New car news!!

From the look of the pic, I'm excited to see what this beast will look like! Being a six cylinder turbo (twin turbo?), I can't wait to hear it either!! Wonder what the paint scheme will be? I wonder if they'll use the batcopter to view the testing from above? Just kidding, who knows what it will look like, it might end up pretty bad ass!!

Let's keep this spy thing going! I know some of you are great photographers, and have special detective skills!!

Let's seek this car out as testing happens throughout the year!!

http://auto-racing.speedtv.com/artic...ng-first-test/

:) :) :)

It is kind of neat that the new car hits the shores next week. More than a few people may hang out at Mid-O after the race on Sunday, just to check it out.

The Honda will be a single turbo, with the GM and Lotus being twin turbos, which could make things interesting. The Lotus/Judd motor is behind in development, so we might have to wait to see who their dance partner will be.

Caution, as with the new Champcar, there could be some small issues. Do not freak out, worry or panic, as that is what testing is for. If there are issues, they have time before the cars ship before the end of the year.

I had hoped that Lola would have got the job, but it looks like Dallra (and Indycar) have done a good job in getting this together, on time.

Eagle, do you think there will be engine failures next year due to the competition? This is something that Indycar isnt used to having.

The mirrors look a lot more functional than the ones on the concept.

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Originally Posted by DanicaFan

Eagle, do you think there will be engine failures next year due to the competition? This is something that Indycar isnt used to having.

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I think there could be some failures, especially in practice and qualifiying trim, especially early on. Indycar will be keeping track of the engines and their development to try and ensure they are close in performance. Competition certainly can push some to the limits. I still remember the Honda CART motors blowing plenums sky high during practice.

We are still waiting to hear what the spare car situation will be. Back in the day, you had your primary and spare or "T" car, which was race ready with an engine. When Honda became the loan supplier, they did not want extra engines "sitting" connected to cars, which is now why we have spare cars that sit w/o the engine. I could see us going back to the old spare situation, but that will depend on what the engine suppliers want.

The Honda engine will be built by HPD in CA, while the GM engine will be built by Ilmor (who supply the current Honda engine). Lotus will be supplied by Judd. Each of these groups have had success at various levels, so I think we can expect some good reliability.

So, Cosworth won't get in next year?

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Originally Posted by jimispeed

So, Cosworth won't get in next year?

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Not unless you wanna write a big check.

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Originally Posted by EagleEye

I think there could be some failures, especially in practice and qualifiying trim, especially early on. Indycar will be keeping track of the engines and their development to try and ensure they are close in performance. Competition certainly can push some to the limits. I still remember the Honda CART motors blowing plenums sky high during practice.

We are still waiting to hear what the spare car situation will be. Back in the day, you had your primary and spare or "T" car, which was race ready with an engine. When Honda became the loan supplier, they did not want extra engines "sitting" connected to cars, which is now why we have spare cars that sit w/o the engine. I could see us going back to the old spare situation, but that will depend on what the engine suppliers want.

The Honda engine will be built by HPD in CA, while the GM engine will be built by Ilmor (who supply the current Honda engine). Lotus will be supplied by Judd. Each of these groups have had success at various levels, so I think we can expect some good reliability.

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You might see some failures in qualifying because someone will create a hand granade if they can't make the pace without pushing the limit. The race, I believe will be another story.

Thanks for the reply Eagle. I thought about that. Because Indycar has been used to engines never failing and their tires being very, very reliable.

Does anyone know if it's a requirement to lease engines? Maybe there could be some outside of the box thinking from a manufacturer and SELL the units...?

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Originally Posted by Wilf

You might see some failures in qualifying because someone will create a hand granade if they can't make the pace without pushing the limit. The race, I believe will be another story.

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Originally Posted by Mad_Hatter

Does anyone know if it's a requirement to lease engines? Maybe there could be some outside of the box thinking from a manufacturer and SELL the units...?

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I think these are lease only. And with the limits Indycar will set on these engines once their put on a dyno with boost and rev limit restrictions, you won't see any chance for these things to blow up unless the manufacturer itself just can't produce.

I may even suggest that if any of these manufacturers embarrasses itself and has a problem keeping up with the pack that bar may be "lowered" so it has a chance to be competitive.

That looks like the oval package they revealed at Indy. I would assume we'll see the other version of bodywork at MO next week. I can't wait to see and hear the new car on track, but i'll be even more excited when we see and hear the Chevy and Judd engines on track as well. I really miss hearing the different engine notes from indycars.

It's been a long time since any of the MFG's were willing to sell their designs outright for independent builders to service without some pretty tight control.
I wonder of the Honda engine has anything in common with the TT V6 Honda developed for the ALMS?

I can't wait to hear those engines around Indy again!

Again? when have we heard V6turbos inthe past? ;)

I agree, I look forward to hearing a turbo engine, well, any engine really turning more than 10K

http://youtu.be/nNDrUIWp09g

We've heard plenty of V6 Turbo engines.

So the IRL is going to manage the competition to ensure equal engines........great......pretty much what I expect from these guys.

Well, .. duh, Brain Fart.... I wasn't thinking about the pre IRL Buick handgrenades and the old indy lights...... senility 1, me......0. My neighbor even owns one... He has an ex-menards engine. I helped him pull it out of his garage and install it in one of the three Grand nationals he has. IIRC, it's blown.

The Dallara protoype had it's first day of testing at Mid-Ohio. The couple of pictures they have in the article looks like the car they were showing at Indy.

AUTO RACING - INDYCAR: 2012 Car Breaks Cover At Mid-Ohio

http://www.racecar-engineering.com/w.../08/FULL-1.jpg

http://dlstatic.speedtv.com/imageser...kground=000000

I am pleasantly surprised. looks much better on track

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Originally Posted by anthonyvop

http://www.racecar-engineering.com/w.../08/FULL-1.jpg

http://dlstatic.speedtv.com/imageser...kground=000000

I am pleasantly surprised. looks much better on track

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I'm sure all the mothers here love it.

L/D will be the thing that defines beauty to me, I'll be watching trap speeds.... My guess the airbox/sail panel is to make the rear wing more efficient.

rh

The airbox is because the prototype is running the Honda N/A 3.5 Ltr V-8.

Still looks like a Dallara Indycar, and by a Dallara, I mean.... well, it's better looking in some ways than the current lawn dart. That's one hell of a front wing. Teh front end looks more like a platypus now. Time for a livery thread.... Oh, wrong forum.. ;)


Change in this case is good. Now lets see what the other companies can come up with!

Ditch the airbox, give it the other sidepods, and It might look pretty good. It's only the first shakedown.....

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Originally Posted by anthonyvop

The airbox is because the prototype is running the Honda N/A 3.5 Ltr V-8.

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Oh really,

'A few minutes later, the roar of the 3.5-liter normally-aspirated V-8 engine as cars exited the appropriately-named Thunder Alley less than 24 hours earlier during the Honda Indy 200 at Mid-Ohio was replaced by the smooth, higher-pitched sound of the 2.2-liter turbocharged Honda V-6 engine that will be among the three (Honda, Chevrolet and Lotus) implemented for the 2012 season."

I couldn't make your stuff up....

Here is one from Tony Cotman

"It's a lighter car, it has more horsepower and it has a lot less drag than the current car, so naturally on the right day it will go quicker and that's something that the fans have to look forward to," Cotman added.

Could we be seeing new track records, probably on Road Courses or Short Tracks, unlikely on 200 MPH plus tracks

Get rid of the airbox?

Get rid of those ugly winglets on jets. so what if they work, I don't like them. :)

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi..._and_AB319.JPG

I don't see no ugly winglets. :)

http://www.google.ca/url?source=imgl...LKDJe4Obiugu5g

arguh - I just can't love it - they took the worse of the two designs at Indy and I think they beat it with one of Honda's ugly sticks a bit more...... sidepods look different that the one at Indy - I think the Indy one flowed smoothly to the rear tire - this one looks a bit like the cockpit frontal bulbous thingy.....

I know the ones at indy looked better in person than in photos - perhaps this thing is just not photogenic - but if Indycar had any effect on the stock market this would be driving the market down even more...... I have no basis for this but it just doesn't look "right"......

It looks like an older LMP2 car and the current Indycar were mashed together and they threw on wings from a current F1 car (not the strong point of those cars) - it just looks like a hodgepodge of race car cliches

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Originally Posted by Marbles

I don't see no ugly winglets. :)

http://www.google.ca/url?source=imgl...LKDJe4Obiugu5g

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Subsonic and supersonic, apple and dragon fruit ;)

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Originally Posted by Marbles

I don't see no ugly winglets. :)

http://www.google.ca/url?source=imgl...LKDJe4Obiugu5g

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No winglets just one ugly aircraft wanting to be something it is not....... :)

I'm not a mother but I like the looks of that car very much. A lot better than the current Dallara. I think I'll love the performance even more...

Trailing car turbulence should be our main topic for the new cars raciness, imho

TO clarify, I would prefer we were discussing the potential to run closer, reduction of the leading trailing car interference

. Also aerodynamic efficiency which is much nicer than horsepower as the speeds approach 180.

I know the goal of this car is to improve in almost every measurable aspect on the performance of the current cars and it's immediate predecessors.

How many of the design aspects are the effects of these goals would be nice to know at some future date, for example, Swift has produced many excellent papers detailing how their designs came to be, what restrictions influenced them.

Here is an excerpt on the last gen Atlantic:

The directive from Champ Car, for the car to be faster in all aspects (straight line, cornering, decreased lap time) would prove to be quite a challenge.

Initial calculations showed that although the new power plant provided a 25% increase in power over the engine previously used in the series, the maximum speed of the vehicle would only increase by approximately 12 MPH, assuming the drag of the vehicle remained the same. Since the new car was larger in several dimensions and with wings of greater chord and span, a drag increase was inevitable. 50% scale wind tunnel models of both the old (014.a) car and the new car were created. The model of the new vehicle being very much a “work in process” as the design progressed.

Both models were evaluated in the Swift wind tunnel and the data received, analyzed and fed back to the group working on finalizing the design. The use of the Swift wind tunnel data in conjunction with lap simulation programs enabled a study to be made incorporating both the aerodynamic changes and the weight increase of the car. Using these tools enabled the Champ Car directive to be achieved.

The Swift 016.a represents an evolution of the successful 008.a and 014a. The Swift 016.a Formula Atlantic racing car is the culmination of a comprehensive customer review of the 008.a and an application of Swift's extensive knowledge of racecar design. Evolutionary in design, the Swift 016.a utilized the Swift wind tunnel to aerodynamically shape the chassis elements and new bodywork.

Application of the state-of-art principles in composite technology and component engineering has increased the durability and performance of the bodywork, driveline, steering, suspension, and cooling systems. Finally, a brand new Swift SG4 gearbox complements the improved chassis. Improvements to the Swift 016.a represent an advanced step and new standard in the evolution of the Toyota Atlantic Series chassis.



The DP01 and now this car are the reversal of the trend of specs forcing the slowing of cars we saw in CART from the late 90's to 2003.

I look forward to the next few years seeing how this works out.

just my 2 cents

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Originally Posted by anthonyvop

The airbox is because the prototype is running the Honda N/A 3.5 Ltr V-8.

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The new car ran with the new Honda engine in place, not the existing engine. The existing engine is branded a Honda, built by Ilmor, and Ilmor were not allowed at the shakedown.

The air scoop feeds the single turbo inlet on the car, instead of having a snorkel on the right side. This allows cleaner air flow over the top of the car to the rea, which in turn increases the downforce produced by the new (two-piece split) undertray. There are also some air flow directed to the bell housing which houses the turbo.

Dallara have a done a great job of balancing safety, cost, aero, etc. to produce a car that, in my opinion, looks pretty good. I find it unfair to label it "ugly" or to state that Dallara make ugly cars.

Riddle me this race fans?

If the car doesn't do 240 next May why bother?

What if the current dallara is faster?

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Originally Posted by SarahFan

Riddle me this race fans?

If the car doesn't do 240 next May why bother?

What if the current dallara is faster?

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If a car even approaches 240 next May, air dams will be bolted on before it turns another lap.

Then why bother with a whole new design?

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Originally Posted by SarahFan

Then why bother with a whole new design?

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This is a point worth discussing.

We are talking about racecars. If the next generation is not meant/designed to go faster (more safely) then really, what is the point.

240 at Indy is too dangerous. There were two fatalities at the speedway in the 90's when speeds were that high.

Were their more fatalities with speeds under 200 or over 200?

Honest question

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Originally Posted by NickFalzone

This is a point worth discussing.

We are talking about racecars. If the next generation is not meant/designed to go faster (more safely) then really, what is the point.

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There are fatalities in auto racing for a myriad of reasons. The point, I think, is that speed improvements should obviously come along with safety improvements. I do think that the safety aspects of IndyCar design have come a long ways since the 90s when 240 was a very dangerous number. Shouldn't "Faster+Safer" be a motto in new car design? If "next-gen" in racecar design these days is basically "safer", then you've lost me as a fan, and probably a vast majority of other fans.