If anyone is interested in his insane antics. And sure why not, bring on the arguments here too :p
http://www.redbullusa.com/cs/Satelli...=1242797773354
(you can move this thread else where if needed)
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If anyone is interested in his insane antics. And sure why not, bring on the arguments here too :p
http://www.redbullusa.com/cs/Satelli...=1242797773354
(you can move this thread else where if needed)
I saw this in the local news (a feat in itself) and why I applaud his success in getting the record, I must voice my distaste for his stupidity.
I mean, all well and good to go for a jump... in a rally car... over a river... BUT, to have such little run off that he is then forced to crash the car sideways in order to stop - not great publicity.
Now you will have all the young wanna-be Ken Blocks not only tearing up unused carparks/vacant lots/airfields but also thinking they can perform huge jumps with little stopping area and expect to survive.
Just my opinion.
I think the problem with the landing was that the run-off surface just wasn't suitable. Cool jump though great spectacle etc.
I don't think this really does anything for rallying - good or bad. I think the whole thing is about a car doing the jump and a rally car is just the best tool for the job. The exposure doesn't affect the sport IMO.
I don't have a problem with it but if I see works teams or drivers start getting involved then I will start to worry.
Yea, Young people never do stupid things.Quote:
Originally Posted by grugsticles
Of course it is good publicity. If it brings even one more fan then it is good publicity.
It is Good publicity for: Red Bull. Travis Pastrana, Subaru, Rally America and rally in general.
Here is the vid of the jump in case anyone missed it.
http://www.rallybuzz.com/pastrana-world-record-jump/
So, for all of you who have made negative posts on the jump (and for those of you who will), consider this.
Say, early in 2009, Red Bull has approached Citroen with this silly idea. On New Year's Eve, at the stroke of midnight, they want to have Seb Loeb jump his Citroen rally car across the Seine in the middle of Paris. It will be broadcast live on French national television for 1 hour and 20 minutes and they hope to pack downtown Paris with spectators. And, since they are doing it, why not try for a world record rally car jump?
What do you think Citroen and Loeb would have done?
How would all of you have reacted (while you were watching on TV) when they pulled it off like clockwork.
I think I know the answer.
Funny how it is bad for rallying when it is Pastrana and Subaru who have the guts to step up and do something like this.
great publicity....bring him to wrc now...
Well hasn´t he tried some PWRC events with no sucess. I guess he´s better on jumpin than driving on tricky special stages... :p :Quote:
Originally Posted by N.O.T
Well when the six-time world champ is being asked to risk life and limb for a sponsor opportunity then that is something else. I imagine Citroen wouldn't go for it. I imagine Loeb would treat the idea with complete distain. I try to keep an open mind about this stuff but I still always seem to end up sounding negative. That's purely because I feel this stuff tends to benefit the sponsor more than the sport. The only thing the casual fan sees is Red Bull.Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug Woods
If you want to do something commercial to benefit the sport then ISC could organise a demonstration in a busy city centre and show the cars off in a way that the public can get close to. Formula 1 teams do this. The DTM and BTCC series also arrange similar things. It gives people who wouldn't normally get an opportunity the chance to see the speed and sound of the cars.
It's best to just not take these things serious anymore.
Doug, I couldn't care less if a WRC make or driver does such a thing. It would rather get on my nerves.
I agree with Simmi, it benefits the sponsor (and Mr. Pastrana) more than it does the sport, which is weird actually, because this stunt has no relation to rallying other than the car.
yes but its great publicity....isn;t this what it matters nowadays ?? our sport is dead so the only solution is more clowns to join it like Block Kimi pastrana to save it....Quote:
Originally Posted by Rallyper
Too bad that you only get to see a two minute clip of the jump on the internet.Quote:
Originally Posted by Josti
The show was 80 minutes long and had features on how the jump was constructed, the details of the rally car, background stories on Travis, rallying, etc. The words "rally" and "rallying" were being mentioned continuously.
This show was big time exposure for our sport, for Subaru, for Travis and, of course, for Red Bull. Now, I really don't care if it was not "real" rallying. It helps keep some important people, manufacturers and sponsors in the sport in the USA and it also helps others trying to find manufacturer and sponsor support.
Not sure how much Red Bull spent on organizing this event (the pre-event preparations and logistics are actually quite mind-boggling). Many, many millions. Perhaps close to what they spend to sponsor Citroen for a season.
Did the jump hurt the sport of Rally in any way?
Did the jump increase or decrease the public interest in Rally?
The answers are No and increased.
Actually he did fairly well with a non-competitive team on roads he had never seen before.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rallyper
There were plans to bring him to the WRC with Subaru but they left the series Pastrana is still signed with Subaru North America so that precludes him from driving in another make.
Why the hell are some people taking this so dead seriously? No harm is done to anyone I guess. :) I was a great jump for sure, but no match to Markko Märtin in Neste Rally few years ago. (I'm sure someone will find a link to it)
As Doug said here, most of the people like myself have seen only 2 mins out of 80 mins. If the remaining 78 mins are used to even get some publicity to the sport, I think it's splended.
Okay, now try to do an 82meter jump on a Finland stage at 180kph+, then I'll be impressed.
Too bad indeed. But this is the only image I get here in Europe, so how much of a surprise is it really to get these kind of reactions on a rally forum?Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug Woods
I actually do care that it's not real rallying, at least, if that's what their trying to represent with this show. Seriously, how much does - a car jumping over a specially constructed ramp under big show lights to get some kind of record - holds any relation to the sport we know as rallying?
If Pastrana wants to trie to put rallying on the map in the USA, why doesn't he take his Red Bull millions to contest in the WRC?
Because the BIG crowd over there have no idea what WRC is, maybe? It's all about the show in US, they have no history in WRC whatsoever, and maybe with tricks like these they will have something in the future? I don't know, but if Pastrana gives it a try, why not?Quote:
Originally Posted by Josti
Or then it might be that he is just having fun.
Well, they do have some history, albeit of course little with drivers success (John Buffum did quite well with private cars now and then), and of course the US did hold a WRC event once.Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodeye
But as far as rallying goes, shouldn't the WRC be the pinnacle? Why not focus to promote that?
Again, if you go and ask the BIG crowd who is John Buffum, I guess you would get a lot of guesses pointing to NBA and NFL maybe. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Josti
I agree that the WRC should be the pinnacle. And maybe the best thing to do to promote something that doesn't exist in US is to have an embassador like Mr. Pastrana to bring it to spotlight first, then get a WRC event with same Mr participating (and with vide coverage) and voilá, you've brought WRC again to US.
I'm available for marketing consulting if anyone in US is interested. :D
Obviously, but I also said the US had it's own WRC event once, that's quite something.Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodeye
But that takes us back to the original problem (at least in my eyes), that is the way they are trying to promote it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodeye
I think the WRC holds nothing really for an American sponsor. Doesn't seem to have much of a presence on television and also hasn't held a round there in 20 years or so. There are more profitable and attention grabbing means of promotion than the WRC.Quote:
Originally Posted by Josti
I think this jump will probably be of a benefit to rallying in the States. It might make Red Bull or Subaru USA extend their contracts or something. It might mean they provide money for bigger ramps at the X-Games. As can be seen by the reaction on here it does literally nothing for the sport in Europe or the rest of the world. It helps make the US rallying bubble that bit bigger. Which is fine until someone tries to jump something so crazy that someone gets injured. A moving train perhaps? Or Ken Block tries to powerdrift underneath a jumbo jet as it takes off. I'm sure that would probably grab mainstream worldwide attention. Then it would be "rallying". But I'm exaggerating.
I think the problem people have is that this could feasibly bring in heaps of exposure and sponsors on the pretence that rallying is something that it is not. And these these stunts will only serve to mean that we will see more of this stuff. I personally think that is where the money will go. Not on rallying but on jumping over, into and on to of stuff. But when the energy drinks move onto their next extreme fad then you aren't left with much.
I have no problem with Travis Pastrana, the jump or anyone trying to push the boundaries. I just think it is naive to say it benefits the sport.
sure, if you can stand on your head and whistle, the driving skill is not so important.Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodeye
I think it's just as naive to say that this might harm the sport.Quote:
Originally Posted by Simmi
Unfortunately I can only whistle. :(Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomi
Maybe so, but he was a reasonable driver, best way to promote is to get a guy like Buffum was, calculated stunts takes you nowhere, i dont belive pastrana or bloke has what it takes, better to find a young guy with sponsors who throws all in the game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodeye
I can't seem to find anything in my post about me saying it harms the sport.Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodeye
I said it doesn't do anything for the sport outside of America. It does nothing as in it makes no impact what so ever. So not harming and not improving.
Wonder what the late Colin McRae would have done with Rallying in the USA.
Would have been good with Pastroni and Block.
Wow, I'm a huge rally fan, but watching that video quite literaly took my breath away! Who cares that it's not proper rallying, it's one of the most dramatic and exciting things I've ever seen anyone do in a car.
Those of you who knock Travis need a bit if a wake up call. Thus guy is pure gold, and he's as rally mad as anyone. What he does now, a whole generation of kids around the world grow up wanting to do. The guy is a genuine superstar. At a time where we have probably the greatest driver who ever lived able to walk down most high streets of the world unrecognised, we need all the stars we can get.
I say embrace Travus and Ken, marvel at what they do and be thankful for all the publicity our sport receives because of them.
No hard feelings, but i think you slightly exaggerate pastranas meaning what comes to rally, also maybe your world is a bit too small.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rally_Rocks
in ref to Colin Mcrae, well he did take part in X games in 2006 wasnt it? .
I love the debate this stuff always brings up. I agree with Rally_Rocks about Travis being a great personality. It's pretty much impossible not to like the guy. His enthusiasm is infectious and he is basically a sponsors dream. He is genuinely a rallying fan.
But I still maintain stunts/PR of this nature only serve to mean more money goes into performing more of the same. So this new warped 'Americanized' genre of rallying will flourish but I'm not sure how it will help you're average American privateer. They may have given rallying some coverage on the television build-up but what Red Bull are surely after are the millions of internet hits and in these instances rallying is very much secondary in the 2min clip.
This isn't me saying this hurts the sport of rallying. I'm just lost as to how this is supposed to relate back in any way to a rally stage to be of any real benefit. It's just so far removed from reality the car is secondary to the spectacle of the jump.
Tomi, I'll try and explain this again. Pastrana is potentially our greatest global ambassador. Not in terms of his ability, but in terms of his appeal. He is in the top ten most recognisable celebrities in the states and his chosen sport is rallying. The challenge is how does our sport embrace and exploit this.
To be honest I'm not sure why I've bothered responding to your post, because if you can't get excited by the video of what Pastrana achieved there's no hope for you.
I think that you yourself must firstly discover what real rally meant. :(Quote:
Originally Posted by Rally_Rocks
I think to be honest it's more like how does his sponsor embrace and exploit this. And we've seen the answer. They could send him off to do selected rounds of the WRC but I don't see them doing it to be honest.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rally_Rocks
Who is our? First of all dont you think that to be an ambassdor of sport the first requairments would be the ability to drive atleast a little?Quote:
Originally Posted by Rally_Rocks
But I dont think he harm the sport in any way, he is just amusing.
He did this.Quote:
Originally Posted by GigiGalliNo1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P0de7m7uU0c
Brother John, I will happily admit I'm a modern day rally fan who refuses to live in the past. You show your true colours when you, "what real rally meant". I'm sorry, but I'm only interested in living in the present and doing all I can to raise the profile of our sport to the level I think it deserves. We live in a commercially driven, celebrity obsessed world. Embrace it and exploit it, then maybe our sport stands a slim chance of not disappearing into niche obscurity only to be enjoyed by anorak wearing whingers like yourself.
Or they could do practical things like lowering the cost of the WRC car. Try to attract new manufacturers through sensible new regulations. Reinstate classic rallies and give events more freedom to take the action to the fans. Aim to progress into key car markets. Improve their coverage package with the help of the internet and new media. Stuff like that. Stuff they are doing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rally_Rocks
Or they could just spend millions on a stunt jump and put so called 'top 10' celebrities in the cars. Generally just whore themselves out to the whims of sponsors and hope these companies stick around. I think you are preaching to the wrong crowd on this forum. People look to the past because it gives them some comfort we could have golden era's like that again in the future.
I'm just glad you aren't the head of the FIA.
Simmi, sometimes you talk sense, this time you are talking total crap!
What's the most exciting thing that's happening in our sport this year? Oh, and who's paying for it?
Raikkonen and Red Bull.
What Red Bull do with Pastrana is all part of an integrated global campaign to maximise the return on their rally investment. It's exciting, it's glamorous, it's glitzy, is that really a problem? Of course it isn't, it's the future. And if you don't like the ride, just jump off. Marketing driven motorsport is, unfortunately for some of you guys, the only way forward.
Is it really? its ok that he is there, but far from the most interesting.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rally_Rocks
To me it seems that marketing men carry you around like a waste bucket.