Would you want to see him driving in the IICS?
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Would you want to see him driving in the IICS?
No I don't think it would be good to have Shane Hmiel driving in IICS. Whether or not he is free of his substance issues he should never drive in IICS. He has a lifetime ban in NASCAR and the image of Indycar accepting him as a driver would be a nightmare for any image building.
Indycar has enough of a struggle to improve it's public image without an addict driving one of it's cars.
No I don't. Although if it was between him and Milka, I might have to side with him.
Yes, Shane Hmiel made some mistakes, but as far as I know all came out publicly is that he was smoking pot... big deal.
If Barry Bonds gets to keep the home run record despite the fact we all know he was taking steroids and HGH then I say give the pot head a second chance, if he can find sponsorship.
He also tested positive for cocaine.
Should the wnba let Marion jones play?
I don't think PED's are really comparable to cocaine and marijuana. The only things marijuana enchances are crappy jam bands.
Cocaine is a PED and illigal if used at a match. Marijuana and Cocaine reduce the ability to control a car, and therefore should not be tolerated.Quote:
Originally Posted by call_me_andrew
I don't believe he should be allowed into an Izod Indycar. There is so much potential for this to become a PR disaster.
As much as I think it would be nice to see a Nascar driver give a Dallara a try, I want it to be one I know will not kill one of our drivers due to a DUI. He can run around in a stock car an bump wheels with guys while he is high and spin a guy around, but the potential for disaster is not all that great. In an Indycar, if he gets a little too close whether he is high or not, he could well die.
His drug history and his lack of experience in an Izod Indycar tell me he should stay away.
I'm not fully up to date on this story as I don't really follow Nascar all that much, but did he not admit to driving high a few times?Quote:
Originally Posted by Starter
EDIT: I checked my facts, and can't find anywhere that he admitted to using drugs during race weekends or being under the influence during races. My bad.
I am inclined to think it is a PR nightmare and it is not like we are talking a household name or anybody that would be better than the current crop of drivers.....
Pr disaster?
We have milka for heavens sake....
If he is clean and sober ..... And can hustle the car around the speedway. .... Then by all means let the guy race
So I read back and read the news aggregate on Jayski, he was found positive for Cocaine and pot.
Still, my feeling is that addiction, especially to hard drugs like Cocaine is a disease, and it should be treated as such. Not only that Shane Hmiel is bi-polar, which is a nasty disease to deal with.
He's been drug tested consistently and racing USAC Midgets (And some people here are always asking for more of those guys in the league) for the last couple of years. He's 30, American, and if he can bring sponsorship I say why not
More details at
http://www.scenedaily.com/news/artic...ing_again.html
Indy Car had no problem bringing in the Whittington's, John Paul Jr and Tomas Enge.
And Randy Lanier came into Indy Cars, with "questionable" off-track credentials.
If Hmiel is truly changed and has turned his life around, then why not? If you make mistakes in your 20's, then you are supposed to be permenently banned from big league racing? If this was the case, there would be no football, basketball and baseball in this country (or there would be lot of bad players out there).
He wants to start out in Lights to get rear-engined experience. He is talking to folks in the series. He seems genuinely interested and excited in becoming a Indy Car driver.
We need all of those types of drivers, as we can find. Certainly better then the current "I can't get into F1, and I need a job and if I am worth a damn, I'll be gone ASAP" way of "finding" drivers.
WTF - who cares about Shane Hmiel?
I'd like to see him at least be given a try. Which car owner would take such a chance is beyond my imagination.
Corporate sponsors would run and never forgive a relapse or anything indicating a relapse.
But hey, if he somehow was scrutinized constantly and came up negative every single test, yet performed competitively, i'd say it would be a positive.
His sponsor could be that company that makes home drug tests for parents to give their kids!
How about the Betty Ford clinic?Quote:
Originally Posted by vintage
as a matter of market strategy, anybody that has a lifetime ban from Nascar should not be allowed to race in ICS period as it admits to a desperation and lower status that its competitor series. besides WTF is a shane hmeil ? its not like he puts even one extra person in the stands
I thought they were already committed to Little Al?Quote:
Originally Posted by Chamoo
He was tested positive directly after a qualifying session. He also admitted that he never drove while under influence but that he did drive while the drugs were in his system. Whatever that means??Quote:
Originally Posted by Chamoo
Everybody deserves a second chance. On the other hand this guy got a second chance at Nascar and also a third chance and he kept blowing it.
I think there is a good point in this. It seems hypocritical to to say he (Shane) can't have a chance with all the problems of Little AL. Substance abuse, relapses, hit and run and assault charges are some of the charges the Al faced, at times while he was still an active driver. If he came to Indy with sponsorship, he'd probably get a ride in the 500. I doubt anyone in Indycar would say he can't race because of his past.Quote:
Originally Posted by gm99
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCalPVguy
1. Indy Car does have a lower status then NASCAR. No shame in admitting it.
2. He's an American driver, who has actually won some professional races in his life, who aspires to race Indy Cars. I know, there aren't many of those guys and gals left. But, still.... And most of our current cast put NOBODY in the stands either. ;)
Insert the name of: Wil Power; Ryan Hunter-Reay, Dario Franchitti, Justin Wilson, Raphael Matos for Shane Hmeil in your statement. We have very few people in our sport who appeared on or were featured on a Wind Tunnel type show before they got into IndyCar.Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCalPVguy
It could be a great rehab story. Would require testing prior to every race/practice weekend.
The problem is there is no testing which deals with whether the drug is affecting activities; they simply test to see if there is any in the body. How many of us could pass a test which checked to see if we've had any alcohol in the last month or two?
Don't take this wrong, regardless of the testing issue, if it is in your system and you don't have a prescription for it, you took an illegal drug. However, that is different from discussing whether it affected his ability to drive.
NO !!! They don't.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lousada
let him race, Id say give him a drug test everyday at the track, as long as he is negative and clean, let him race, if he is tested positive for a illegal drug, then he is parked.
Nothing like a good addiction thread for folks true colors to come out.....
*btw I'm a recovered cocaine addict ..... Can I still post
Depends how we feel on any given day.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken
I figure that most Americans love a story of a guy overcoming adversity. He passes the drug tests, he has admitted to cleaning up his act and taking treatment for his addictions and issues; so let him have a shot. Little Al keeps getting a hearing when it is clear he was a first class JERK at some point in his life and with his demons. Yet if he showed up at the Speedway this May, people would welcome him back.
Scott is right, The IRL isn't as picky and cannot afford to be AS picky. Shane seems to have some talent. If he made a go of it in Indy car and became a great story of redemption, at least we know NASCAR has banned him, he wouldn't be going anywhere!
I'm just speculating here but I believe "under the influence" is when your mind is actually affected by said drugs, however they can remain in your blood system (and therefore detectable by drug tests) after their effects wear off. Of course any drug test cannot detect the level of "under the influence" (excuse the grammar), only the volume of drugs in your system, so obviously when drugs are detected in a test and CAN affect you in a dangerous way, the only option is to assume the worst.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lousada
For instance if I had 10 pints of beer (approx 20 units) one night I might wake up the next morning feeling sober (albeit very hungover), but you can bet that if I got straight out of bed, into a car, and got pulled over for a random breathaliser test my next stop would quite rightly be jail.
Also marijuana I believe (someone correct me if I'm wrong) can stay in your system for months after using it (even once), even if its noticeable effects on your faculties wear off after a few hours (or certainly by the next day anyway!).
Not that that's any excuse of course - a friend of mine got a job a few years back where he was made aware that he would be subject to very occasional random drug tests as company policy, at that moment he resolved never to have the occasional spliff again, a pledge he has kept to this day, simply because a joint in September might mean a failed drugs test and the sack in November.
Does IC even have a drug policy?
Do they ever test and if so who?
Was Shane ever actually legally charged with an offence?
A Taxi Cab ban should not affect other organizations.
No not every one gets a second chance - pedophiles, rapists, murderers - they're "one and done" preferably permanently in my book.
In the case of Hmeil, he DID get a second chance, a third and maybe even a fourth chance in Nascar and he blew them all - hence the lifetime ban- it was not for just one offense. No he was never charged in a court of law but that doesn't matter here.
I cannot think of a worse combination- drinking/drugs and auto racing, that might even be worse than drinking/drugs and daily driving and we know how society feels about that !!! Putting a guy like Hmeil in an indycar would send the absolutely opposite wrong message to our fans and sponsors.
If any body disagrees please send your responses to Mothers Againt Drunk Drivers who may have already lost loved ones to losers like Hmeil.
Yeah, I think after Little Al's (many) exploits, any moral high ground, when it comes to drugs, was lost a long time ago.Quote:
Originally Posted by DBell
I don't use drugs (even marijuana). But I'm not one to look at a guy smoking a joint and tell him that I'm better than he is... while I'm holding a glass of Scotch in my hand. And let's face facts, the U.S.'s current policy on marijuana only came about because of that idiotic movie, Reefer Madness, back in the 30's. Yet every year, many more people are killed in auto accidents because of alcohol than pot. But if there was an announcement that Jack Daniels, Jim Beam, Miller and Budweiser were all going to be sponsoring cars at Indy this year, people would be jumping for joy like we haven't seen in 15 years. And what if Penske could get Marlboro back, that (make believe) Lotus team could get Camel and Forsythe would show back up with Players?! Oh my gosh, can you imagine??? People would be falling out in the floor with joy. Hard liquor, beer and cancer sticks... give us more, give us
more!!! :bounce:
All that to say, I don't really care. It would matter to some (sponsors and fans). But as long as he could keep himself clean while driving and doing appearances, sure, why not? But at the age of 30, and with no prior formula car experience (that I know of), I really think it's going to be a non-issue... as I don't see anything coming of this. Like they say, people in hell wish for ice water, but they don't often get their wish.
Okay, that makes sense. I believe they can actually see the difference between "under the influence" and "still in your system" in a drug test. But I don't know if Nascar cares about that difference.Quote:
Originally Posted by V12
This guy tested positive for marijuana AND cocaine. I don't care if somebody smokes joints or even snorts cocaine in his spare time. But please stay away from motorvehicles while you are under the influence. Hmiel was tested positive at a raceweekend.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jag_Warrior
Being under the influence of alcohol while driving is forbidden is it not? I don't understand your argument here.Quote:
Yet every year, many more people are killed in auto accidents because of alcohol than pot.
Cigarettes do not impede your ability to drive a motorvehicle, so I do not understand why you bring this up. Questionable or not, neither cigarettes or alcohol are illigal in the US. Of course you also understand the difference between simple sponsorship and driving under the influence.Quote:
But if there was an announcement that Jack Daniels, Jim Beam, Miller and Budweiser were all going to be sponsoring cars at Indy this year, people would be jumping for joy like we haven't seen in 15 years. And what if Penske could get Marlboro back, that (make believe) Lotus team could get Camel and Forsythe would show back up with Players?! Oh my gosh, can you imagine??? People would be falling out in the floor with joy. Hard liquor, beer and cancer sticks... give us more, give us
more!!! :bounce:
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By the way, talking about "unmoral" sponsorship. Anyone remember that AVG car that was supposed to compete in Champcar?? People weren't jumping for joy when that was announced, now THAT was hypocritical :D
I didn't know that one (or more) of his positive tests was on a race weekend. Was he sited by law enforcement for driving under the influence? Honest question... I don't know this guy from Adam. But that has nothing to do with the NASCAR policy. Any test, taken at ANY time, which shows a banned substance in your system can result in a suspension or ban.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lousada
Now that's NASCAR's basic policy. And they have every right to do that. If someone doesn't want to abide by their rules, they don't have to drive in NASCAR. I don't care what people do, but I don't allow drugs at parties on my property... mainly because I don't want to get caught up in an potential legal hassles. Like NASCAR, it's my property... and my rules. I just don't get all moral about it.
I mean that some people get especially loopy when they begin talking about pot. But they would welcome actual sponsorship from companies that sell products that cause more social harm than the one they want to brand as something that Satan himself grew.Quote:
Being under the influence of alcohol while driving is forbidden is it not? I don't understand your argument here.
Actually I read a study that smoking while driving does contribute to an increased vehicle accident rate. Nothing to do with the smoke, but the attention taken from the road while you're lighting up or flicking the ashes. But again, the point is simply that some people go off the reservation when they hear that someone has been using drugs (*shudder*). But when Dale, Jr. said that he was going to get looped on Budweiser after a race win, people cheered. I'm sure none of his young fans were influenced by that, eh? It's not like binge drinking is a major issue among young people in the U.S. or anything - to say nothing of alcoholism and drunk driving accidents. The legends of NASCAR were people who transported a "banned substance" to make money to race and live. They're heroes. Junior Johnson now sells a (legal) knock-off of the moonshine he used to run. It's crap to drink but it's very popular. A friend of mine is in law enforcement. When we're at lake parties, guess who the guy is who brings the clear liquid in the mason jar that burns blue? ;) But that same guy will bust your ass if he catches you with that same jar, or if he sees you hitting a joint. I just don't get wound up about this stuff like some people do. Moral Majority types have their way of looking at things and wanting to regulate personal behavior as they see fit... and I have mine.Quote:
Cigarettes do not impede your ability to drive a motorvehicle, so I do not understand why you bring this up. Questionable or not, neither cigarettes or alcohol are illigal in the US. Of course you also understand the difference between simple sponsorship and driving under the influence.
I didn't see the big deal with that either. Especially since I was on a board at the time where many of the same people were hoping and fantasizing about Pacific Coast getting Playboy sponsorship. I did understand that other sponsors (what few there were) might have a problem with it. But in my opinion, there's too much (hypocritical) political correctness in society and sports these days.Quote:
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By the way, talking about "unmoral" sponsorship. Anyone remember that AVG car that was supposed to compete in Champcar?? People weren't jumping for joy when that was announced, now THAT was hypocritical :D
But I see Danica Patrick winning the IRL championship before this guy even gets a test in an IRL car. Storm in a tea cup, IMO.
He was never charged. I don't think law enforcement can do anything as long as he doesn't make an accident?? A drugtest takes a few weeks to do, so the result will be known some time after the facts. Is a third party drug test even allowed as evidence? Would be hard to get proper criminal evidence weeks after the fact.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jag_Warrior
According to WADA cocaine is only a banned substance if taken during a race. Since he was caught during a raceweekend, I take it Nascars policy is the same?
I agree with you there. I don't see much difference between a joint and alcohol. Cocaine is a bit more serious though.Quote:
I mean that some people get especially loopy when they begin talking about pot. But they would welcome actual sponsorship from companies that sell products that cause more social harm than the one they want to brand as something that Satan himself grew.
Yes, you are right. My point is that Hmiel got busted during a raceweekend. It's not really clear to me if he was actually high or not, but I assume he was, since they busted him. If he takes a Bud or smokes a joint after the race... I really couldn't care less about that.Quote:
Actually I read a study that smoking while driving does contribute to an increased vehicle accident rate. Nothing to do with the smoke, but the attention taken from the road while you're lighting up or flicking the ashes. But again, the point is simply that some people go off the reservation when they hear that someone has been using drugs (*shudder*). But when Dale, Jr. said that he was going to get looped on Budweiser after a race win, people cheered. I'm sure none of his young fans were influenced by that, eh? It's not like binge drinking is a major issue among young people in the U.S. or anything - to say nothing of alcoholism and drunk driving accidents. The legends of NASCAR were people who transported a "banned substance" to make money to race and live. They're heroes. Junior Johnson now sells a (legal) knock-off of the moonshine he used to run. It's crap to drink but it's very popular. A friend of mine is in law enforcement. When we're at lake parties, guess who the guy is who brings the clear liquid in the mason jar that burns blue? ;) But that same guy will bust your ass if he catches you with that same jar, or if he sees you hitting a joint. I just don't get wound up about this stuff like some people do. Moral Majority types have their way of looking at things and wanting to regulate personal behavior as they see fit... and I have mine.
And that's the biggest truth in this thread ;)Quote:
But I see Danica Patrick winning the IRL championship before this guy even gets a test in an IRL car. Storm in a tea cup, IMO.
I agree with all of it....except the sponsors mean little. What we are talking about is Shane Hmiel someone want in the sport because of his past? YES, because if someone is willing to take the chance to sponsor him and employ them, he hasn't done anything IN THE IRL to ban him for. Yes, he was a loser in NASCAR. Yes, I get all that, but the second they allowed Al Jr. back behind the wheel at Indy, all credibility to keep Shane out is lost. The IRL is no position to get all high and mighty about it. As you Said Jag, who are we right? You and I think are on the same song page on this one, but there a few who would ban this guy forever no matter what. The "second chance" this guy blew in NASCAR land he is still paying a high price for.....at some point, most act's of stupidity are forgiven....Quote:
Originally Posted by Jag_Warrior
I know this is the IRL forum. But while we're on the topic, what has become of the Geico Caveman, J.C. France? Now, his case I see differently. He was busted with coke in his car (Lamorghini?) and/or on his person, and he was drunk and high as a kite apparently... all while street racing. So if NASCAR/Grand Am chooses to ban him for 1000 years, so be it. But I think it's pretty interesting how that story has quietly gone away. Not that he could drive anything more than a nail into a soft piece of pine, if that, but still...
But ol' Shane wants to race a formula car like I want a one night stand with Ivanka Trump. I doubt either of us gets our wish. Although if she ever got drunk enough and I was wearing some of that High Karate cologne, ya shouldn't count me completely out! :bounce:
:rotflmao: :up:Quote:
Originally Posted by Jag_Warrior