Pick a number

So, perhaps the one good change that has come out this week is that drivers can race with a permanent number from now on:

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2013/12/0...ers-next-year/

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Formula One drivers will select race numbers which they will retain for the rest of their careers from next season.

Drivers will be given the choice of numbers between 2 and 99 from next year.

The number one will remain for special use of the reigning world champion, if they choose to use it. Where two drivers choose the same number, whoever finished highest in the championship will have first preference.

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If I was Mercedes, those two cars would be running 658 and 722 on them.
Likewise, Ferrari should see if they can secure 27 and 28.

Wonder what number Vettel would want :p: :D

Good news is that number 13 is available.

I wonder who will get it.

Excellent! Been wanting to see this brought in since they started the new numbering system (I think in the mid-90's?). Changing numbers every year means there's no association built up.

Now this is a good introduction. I'd much rather see a driver pick a number and stick to it for their whole career. I liked it when Valentino Rossi would use his unique number even when he was entitled to have the number 1 on his bike. Its good to see F1 drivers can once again do this.

Now of course we wonder who is going to get the historic 27&28! I can see 99 being a popular choice too, I would be my guess we won't see a '2' on the grid next year.

Is significantly different to the past of course when the teams had the numbers, now it's the drivers.

finally a good rule change. Most sports have it, why F1 did not was baffling.

The FIA have an uncanny knack of taking something and then regulating it in order to make it worse. Changing the numbers to be based on the previous years championship position is a case in point. Regulating the podium celebrations, tyre change rules.

Need I mention them destroying Rallying by regulating the distance, amount and location of stages to make them 'TV friendly' which destroyed the essence of the sport.

I generally feel that F1 thrives despite of the organisers, not because of them.

I'd pick 28, if I could. I was a huge fan of Fred Taylor at the Jacksonville Jaguars.

I can see Red Bull having a number 83 in there somewhere. Something to do with the can size, which was why their NASCAR team used it.

I can definitely imagine Alonso picking 27 - not just the traditional Ferrari link, but Senna won one of his titles with that number - and Hamilton 44, which was a favourite of his in karting (I think he also had some success with 25). Indeed, we could see a few old karting numbers revived; it was probably the last time most of the current grid got to keep a number for any length of time. And Kimi may well pick 69, just for the hell of it... ;)

Of course, the irony of all this is that even picking your own number, you won't beat the current records for smallest and largest winning car numbers - 0 (any of Damon Hill's first nine wins) or 101 (Alberto Ascari, 1952 German Grand Prix, which was entirely contested by cars with three-figure numbers!).

Just as long as we don't go down the NASCAR route of allowing two-figure numbers with a leading zero...

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Originally Posted by inimitablestoo

Just as long as we don't go down the NASCAR route of allowing two-figure numbers with a leading zero...

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I have no problem with this.
Australian touring car drive Peter Brock ran the number 05 from 1978 onwards because of the 0.05% blood alcohol limit in Victoria. Mind you, that's a little strange in itself because on one hand it's an anti-drink driving message and on the other, the car was sponsored by Marlboro.

Also:

http://pbs.twimg.com/media/BbJ8s3nCUAAeXJB.jpg
This is the Australian GP in 2004; Jensen Button's BAR. Looky looky, what do I spy on the rear? 09

09 is a pun. The Oni are a kind of Japanese devil; Jensen can drive like a demon.
Link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oni

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Originally Posted by odykas

Good news is that number 13 is available.

I wonder who will get it.

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Well, Mark has left the building. Daniel?

The only - slight flaw I can see in the system is that if it works as intended, and numbers get associated with particular drivers, then those numbers will continue to be associated with them after they retire. We've often seen numbers in the likes of NASCAR 'retired' out of respect for a particular driver, meaning they aren't available to use any more.

Bottas could be:
8O7TAS #87
8OT7AS #87
8OTTA5 #85
80TTAS #80
BO77AS #77
BOT7A5 #75
BO7TA5 #75
8OTTAS #8
BO7TAS #7
BOT7AS #7
BOTTA5 #5

and same with other drivers

K1M1 #11

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Originally Posted by Mark

The only - slight flaw I can see in the system is that if it works as intended, and numbers get associated with particular drivers, then those numbers will continue to be associated with them after they retire. We've often seen numbers in the likes of NASCAR 'retired' out of respect for a particular driver, meaning they aren't available to use any more.

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Nascrap aside, and this may well be the practice in Euro ball ;), but in the U.S. professional teams permanently retire #s of players who have exceptional careers for that franchise, it is however very infrequent. So that simply means that no player for that franchise will have that # available when choosing one. It doesn't stop Joe Blow of the Toledo Mud hens from wearing #21 which was the great Roberto Clemente's # when he played for The Pittsburg Pirates and is permanently retired and not available to a player for that team. The same should be true for F1 IMO. Let the teams retire numbers and if a pilot for another team wants to use it, fine that pilot would simply not be allowed to use the number for the team that retired it. Problem solved. :bulb:

That could get tricky if I'm talking about driving for Ferrari and I have #27 but they are like no way, the great Alonso had that number and we retired it. There goes my Ferrari dreams and it's all YOUR fault :(

Actually, NASCAR's policy is not to retire numbers - indeed, I read just a few minutes ago that Dale Earnhardt's legendary #3 will be back in the Sprint Cup next year. CART retired a couple of numbers (although the 14 "unretired" before the merger, and 99 has been used since the merger) but the only other motor racing series I can think of off hand that did this was, randomly, British Formula Ford, which retired the number 8 after the death of Neil Shanahan in 1999.

I think there's an early Futurama that parodies the whole retired numbers idea when the only numbers left for players to use are things like pi and quite specific fractions :D

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Originally Posted by Mark

That could get tricky if I'm talking about driving for Ferrari and I have #27 but they are like no way, the great Alonso had that number and we retired it. There goes my Ferrari dreams and it's all YOUR fault :(

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Dude, you’d take any freakin # for a Ferrari ride. Sometimes just step off your highish horse ;)

Anyone care to guess what numbers the top drivers will choose next year?

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Originally Posted by Mark

Anyone care to guess what numbers the top drivers will choose next year?

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I'll have number #11 Mark :P

I'd prefer it if the teams got the numbers, not the drivers. Drivers are transient, teams are permanent (well, some of them are).

27 belongs the Ferrari damn it! If some pay driver in a Marussia gets that number I'm going to be mildly annoyed.

if Alonso is #27, he will take that number with him to McLaren 2015...

for Kimi #27 is OK, because Ferrari will be his last team.

I would hope that once a driver picks a number they will NOT be permitted to change it. I can imagine the likes of Vettel choosing a different number every year just because...

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Originally Posted by inimitablestoo

I think there's an early Futurama that parodies the whole retired numbers idea when the only numbers left for players to use are things like pi and quite specific fractions :D

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Not sure what you are getting at, I mean I really like Futurama, but when you look at sports franchises that retire #s the facts are a little less comical. Sticking with the Pittsburg Pirates they joined the National League in 1887 which they have been a member of continuously until the present. I believe that in the interim they have retired 7 players #s, which is barely one per generation. Hardly supports any point the cartoon was making, especially considering that sports competitors in that cartoon are exclusively droids. ;)

Yes, but Futurama is set 1000 years in the future, so the list of retired numbers would be quite high, allowing for the laws of comedic exaggeration of course ;)

Presumably associating the numbers with the drivers also means teams will be less prone to rotating driver line-ups now (not that they have much in recent seasons) because it'll mean repainting the car every time? ;)

Nico Rosberg choice:
#6 Keke´s number in 82 when he won championship

FIA ask them three choice, so Nicos other choices are #5 and #9

Sergio Perez wants #11 (but I´m ready to bet that he will not get it)

source: Autosport

[quote[
The regulation states: "Prior to the start of the 2014 World Championship season race numbers will be permanently allocated to drivers by ballot, such numbers must then be used by that driver during every Formula 1 championship event he takes part in throughout his career."[/quote]

Seems to confirm the number choice is permanent, this is good; no chopping and changing around!

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"The only exception to this allocation process will be for the reigning world champion who will have the option to use the number one.

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They can choose to run #1 or not, interesting, but follows the practice of other motorsports.

"The number that was previously allocated to him will be reserved for him in subsequent seasons if he does not retain the title of world champion."

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Drivers will now have to carry the race number not only on the front of the car in a way that must be "clearly visible" but also on their crash helmet for the first time.

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Interesting! It's been a feature that since the numbering system was changed it coincided with numbers being less visible, so this is a good change too.

I'm not so keen on the permanence of the number change but hey, a few years down the line that may change again, so who knows? After all, the likes of Lorenzo, Pedrosa and Edwards have all changed numbers in MotoGP despite the apparently inextricable linking of rider and number. Besides, the whole choosing a number idea has its roots in superstition, and if a driver feels his permanent number has brought him bad luck, he may want a new one. Either that or we see some devious means to get one: "Yes, my name is Nick O'Hulkenberg; no, not the German F1 driver, I'm a completely different Irish F1 driver, so I'd like a different number please".

Presumably there would be an exception if a driver left F1, the number was re-allocated and then the original driver returned while the number was still in use with its second driver.

Twitter:
Valtteri Bottas:
So, It´s the #77 I have applied for! #17 as 2nd choice and #11 as 3rd choice.
#BO77AS

I read somewhere:
Massa #19
Perez #11
Vergne #25 #21 #27 -hope that he will not get #27

I think nobody will take #2, #13 or #69

#12 - LEWIS HAMILTON, well Senna was his hero and this was Senna's number in his glory days of the late 80's
#27 - FERNANDO ALONSO, Well its synonimous with Ferrari, so why not
#28 - KIMI RAIKKONEN, Read above
#23 - KEVIN MAGNUSSEN, Dads number from his Stewart days
#62 - DANIEL RICCIARDO, Randomness FTW

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Originally Posted by inimitablestoo

I'm not so keen on the permanence of the number change but hey, a few years down the line that may change again, so who knows? After all, the likes of Lorenzo, Pedrosa and Edwards have all changed numbers in MotoGP despite the apparently inextricable linking of rider and number. Besides, the whole choosing a number idea has its roots in superstition, and if a driver feels his permanent number has brought him bad luck, he may want a new one. Either that or we see some devious means to get one: "Yes, my name is Nick O'Hulkenberg; no, not the German F1 driver, I'm a completely different Irish F1 driver, so I'd like a different number please".

Presumably there would be an exception if a driver left F1, the number was re-allocated and then the original driver returned while the number was still in use with its second driver.

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Odd, I thought Pedrosa has raced with #26 his whole career

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Originally Posted by DazzlaF1

#62 - DANIEL RICCIARDO, Randomness FTW

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Ricciardo is more likely to be #19 as that was both his number in Formula Ford in WA and the first number he head in F1

It will be good to see #27 and #28 on the Ferraris again. This will of course only last until either of the drivers leaves.

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Originally Posted by DazzlaF1

Odd, I thought Pedrosa has raced with #26 his whole career

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I had to look it up to make sure, but he did carry the numbers 2 and 3 in 2008 and 2009 respectively.

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Originally Posted by Rollo

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Originally Posted by DazzlaF1

#62 - DANIEL RICCIARDO, Randomness FTW

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Ricciardo is more likely to be #19 as that was both his number in Formula Ford in WA and the first number he head in F1

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Massa wants #19 and he was higher in classification this year, so he can choose before Ricciardo...

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Originally Posted by Mark

It will be good to see #27 and #28 on the Ferraris again. This will of course only last until either of the drivers leaves.

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several sources say:

Kimi #7
Alonso #14

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Originally Posted by Mark

It will be good to see #27 and #28 on the Ferraris again. This will of course only last until either of the drivers leaves.

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Just a guess here Mark, but I have a suspicion that those decisions were not made by the drivers but by the team. It might even already be an addendum to their contracts that they take the numbers they are given by the team. I could be wrong however :confused: ;)

Which is why changing numbers should be completely impossible. So the teams don't end up dictating it.

:stareup: While I agree in principal with what I think is your belief that teams shouldn't be dictating the #'s that pilots fly, and if I am correct about Ferrari wanting, neigh insist their pilots do so (which would be something that Ron Dennis would probably do as well) They have certainly picked two cats that currently would not be afraid to disclose it. I get the impression that if things get too untenable for Kimi there, and I don't simply mean being beaten, the freakin' guy may just park his challenger on track step to the infield and hang a big steamy shit, wipe his ass with a copy of his contract and catch a ride while wearing flip flops some placed like Monaco. It's not like he hasn't already driven for the douchbags at Lotus without full remuneration. Fred will just tweet out that the team decided they wanted him to use the #, and he accepted a few extra bucks for it. There is, I believe, a limit to what Fred will put up with from the team.
Mark I'm in the camp that says you should be able to pick a number and have to stick with it for the entire season, but if you chose to change it the next fine, kind of like changing your screen name on a forum :angel: I really don't see a big problem with # preferences whatever they are, only that you use that number for a entire season. In the US It is not uncommon for ball players to change teams and ask a player on the new team if he wouldn't mind giving up the # they are used to wearing. The request is almost never denied, although the new player generally pays the guy who currently wears it a pretty good hunk of dough for that #. The powers that be in F1 and the FIA don't give a crap about the legacy of this sport, why should we when all we are doing is banging our heads against the wall?