics for politics purposes is wrong - that's sportswashing. I can't see yet what Ben Sulayem plans to do that includes this.

Don't be of the view westerners haven't gamed these systems in exactly the same way. I believe the USA bribed FIFA officials too when Qatar won the vote, thus the enraged kickback. I also agree workers have been treated badly in Qatar but the best protest is a commercial protest - don't go or buy FIFA merch.

And as others say, few democratic nations are democratic. Much of Europe still have monarchies like it's the 13th century. That's not very far ahead you are correct. My country even still has unelected Lords, Ladies and Bishops of the Church of England passing laws FFS.
24th December 2021, 18:15
Zico

Really interesting discussion.. and a rare one where I really can't disagree with any of the points raised.

I was reading the other day that Bernies wife Fabiana Flosi is Mr MoBinSuls 2nd in command ie; FIA vice president.. which might well explain the slant the sport has gone recently. Maybe its not Saudi money.. is Bernie still pulling the strings? :)

Edit- Bin Suleyems alleged quote

Formula 1 rules dictate that the top three drivers in the championship must attend.

"If there is any breach, there is no forgiveness in this," Ben Sulayem said.

Asked to clarify whether he was saying Hamilton would be penalised for not attending the gala, he said: "Forgiveness is always there. But rules are rules.

Kinda begs the question, is he a hardliner.. or Bernies front man?
28th February 2022, 18:14
Nitrodaze

Quote:

Originally Posted by M5

The FIA members have elected a new president, Mr Mohammed Ben Sulayem.
The first non European president in FIAs 117 year history, so that was about time.
But in these days where many speaks of "sportswashing" in regard to what is happening in football, and the world championship in Qatar.
It is about how corruption bought votes to get the votes, and also how they treat people building the stadiums and other infrastructure needed.

I struggle to understand that our sport can let a person from a non-democratic state, even being allowed to run.

This is what wiki say about UAE:
The UAE is an authoritarian state. The UAE has been described as a "tribal autocracy" where the seven constituent monarchies are led by tribal rulers in an autocratic fashion. There are no democratically elected institutions, and there is no formal commitment to free speech.

UAE is not very far ahead on human rights, equality btw the sexes, gay rights, freedom of expression, freedom of religion, and the list goes on and on.

I do not like that they use international sport to whitewash the way they organize their countries, and treat people.
Ben Suayem is probably a nice guy, but that in not the issue. Non democtratic nations should not be eligble to seek international office, and if they slip through, they should not be elected. In most cases for getting championships, they buy enough votes - I hope it is not the case here.

How do you feel about sportswashing from authoritarian states?

Your post really surprises me. Generalization is a form of prejuidice. You do not know the man but you doubt his integrity based on your view of his nation. WTF. How about you give him the benefit of the doubt as people from your preferred countries are proving to be corrupt and dodgy as hell. I can assure you that he cannot do much worst than Jean Todt did. They manufactured a Driver World Champion for the 2021 season, so this guy in my book, is a saint until he proves different.
28th February 2022, 18:16
Nitrodaze

Quote:

Originally Posted by F1nKS

From what I can see - most of the European nations are more authoritarian than democratic and freedom-loving.

After Trump and George Floyd, you do not qualify to point a finger at any nation for anything buddy.
28th February 2022, 18:17
Nitrodaze

Quote:

Originally Posted by airshifter

It really doesn't bother me that someone with a racing background has become President of the FIA, regardless of where he is from.

It actually bothers me more that they allow races in countries that still abuse many basic human rights recognized by the rest of the developed world. That falls on the government of the country, not the individuals within it.

Well, those deals were done by the F1 management. Nothing to do with the FIA. The F1 management would hold a race in a brothel if they can find a brothel willing to pay to host a race.
28th February 2022, 18:25
Nitrodaze

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zico

Really interesting discussion.. and a rare one where I really can't disagree with any of the points raised.

I was reading the other day that Bernies wife Fabiana Flosi is Mr MoBinSuls 2nd in command ie; FIA vice president.. which might well explain the slant the sport has gone recently. Maybe its not Saudi money.. is Bernie still pulling the strings? :)

Edit- Bin Suleyems alleged quote

Formula 1 rules dictate that the top three drivers in the championship must attend.

"If there is any breach, there is no forgiveness in this," Ben Sulayem said.

Asked to clarify whether he was saying Hamilton would be penalised for not attending the gala, he said: "Forgiveness is always there. But rules are rules.

Kinda begs the question, is he a hardliner.. or Bernies front man?

That is a good question though. Is he a puppet? Can he wield the power of the office without backlash from highly influential people in F1? That is yet to be seen.