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Have those plenty in the past in different teams. For how long it'll take when mr. Quesnel have to reconsider his statement and think for the best of Team Citroen?? Meaning cooling things down and lower more prone driver to mistake, Ogier that is, to secure team points and let Loeb fight for the title ??
I think he is already thinking different.The price to push Ogier instead of Loeb is expensive and he already paid it.
I really can t think that exists a manager that in his team he is going to push a rookie instead of a 7 times champion.He didn t won 7 champ by no reason or by lack.Hope he undrstood that today.
This pushing to Ogier can be when manufacturer championship is secured.Not in second rally of season while back in points from ford.Ogier as last year cant be consistent fast as Loeb and inside road.Patience will be good for him.
Quesnel is a lucky man in my view. He inherited the team from Frequelin and all I've seen him do is make stupid comments & decisions since.
RedBull F1 team has the best tactics - equal drivers and the best wins..
This is McLaren-Mercedes, and only under Whitmarsh :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Barreis
Back on topic, Citroen are lucky to has such fast drivers!
I think this problem might already have been solved as we speak.
Well, Ogier has a really bad record right now. 4 offs in last 5 rallies and 0-podiums in last 5 rallies+1 destroyed car during the testing. He even beats Jari-Matti with that record!
Thats why i said that is Quesnels mistake.No orders to a rookie while he can t finish ralies continuesly? Totaly stupid.Quote:
Originally Posted by bluuford
I am just imagine what he could do with Jari and Miko.....
And I take the stance from a fan point of view. No thanks to all this PR crap, so he crashes, Citroen lose, nice for a change. I'm not a fan of him, but it's good there's another fast driver in the mix, I rather see him drive than to be a whipping boy, and I think with Ogier attitude is harder to tame than Latvala (or Sordo for that matter). Ford can capitalize on this to retake the titles this year.
“The situation is what it is,” he commented after Rally Mexico, when Ogier crashed out on the final morning while trying to fend off Loeb. “Up until this year I have been the team leader, but now there are two team leaders. He is trying to beat me and I am trying to beat him. For now this is the reality, later we will have to see. But I’m not very happy for him because he did not deserve this and I’m not very happy for the team to see just one Citroen on the podium.”
More craps from Loeb, I already understood your message. Okay then, let Ogier the faster one be the team leader and you support him. But the reality is Ogier is not new to this (and if I am correct someone here mentioned even the French govt is supporting Ogier), there will be immediate changes in the next rally. Ogier won't win Portugal this time. Or maybe he will, since he crashes out I figured he will be given a lower starting order?
If Ogier had been told to play number 2 to Loeb everyone would be moaning that Citroen should let Seb 2.0 drive flat out and push Loeb.
Apart from those two mistakes he drove a near perfect rally even driving first on the road Saturday and 1 Stage Sunday, for me im glad there allowed to fight each other, its about time Loeb was pushed by a team mate.
Ogier will probably win in Portugal if everything goes ok with him, I remember hearing last year that his driving was much more kind to tyres and Loeb not so much, and in Portugal that is a big factor.
Anyway Im sure Citroen isn't going to tell Ogier to control his times by Loeb from the beggining, that is a bad decision in my point of view, because in the end what teams really want to see is one of their cars in the top of the podium.
Are you sure about this?Ogier is always much more sideways than Loeb,from videos i ve seen.Quote:
Originally Posted by Francis44
And this they didn t see last 8 years with Loeb?Quote:
Originally Posted by Francis44
Ogier is a citroen employe as Quesnel.They are paid for a reason and not for their ego,or their particular likes at drivers.Above them are marketing heads that want their decades millions of euros spent properly.Till now from results are spent properly,but balancies are very ''fragile''.
I have to say that i like very much Ogier(specially his aggresive driving comparing to Loeb) but here i am talking about Quesnels choices/decisions.
Ogier is 99% sure that is going to become world champion with his abilities and treatment from Citroens manager.But he has to wait some more,as we saw he is not so ''ready'' for this.Also i understant that Ogier is Quesnels creature, but he also must be patience with time.
There are two subjects.One is about Quesnels decisions for his team which i doubt they are right.Another is about a free competition without team orders for a championship with a lot of dramas.I can say that i prefer the second!
Im pretty positive I've heard this last year, his driving may be much more sideways but he manages his tires much better, and have you seen Loeb really pushing?! I've seen both fighting at the end of day 2 last year in Portugal and Loeb was as agressive if not even more than Ogier, and if both continue driving like this, Loeb will have problems aswell.Quote:
Originally Posted by dimviii
Regarding teams and Brands, perhaps Ford got the best result out of this rally but as a fan of the sport Citroen made the biggest impression, yeah both cars were not in the end but they showed supremacy and at the end of the day news were much more highlighted with Citroen pictures. What I am trying to say is that sometimes you make bigger impression even if not with the best result and that's what I think brands are looking for.
Citroen won the rally, so they'd get the most coverage.
Sure Citroen won the rally, but took less points than Ford which were minutes back(Ford 33 points-Citroen 25 points)All these with Quesnels decision to free his drivers at second rally of year while back already in points from SwedenQuote:
Originally Posted by 6789
Championships(which is the target) don t win woth coverage but with points.
its still very early.....hopefully the ford camp can do something otherwise its going to be a citroen sweep...
It was a bit stupid by quesnel to let them fight...but then again he did the right thing for sport, if he said to hold positions then everyone on here would bash quesnel like a snitchel before the grill.
Told here already several times that Ogier this year will go off the road several times and not win the championship in 2011.
Loeb and Ogier are fast but there are many fast drivers who unfortunately have to do what the (only 2,5 :rolleyes: ) teams decide in the modern WRC!
I like that Mr. Quesnel make mistakes and says stupid things in the press before and after the rallies. :p
Unfortunately, everything must go in WRC to his liking, which we alo saw in the IRC Monte Carlo his typically French stupid comments. :s mokin:
If i was Quesnel, I'd give Ogier one more chance at challenging Loeb for victory until another crash, and then it's No2 for him - supporting Loeb and picking up Manufacturer points. However, would Ogier accept this?
This is why I'd like to see 3 cars teams...
Unfortunate result for Citroen but a good decision for the sport because none of us wants to see any driver being told to drive slowly.
I understand the position team bosses are put in but I too would love to somehow see the drivers pushing each other to the limit with no team orders on every single event.Quote:
Originally Posted by sonnyc4
The only way to allow that would be the highest placed car for each manufacturer scoring sole manufacturers points. The drivers championship would then become a real, fair and open championship and the sport would benefit from it very much.
I don't see there any problem for the FIA's Citroen "Sport" group, they had always the strong help of FIA for their "fair" wins.
That is actually not a bad idea... The manufacturers championship is after all a bit watered out already, with several teams registered as manufacturers even though there are only 2 (so far) car brands involved...Quote:
Originally Posted by Zico
I can sense some anger and bitterness after the Citroën show in Mexico, i just can't imagine a DS3 1-2-3, some forum members would have gone mad.
Little comment on Brother flemish's post. As the quote says : you can't expect any better from a flemish.
Back to the thread, a dream line up shouldn't be a problem unless it turns out something like Sainz/Mc Rae, Kankkunen/Burns etc... for the recent WRC era.
Latvala is a good example, he had an unfortunate streak of offs, whether he was put on a leash by MW or understood by himself (or both), he got over it, rebuilt his confidence, played his support part in the team, picked up big points and convincing wins.
While a clean fight down to the wire is always enjoyable, WRC is also about team efforts in a fierce competition, not only a matter of individual/ego driver glory, hence compromises.
Drivers must take that into account and drive accordingly, something Ogier the rookie hasn't learned yet.
Τheir strongest help is that they know how to build a fast car.in their first gravel rally they won almost all ss, even with non factory entries(Petter).Only when cruising with 1,5min difference they allow to Ford to gain ss wins.be sure that this is not happening with FIAs strong help.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobcat
i just e-mail m-sport suggesting to withdraw the budget of wilson Jr and put it in the development of the car....i really would like to see their reply.
So far i see 2010 rivisited and its very alarming i must say....maybe this year ford will manage and get 2nd place with no problems, but if from 2012 on VW and BMW get serious about their projects i think ford is going to be the new subaru...
ok Ford only had its loyalty to advertise, since they are by far the biggest losers the sport has to show....no other team lost so many in such a long time of involvment, its a joke....but at least they can try and win something when the competition is not that high.
I do not know what is the budget wilson sucks from the team but it would certainly help since both cars are pretty undeveloped now....if they wait then the situation might be irreversible.
No, I think that their strongest help is that they know how to build their cars with something like the illegal FIA restrictor by Toyota.Quote:
Originally Posted by dimviii
http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/t...n-1537474.htmlQuote:
In 1995, Toyota were caught using illegal turbo restrictors at the Rally Catalunya and were given a 12-month ban by the FIA. FIA president Max Mosley called the illegal turbo restrictor "the most sophisticated device I've ever seen in 30 years of motor sports." Toyota and their drivers, Kankkunen, Auriol and Armin Schwarz, were also stripped of all points in the championships. Kankkunen had been in contention for the drivers' world title.
I do hope this is really the future for the Citroen "Sport" group.
So Citroen at last 8 years were with illegal engines?
Tell me more about Citroen illegal engines.I want to know more.
its good that you hope Citroen to have the same luck with Toyota.I am afraid that there is no other way for Ford to win.
If I have not doubt about the future of Citroën there, yours is much more uncertain. It would be careful that you bring the proofs of what you write, or that you erase fast. But maybe you have a very good lawyer?? What you write is not only stupid but certainly more of defamation.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobcat
sportingly
are you out of your mind ???Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobcat
lol.
There are not many drivers out there who can challenge Loeb by speed and consistency. I may be wrong when I guess but I'd say..... none.Quote:
Originally Posted by Karukera
I truly like Ogier´s attitude. Not because he is then more prone to make a mistake but he is one the rare drivers who can push Loeb. Maybe the fact he is Loeb's fellow countryman and in the same team, it affects Loeb more than Hirvonen and Latvala and Solberg.
Such a blind Ford mark..
Citroën probably have a better engine because they invest money and develop it. You seriously don't work for Ford?
Me?
BobCat.. Was on my phone and couldn't quote. Sorry :)Quote:
Originally Posted by A.F.F.
i think he refers to Bobcat....who i might say he takes thing very very seriously.....its entertainment guys you must add more sick dog mentality to your thinking to have fun.
That would explain why the ford engine suffers from altitude sickness! Part of the result of one of the biggest car manufacturers in the world Versus M sport....And 7 long years of complete dominance from 1 driver.Quote:
Originally Posted by 6789
Bring on VW :p :
As problems go though, I bet MW is jeallous of quesnel on that one:-)
From "L'equipe" french Sport news paper yesterday.
http://img51.imageshack.us/i/lequipe012ps.jpg/
They write about the strategy of Olivier Quesnel which asked on Saturday evening Loeb and Ogier to congeal positions up to arrival. What Loeb refused because it is only the 2nd rally of the year and because without technical problem he was in front of Ogier. I am here to earn one 8th title I do not have gift to do ! A win must never be a gift!
I told you! After Loeb finished the stage where Ogier crashed, he was really distracted and sounded like he was asked not to push Ogier. But he did and after Ogier crashed he was a bit out of shape..
hmmm.... Loeb has a point but i think he went too far with this the team should matters beyond personal achievements...lets see how the year unfolds.
LOEB is LOEB!!!! He should not be second driver in HIS team. Remember that Loeb has made Citroen wht it is now. Unless he is out of the calculation for the championship, he should be number ONE!!!! Ogier, must wait. In one or two years he can be the number one driverQuote:
Originally Posted by N.O.T